This is page numbers 693 - 720 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 7th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was aboriginal.

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Supplementary To Question 250-13(7): Government Response To Aboriginal Request
Question 250-13(7): Government Response To Aboriginal Request
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 701

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. I am going to rule the question out of order because we all know, in this House, what the question is about. It is a matter that is in front of the committee. Oral questions. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today are for the Minister responsible for the Department of Justice. Mr. Speaker, I made a Member's statement today, and I have been asking questions in the House. I want to make it clear from the outset that I have no particular axe to grind with Mr. Kakfwi or any of the Cabinet Ministers, for that matter. I do recognize that Mr. Kakfwi was not the Minister of Justice when the original decision was made regarding the location of the young offenders facility. I wanted to preface my questions with that so that there is no confusion about that. Yesterday, in response to a question in the House, Mr. Kakfwi answered for me. He stated, and I quote from unedited Hansard, "I know that there is no time to ask and consult MLAs and communities about where else we could possibly locate this one facility," (referring to the young offenders) "let alone two facilities." My question, Mr. Speaker, is why can we not take the time to revisit and consult communities and MLAs on this decision? Thank you.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Justice, Mr. Kakfwi.

Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 701

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday I tried, in a very gentlemanly way, to point out that the Cabinet, under Premier Morin last year, made a decision to locate a young offenders male facility here in Yellowknife. There were, as I recall, no provisions made for consultation with MLAs or the public.

Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin, your point of order.

Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, for the last few days, I continue to hear the rhetoric out of this Minister referring to previous decisions made by myself as the Premier. I ask you to rule on that because he is talking about previous positions I had. He also mentions and leads the public to believe that he never sat on the same Cabinet. Now, I know he used to hide behind me in my decisions, but he is standing on his own two feet, and he has to get out there one of these days and do that. He should take possession of his decisions, Mr. Speaker. But also I would appreciate it if he quits referring to what I did previously.

Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. What is your point of order?

Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I just made it.

Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 701

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

I would like to ask the Members to refrain from making reference to Members that have served, whether they are Ministers or not, that no longer are in those positions and even those that were in those positions that cannot defend themselves in this Chamber now, that we should not allow references regarding decisions that were made. Just as we do not make references to the past Assemblies as to what happened during the 12th Assembly is not allowed in this House. I do not think, it is fair to other Members when they are no longer in the position they cannot defend themselves. It is unfair to them, and it is not appropriate. I would like to ask the Members that they refrain from what happened in the past if those Members cannot defend themselves.

The Minister of Justice is not in this House, the previous minister, to defend himself on any of the decisions that were made too. It is not fair. It is in-appropriate. I would appreciate the Members if they would respect each other by being more courteous in the way they ask questions, as well as in the way they respond. Thank you. Just a reminder to the Members, Mr. Morin does not have a point of order. Mr. Kakfwi.

Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 701

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you for allowing me to wrap up the first part of my response. The point I was trying to make is that decisions to locate and to carry out certain work, one of which is a $30 million capital commitment, was made over a year ago by Cabinet. I was

trying to spread out the credit.

--Applause

But, if that is not to be the case, that is fine. But Cabinet takes responsibility for the decision that was made at that time. There was no explicit call, at that time, to have wide-ranging consultation about where those facilities would be located or whether or not the $30 million renovation to the adult facility located here in Yellowknife should be considered as a possible total replacement project. No, the Cabinet just decided yes, to locate the young male offenders facility here in Yellowknife, no consultation, no discussion. The same with the $30 million renovation to the adult facility. So the decisions were made last year.

The Member is asking is there any consultation available now. The decisions were made over a year ago. That is the point I was trying to make. I would like to get some credit for saying that, as a Minister who was assigned to this portfolio in April, I did take the time, at the request of certain Members, to review the decisions that were made to see if there were any arguments that could be made to revisit these issues. I have decided, as interested as I was, that it is not in the interest of the public, this government, the inmates or the people that we have commitments to, to revisit the issues at this time. I do not believe we have the time to consult and to put these projects back on the table. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my supplementary question is, I understand that the decision was made previously but now many things about this project have changed. The method of delivery, the scope of the project and the location of the project. All of these things have changed now so forget about the previous Cabinet, I am asking this Minister now, is it within his ability, within his power to revisit this subject now? Because I think the whole thing has been reopened. I think the whole thing could be re-examined now and there could be viable and compelling arguments out there if the department could hear from MLAs and could hear from communities. I do not think it does the project justice to proceed now we have an opening to have that. Is it within the Minister's authority to revisit this subject? He? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there has been an undertaking on my part as a Minister to review the basis on which these previous decisions were made. To find our for myself whether or not these decisions were in fact decisions that were sound and should be continued to be supported by me, and whether there were any probable or reasonable grounds on which to go back to Cabinet to ask Cabinet to reconsider. Not only these two projects, but in fact also a number of other capital projects. I have decided that there would be no particular good that would come of me revisiting and reopening this whole issue that has seen extensive work and resources put to advance it to this stage. So, it is my view, and I asked Cabinet if they still stand behind the decision and Cabinet has indicated they stand behind the decisions made by Cabinet and FMB last year. That is where we are now, we are ready to proceed with the decisions that have been made and we look forward to discussing some changes to the financial aspects of the proceedings. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Further Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I do thank the Minister for his answer, however it is not the answer to my question. My question is, is it within his power, his authority as a Minister of Justice to now conduct consultation and revisit this? He said he has looked at some of the arguments that were made for the decision that was previously made and he concurs with them. But how could he know whether or not they were sound decisions and based on sound information not knowing what other communities may have to offer?

For example, Hay River did not have the opportunity to put forward a proposal of what we could offer in our community. Yesterday the subject came up of services. Hay River has a wonderful hospital. We have a full complement of RCMP detachment. We have counselling services. We have a courthouse. We have many facilities that could complement the establishment of this facility in Hay River. Without that information in hand, I do not know how the Minister could possibly make a comprehensive judgement on this subject, but my question is again, does he have the authority and power to revisit it given the substantive changes in the project recently without consultation? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is going to be a very short response. I do not have the authority to undo a decision of Cabinet, to undermine a decision of Cabinet on my own. I cannot go out and consult and set up a process to undo a decision of Cabinet without expressed approval of Cabinet. I do not have that authority to do that. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 702

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, perhaps then if the Minister does not have that authority, he might provide me with some advice or some guidance as to how

we could revisit this because the argument that was made for Cabinet deciding to replace the YCC where it is because it was a replacement. You could apply that same argument to Hay River. The young offenders facility capital project was a replacement. There was no discussion about moving the adult facility. The same argument should apply to Hay River. There should have been no discussion about moving it if it was a replacement of an existing facility. Could the Minister please provide me with some avenue, some access that I may have to appeal to Cabinet to reconsider this decision because if they would at least give us the opportunity, I am sure we could make a very convincing argument for our community. Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Whether or not the decision, in the first instance, in isolation or in tandem with the decision to locate capital facilities elsewhere at that particular time, the fact is, as a Minister and as a Cabinet, we believe that locating the adult facility here is the most logical thing to do. To construct a young offenders facility here in partnership with the construction of the adult facility is the way to go. It is my view that we do not have time to revisit this, to put this back on the table. It means the entire capital projects should then also follow the same. We are not in the business of revisiting Cabinet decisions and opening up capital projects that have been voted on and committed to in this House in Cabinet and in the Financial Management Board. The time to have consulted was prior to June, 1998, and September, 1998. That, unfortunately, as far as I know, was not done. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Question 251-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facilities
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Krutko.

Question 252-13(7): Progress On Northern Accord Negotiations
Item 6: Oral Questions

July 28th, 1999

Page 703

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Premier. It is in regards to my Member's statement and the lack of progress in the area of the Northern Accord and also the developments that are taking place, yet there is very little progress in the area of the Northern Accord Agreement which was transferred from the federal government to this government to start negotiating the federal transfer devolution of the Northern Accord for oil and gas mineral resources to the Government of the Northwest Territories. Mr. Speaker, we have a lot of development happening. There was an agreement signed just yesterday between the Alberta government and TransCanada Pipelines to start looking at oil and gas reserves in the western Canadian sedimentary basin that goes from Alberta all the way up to the Beaufort Sea. There was mention also that they were looking at the oil and gas in the Beaufort Delta.

Mr. Speaker, my question to the Premier is, it has been over ten years since this agreement was signed off between the federal government and the Government of the Northwest Territories to conclude those negotiations. Can the Premier tell me how much of a priority is it for this government to conclude those negotiations and what resources have been put to concluding these negotiations? What is the department doing to try to ensure that we do work in this area? Thank you.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Premier, Mr. Antoine. I heard three questions.