This is page numbers 693 - 720 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 7th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was aboriginal.

Topics

Members Present

Honourable Jim Antoine, Honourable Charles Dent, Mr. Erasmus, Honourable Sam Gargan, Mrs. Groenewegen, Mr. Henry, Honourable Stephen Kakfwi, Mr. Krutko, Honourable Michael Miltenberger, Mr. Morin, Mr. Ootes, Mr. Rabesca, Honourable Floyd Roland, Honourable Vince Steen.

Oh, God, may your spirit and guidance be in us as we work for the benefit of all our people, for peace and justice in our land and for the constant recognition of the dignity and aspirations of those whom we serve. Amen.

Item 1: Prayer
Item 1: Prayer

Page 693

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. Good afternoon. Orders of the day, item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Antoine.

Minister's Statement 81-13(7): Dogrib Agreement-in-principle
Item 2: Ministers' Statements

July 28th, 1999

Page 693

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to announce that negotiations have reached an important milestone with the Dogrib First Nation and Canada on the first combined land claim and self-government agreement-in-principle in the Northwest Territories.

This agreement-in-principle is historic. It represents a new chapter in the development of new governance models in the North. It also is an example of this government's support and recognition of the aboriginal inherent right to self-government.

We are committed to investing the time and resources necessary to develop new partnership arrangements with aboriginal governments. We have emphasized many times that peoples must develop respectful relationships with one another to make the North a better place to live in and to raise our children.

We know the political landscape of the North is changing dramatically, as we work to redefine our relationships. Just four short months ago, the people of Nunavut achieved their goal of a new territory. Now we continue the process of redesigning our system of governance in the Northwest Territories. This must be done with aboriginal and public governments.

Mr. Speaker, the Dogrib Agreement-in-Principle will be initialled by the three chief negotiators at the Dogrib Annual General Assembly in Gameti on August 9, 1999. By initialling this document, the negotiators are recommending the document to their respective governments for review. Just as importantly in our view, this will allow the document to be released for the information and consideration of all interested parties.

Once approved and signed by all three parties, the agreement-in-principle will set the framework for negotiating a final agreement.

Mr. Speaker, while this is an important and historic event in this process, it is important to note that several outstanding issues need to be resolved before a final agreement can be concluded. Key amongst these are issues related to the financing of self-government. We have not yet reached a resolution at the Dogrib table on self-government financing, fiscal arrangements or taxation issues. The Minister of Finance will be following up with a more detailed statement on these issues later today.

Mr. Speaker, another key issue for the Government of the Northwest Territories is the resolution of overlap issues between the Dogrib First Nation and adjacent regions.

This government continues to insist that substantial progress must be made to resolve these outstanding overlap issues before the agreement-in-principle can be signed. Therefore, I urge the Dogrib First Nation to immediately enter into discussions with aboriginal governments with overlap interests in the North Slave region to develop a process that will lead to a fair and mutually satisfactory resolution of these issues.

Mr. Speaker, getting to this important milestone at the Dogrib table has been a challenge. However, it shows that aboriginal rights negotiations in the Northwest Territories are moving forward in a positive, constructive and timely manner.

I would like to recognize the hard work and dedication shown by the three chief negotiators and their teams during this process and thank them for their valuable contributions. This government will take the opportunity after initialling to fully review the document and to work on resolving some of the outstanding issues that remain, including those that I have outlined here today.

Mr. Speaker, the Dogrib Agreement-in-Principle will become a public document after it is initialled on August 9. I encourage the Members of this House and all citizens of the Northwest Territories with an interest in this matter to take some time to review it. Mahsi cho, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Minister's statement. Mr. Dent.

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, good afternoon. Mr. Speaker, I would like to follow up on the Premier's statement regarding the draft Dogrib Agreement-in-Principle by providing more detail on some of the financial issues. The Dogrib AIP represents a very significant amount of work on the part of the three parties. It is a crucial and historic

step for the Dogrib First Nation in realizing their aspirations.

The AIP reflects the successful conclusion of negotiations on most issues. However, negotiations on self-government financing, fiscal arrangements and taxation issues have not yet been finalized. The three parties have agreed to complete these negotiations during the final agreement phase.

Mr. Speaker, in order to clarify the GNWT's position and to provide an opportunity for public discussion, I will table today a document called Financing the Implementation of Self-Government - GNWT Principles. This document explains in some detail the proposed approach of the GNWT when negotiating fiscal arrangements with the Dogrib First Nation and Canada. These principles represent the position of this government and reflect our continued commitment to negotiate self-government agreements that are practical, affordable and which will ensure that all governments have the financial capacity to exercise their powers and meet their residents' needs.

The first and most important issue is to determine the costs to implement self-government and who will pay those costs.

There will be additional one-time and ongoing costs to establish self-government institutions and service delivery structures. The cost to implement self-government is a fiduciary responsibility of the federal government. Further, the GNWT maintains that, given our limited fiscal resources, we do not have the ability to pay for incremental costs, without compromising our ability to continue to provide the same level of programs and services to territorial residents. For both these reasons, the GNWT's position is that Canada is responsible for funding incremental costs.

The second issue is whether money would flow to the Dogrib First Nation government through the GNWT or directly from Canada. The position of the GNWT is that it will act as the funding agent where programs and services are delivered by governments or institutions that represent and serve all residents.

In areas where a First Nations government exercises its exclusive jurisdiction over its citizens or its land, the GNWT's position is that funding should flow directly from Canada. The GNWT would, in both cases, contribute its share of current expenditures on relevant programs and services.

Third, Mr. Speaker, with respect to taxation, the parties will strive to reach agreement on the extent of the taxation powers of the Dogrib First Nation government. A taxation agreement will be negotiated prior to concluding the final agreement.

Mr. Speaker, I would also like to applaud the commitment and excellent efforts of the negotiating teams and acknowledge the extensive amount of work to date.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Ministers' statements. Mr. Roland.

Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to inform the Members of the Legislative Assembly that the Minister's Forum on Health and Social Services has begun its work. The forum will focus on ways to sustain and improve the health and social services system in the NWT.

MLAs and other stakeholders in the health and social services system nominated forum members. The nine forum members are:

- Ms. Glenna Hansen, co-hair, Inuvik;

- Mr. Duncan MacNeill, co-chair, Hay River;

- Ms. Rita Cli, Fort Simpson;

- Mr. Don Blaquiere, Fort Smith;

- Dr. Ross Wheeler, Yellowknife, who represents the NWT Medical Association;

- Ms. Dee McCallum, Yellowknife, who represents the NWT Registered Nurses Association;

- Ms. Gina Dolphus, Deline;

- Ms. Hazel Nerysoo, Fort McPherson; and

- Mr. Blair Dunbar, Yellowknife, who represents the NWT Social Workers Association.

All forum members have been involved in the delivery of health and social services in the North. In selecting the members, I tried to achieve a balanced panel. It was difficult to choose from among the many well qualified Northerners nominated to the forum.

The forum members met in Yellowknife July 13-16 for a thorough orientation to the health and social services system and to develop their consultation schedule and work plan. Consultations will take place with the public, professional associations, aboriginal organizations, communities, health and social services boards and other stakeholders.

The purpose of the forum is to recommend ways to improve and sustain the health and social services system. I have asked them to focus on four areas including:

-Leadership and governance of the system;

-Human resources;

-Financial sustainability; and

-Program and service delivery.

Community meetings will be held from August 31 to September 9. Information on meeting times and locations will be advertised in early August.

Northerners who cannot attend a community meeting will be able to make written submissions. Advertisements calling for written submissions will soon appear in community newspapers. A toll-free phone number will also be set up to allow people to call in and give their comments.

Forum members will participate in a territorial health and wellness conference planned for October. At this time they will present an interim report on the results of their community meetings. The forum will then prepare a final report and submit their recommendations for sustaining and improving the health and social services system. I expect to receive their final report in early December.

As Members of this House know, our health and social services system is facing significant challenges. We need to act now to ensure that we have a sustainable and efficient system. I am confident that the forum will provide appropriate and affordable recommendations to ensure that our system continues to provide quality care and remains sustainable in the long term. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Mr. Steen.

Vince Steen

Vince Steen Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to announce that on May 30th and June 1st the Aboriginal Sport Circle of the Western Arctic held its first annual general meeting in Dettah, Northwest Territories. Aboriginal recreation leaders and volunteers from the Inuvik, Sahtu, Deh Cho, North Slave and the South Slave regions attended this gathering. The purpose of this meeting was to select a board of directors and to set the course for this newly formed organization for the new year.

Mr. Speaker, the Aboriginal Sport Circle of the Western Arctic has been established to work with other partners to promote and enhance community wellness and cultural awareness through sport and recreation. The Aboriginal Sport Circle is working in partnership with Sport North and Municipal and Community Affairs to encourage aboriginal youth in the Northwest Territories to participate in the sport, recreation and cultural activities to live healthy, productive and spiritual lifestyles.

Mr. Speaker, the Aboriginal Sport Circle desires to make a difference by working together with communities, Sport North, territorial sport organizations and our department to increase participation of aboriginal youth in sport at the community, territorial and national levels. The Aboriginal Sport Circle of the Western Arctic was created to enhance the current sport and recreation system's ability to respond to the needs for accessible, equitable, and affordable sport, recreation and cultural opportunities in smaller communities. These activities continue to play an essential role in enhancing individual lifestyles and in addressing issues such as alcohol, substance abuse and unemployment.

The Aboriginal Sport Circle will also serve as a facilitation body whereby the communities of the Western Arctic work together in partnership to increase participation of aboriginal youth in a variety of sports at all levels. The Aboriginal Sport Circle will work with Sport North, territorial sport organizations and the department to develop athletes and coaches for regional, territorial and national level competitions.

Mr. Speaker, the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs supports the Aboriginal Sport Circle of the Western Arctic working in partnership with Sport North and its member territorial sport organizations. This will ensure that all residents of the NWT have access to sport and recreation opportunities while avoiding unnecessary duplication of administration or services. This will also allow for the development of a better sport and recreation system while working within the existing resources available. It will also allow the organization to provide some focus on addressing unique issues facing sport development in the smaller predominantly aboriginal NWT communities. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Mr. Miltenberger.

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Department of Education, Culture and Employment produced its current strategic plan in 1994. This plan has provided the vision and direction for the department's work over the past six years. In December, 1998, the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment announced a review of the plan. The purpose of this review was to update the strategic plan based on the changes that have occurred in the Northwest Territories and our vision as a new territory. As part of that process, the Minister's Forum on Education was appointed to hear the views of NWT residents on what is working and what could be improved in the education system. The forum undertook a very broad consultation process across the NWT, visiting eleven communities and receiving a number of written submissions.

Mr. Speaker, in April this year, I tabled the report of the Minister's Forum on Education in the Assembly. The report outlined both the strengths of the current system and the areas where people would like to see improvement. While the forum results are intended to be part of the longer term strategic plan update, there were a number of issues raised in the report where more immediate and short-term action was possible. We decided it was important to provide a swift response to the forum recommendations, highlighting what could be done right away. During a meeting in May, DEC and DEA chairs also expressed their support for taking quick action, where possible, on the forum recommendations.

Later today, I will be tabling our response to the nine areas of concern identified by the forum. The response speaks mainly to the actions that the department will undertake. However, these actions will also be supported by the Divisional Education Councils and District Education Authorities through other activity at the regional and school levels.

Without question, Mr. Speaker, some of the forum recommendations will need additional resources if they are to be fully implemented. As we look at future years' budgets, these needs will be reflected in our decisions as a department. However, in the meantime, staff have identified a number of actions which will have a positive impact on the areas of concern. The response speaks to those actions. The feedback from the Minister's forum and this response will be included in the longer term strategic plan update, which will be completed by September. The actions I am putting forward today are consistent with the overall direction and vision for the department over the next five to ten years.

Mr. Speaker, we believe that this response demonstrates our commitment to seriously addressing the forum's recommendations. The actions are positive and realistic within our current resources and will contribute to the continuing process of our education system. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

-Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Members' statements. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I want to as concisely as possible recount the events and ironic contradictions which have led to the debate which has taken place in the House this week surrounding the government's decision to construct a collocated adult and male young offenders facility in Yellowknife. Mr. Speaker, I am obviously most familiar and most concerned with the young offenders facility component of this project. For a number of years Hay River was the home of a triple designated young offenders facility accommodating open custody, secure custody, and remand-detained youth. The structure was originally built as a receiving home for children. After being taken over as a young offenders facility, structural deficiencies under the fire and building codes were addressed to satisfy requirements on an ongoing basis, with the understanding that complete replacement would be required at some point in the future. The replacement of the facility was indicated in the five year capital plan.

Then along came the concept of Public/Private Partnerships, or P3. MLAs were canvassed to find out if there were projects in their ridings which might be adapted to P3 projects, thus alleviating pressure on the government's dwindling capital budget and involving private sector investment and generating much needed economic activity to diminish the negative impact that this diminished activity was having on our construction sector. After a brief scan of potential interest in my community for converting this projected capital replacement project to a Public/Private Partnership, I wrote to the Minister of Justice identifying this project. A list of 27 other projects was provided to Government Operations after departments provided input as to projected cost and level of priority of these facilities to their operations. On the list of 27 projects it clearly stated, replacement of young offenders facility Hay River, $10 million, high priority. After narrowing the list of projects in consultation with Government Operations, the Hay River young offenders facility was still on the short list of 12 projects.

It was not until the then Finance Minister, John Todd, issued a press release listing the P3 projects that Hay River's name was missing beside replacement of young offenders facility. When I questioned the Finance Minister in the House, he was evasive, but in private he assured me that he was pushing hard for Hay River but was meeting with resistance. Mr. Speaker, I would like to seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement. Thank you.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Hay River is seeking unanimous consent to conclude her statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mrs. Groenewegen, you have unanimous consent.

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you, colleagues. Moving this project from a GNWT capital project to a P3 eliminated the requirement for usual consultation and review by the Standing Committee on Social Programs. Then even P3 protocol was breached when I came to learn that the P3 was in fact being split and going to Inuvik and to Yellowknife for a new young offenders facility. I found this out through a press release issued by then Minister Goo Arlooktoo when I walked by the Member's fax machine and happened to see a press release laying on it. I was assured by the Deputy Minster of Justice that the decision was a result of a report called the McCready report, which provided several options for meeting the future needs for young offenders facilities and programming. But a nagging doubt persisted, based on the Mr. Todd's opinion that this decision had been based on politics. If the decision had truly been made in the best interests of our youth, how could I reasonably argue with it? But was it political?

For this reason, shortly after the departure of the Nunavut Cabinet Ministers, I wrote to Mr. Kakfwi, the new Minister of Justice, asking him to revisit this decision so that I could be assured the decision was made for sound reasons and not as a result of any political attentions which might have existed at the time. I received a response from Mr. Kakfwi, and since Mr. Kakfwi was and is a Minister I have a great deal of respect for and confidence in, I again laid aside the issue of the young offenders facility, somewhat more confident that I had enough information to satisfy my own concerns and any concerns that might still linger for my constituents. Then came this week and the revelation that with no consultation with the Standing Committee on Social Programs, the location, method of delivery, and scope of this facility has again changed. To me, this reinforces the need to re-examine the whole issue and assessment of all factors affecting this project. The best decision must be evaluated on the basis of many factors, some of which include cost, available services in the community, and the fair distribution of government infrastructure.

Mr. Speaker, sometimes I wonder if this Cabinet thinks that capital budget means money to be spent in the capital, Yellowknife.

--Applause

Mr. Speaker, I appeal to the Minister of Justice, in the name of justice and fairness and in view of the many ironies, contradictions, and deviations from normal process, not to change his mind as to where this facility should be located but to go back to the drawing board and put in place proper consultation with the appropriate committees, and put in place a process whereby communities such as the one that I represent could have a fair and level opportunity to prepare a proposal and make presentation to him and his department for the proper, careful, and comprehensive consideration of this very important decision, because I know that we could make compelling arguments just given the opportunity. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. Morin.

Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Earlier in this same session, last winter, once Justice de Weerdt's decision had become public knowledge and after a motion passed in this Legislative Assembly urging the government to appeal that decision, the Premier, speaking on behalf of the government stood in this Legislative Assembly and said he would not appeal because of the advice that he received from this government.

At that time, the government said they were looking for political solutions. I said at that time that this government abandoned the aboriginal governments of the western Arctic and I feel more strongly about that today, Mr. Speaker, that this government abandoned the aboriginal governments of the western Arctic.

Yesterday, Mr. Speaker, July 28, 1999, July 28, 1999, is a dark day in the history of the 13th Legislative Assembly because now what this government has chosen to do is abandon the rest of the people of the Northwest Territories. Why do they choose to do that? Because they choose not to take action. They choose to pass the buck to the 14th Legislative Assembly, the next Legislative Assembly. There was plenty of time left in our mandate, Mr. Speaker, to carry out a constitutional commission for this Assembly to develop it and carry it out. What does the government choose to do? The government chooses to do nothing. Why are they here? To do nothing, to do nothing for the people of the western Arctic. That was the last hope that you could deal with it on the same level as Bill 15 is being dealt with. Bill 15 will be considered in this House, that should be considered in this House as well. It is an equal level playing field.

Mr. Speaker, walking into this Assembly today I had the opportunity, right out these doors, to talk to a member of the Aboriginal Summit, the Premier was there as well. What is the clear message from the Aboriginal Summit? They want this government to adopt the recommendations that our committee put forward. They want this government to do something. They will not live on borrowed time or broken promises or hollow promises.

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Tu Nedhe is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Morin, you have unanimous consent to conclude your statement.

Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Aboriginal Summit have made it very clear to this government through the Premier that they want an electoral boundaries and reform constitutional committee formed so something can happen. We cannot go round any longer promising people that you are going to do something in the next Assembly. You have the ability to do it now. Mr. Speaker, I quote from Hansard on March 24, 1999, the government, the Premier, on behalf of the government.

First it gives us an opportunity to find a solution to this issue. It is not the intention of the government to try to ram this legislation through even if we could. We know there is no consensus at this time to resolve the major constitutional issues. Taking the time to build this consensus is important. We do not have consensus with our aboriginal leaders or with our communities leaders. In our view, building of the understanding of the issue and reaching a political resolution is critical.

Reaching a political resolution is critical. We have given you that opportunity. You still have today and tomorrow to reconsider your point of view, to reconsider the stand that this government took yesterday in this Legislative Assembly, passing the buck to the 14th Legislative Assembly. I ask you on behalf of all the people in the western Arctic, try to keep the western Arctic together, be a leader, be leaders, that is what you are there for, all six of you. Stand up and form a reform commission that will look at the constitution for the western Arctic and give everybody a fair government, not just the capital city of Yellowknife. Thank you.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. Krutko.

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we have heard a lot of statements in this House about resource agreements being made between the Alberta government, this government and TransCanada Pipelines. We have heard agreements made with the mining companies in regard to accessing diamonds and also accessing lands within the Northwest Territories. Mr. Speaker, I think there is one group that this government does not seem to be making any progress on in making agreements with and that is the First Nations people of this territory.

I am talking, Mr. Speaker, on the Northern Accord process, which was signed off by this government and the federal Government of Canada to negotiate the Northern Accord Agreement to transfer oil and gas mineral authority to the Government of the Northwest Territories. As part of that arrangement it was clear that they had to negotiate agreements with First Nation governments of the Northwest Territories. Here today we are seeing the government signing agreements with other jurisdictions in Canada. We are giving them access to our resources. Pipeline companies are coming up and building our pipelines, but there is nothing in place to protect the First Nations people of the land. There is nothing in there to protect the environment in regard to that protection. Ensuring that the aboriginal people when impacted will be compensated for harvesting. Also in regard to maintaining the impact that will be affected to these communities with regard to alcohol and drugs that will flow into these communities because of these developments. Mr. Speaker, we can go around telling the industry, the mining companies, Diavik, and all these other companies that who is in control here is the Government of the Northwest Territories. Yet the Government of the Northwest Territories does not own any land or have any jurisdiction on land outside the municipalities.

Until the transfer of the Northern Accord Agreement if finalized, no resource development should take place in the Northwest Territories. Until this government sits down with the Aboriginal First Nation governments and negotiates a Northern Accord Agreement and spells out exactly how those agreements are going to impact on development and how the aboriginal people will benefit from it, we should not be signing any agreements with any jurisdictions in Canada giving them the authority to our resources. The First Nation governments do not have the ability to generate revenues, or have a say on how they are going to benefit these programs. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Mackenzie Delta is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Krutko, you have unanimous consent to conclude your statement.

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, colleagues. In regard to how these agreements are going to be finalized we have to establish a table to sit down and negotiate with Aboriginal First Nations. The Inuvialuit and the Gwich'in are the regions I represent. They are in the process of negotiating a self-government agreement. They want to know exactly how are they going to have access to the resources in their jurisdictions, in the Beaufort Delta, so that we know that we will be able to arrive at some financial arrangement between the First Nation People, the developers and also know that we will be able to use some of those resources for our self-government programs and services. I think it is essential that this government, on one hand they can say they are showing that aboriginal rights are being negotiated, and they are also saying that the Government of the Northwest Territories is moving forward on the position of these negotiations and also concluding these agreements.

The Inuvialuit signed their agreement in 1984 to establish the Inuvialuit Final Agreement, 1984, that is 25 years ago, excuse me, that is 15 years ago. In regard to the Gwich'in they signed their agreement off in April 22, 1992. That is seven years ago. Now you have the Dogrib coming forth with an agreement-in-principle. These land claim agreements are constitutionally protected agreements. They are there to ensure that the people know that these rights are there for the First Nation people. This government refuses to conclude commitments that they have made in these land claim agreements and the government is going off negotiating agreements with other jurisdictions in Canada without concluding its obligations to the Aboriginal First Nation people of this land.

I find it pretty sad. On the one hand we are saying we are working in partnership with the aboriginal people, but not living up to the commitments that we make to these First Nations People. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. Erasmus.