This is page numbers 863 - 902 of the Hansard for the 12th Assembly, 6th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was chairman.

Topics

Supplementary To Question 406-12(6): Contract For The Construction Of Rent Supp Homes
Question 406-12(6): Contract For The Construction Of Rent Supp Homes
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 885

The Speaker

Minister responsible for Housing, Mr. Morin.

Further Return To Question 406-12(6): Contract For The Construction Of Rent Supp Homes
Question 406-12(6): Contract For The Construction Of Rent Supp Homes
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 885

Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I have made this House aware already that we are doing a new business incentive policy with full consultation to the regional people and the business people. It's a few irresponsible contractors who are working in the Northwest Territories that give a bad name to a lot of other good contractors.

Even these so-called northern contractors who continually bring in Newfoundlanders and other people from southern Canada to do the work and call them northerners, we're going to have to make moves to stop them. I've already said that not only the health card that anybody and their dog can get after they've been here three months, but a driver's licence, a T-2222, an income tax form as well as a statutory declaration for their address has to be supplied to us. It's up to the contractor to confirm to us that their people are northern or local.

We also are going to build in amendments to the contracts where if you do not uphold to your northern and local content, you will lose your business incentive policy, but you may lose your contract. I can do those things now for next year so that we can come down with a heavy hammer and I can deal with these people. Thank you.

---Applause

Further Return To Question 406-12(6): Contract For The Construction Of Rent Supp Homes
Question 406-12(6): Contract For The Construction Of Rent Supp Homes
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 885

The Speaker

Item 6, oral questions. Item 7, written questions. The honourable Member for Deh Cho, Mr. Gargan.

Samuel Gargan Deh Cho

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I have a written question for the Minister of Renewable Resources.

Would the Minister of Renewable Resources undertake to provide me with a brief summary, in layman's terms, of the latest results of all water quality studies, including fish and sediment sampling, recently completed or currently being conducted in the Mackenzie River Basin area of the Northwest Territories?

The summaries should include any information regarding the presence of contaminants and the nature and concentration and determinable origin of any such contaminants.

The Speaker

Item 7, written questions. Item 8, returns to written questions. Mr. Clerk.

Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton

Madam Speaker, Return to Written Question 20-12(6) asked by Mr. Whitford to the Minister of Public Works and Services, concerning the annual costs since implementation of the business incentive policy.

The business incentive policy is applied on all GNWT contracts and provides a 15 per cent or 20 per cent adjustment for NWT or local content respectively. In most cases, an award is made to the low bidder. In some cases, an award is made to a company that is not the lowest bidder. This would happen when the company has greater NWT or local content and therefore receives a larger BIP adjustment. The extra cost to award to this company equals the difference between the amount of the award and the amount of the lowest bid. This extra cost is referred to as the BIP premium.

The Department of Public Works and Services maintains records on construction, maintenance and services contracts awarded based on the BIP and the applicable BIP premium. during the past four years, for which information is readily available, the BIP premium has been as follows:

1994-95: total number of awards made based on BIP, five; total BIP premium, $327,402; total value of awards made based on BIP, $10,115,617; total BIP premium, 3.4 per cent; percentage of all awards made to NWT firms by value, 92 per cent.

1993-94: total number of awards made based on BIP, three; total BIP premium, $454,371; total value of awards made based on BIP, $6,813,839; total BIP premium, 7.2 per cent; percentage of all awards made to NWT firms by value, 89 per cent.

1992-93: total number of awards made based on BIP, seven; total BIP premium, $168,315; total value of awards made based on BIP, $2,803,308; total BIP premium, 6.4 per cent; percentage of all awards made to NWT firms by value, 84 per cent.

1991-92: total number of awards made based on BIP, nine; total BIP premium, $631,080; total value of awards made based on BIP, $14,107,254; total BIP premium, 4.7 per cent; percentage of all awards made to NWT firms by value, 82 per cent.

The Speaker

Thank you. The House will recess for 15 minutes. Thank you.

---SHORT RECESS

The Speaker

Item 9, replies to opening address. The honourable Member for Yellowknife North, Mr. Ballantyne.

---Applause

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 886

The Speaker

Mr. Ballantyne's Reply

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 886

Michael Ballantyne Yellowknife North

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I wasn't going to make a reply, but a number of things that I have been reading about in the country over the last few weeks have really concerned me. I just wanted to express some of my feelings to the House. What's happening to our country?

As we, in the Northwest Territories, attempt to deal with increasing violence and problems with our youth and social problems across the territories, I think we have to keep in mind that we're part of Canada; and something that's happening in Canada should concern us all. I really see a breakdown of the values that Canadians have been so proud of for so long. The things I'm about to say are not meant as criticism to the judges here in the territories or to the police here, to the prosecutors or to the government. I think everybody here is doing the best they can with the roles and the limitations they have to work within.

But a number of things have happened recently. I was reading here on the front page of the paper, the American concept of violence is coming north, is coming north very, very quickly; that a pro-choice doctor was shot in Vancouver. That was an unheard-of concept five years ago. Those sorts of things didn't happen in Canada.

I was reading about the feelings of Canadians, about what has happened with the Charter of Rights and how the Charter of Rights is seen by many Canadians only as a protection for people accused of serious crimes, and of criminals; and that balance in our society seems to be lacking.

I was reading, recently, of a woman who purchased pepper spray for use in protecting herself from attack and was charged for possession of a prohibited weapon when she was attacked, and charges against her attacker were stayed. So what the prosecution has said is it's legal for a woman to use pepper spray to defend herself against a vicious dog; however, it is illegal to use the same spray to defend herself against attack from a would-be rapist.

We've talked here about the Supreme Court decision on drunkenness and the use of drunkenness as a defence, and the recent case in Alberta. Members will remember the Askov case where accused persons have the right, under the Charter of Rights, for a trial within a reasonable period of time. People will recall that as a result of this Supreme Court decision in Askov, thousands and thousands of cases were thrown out of court for what was termed unreasonable pretrial delay. So while the right of the accused to a trial within a reasonable period of time is of significant importance, I can't help but feel that society's right to ensure that criminals are prosecuted was ignored in this decision.

Madam Speaker, the former government had promised to bring in anti-stalking laws. People have heard about these laws in the United States. There have been many cases of women who had been stalked by former boyfriends, by former husbands, have reported it to the police, there have been restraint orders established by courts, and a still alarming number of women have been murdered. And, under our system, you can't do anything about it. The police have to tell a person who is being stalked time and time again, until somebody actually does something to you there's nothing we can do. I understand that our present government, because of the Charter of Rights, is not going to proceed with anti-stalking laws.

The case of sexual predators...It is a fact that we're now able, in many cases to reasonably predict that some individuals, once they are out of jail, will sexually attack kids again. We have unbelievable cases where parole reports even say that that individual could kill if they were released; and did kill. So, again, the Charter of Rights says that we can't keep somebody in prison longer than their sentence, even if we know, with reasonable certainty, that if we let them out, an innocent victim will be badly hurt. Again, I understand that there's not a lot being done about this because of the Charter of Rights.

I was reading in the Globe and Mail that they're having a major symposium in Toronto about international crime. And I'll quote, Madam Speaker, "Some of the top crime fighters in the world are at the symposium." They say there are at least 10 organized crime syndicates, including the so-called Russian mafia, two Italian mafia, two Columbian drug cartels, Chinese triads and Japanese gangsters operating in Canada, drawn by its generous immigration policies, lack of currency regulation and lenient judicial system.

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 887

An Hon. Member

Shame.

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 887

Michael Ballantyne Yellowknife North

The panel, which includes one of Italy's top Mafioso fighting prosecutors says naivety about the threat of organized crime, preoccupation with personal rights make Canada a virtual free market for the underworld. Again, I have some real concerns about where we are heading in Canada.

When the Young Offenders Act was brought in, we had a vision in Canada of innocent young people who, through situations that were out of their control, got into some trouble. And, quite rightly, society said let's treat them differently than we treat other criminals. But times have changed in the last 12 years. Now some of our young people are hardened thugs. For 10 years now, the Ministers of Justice across the country have tried to bring changes to the Young Offenders Act, and for whatever reason, changes are delayed time and time again. Again, with our preoccupation with rights of one segment of society, we're forgetting about the rights of the vast majority of Canadians.

Society has changed dramatically over the past 12 years since the Canadian Charter of Rights was introduced with great fanfare. I feel that, as a society and as a legal system, we're incredibly naive as to the type and numbers of dangerously sick and hardened individuals who increasingly prey upon innocent victims in our society. It seems to many Canadians that the Charter of Rights is being abused by an increasing number of dangerous Canadians who know that our legal system will go to almost any lengths to protect their rights.

A case in point -- and I brought it up here in the House -- was the Charles Ng case; a brutal accused murderer from California where there were actual graphic tapes of the torture and murder of victims. He came to Canada -- again because Canada has a pretty lenient system -- and was arrested here. Again, I think of an unjustifiable preoccupation with rights, we cannot without tremendous difficulty extradite somebody, even to the United States, if they can face the death penalty. Now if anybody deserves to face the death penalty it's Charles Ng. Four years and approximately $4 million later, the Justice Minister actually got him out in the middle of the night and sent him to California, for which was harshly criticized. Where is the justice?

In the Homolka/Teale case, it seems like our society is going to inordinate lengths to ensure that the very best defence is available to the accused. Again, when the facts of that case are made public, it will chill everybody in this room. The facts are unbelievably ugly and somehow or other we are still living in a world that can't respond properly.

So I ask what has happened to the Charter in the last 12 years? What's happened to the Charter's responsibility to protect the rights of victims, of defenceless children who are being preyed upon by sick and bizarre psychopaths?

We've abolished capital punishment in this country because we feel it's immoral for society to take a life. I'll give you the case of Clifford Olsen. Again, a string of brutal murders. And I would almost guarantee that if anybody in this room could have been a witness to one of those tortures and murders, they would have no hesitation whatsoever in agreeing to capital punishment. This man to whom we have offered the full rights of our legal system, has written letters to the families of victims and victimized the families again. This man has taken our penitentiary system to court on numerous occasions. Finally, a judge said it's a nuisance but we've afforded him on dozens of occasions the luxury of taking our system to court because he wasn't able to read books or because certain of his rights he thought were being contravened.

Something is obviously wrong here. I think we have to understand that here in Canada, we don't have a justice system, what we have is a legal system. It is a legal system where the pursuit of justice is becoming increasingly sporadic.

But, we can't blame the justice system for all our ills because the justice system is a product of our society. To me, the major culprit is the naive, trustful nature of the Canadian psyche. It is like we're living in a dream world, as our world is slowly crumbling around us. We're pretending we're still living in the 1960s. What can we do, people ask. There are two diametrically opposed concepts. One is the right-wing approach, which is more police, harsher penalties and bring back the death penalty. The other one is more left-wing approach, and that is, let's treat the young people, let's intervene aggressively and treat at-risk youth. Unfortunately, the debate has become such that you have to be one or the other. I think we need a combination of both of these approaches.

The charter has to be modernized. It is very difficult to do it constitutionally and we can only hope that judicial interpretations of the charter will give it more equality in its treatments of victims as well as the accused. Even though the charter was put there for the rights of individuals, I don't think we can forget the rights of society. The charter has to reflect modern reality and it must protect all Canadians, not just the criminals and those accused of violent crimes.

I, for one, think that the people who have been convicted of violent crimes should be punished severely. I've heard the argument that jail sentences are not deterrents and they eventually get out, et cetera. That is true but, on the other hand, we have to give a strong message that our society will not condone that sort of behaviour. I think the sort of thing we're trying here is to mobilize communities against crime and violence. It is key and all of Canadian society has to do that. We've talked about resources for police and there is the same call across the country: police need the tools to do the job. I agree with the Justice Minister that more police and more judges aren't the complete answer, but they are part of the answer and there has to be better cooperation and support from the community for the police and better interaction of the police with the community.

I think that governments must intervene massively and aggressively with young people right across the country. We are now able to identify troubled youngsters. We can predict, with a certain amount of certainty, that they are going to get themselves into serious trouble. I think we have to start spending the money and intervene early. People have to recognize that in the area of human resources, you can't do everything. So, it means, in one sense, that you're not going to be able to spend the resources on the present generation. In one sense, you have to almost warehouse them, do what you have to do, but put new money to save the next generation.

You have to protect the future, otherwise I see that what is happening in the inner core of major cities in the United States where you can't live, is going to happen here. They're out of control; there is anarchy. There is no respect for law and order, there is no respect for life. Gangs have taken over southern Los Angeles, Washington, Chicago and New York. You can tell from the last election there that politicians are held in the lowest regard. I don't know where it all goes. As you saw, the last political campaign in the United States was totally negative; everything about it was negative. Ultimately, that negative attitude permeates society and people believe that there is no way out of the mess. We are not there yet in Canada, but I think we have a responsibility to make sure we do get there. I think victims must be supported in a major way.

I heard a report that Doug French, who is the father of one of the young girls brutally murdered in Ontario, appeared before a parliamentary committee and said victims have no rights, I have no rights. He said, here is a man whose life has been changed irrevocably and he's an example of many. When someone is brutally murdered, their families will never recover and their friends will never recover. It doesn't just affect one person; there are probably hundreds of people affected by each one of these crimes. What about their rights? It is fine to say that Homolka/Teale has rights, but what about the rights of the families whose lives have been totally shattered?

I feel that here in the Northwest Territories, our government is giving some good examples to the rest of the country and I applaud them for that. But, I think we have to act quickly and very decisively or we will face a breakdown of law and order and the violence that we see in the United States. Canadians take so much for granted. There is no doubt in my mind that the world, in the 1990s, is a nasty place. There is a lot of violence and there are a lot of very nasty people out there. That reality is hitting our country very, very quickly. I think that we may wake up one day and discover a Canada we don't recognize or like. Thank you, Madam Speaker.

---Applause

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 888

The Speaker

Thank you. Item 9, replies to opening address. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South, Mr. Whitford.

Mr. Whitford's Reply

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 888

Tony Whitford

Tony Whitford Yellowknife South

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to reply. It has been quite a while now since the opening address was delivered in this House and a lot of things have happened in this House during that item. I had a copy of it so I could read and respond to it specifically, but I seemed to have misplaced it among all the other papers that we accumulate here during a session.

A lot of things have happened and one of the things that I wanted to take this opportunity to do was to say a few words of thank you to former Commissioner Norris. I was in the former Legislature that selected Mr. Norris to be the first aboriginal Commissioner and was really pleased when he did get that nomination. I think I was pretty outspoken in insisting that Commissioners do come from the Northwest Territories. Charles Camsell was born in the Northwest Territories prior to Commissioner Norris' appointment, but that shouldn't have been the end of it. We had many good Commissioners after it and Commissioner Norris takes his place in history for the things he has done.

I think he made a valuable contribution to the Northwest Territories and I wish him well in the pursuits he will be undertaking. I wrote him a letter to say these things to him and to tell him that I wished him well in whatever ventures he pursues. Not only that, I look forward to working with him in other areas as our paths cross.

A couple of things I was involved with on behalf of the people of the Northwest Territories, not necessarily just Yellowknife and the people I represent -- and what is good for us is sometimes not always good for others and what is good for others doesn't always benefit us directly -- including my visits to Europe this past summer to assist the now Minister of Renewable Resources, the Honourable Silas Arngna'naaq in the lobby of the European parliament with relationship to their stand on Canadian furs and methods of trapping.

They had points, but not always well-informed points, as we found out when we were in places like Belgium, the Netherlands, and Denmark. Those countries, as an example, Madam Speaker, depend quite a lot on fur. In the Netherlands, for example, 15,000 jobs are associated with fur, with the raising of fur in the Netherlands. And that comes from an unusual source. A lot of the monies that are associated are subsidiaries to the fur industry. One of those is the fishermen. We are well aware that the Netherlands is on the coast and depends quite a lot on the ocean for the exportation of fish. They catch a lot of fish and they process these fish Not all the fish they catch are top quality -- tails, heads, fins, scales, and stuff are all sold to the fur industry to provide food for foxes and mink. Their reply to that when I asked what about the 15,000 people, fishermen for whom it's an extra income? They said they'll just have to find something else to do.

How asinine can an attitude be. That's a proper word; it's in the dictionary. Sorry, I won't use it again. How silly can they be, Madam Speaker, to fight Canadians by cutting off the importation of furs because of humaneness and they don't worry about how it affects our economy. They don't even worry about how it affects their economy. When you try to point these things out to them, they say well that's different. They kill half a million muskrats a year; we've pointed this out to them. What do they do with them? They burn them out of their dens, they drown them, they beat them with clubs, they use leghold traps.

But that's different, Madam Speaker, because over in the Netherlands, muskrats are pests. Over here they're not pests you know. They feel we treat our muskrats a little more humanely but, because the muskrat over there is a pest, they think they can do anything they want with the poor little critter. I explained to them that we eat muskrats, we eat beaver. They said oh, you can't possibly do that. Yes, we do. You see how ill-informed they are. The point I was trying to make is that European parliament is ill-informed with it comes to this particular issue of the fur lobby.

I understand that we have another Member going over shortly to continue this lobby and I hope that he comes back with information that yes, they've been able to reconsider their position. On the leghold traps, we pointed out to them that we are moving with great strides to a more humane method of trapping. For many years Canadians have been leaders in trying to develop a trap that was more humane. Connibear, for example, in the 30's was already developing the famous Connibear trap which is quick kill. If we draw the line between humaneness and the fact that we do have to take an animal's life in order to benefit from you know that we try to do that as humanely as possible. We've always done that but we make no bones about the fact that we do hunt, we do trap and we do this as part of our economy.

The economy of the north benefits some $12 million from the fur industry, as I started to say earlier on. Although it doesn't affect us directly in my riding, it did in the past. When I was growing up in Fort Smith, I recall the lifestyle that people had related to trapping. They would go out in the fall and stay there for many months catching furs and processing meat and stuff like that. A lot of pride went into that. That's gone now, Madam Speaker, in some parts and it's unfortunate because it's a lost way of life, it's a lost set of values, and it's contributing to some of the social problems that we do face here today. Life has changed greatly and those are some of the contributing factors to it. We try to point this out to the Europeans and they don't seem to want to listen.

Mining is the lifeblood of Yellowknife and it's nice to see over the past two years the upsurge in exploration in the mining industry that has put a lot of dollars back into our economy here; much-needed dollars. Mining dollars are new money. Money that's coming fresh and is circulated around the north through jobs and through the purchase of supplies, services, and equipment. The diamond industry, for example, here in Yellowknife has been quite beneficial to us in many ways. The lumber yards are preparing, just as an example, Madam Speaker, boxes to put core samples in to. I've seen truckloads and truckloads of those going out to the airport to be sent to the exploration areas; that all translates into jobs.

New gold discoveries have been made in the last few months here that are exciting. Miramar Con Mine, for example, has done some more exploration work in areas that they previously thought were unproductive. They have found good reserves there that would put a few more years to the life of that mine. Royal Oak has shown a profit this year, up substantially from previous years. It's good to see that Discovery Mine at Giauque, a little bit northeast of us here, a mine that was in operation in the 1950s and early 1960s, shut down because the cost of gold recovery was more than the value of the gold, $32 an ounce. It's gone up considerably now, Madam Speaker, so there's new works taking place there. It's good to see that that's going back into production.

The pursuit of those precious base metals still continues and that's good to see because, as I said, it's good for business and that's what keeps our economy going. As a result of it, the population of our city has increased dramatically and I'm proud to say that the riding that I represent has almost doubled in its size since the last boundaries review. Now it's time to look at that again to redistribute some of the population within the constituencies in the city. People have moved up here, built homes, moved their families here. It's put a strain on our schools. We have built a school in that area to take up the newcomers. It's almost filled to capacity already. New businesses have established themselves. Wal-Mart has moved in now to service the city and surrounding areas. I was there on Monday to the official opening of Wal-Mart and I said it was good to see that now Yellowknife has become the south where people always go to do their shopping. In the old days, people would get on a plane and fly south to Edmonton to do their shopping at some of the malls there. Well, I see now that some of the communities from the north are coming to the city here and not going as far as Edmonton any more. That's good for the north because the money stays here.

Sam Yurkiw, a well-known businessman in this community has expanded his business in our area. He's built an addition on to the car wash, a valuable part of our business. There's been two little businesses associated with that; a small corner store run by a couple and the gas station that goes along with it. It's amazing to see the amount of growth in our area.

One of the things that I have been pursuing in this House over the past year, Madam Speaker, on behalf of the Council for the Disabled and of the Canadian National Institute for the Blind, has been the introduction of a donor card on the back of driver's licences. I've pursued this matter now for a couple of years from previous Ministers and had I stayed as Minister of Transportation, it may have been accomplished by this time. I want to say that this is a an area that I want to continue to pursue. I think there are many misunderstandings about it. One of the things that I've found out is that it is a valuable and appreciated act by one human being to another. It's one way of saying that life is valuable and in the event that something happens to me, someone else can benefit from it. Eyes, for example, the operation is so easy to do. The operation that is required to remove the corneal lens can be done in this hospital contrary to what has been said. It is...

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 890

The Speaker

Go ahead.

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 890

Tony Whitford

Tony Whitford Yellowknife South

Sorry, Madam Speaker, the light went out and I took that to mean that my time had run out.

About the donor cards, it is so easy to do, it is voluntary, it is easy to administer and coordinate, there are no extra costs to this government, there is no liability to this government, there is no unnecessary expense to our hospital, there is no new technology required, it only needs the endorsement of the department or this government.

The argument against putting this on the back of drivers' licences is that we don't have the ability to do transplants here. Well, we're not asking for the ability to do transplants in the Northwest Territories or anywhere in the Northwest Territories. We are only asking for the addition, on the back of drivers' licences, of information. It could probably be done with another card, but the most common place that people who are involved in accidents will be looking is the driver's licence for identification. And, if on the back of a driver's licence, there is that information, it alerts medical people straight away of what to do. They don't pursue it any further, once they find out the identity of victims. I've been told that by police: that is the simplest way of doing it. It is there.

The other thing that may be misunderstood is that it is not a compulsory thing. It is not that everybody has to do it. It is only those people who want to have it done. You have a choice, you can have the various regulations by coding on the back of drivers' licences. If you want to be a donor, you sign the back and carry it with you at all times. That is the place to do it. I certainly wish that people would understand that this isn't an imposition on anybody. It is a voluntary thing. When you go to renew your driver's licence, you can indicate your wishes, or the individual can request that be placed on the back, once they have signed and completed the document required.

Corneas can be removed here in the hospital, it has been done. They have a good transportation life. They can last from 36 to 48 hours, depending on conditions and Edmonton is only two and a half hours away. Edmonton has the capacity to do cornea transplants. It is so commonplace that it is done almost every day there. The only problem is they don't have enough organs for transplantation. There are people who have kidney problems who are waiting in hospitals on dialysis machines for proper kidneys. There are people who need marrow transplants. There is skin grafting for burn victims.

One of the toughest things to do is to see somebody who has been burned and scarred for life because they didn't have the right methods of treatment. The only thing that can treat skin burns is skin, itself, with a minimum of reaction. Most important, a lot of us travel and we travel to areas where there are facilities. And, when, God forbid, an accident does happen, at least people know that in the event of a tragedy, their wishes can be complied with, that life can go on and they can help others through a simple event such as a transplant because of the donor card they may be carrying.

Madam Speaker, we're winding down this session and there are a few things that have to happen today, so I won't take any more time. I wanted to get these points across and this is the forum where I was able to do this. I thank my colleagues for their patience while I was able to convey to them my point of view, which may be somewhat controversial. I have many times, supported the opinions and efforts of other Members who have put forward issues in order to benefit people in their ridings. I would ask only that this be thought about from a humane point of view, rather than something that is gruesome and grisly.

The fact is, life does terminate for some people rather prematurely and life can be extended for others through their generous contributions. I always like to take every opportunity to congratulate people and one of the groups that I would like to congratulate are the justices of the peace and the coroners, without whose service northern justice wouldn't quite be what it is. We have to be thankful that in each community there is a justice of the peace of aboriginal descent who know the ways of the community and is able to translate that into the administration of justice.

I recognize the fact that there are situations that may not be appealing to everybody, but I would also invite people to, rather than criticizing the justice of the peace system, put their names forward and take the training necessary to become good justices of the peace and coroners. Aboriginal coroners are sadly lacking, because it is sometimes seen to not be the aboriginal way of doing things. Yet, people die and coroners fulfil an important role. They go to a scene of an accident or death outside of a hospital and help to get the message across about what happened. They not only do that, but they are also able to counsel survivors of the family. They let them know what has happened, and that their loved ones have not died unnoticed and uncared for. To the coroners, we owe a great debt of gratitude for the fact that they do take on this sometimes unpleasant task.

And, to the justices of the peace, who do everything from first appearances in court and signing of documents -- some pretty mundane stuff, but at times, some pretty exciting stuff -- who are of great benefit to all people of the territories, I tip my hat and say, keep up the good work. If the Minister of Justice was here, I would encourage him to reinstate some of the things that used to be done by the justices of the peace and the coroners. I just learned the other day that a very important conference scheduled for the coroners was cancelled because they don't have enough money. Consequently, the training they receive is done long distance. It is done through letters, telephone calls and books. It doesn't have the same thoroughness of training sessions that used to be held here and in other major centres for coroners and justices of the peace.

There is another element, Madam Speaker, that is very important and that is the camaraderie, l'esprit de corps, that these members of our unofficial civil service have with each other. There is a time when you meet, talk and share thoughts with each other. That's important, too. That comes with the training programs and conferences that have now been cancelled. Yes, it costs money, but I think the benefit that we get from them translates into a far better service than if we save money and do it another way. For the justices of the peace, it is the same thing.

I know that there's a good program in there. We lost our justice of the peace trainer, by the way and I don't think they've replaced that person. We do need that so we can keep up this lower level of the court system. The one that's the grass-roots level of service that people demand in the territories. We have people that feel much more comfortable appearing in front of a justice of the peace than they do in territorial court or supreme court.

I say to the justices of the peace, don't be afraid to deal with every aspect that they feel comfortable with of the judiciary because you cannot make a mistake as a justice of the peace. You can err, yes, but there's always a mechanism that's going to catch this and is going to regress it. That's why we have the Territorial Court. That's why we have the court of appeal. That's why we have the different levels of appeals court. That's why we have the Supreme Court. I point to them that when you go to a law library you see the hundreds and hundreds of volumes of books on cases that have been appealed at some point in time; and, from each appeal we learn.

I think that if learned people, people who have gone off to universities and taken law and studied law for many years and have different degrees in law, can make errors themselves, we shouldn't be ashamed at all of making an error from time to time. It only tests the system and it delivers that form of justice that only justices of the peace can deliver to the people that they serve.

With that, Madam Speaker, I will say in closing that it's been a very interesting year. A lot has happened. I don't think we'll ever see the likes of this again. The city of Yellowknife has come out of a very traumatic time over the past few years; has stood firm, has stood together, and has pulled together and we only look forward to the future. With anticipation, perhaps, but not with fear. We look forward to the rise in the economy that's been predicted. Our Premier is overseas right now and is negotiating on our behalf to see if there are some things that can be done in the Northwest Territories that the people in the Republic of China would like. I was looking in the paper and I see that British Columbia is going to be selling salmon heads to the Chinese to make the special sauces that they make. I was wondering if they would ever look at char heads? That's an exotic part of the fish that maybe some people don't always use and there may be a little bit of a market there; Char tails and char fins, et cetera. What may be a product that's not of value to us can become valuable through the efforts of people who know how to process this and benefit greatly from it. If they benefit from it, we do too. Why? Because we get the money that would otherwise be wasted. I return now to my statement about the fur and what the Netherlands people are doing. They're saying scrap those fish, we don't need them. To heck with it because we're against fur so bad that we don't care what we do. Sometimes, though, if you do that, you cut your nose off to spite your face. Anyway, with that, Madam Speaker, thank you very much for this opportunity to return to the address. Thank you.

Item 9: Replies To Opening Address
Item 9: Replies To Opening Address

Page 891

The Speaker

Thank you. Item 9, replies to opening address. Item 10, petitions. Item 11, reports of standing and special committees. Item 12, reports of committees on the review of bills. The honourable Member for Deh Cho, Mr. Gargan.

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills
Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Page 891

The Speaker

Report On Bill 17

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills
Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Page 891

Samuel Gargan Deh Cho

Madam Speaker, I wish to report to the Assembly that the Standing Committee on Legislation has reviewed Bill 17, An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, No. 3, and wish to report that the bill is now ready for committee of the whole. Madam Speaker, I request unanimous consent to waive rule 70(5) to allow Bill 17 to be placed in committee of the whole today.

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills
Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Page 891

The Speaker

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to waive rule 70(5) to allow Bill 17 to be placed in committee of the whole today. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Bill 17 will be on the order paper for committee of the whole today. Item 12, reports of committees on the review of bills. The honourable Member for Nahendeh, Mr. Antoine.

Report On Bill 20

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills
Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Page 891

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I wish to report to the Assembly that the Standing Committee on Finance has reviewed Bill 20, An Act to Amend the Student Financial Assistance Act, and wishes to report that Bill 20 is now ready for committee of the whole. Madam Speaker, I request unanimous consent to waive rule 70(5) to allow Bill 20 to be placed in committee of the whole today. Mahsi.

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills
Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills

Page 891

The Speaker

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to waive rule 70(5) to allow Bill 20 to be placed in committee of the whole for today. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Bill 20 will be placed in committee of the whole for today. Item 12, reports of committees on the review of bills. Item 13, tabling of documents. The honourable Member for Hay River, Mr. Pollard.

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents
Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 891

John Pollard Hay River

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I wish to table Tabled Document 59-12(6), the Northwest Territories

Law Foundation 12th annual report for the fiscal year ending June 30, 1994. Thank you.

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents
Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 892

The Speaker

Thank you. Item 13, tabling of documents. Mr. Clerk.

Item 13: Tabling Of Documents
Item 13: Tabling Of Documents

Page 892

Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton

Madam Speaker, according to rule 42(1), I wish to table Tabled Document 60-12(6), a response to petition 3-12(6), presented by Mr. Pudlat and responded to by the Minister responsible for the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation.