This is page numbers 863 - 902 of the Hansard for the 12th Assembly, 6th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was chairman.

Topics

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Mr. Chairman, I would like to follow up on an item that Mr. Koe was talking about, about the PYs increase. I recognize that four of these PYs are in response to SCOF recommendations, but it just seems to be a tremendous number of positions to increase in times of fiscal restraint. I'm also going to question the allocation. I would like the Minister to advise me, do we have a social worker in every community now?

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 899

The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Minister Pollard.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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John Pollard Hay River

No, Mr. Chairman, we don't.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 899

The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Minister Pollard. Mr. Dent.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 899

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Mr. Chairman, instead of some of these positions, could we not have perhaps put the money into ensuring that

basic social services are supplied to the people in all the communities of the north?

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Minister Pollard.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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John Pollard Hay River

Mr. Chairman, I suppose we could have. But, I'm told repeatedly by Mr. Kakfwi that he doesn't have enough people in his correctional centres to take care of the problems that are there, that his staff are getting burned out, and that there is potential for problems in these centres. He convinced us that he needed those extra positions.

We know that in Safety and Public Services, there has been a call for more monitoring across the Northwest Territories, whether it is in safety or whether it is in mines. We know there is an increase in mining activity in the Northwest Territories. And, so, there are two new mining inspectors required.

I can't defend the Public Works and Services Yellowknife office plan, I mean it was a requirement that was felt to be needed by the department. Mr. Chairman, I can't say that is as important as the other ones.

With regard to Rankin Inlet and Inuvik computer operators, that is just an area that is growing; that is, the transmission of data from those centres to us or between themselves. There is a need for more operators because of increased activity.

In Transportation, with Arctic A airports, we felt we needed a designated person to be there to conclude what we term is a very important agreement with Canada. We wanted a dedicated person who was totally committed to working in this area and, as I say, that is going to fold as soon as negotiations are either completed satisfactorily or they fail.

And, as I said, on the other ones. The two in Health are from the federal government, vote 45, as is Municipal and Community Affairs. The one I suppose we could have done without is the Public Works and Services project officer, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 900

The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister. The chair recognizes Mr. Dent.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I know it is difficult when you are talking about positions to find room to change things around. But, knowing the layer of people in Public Works and Services, I'm not surprised to hear the Minister say he cannot defend that one.

Mr. Chairman, regarding the 14.5 PYs for corrections, which are coming from a base deficiency, I would like to point out that that program was recently transferred from Social Services. And I have no doubt it was short when it came over; Social Services has always been at the short end of the stick. I would also like to point out that perhaps, here, we are providing 14.5 PYs to deal with people after they have got into trouble, instead of providing the social workers to provide the counselling and assistance to try to help keep people out of trouble in the first place, which would, in the long run, be a heck of a lot more efficient.

I would like to ask the Minister, when are we going to deal with this critical shortage of social service workers in the communities?

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 900

The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Minister Pollard.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 900

John Pollard Hay River

Mr. Chairman, the Minister of Health and Social Services and myself have discussed this issue and she assures me that she is working on this particular issue. I would hope that we will have some word for the House the next time we sit in the budget session, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 900

The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Minister Pollard. The chair recognizes Mr. Dent.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Well, I appreciate the commitment and the Minister can be assured that I will be waiting with much anticipation to hear such an announcement. I have another question, Mr. Chairman, and because it relates to more than one area in the detail, I would like to get it out now if I could. It has to do with the building and learning strategy.

At SCOF, we had asked Mr. Pollard whether or not there was an evaluation of value for money with the building and learning strategy. Our chairman's opening comments allude to the concern that because there's a large amount of money being spent on this, we need to know that there is some evaluation.

The committee is coming from a position of support on the program. Our gut feeling is that this is a good program. But with any expenditure, there should be some evaluation as to whether or not there is good value being received. The Minister's response to SCOF doesn't indicate whether or not there is any evaluation taking place. I was wondering if the Minister could assure us that the program is being evaluated.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 900

The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Minister of Finance.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 900

John Pollard Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the Minister of Education and myself had occasion to talk about this today. We will assure this House that there will be an evaluation done of this particular program. Thank you.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Pollard. General comments. Detail of the document. The chair recognizes the Member for Nahendeh, Mr. Antoine.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just wanted to ask the Minister a question on the PYs, just following up on the comments. Looking at the situation that we have here, during these really tough times of fiscal restraint, we see an increase to the PYs. We did received a response, but the larger question I would like a response to is why in these tough times there is a request for a significant increase in the PYs? Was it not possible to meet the needs from within the existing appropriations, perhaps through secondment or transfer or some other means? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Antoine. Minister of Finance, Mr. Pollard.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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John Pollard Hay River

Mr. Chairman, I would point out that over the last three or four years we've actually decreased the number of employees that we have working across the Northwest Territories. I will admit that they've moved around by community, and some departments have gone down more than others, some departments have gained. But in this particular instance, the seven PYs in the Executive were already existing, Mr. Chairman, they were there last year. They're not exactly brand new, they were there working last year. The feeling was that these PYs were justified. It wasn't as many as departments were asking for, believe me.

Could we have done it from within? Well, yes, I suppose we could have downsized some more from within, Mr. Chairman. We chose not to do that. Thank you.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 901

The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Mr. Minister of Finance. The clock having sounded 6:00 pm, I shall rise and report to the Speaker. I would like to take this opportunity to thank the Minister and Mr. Voytilla for assisting us in the matter before the committee. Thank you.

Bill 19: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1994-95
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Speaker

Item 20, report of committee of the whole. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South, Mr. Whitford.

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole
Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

November 9th, 1994

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The Chair

The Chair Tony Whitford

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, your committee has been considering bills 17, 20 and 19, and would like to report progress and that bills 17 and 20 are ready for third reading. Madam Speaker, I move that the report of committee of the whole be concurred with.

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole
Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

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The Speaker

Thank you. The motion is in order. Seconder to the motion. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Lewis. to the motion.

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole
Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

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An Hon. Member

Question.

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole
Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

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The Speaker

Question is being called. All those in favour? All those opposed? Motion is carried.

---Carried

Item 21, third reading of bills. The honourable Member for Hay River, Mr. Pollard.