This is page numbers 211 - 240 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 7th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was business.

Further Return To Question 86-13(7): Previous Funding Assistance To Giant Mine
Question 86-13(7): Previous Funding Assistance To Giant Mine
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 221

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Mr. Speaker. I understand the money was part of the surplus that was split with the Government of Nunavut. The exact amount that we provided to Giant on what days and what amounts can be provided to the Members. I will circulate that information and also provide what amounts were actually withheld because of the developments with Giant in the last two weeks. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 86-13(7): Previous Funding Assistance To Giant Mine
Question 86-13(7): Previous Funding Assistance To Giant Mine
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment. One of the recommendations contained in the minister's forum was ECE should investigate the need to offer vocational programs and explore options on appropriate methods for offering these programs either at the community, regional or territorial level. Vocational programs. The Minister has just stated that we should have had more lead time to prepare people for the diamond industry, I believe there has probably been a shortage of tradespeople in the Northwest Territories for a number of years and this is something specifically in my community, vocational program in the high school has been talked about for 20 years. Should we have any renewed hope of preparing our students for occupations in trades and in the diamond field based on this recommendation now when we have not seen any action on this in the last 20 years? Thank you.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Miltenberger.

Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the saying goes, the hope springs eternal from the human breast. I think we always have to be optimistic, in spite of what we see as the lack of revenue to proceed on a lot of these issues. We meant just this morning, for instance, with members of your community and the Ice Diamond people about the employment opportunities in the diamond sector and the need for the schools and the college to be involved in that. As well the college is currently trying to gear up and tool up its apprenticeship programs to address and meet the significant shortfall in terms of tradesmen, millwrights, welders, electricians, plumbers, et cetera. We are gearing up. There is no new money, in fact, to do this. A lot of the funds we do have we are looking for third party funding. We have increased that funding significantly in the last few years.

Yes, I think there is cause for hope. What that exactly translates to in terms of vocational programs in Hay River, I cannot tell you at this point. I can tell you that our 6:45 a.m. meeting this morning addressed the issue of how we are pulling these recommendations together and the work that is going to be done on those. Thank you.

Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 221

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I hope that my comments and questions do not contradict Mr. Ootes's position that he took on no new initiatives without the money. That is a concern and I think if we are realistic, we should not try and career path or education path everybody along academic lines strictly, that there is a good opportunity under the budget and money already allocated for high schools to get students started in that stream before they get to apprenticeships or college or choose an actual trade or profession. Could the Minister indicate whether or not there would be the opportunity within high schools that currently exist to add vocational training if it did not include more funding, is that an opportunity that is available at this time for high schools to integrate vocational trades and training at the high school level at this time?

Supplementary To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would say that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment is willing and committed to look at all these particular opportunities if the community wants to define where they think some of the needs are. I met with Mr. Butler from BHP and talked about the very issue of going to the schools on the issue of vocational trades and the needs for tradesmen. As well, I am meeting with the Ministerial Forum on mine training on Thursday and that is one of the issues we are going to be looking at. I would say, yes, and I would hope that the DECs and the DEA in Hay River are putting pen to paper in terms of how they would like to see that happen.

Further Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 221

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 221

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, can the Minister tell us, does the department at this time have any way of tracking or identifying where there are trades, where currently we are bringing people in from southern Canada to fill trade positions? Can they quantify the needs for tradespeople in the various industries at this time?

Supplementary To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 221

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. To my knowledge we do not have a database of that nature but it is one of the issues that I talked about earlier in regards to a response to Mr. Henry of the need to be able to do that. To anticipate and forecast and point out where the needs are short-term and long-term in terms of those types of occupations so

that we can plan and gear up our systems to meet the demand. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 222

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 222

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At this time the Minister cannot tell us that the department knows for example, if there is a shortage in the area of heavy duty mechanics, automotive mechanics, I mean how can we gear our education system to these needs out there in the workforce if we do not have any idea of where there is a shortage. Do we need welders in the Northwest Territories right now? Where are we lacking or does the department even know? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 222

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 222

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The department has an idea, we know for instance that BHP is importing a lot of skilled tradesmen from the south, welders, millwrights, all those type of trades. We know in the different areas. I have not yet been made aware of any type of coordinated database that brings it all together to allow us to forecast. We do have information, but it is not as well put together as I would like. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Question period is over. Mr. Krutko.

Further Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 222

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to return to recognition of visitors in the gallery.

Further Return To Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Question 87-13(7): Vocational Training In High Schools
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 222

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Mackenzie Delta is seeking unanimous consent to return to item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Krutko, you have unanimous consent.

Revert To Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Revert To Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 222

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At this time it gives me great honour to recognize Roberta Vaneltsi and her young son, Joel, and my newly appointed constituency assistant, Ms. Sharon Firth who is a former Olympic cross-country skier on the national team and a famous athlete at that. I would like to welcome Roberta, Joel and Sharon.

--Applause

Revert To Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Revert To Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 222

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Welcome to the Assembly. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 7, written questions. Item 8, returns to written questions. Item 9, replies to opening address. Item 10, replies to Budget Address. Mr. Erasmus.

Budget Reply 1-13(7)
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

April 19th, 1999

Page 222

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, before I start, I would like to congratulate the Minister of Finance on his first budget, although we are in a way balancing our budget, I guess it is still technically a deficit budget because we are going over our allocated revenues and using up our surplus from last year which, of course, only occurred because of the one-time injection of revenue from the federal government due to our population.

Mr. Speaker, I wanted to indicate that we do indeed have a lot of social challenges as the Minister has indicated in his address, and we are trying to address those social challenges. We have extended grades, this has increased enrolments in the communities and the people who required a better education are taking advantage of that. Many of the community people, the aboriginal people, are dropping out at the grade 9 or grade 10 level and this seems to be helping. I too, would like to commend the Minister for putting more money into the school system to ensure that the pupil/teacher ratio is maintained. However, Mr. Speaker, as we have heard, we do have the highest pupil/teacher ratio in Canada and simply putting enough money into the system to maintain the current ratio is not good enough. We need to decrease that ratio. We need to work on making the amount of students in our classrooms less in relation to the amount of teachers there. Particularly with social passing and inclusive schooling, we need more assistance in those classrooms. Mr. Speaker, while I think it was a good move to ensure that the pupil/teacher ratio does not increase, I think we have to work at decreasing that.

The Working Together Program, which provides employers with a wage subsidy to help students work in the summer and basically I guess this is for during the year as well, putting more money back into this program as it was supposed to end this year, was a very good move. I certainly support that 100 percent. Also Mr. Speaker, the Investing in People Program, was also supposed to end this year, and the Minister was able to find $1 million to put into this program to help keep adult basic education in some communities for the first time were able to get adult basic education. I fully support this as well. Hopefully, this will mean that the program for the first time was supported in Yellowknife North constituency of Detah, Ndilo will continue to be supported this year.

Mr. Speaker, I was very pleased to see in the Minister's comments that children are a priority of this government and of course we all support that and we support the continued support of the Health Children Initiative. Under health care, Mr. Speaker, we all know that the turn over rate for nurses is very high and this, I guess, substantiates that it is much higher than the governments staff average turnover. This also substantiates that our salary and benefits packages have not remained competitive enough with southern jurisdictions. We have been asking that in the past and I do not think we have received a straight answer. So this substantiates that. I am very glad to see we are putting more money into recruitment and retention in the health care area, specifically scholarships, summer employment and $3 million for salary incentives. I do not know how they are going to do that. I understand we have unionized workers and as far as I know, we have just finished signing an agreement. How this is done I suppose, will have to be done very carefully, and with the cooperation and assistance of the unions. It is a good move, because we cannot offer less than the provinces are offering, because people will naturally go to a warmer climate. The majority of them anyways.

Mr. Speaker, the one area that does concern me, I do not see anything in here relating to housing. Since this government saw fit to do away with the housing that we used to provide for our teachers, nurses and other staff personnel, we seem to be having a hard time hanging on to those personnel. People are moving at an alarming rate and obviously this is substantiated in here when it says that the turnover rate for nurses is much higher than the government staff average and those are the nurses in the smaller communities. So this still has to be dealt with.

Mr. Speaker, I am very glad to see we are putting some money into the justice system, to improve the community justice and correction services and to have a dedicated probation and parole service that will work specifically on parole services and probation services. This has been needed for a long time and we have spoken about this in the past as Members of the social programs committee and also on the rehabilitation programs. We know that particularly in the Yellowknife Correctional Centre, the situation is so bad that the spaces that had been at one time put in place for adult basic education or whatever type of rehabilitation programs, those are all now used to warehouse those inmates. I recently had an opportunity to visit the Yellowknife Correctional Centre and I was appalled, Mr. Speaker. There is absolutely no room, I think there is one room that is available for art and that is about it. Every place else, even places where they were supposed to be eating and for recreation, those are now all used up with bunks to house the inmates. The renovations to the Yellowknife Correctional Centre are very, very welcome. I am glad to see this is happening.

The Community Assistance, Fire Prevention and Safety Program that has been initiated, I think is long overdue. Every year we hear of another school, or co-op building or something else that has been burned down whether by accident or through arson, and this is a huge drain on our resources. Obviously it is a shock to the community, as well, when these types of facilities are lost. The fire prevention and safety program is very welcome.

Mr. Speaker, in the area of housing I would also like to mention that the Cabinet made a very, very good move when they initiated the Minimum Down Payment Assistance Program. I know particularly in Yellowknife with the loss of jobs and the uncertainty created by Giant, Con mines and other areas, there were a lot of people who had their houses on the market and they were not able to sell those houses. This has given those people an opportunity to sell their houses. Many of them may have actually lost their homes because they were not able to meet their mortgage payments. This has now given them an opportunity to get out of those commitments and to allow other people who do have the money to meet their mortgage payments, but may not have had the money for the down payment. This has helped out on both sides of the fence, the people who were waiting, perhaps were saving and would have had to save for years in order to get into a home, it has helped those people. It has also helped those people who could not sell their homes. I believe this was a very good initiative. Obviously there have been some complaints that there were not enough restrictions but, of course, it is always easier with hindsight to say you could have done this, you could have done that. I believe if we do this again in the future the Cabinet and the Minister responsible for Housing will have the benefit of this past experience to put some more restrictions in place so that perhaps some of these loopholes will be covered.

Mr. Speaker, we know that we are going to need a lot of jobs in the future for our young people. We have the youngest population in Canada and I am glad to see we are putting some money into projects to take advantage of the new diamond mines and those types of activities. I am also am glad to see that the resource potential in oil and gas has not been forgotten. We have heard many times in this House where people such as Mr. Krutko, who has those potentials in his area, have been very concerned about this.

Mr. Speaker, I am glad to see that we are looking at economic diversification because we simply cannot rely on mega projects such as those diamond mines and other mines. We cannot rely on those alone. The mines are only in existence for a certain period of time. We have seen time and time again that it is not the community people who take advantage of the jobs and the economic opportunities that are presented when these mega projects happen. A lot of these opportunities go to southern people and to southern companies. I am very glad to see this government looking at economic diversification and I certainly hope that we are talking about looking at things like tourism and other investments so that some of the communities like Kakisa, Detah, Fort McPherson, those smaller communities can also benefit.

Mr. Speaker, I am very glad to see that there is no increase in our tax rates. I know that people are always saying we need more revenue, we need more revenue, but we simply cannot afford to tax our people at a higher rate. If we really sat down and analyzed how much money would be generated by increasing taxes, it is not that great an amount. Rather than placing a greater burden on our people and actually scaring people from moving up here, I think it is a good move to keep these rates lower so that people will not be frightened off and will move up here. Particularly, corporate income tax rates, we do have the lowest with the exception of Quebec and I think we have to keep that in place because it is expensive enough for corporations to move up here and to do business, we do not also have to have a high corporate tax system so that it is an added burden on them to do business up here. Of course, this does not mean that we have to give them an open cheque book and let them do all kinds of environmental damage and the rest of that. This all has to come hand in hand, but I think it is a good move to keep our corporate taxes low.

Mr. Speaker, there has been a lot of talk about gaining northern control of northern resources and getting some movement on the tax window so that we can benefit more from the taxes and the royalty revenues from the new mines and any other new developments that occur. Mr. Speaker, obviously with a decline in our population and people have moved out of the territories due to losses of jobs, insecurity, and those types of things, because of that our budget will remain the same or perhaps even go lower in the future. We do need additional resources but we cannot get those additional resources, we cannot make a deal with the federal government on our own, we have to make that deal with the aboriginal governments. We know that, the aboriginal governments know that, because the Minister of Indian Affairs and Northern Development has stated that we have to do that. We have to have all the aboriginal governments, the main aboriginal governments on side. They have to agree.

I am glad to hear and to see in writing that the Minister of Finance says we have to do this in partnership with the aboriginal governments because we know that in the recent past there were some aboriginal governments who took exception with some of our Cabinet Members. They had mistakenly thought that the government was trying to move ahead on their own. We know from our meetings that this government is not moving ahead on its own and wishes to work in partnership with the aboriginal governments. I would like to encourage our Cabinet colleagues to try to move ahead as quickly as possible so that we can, in fact, ensure that we do gain control over those resources and perhaps are able to get a greater tax window and greater royalties from the resources in the Northwest Territories. As we all know, Mr. Speaker, if we do not do that it will mean a decrease in our programs and services. It will mean that the programs and services that we can provide to our constituents will not be as good as they are today. I do not think that anybody wants that. Thank you.

--Applause

Budget Reply 1-13(7)
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

Page 224

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Replies to the Budget Address. Item 11, petitions. We will take a 15 minute break.

--Break

Budget Reply 1-13(7)
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

Page 224

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

I will call the House back to order. Item 12, reports of standing and special committees. Mr. Erasmus.