This is page numbers 1 - 29 of the Hansard for the 12th Assembly, 6th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was housing.

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Bill 7: An Act To Amend The Arctic College Act
Item 14: Second Reading Of Bills

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Dennis Patterson Iqaluit

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I would like to briefly speak in support of the principle of this bill. I believe that it was the Standing Committee on Agencies, Boards and Commissions that first recommended the logic of splitting the Arctic College in order to prepare for Nunavut. The government responded soon thereafter with its recommendation, which I believe was discussed with the reshaping northern government group, that the college should form itself into two parts.

Madam Speaker, I believe that training and preparation of Nunavut residents for jobs associated with the implementation of the land claim and the new Nunavut government is going to be a critical undertaking. I would even go so far as to say that Nunavut and the land claim will succeed as we succeed in training northern residents to take on these new jobs. I believe that, if we are forced to hire southern people to take on these new responsibilities, then much of the reasons for the land claim and the establishment of Nunavut will have been frustrated. So, Madam Speaker, I see this move proposed in this bill as a very helpful step towards focusing on those challenges of meeting the human resource requirements for the establishment of Nunavut and the successful implementation of the land claim. I am confident that we can do it.

I know there is perhaps some hesitation on the part of some Members about the changes that are proposed for the NWT Science Institute. I had the privilege of being a Minister responsible for the Science Institute for some four years and I know that other Members of this House, including the present Minister of Education and the Premier also had that role. I think, Madam Speaker, that we all wanted the Science Institute to succeed in its objects. There were some very capable people who were appointed to the board of the Science Institute and hired as staff for the Science Institute. In these comments, I do not, in any way, wish to take away from the contributions those people have made.

However, Madam Speaker, I think, if we reflect back on the work of the Science Institute over the years, the primary function of the Science Institute, which was to provide advice to this Legislature on matters of science and research and development in the Northwest Territories, actually was very rarely exercised. In my time in this Assembly, since 1979, I can only recall two occasions on which the Legislature actually petitioned the Science Institute to give advice.

One of those matters was the matter of uranium mining in the Northwest Territories. The Science Institute did provide us with some advice, but actually, it was the Assembly itself, in an epic eight-day session in Hay River, with many witnesses, that actually tackled the issue and determined the pros and cons of uranium mining. I think that we got help from the Science Institute, but I don't think they actually ended up giving us specific advice on that matter.

The other matter that I recall, in which there was a request made to the Science Institute, was the matter of finding more modern technology for tanning moose hides. There may have been other matters, Madam Speaker, but those are the only two that I can recall where the Science Institute was asked to pursue its objects of giving advice to the Legislative Assembly on science matters.

There were annual dinners and meetings with the MLAs and the Science Institute, of which useful exchanges took place over supper, but I feel that that primary function was never actually realized. That is not to say that the Science Institute didn't do a great deal of tremendous good work, but I think we have to be honest with ourselves and recognize that that science advisor function and that reporting relationship and exchange relationship with the Legislative Assembly never was actualized or realized.

There are good things the Science Institute did. We now have an excellent system for licensing, scientific research and for giving feedback to communities and MLAs about the nature of that scientific research. Initiatives like science fairs, support of the science fairs, science camps, promoting northern students involved in archaeology, all have been promoted very effectively by the Science Institute. But, in my view, those are more education-related activities or perhaps activities that are more related to the Department of Renewable Resources. I am not sure that those worthwhile activities, in themselves, any longer justify the Science Institute being a stand alone, quasi-independent body.

So, Madam Speaker, I think it is time, especially in these more difficult financial times, to look at rationalizing the science advisory function within a government department. I think this is the trend that we may learn is being pursued in other jurisdictions. I believe that Arctic College will still have the capacity to attract third-party funding and to provide independent advice to the government and to the Legislature on research and development matters.

So, Madam Speaker, in principle, I think it's the way to go. I just want to say in closing, Madam Speaker, that as far as the division of the college is concerned, my understanding is that the board of the Arctic College and the administration are planning on a July 1 target date for implementation of those changes. There have been financial arrangements made, offices leased and staff hired, based on that expectation. So, I think, if I may suggest, that it is urgent that the legislation be carefully considered by this House, but hopefully soon adopted by this Legislature, so the very challenging job of training our human resource requirements in Nunavut, in particular -- and I know there are corresponding needs in the west associated with land claims, and the constitutional and political evolution that will take place there -- may get up and running as soon as possible.

Madam Speaker, I have never spoken at such length...

---Laughter

...to the principle of a bill in my short time in this Legislature. I'm quite sure this is the longest speech I've ever made...

---Laughter

...on the principle of a bill. I thank the honourable Members for their indulgence in permitting this unusual behaviour on my part. Thank you.

---Laughter

Bill 7: An Act To Amend The Arctic College Act
Item 14: Second Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thank you. To the principle of the bill. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Lewis.

Bill 7: An Act To Amend The Arctic College Act
Item 14: Second Reading Of Bills

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Brian Lewis Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I will be as brief as Mr. Patterson, Madam Speaker, in addressing this issue of the principle of this bill. What has bothered me already today, Madam Speaker, is that it is the first day of a new session and it is also the last day of a long work-load that has gone on since January. It bothered me a little bit while I listened to how quickly we agreed to the principle of bills we've never even seen before today.

This one is different because we're familiar with it, but already we've agreed to the second reading of bills we're not even familiar with. I suspect it is because we are tired and, on a day like today, we're probably not giving 100 per cent to everything we're doing. I know the government is going to get its way...

Bill 7: An Act To Amend The Arctic College Act
Item 14: Second Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Mr. Lewis, may I remind you to speak to the principle of the bill. Thank you.

Bill 7: An Act To Amend The Arctic College Act
Item 14: Second Reading Of Bills

Page 28

Brian Lewis Yellowknife Centre

The principle is that the government is going to get its way on this issue, which is the principle of this bill I'm going to question. The politics behind this is one of our own committees of this Assembly recommended that we have two colleges, in recognition of the fact that over the next five or six years there's going to have to be an awful lot of training done, and maybe the needs of the east and the west are going to be somewhat different, and there should be two sets of administration to guide them in the appropriate directions.

However, as a policy issue, the government also decided to do something else, which has nothing to do with this college system at all. It was do with a decision to decentralize the Science Institute. Our committees had never looked at that. It was never an issue of debate. But, now we're being put in a very awkward position of having to support a bill which supports the idea of dividing the college and at the same time repeals another bill which created the Science Institute in the first place, which was designed to serve another purpose.

That was, to provide overall advice to our Legislature, especially in an age of increasing political decisions, to have something with a degree of objectivity. I went there many times, as a legislator, to find out stuff and what is going on, so I didn't just read the political newspapers, but found out what scientists were saying about different things.

I agree with Mr. Patterson that we have probably not made as much use of the Science Institute as we could have over the years, but there have been landmark cases where controversies have been very well recognized and appreciated by Members who really wanted to know the truth. The concern that I have with the principle of this bill is that we're putting ourselves in the very difficult spot of having to agree with one part of it, which has to do with dividing the system into two colleges -- which we all seem to be onside about and we all agree with -- while I am put in the difficult position of having to oppose something that matters so much, especially to the people of Nunavut.

The price I pay is that we lose the independent, scientific objectivity of an institute that ten years ago was considered to be absolutely essential as our political system evolved and developed and we needed to have at least some place where we could get information that was unsullied by political interference. That will now be lost.

All we will have is an advisory council. They've already met, just a couple of weeks ago, and already, the feeling is, what's the point? The science bit is going to be part of another department and it is going to be directly under a Minister who's responsible for the education system and the focus has completely changed. It is not the same as it was before.

I wanted to have this on the record today, Madam Speaker, as an issue of principle, because the principle has been lost. The principle is no longer creating two colleges. The principle has been confused somewhat because now, an added objective is to get rid of something, to back up a policy decision this government made and didn't know how to go through with. They worked on different scenarios and now they've found a clever way of doing it, which is to attach it to another bill, to make it very difficult for someone like me to vote against it. However, I shall be voting against it, now that people know why. Thank you.

---Applause

Bill 7: An Act To Amend The Arctic College Act
Item 14: Second Reading Of Bills

Page 28

The Speaker Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thank you. To the principle of the bill.

Bill 7: An Act To Amend The Arctic College Act
Item 14: Second Reading Of Bills

Page 28

An Hon. Member

Question.

Bill 7: An Act To Amend The Arctic College Act
Item 14: Second Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? Motion is carried.

---Carried

Bill 7 has had second reading. Item 14, second reading of bills. Bills 4, 5, 7 and 8 have all had second reading and, accordingly, the bills will now be referred to committee. Thank you. Item 15, Mr. Clerk, orders of the day.

Item 15: Orders Of The Day
Item 15: Orders Of The Day

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Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton

Madam Speaker, there will be a meeting of the Western Caucus immediately after adjournment this afternoon, followed by a meeting of the Reshaping Northern Government Working Group. Meetings for tomorrow morning at 9:30 of the Chairs' Liaison Committee, at 10:30 of the Ordinary Members' Caucus, at 12:00 noon of the Nunavut Caucus. Orders of the day for Thursday, April 7, 1994.

1. Prayer

2. Ministers' Statements

3. Members' Statements

4. Returns to Oral Questions

5. Oral Questions

6. Written Questions

7. Returns to Written Questions

8. Replies to Opening Address

9. Petitions

10. Reports of Standing and Special Committees

11. Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills

12. Tabling of Documents

13. Notices of Motion

14. Notices of Motions for First Reading of Bills

15. Motions

16. First Reading of Bills

17. Second Reading of Bills

- Bill 2, Aboriginal Custom Adoption Recognition Act

- Bill 3, Guardianship and Trusteeship Act

- Bill 9, An Act to Amend the Charter Communities Act

- Bill 10, An Act to Amend the Cities, Towns and Villages

Act

- Bill 11, An Act to Amend the Hamlets Act

- Bill 12, An Act to Amend the Commissioner's Land Act

18. Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

- Tabled Document 2-12(6), New Social Housing Rent

Scale

19. Report of Committee of the Whole

20. Third Reading of Bills

21. Orders of the Day

Item 15: Orders Of The Day
Item 15: Orders Of The Day

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The Speaker Jeannie Marie-Jewell

Thank you. This House stands adjourned until Thursday, April 7, 1994, at 1:30 pm.

---ADJOURNMENT