Hello, my colleagues. Before we go to the Orders of the Day, I wish to provide my ruling on the Point of Order raised on September 30, 2003, by the honourable Member for Frame Lake, Mr. Dent.

Before addressing the specific Point of Order, I would like to make some comments to refresh Members on the procedural purpose of a Point of Order. A Point of Order is a question raised by a Member who believes that the rules or customary procedures of the House have been incorrectly applied or overlooked during the proceedings. Members may rise on Points of Order to bring to the attention of the chair any breach of the relevance or repetition of the rules, or the utterance of unparliamentary remarks. Members are able to do so at virtually any time in the proceedings, provided that the Point of Order is raised and concisely presented as soon as the irregularity occurs or as soon as practicable thereafter. As a Point of Order concerns the interpretation of the rules, it is the responsibility of the Speaker, or chair in Committee of the Whole, to determine its merits and to resolve the issue.

To the specific Point of Order raised by Mr. Dent. I find that the Point of Order was raised at the earliest opportunity, based on the facts as outlined by the Member for Frame Lake. The honourable Member contends that the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, the Honourable Mr. Antoine, may have misled the House as his comments during question period on February 21, 2003, were not consistent with the Minister's subsequent actions.

Any allegation that a Minister may have misled the House is a matter that the chair and all Members must take very seriously. In this light, as I do with all Points of Order, I took some time to review the facts available to me. Some of the facts raised by Mr. Dent unfortunately touched on matters that occurred outside the House and cannot be confirmed, as to whether or not they are an accurate account of events. The facts available to me were the comments made by the Minister on February 21, 2003, as outlined by Mr. Dent in his Point of Order. The comments are contained on pages 235 and 236 of Hansard. I am drawn to the comments of the Minister in responding to an oral question by the Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen, and I quote from page 236 of edited Hansard, "so at this point in time, the decision is for us to not proceed, but to have a mechanism in place developed by RWED."

The chair, and all honourable Members, must assume that the statements made in the House were an accurate reflection of the Minister's and the government's intent at that particular point in time, as there is no evidence to suggest otherwise. Circumstances obviously change over time and can influence future decisions. This cannot be viewed as evidence to show that the Minister intentionally and willfully misled the House. I, therefore, find that the Member for Frame Lake does not have a Point of Order.

Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Kakfwi.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'd like to take this opportunity to announce this year's recipients of the Premier's Award for Excellence. The Award for Excellence was recently created to recognize our employees who have distinguished themselves through work-related achievements and contributions. Today I honour the following employees and teams for their accomplishments:

• • Dr. Anne Gunn, a biologist with the Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development who has made a significant contribution to our understanding of caribou ecology;
• • Keith Hickling, manager of fish and wildlife with the Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, who has undertaken many initiatives to help the youth of the Northwest Territories through programs such as the Youth at Risk Trapper Training Program;
• • Karen Hicks, a program advisor with the Financial Management Board Secretariat, who had the lead in developing and implementing the government's performance measurement system;
• • John Nishi, a bison ecologist with the Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, who has represented our government on all fronts regarding the control of bison disease;
• • Raymond Tuccaro, traditional counsellor at the Yellowknife Correctional Centre for the Department of Justice, who has played an important role in assisting inmates, families and their community in the process of rehabilitation;
• • Al Woods, who is the interim chief executive officer of the Stanton Territorial Health Authority, as well as the Yellowknife Health and Social Services Authority. Through a period of great transition, Mr. Woods has provided the necessary leadership to ensure that the region's health care system was maintained at an effective level.
• • The equal pay team of the Financial Management Board Secretariat was instrumental in reaching a settlement of the long outstanding pay equity complaint and was responsible for the smooth implementation of the settlement. The team members include Shaleen Woodward, Andy Bevan, Daniel Grant, Vishni Peeris, Jami Semenoff, Jeff Barichello, Tracey Rumig, Alexandra Robles and Colette Perry.
• • The territorial biomedical engineering team from the Stanton Territorial Health Authority also introduced innovative processes to improve their liability and operations of biomedical equipment across the Northwest Territories, and this team has shown an extraordinary commitment to the development of a homegrown biomedical engineering workplace. The members of this team include Kevin Taylor, Christine Roemer, Phil Borer, Erwin Sumcad, Keith Deans and Doug Osmond.
• • The Tlicho GNWT negotiating team is also recognized, having worked diligently towards the Tlicho agreement, now seen as an historic and unique agreement that was ratified in June and signed by the Prime Minister of Canada in August. The Tlicho negotiating team includes Paul Beauchamp, John T'Seleie, Steve Iveson, Mark Warren, Kevin Campbell, Lorraine Whiteman, Jim Cunningham, Fred Chambers, Joe La Ferla, Mike Kalnay.
• • As well, today we recognize the Idaa Trail project team who were successful in developing an innovative program that invites people to learn about the Dogrib culture and heritage as they embark on a virtual journey through a traditional Dogrib travel route. The members of this team include Tom Andrews, Richard Valpy, Mark Heyck, Wendy Stephenson, Barbara Cameron, Lucy Lafferty, Gerriann Donahue, Kyle Kelly and Rosa Mantla.
• • We also recognize the Inuvik Regional Health and Social Services Centre project team who was responsible for the construction of a new health centre in Inuvik which is the largest, most complex project carried out in the Inuvik region to date. Members of this team include Brent Rausch, Ted McLeod and Len MacDonald.

Mr. Speaker, all teams and employees who have been chosen to receive this award were nominated because they demonstrated excellence, innovation and dedication to their work. They have provided a valuable contribution and it is my great pleasure to honour them. Please help me congratulate them on their achievements. Thank you.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Premier. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Kakfwi.

Thank you. The honourable Minister is anticipating that his time will run out and he's seeking unanimous consent of the House to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays, Mr. Premier, you may conclude your statement.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. With limited capacity, facing some of the most powerful mining and oil and gas corporations in the world, together we staked out an agenda for ourselves for non-renewable resource development.

We were the first in Canada to recognize the magnitude and impact that Northwest Territories' diamonds would have on the world diamond trade and to push for a Canadian diamond policy and a secondary diamond industry in the Northwest Territories and Canada. We are also sharing our expertise now with other governments through initiatives such as the national diamond strategy.

We were clear that development in the North would not occur at the expense of the environment. We supported the implementation of the Kyoto Accord and support Mr. Krutko in bringing his message about the protection of the Porcupine Caribou to Washington and the U.S. government.

We were committed to ensuring that development of northern resources be determined by market forces and that Canadian gas in the Beaufort and Mackenzie Delta and in the Liard Valley is not stranded.

We have been relentless in our demand for northern long-term benefits flowing from our development and our resources.

We have collaborated with other northern governments and the private sector through the Northwest Territories Business Coalition on the need for investments in infrastructure and training to make sure that our residents in our territory manage and benefit from development.

The heavy load of all these files was primarily carried by Minister Antoine who worked closely with our business community and the representatives of industry, like Imperial Oil's K.C. Williams, who truly wants to see the Northwest Territories realize its economic, social and political agenda.

We should be proud that we have, along with our 42,000 people, unified together, agreed on a common purpose, and have together made such incredible results and progress.

At this time, I want to acknowledge the contributions made by my colleagues in Cabinet and all of you as Members of the legislature for the past four years.

While the role of seasoned politicians is critical to the momentum and stability of our governments, the energy and new ideas injected by new Members such as Mr. Bell, Mr. McLeod and Mr. Delorey are important and essential to the success and future of our territory.

I want to encourage all young people in the Northwest Territories, especially aboriginal youth and young women, to look to a career in politics whether it is at the territorial government level or with aboriginal governments.

Whatever direction they choose, we must keep focused on the need for our youth to be raised in strong families and communities. We must encourage them to remain in the North, to take advantage of the opportunities and quality of life that we all have to offer, and to get them to help us build a better future for our territory.

As our term draws to a conclusion, it is only fitting that I thank all our employees, the territorial administration, here at the Yellowknife level, in the regions and communities. All of you out there should be proud of your collective accomplishments during this term and your contribution to the amazing future of our territory and its people.

In particular, we have benefited from an outstanding group of deputy ministers who take seriously their responsibilities for implementing our agenda. As a key source of advice, some of which sometimes we don't want to hear, but which is necessary, they have made for an effective operation as a team with us for our government.

I also want to thank personally the contributions of my staff in my office, in the Cabinet office and in the Department of Executive. All of those who have helped me, you have helped me immensely on a daily basis with my responsibilities during the past four years.

I also want to acknowledge your role, Mr. Speaker, in overseeing the operations and the work of this House and this Assembly. I want to thank you on behalf of all Members. Mr. Speaker, I also acknowledge outgoing Clerk David Hamilton for his long service in support of this Assembly and all the other ones I have served on and even before my time.

Most importantly, now I want to thank my wife, Marie, and my children: Kyla, my son-in-law Amos, my daughter Daylyn, and my son Keenan who have made many, many sacrifices in supporting me through these last four years.

Mr. Speaker, colleagues, northern leaders, elders, friends, it has been an honour and privilege to serve as your Premier. In the weeks coming, I look forward to continuing. I will work hard right to the completion of our agenda and to the end of my term as a Premier and help prepare for the transition for the next legislature. So thank you very much. Thank you.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Premier. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Deh Cho, Mr. McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, once again I want to raise the issue of taxation on First Nations people. Mr. Speaker, Treaties 8 and 11 state, "Her Majesty agrees to pay the salaries of such teachers to instruct the children of said Indians." Because of this inclusion in the treaties, Mr. Speaker, concern has been raised by my constituents in my riding on the matter of financial responsibility for Indian education. The Government of Canada's responsibility for First Nations' education is clear to my constituents, thus the concern of why are they being taxed for education when it is a treaty right.

When this government taxes First Nations people and their property, a portion of this tax is identified for education. Is such taxation a contravention of both Treaties 8 and 11?

Mr. Speaker, taxation of First Nations people has and will continue to be a concern. The Government of Canada provides this government with transfer payments and powers upon which we are able to provide services within this jurisdiction. However, it is important that this government provide our constituents with a breakdown of what portions of funds are for First Nations; further, what amounts are allocated for various services such as education, health, housing, economic development, et cetera. Mr. Speaker, I will have questions for the Minister of Finance during question period.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Item 2, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker today I raise an important point of essential services being provided to our communities. This summer again we find ourselves in the Mackenzie Delta communities with emergency services being provided at our centres in which daily clinics have been cancelled. Mr. Speaker we talk about improving the lives and well-being of the residents of the Northwest Territories and improving the quality of life for the residents of the Northwest Territories, yet today we still cannot even deliver the basic essential services to our communities such as health care, the lack of mental health and alcohol and drug workers in our communities or the lack of police.

I, for one, stand here today knowing what the communities are going through. Here is the point. This is what has been posted in our communities: "To all community residents: While community residents in the Northwest Territories expect nurses shortages along with the rest of Canada, this means at this time that the Inuvik Regional Health and Social Services has to restrict the services we normally provide to our clients. Formally, our communities will be affected as follows: Emergency services only from July 30th to August 12th and from August 18th to September 16th. Daily clinics will not be scheduled and only urgent emergency cases will be seen at the Health Centre." Then it gives you a phone number to call at the Inuvik Regional Hospital.

For us to say we provide services to the people, we have seen the outcry because of a few doctor specialists. We make a major move to increase their wages to improve services. Have we seen an improvement in services to the people in our communities? No, we have not. If anything, I hate to admit it, it has gone down in regard to the quality of the services we are getting in our small communities.

Mr. Speaker, we have programs that are socially offered right across Canada in regards to ensuring that the well-being of Canadians is taken up to federal programs. I would like to know as the Government of the Northwest Territories, are we even meeting the national standards that are out there to providing the service to the rest of Canadians across the country?

I, Mr. Speaker, will have some questions to the Minister of Health and Social Services who I have been corresponding for months on end, if not years on end, on this issue. So I will be asking the Minister a question on this matter later. Thank you.

---Applause

Thank you Mr. Krutko. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River North, Mr. Delorey.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as most Members are aware, the Honourable Chief Judge Robert Halifax recently retired after 26 years of distinguished service to the residents of the North.

Mr. Speaker, most people from Hay River and Yellowknife and other parts of the country gathered to honour Robert Halifax this past Saturday, including the honourable Minister Roger Allen, Minister of Justice. A common theme for the evening, Mr. Speaker, was the relationships with the people in all of the communities south of the lake that Robert was able to establish as the resident judge based in Hay River.

Mr. Speaker, Judge Halifax served the communities of Hay River, Fort Smith, Fort Resolution, Fort Providence, Fort Simpson and Fort Liard. In addition he served Trout Lake, Nahanni Butte and Wrigley as needed.

Mr. Speaker, I believe that a resident judge based in Hay River is essential to establishing continuity both within the justice system and within the communities that are served. A resident judge is able to establish relationships with the people they serve. A resident judge will get to know the families involved and the people's backgrounds which, I believe, is key to an effective judicial process.

Mr. Speaker, the loss of a judicial presence in Hay River and indeed south of the lake, will lead to the public perception of being remote and removed from the justice system. We simply cannot allow this to happen.

Mr. Robert Halifax was instrumental in establishing the Justice of the Peace program in the North. The Justice of the Peace program has proven to be a tremendous success over the years. There are a number of long-serving justices of the peace south of the lake. A resident judge for Hay River is essential to ensuring this valuable program continues.

Mr. Speaker, Hay River is a vibrant, growing community. We need to retain resources in our community and continue to develop our infrastructure. Conversely, Mr. Speaker, this government needs to empower communities and operate within our mandate of decentralization. I believe it is imperative that we as legislators create a sustainable economy with an economic base at the community level.

Mr. Speaker, the support services for a resident judge are firmly established in Hay River. We have all of the infrastructure in place to fully support a resident judge and our location within the South Slave region is ideal. Mr. Speaker, I feel it is incumbent on the Minister and the Department of Justice to ensure that the needs of the residents...

Mr. Delorey, your time for Members' statements has expired. What is your wish, Mr. Delorey?

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to deliver my statement.

The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his Member's statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays, Mr. Delorey. You may conclude your statement.

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Thank you, colleagues. Mr. Speaker, I feel it is incumbent on the Minister and the Department of Justice to ensure that the needs of the residents of the nine communities south of the lake are taken into consideration when determining a replacement for resident Chief Judge Halifax.

Mr. Speaker, I urge the Minister to do the right thing and to ensure that a resident judge is placed in Hay River. Mr. Speaker, I think the Premier may have missed one person in the Northwest Territories. I would like all my colleagues in the House to recognize the 26 years of service Chief Judge Halifax gave to the North. Thank you Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you Mr. Delorey. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we are all aware of the shortage of health care workers in the Northwest Territories. Today I want to speak about one consequence in particular.

There is a crisis in Hay River and across the Northwest Territories and that is a desperate shortage of resources supporting dental surgery. The hospital in Hay River cannot retain sufficient nursing staff which means that in just two years dental operating room time has been cut back by 60 percent.

The last dental surgery in Hay River was performed on June 5th and, despite a waiting list of 141 patients that is growing by the day, the next surgery will not be until November 17th again reduced probably three-and-a-half days from nine-and-a-half days.

The H.H. Williams Memorial Hospital in Hay River serves 17 communities including Hay River. According to reports we received, there are children in these communities who cannot eat properly because the nerves in their teeth are exposed. Mr. Speaker, this is not inflammatory rhetoric. This is information supplied by someone who would know: one very fed-up dental clinic office manager.

There is no use travelling to Yellowknife or Inuvik for surgery because their waiting lists are almost as long. Even if they could get an appointment, it is too expensive for many people in the communities to make a special trip into Hay River because medical travel does not cover dental surgery. Heading down south is so expensive that it is completely out of the question.

The problem is only going to worsen this fall as community nurses who perform routine checkups on school children diagnose more dental conditions requiring dental surgery. This situation is already at a crises level.

Antibiotics and painkillers can only be used for so long before they themselves become a health risk, especially for children and seniors. This government must find a solution. Dental health is directly related to general health. If people cannot chew and subsequently properly digest their food, over a period of time their health and well-being will suffer. We know that an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

I commend the extraordinary efforts that our northern dental professionals and clinics go to in terms of creating awareness and contributing to preventative initiatives in dental care.

When situations deteriorate and surgery is required, this government has a duty and an obligation to ensure that the necessary services and treatments are available. Mr. Speaker, I will have questions and follow-up to this to the Minister of Health and Social Services today. Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I rise about the benefits of being a large centre in the Northwest Territories, especially when you find yourself to be the capital of the Northwest Territories and government has situated itself there and does a lot of its business in the capital.

Mr. Speaker, a lot of things we've done in the government over the years has been trying to diversify the economy to help out communities and small businesses throughout the territory. Unfortunately, Mr. Speaker, it seems like we've started to go back the other way. The other way, Mr. Speaker, being, I can recall, for example, in Inuvik where the government services department -- stores, as they called it -- had everything from copper elbows to screws to nuts and bolts to anything you can fix that the government owns. We've gone away from that, Mr. Speaker. We've gone towards each community being able to supply and develop its own professional people that can repair things in their communities and not having to ship people out of headquarters or from regional centres.

Mr. Speaker, I used to work for the government and travelled to the smaller communities to fix their equipment, and that now has been devolved so communities themselves have their own maintenance people and mechanics to be able to fix their own equipment. We've done that throughout the Northwest Territories, but it seems that we've once again started pulling it back into the centre to try to help out government expenditures, I guess is the main reason that would be used, is that we need to save our dollars.

So, Mr. Speaker, I think as a government we have to think, are we doing the right thing by pulling things back into the centre? I'll use a specific example, Mr. Speaker. Recently, a tender was let out by the Department of Public Works and Services for over 100 computers. Mr. Speaker, over 100 computers were put out in one tender. One tender, Mr. Speaker, given out to compete across the Northwest Territories. I can tell you, since the government has gone to this system of going to every department and doing one large tender for computer services, what happens is all the small companies throughout the Northwest Territories do not get that service or cannot bid and match the services of a larger centre that deals strictly in volume. It's a known benefit, Mr. Speaker, that the more volume you get for equipment and service the cheaper you can supply a service or supply materials.

So, Mr. Speaker, I will have questions for at least one Minister, maybe more, in this area of where government is heading in regard to small businesses across the Northwest Territories and having to remind this government that one of our goals that we had for Towards a Better Tomorrow would be to have a healthy and diversified economy providing employment opportunities for Northerners in all communities. So I'll have questions for the Public Works and Services Minister later. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for North Slave, Mr. Lafferty.

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Frame Lake, Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in 1990 the United Nations declared that October 1st would be observed as the International Day of Older People. So today is a worldwide celebration in honour of older people. Mr. Speaker, I would like to recognize the ongoing contributions that are made in Yellowknife and in communities across the Northwest Territories by our seniors and elders. Unfortunately, some older people are marginalized, forgotten about or even abused. We need to ensure that all individuals, older persons included, enjoy independence, appropriate care, dignity and are able to achieve self-fulfillment.

Mr. Speaker, the Northwest Territories Seniors' Society is a vital and thriving organization which supports older persons all across the Northwest Territories. I'd like to recognize their efforts, as well as the efforts of the Yellowknife Seniors' Society for the important and effective work they do for seniors and elders.

Mr. Speaker, I hope that today older people across the Northwest Territories are able to enjoy a special time with their families as we all reflect on how seniors and elders have made the Northwest Territories a better place to live. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Great Slave, Mr. Braden.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It's a day for a few accolades and I would like to make one myself, but it's going to be balanced with a bit of criticism. I'd like to acknowledge, Mr. Speaker, the Premier's efforts in recent days in promoting devolution and development in the Northwest Territories. Visits to the economic power centres of Canada and the United States show that our message is getting across of the increasing stature of the Northwest Territories in the Canadian economy. The message, of course, is that diamonds and oil and gas are enormous economic advantages for us and outside investors and markets and are spurring a political and social development, as well.

However, Mr. Speaker, closer to home, recent statements in the media from Finance Minister Joe Handley have sent some confusing signals from our government. In the Wednesday, September 24th, edition of the Yellowknifer he's quoted as saying the diamond cutting and polishing jobs are relatively minor benefits from the mines, the jobs are boring and don't pay much and we want to get beyond cutting and polishing and into trading and jewelry making. I wonder why the Minister is saying this. The overall value of the industry and its people deserve to be shown in a much more positive light, Mr. Speaker. Not just in Yellowknife, but in Fort Simpson and Hay River, in Edzo and Fort Smith, but all communities that have been seeking to share in this benefit.

The North's cutting and polishing industry is a fledgling industry, seeking its way in the world markets and in doing so is contributing significantly to our economy; a fact that shouldn't escape the Finance Minister. Some indicators: on an average salary of $45,000 plus bonus and a manufacturing multiplier of 2.8, the current industry is worth $12 million from these workers to this city alone.

With the coming on stream of Tiffany's Laurelton diamond plant and production from existing plants, we have the capacity for up to 200 people to be employed. I think that's about double the number of people in the industry today, Mr. Speaker. This is not an insignificant contribution to our economy, especially when we see it against the payroll equivalent of the Con Mine, which is closing its doors later this month.

Mr. Speaker, with proper management and collaboration, this industry can be a catalyst for even more positive impact and diversity in our economy. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his Member's statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Braden, you may conclude your statement.

Mr. Speaker, colleagues, thank you. Our message should be consistent, clear and positive. Northern polished diamonds will bring us increased benefits from exposure in North America and the world. Even today, Mr. Speaker, Aurora College is attracting students for these courses from Australia and the United States. Isn't this evidence of a further opportunity that lies before us?

The industry is triggering new immigration to Canada and to the Northwest Territories. I look forward to seeing some of these people taking the oath of Canadian citizenship as a result. If the job is as boring as the Minister suggests, I say the chance for a new life in Canada is a pretty exciting prospect for these new workers and their families.

Mr. Speaker, we can expand our opportunities associated with diamond mining. We need to build from the ground up and continue to support these companies and their workers by giving us a better future. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife South, Mr. Bell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I listened with interest yesterday as my colleague, Mr. Braden, had questions for the Minister of Health and Social Services and also his statement about alcohol and drug treatment residential facilities in the Northwest Territories. He put the question to the Minister and asked if it was an indication, that being our performance in the past four years, was an indication that residential alcohol and drug treatment facilities in the Northwest Territories are no longer a priority for our continuum of care. I think a lot of residents have that sense, Mr. Speaker. The Minister was very careful to point out that our strategy has been to focus attention at the community level, to make sure that we have adequate salaries for alcohol and drug workers so that we have more people willing to work in the field, and his opinion that it made sense to work more closely with the existing facilities that we have.

I think we all recognize that with our limited resources we're not going to see new dollars poured into capital. It isn't realistic to think that we're going to find bags of money or new treatment facilities, but that doesn't mean, Mr. Speaker, that we can't do something. We've got this serious need for residential treatment and I think it's at the same time that we're seeing falling custody numbers in all of our young offender facilities right across the territory.

The Department of Justice, I think, is indicating that they had a mere 21 young offenders in custody in the Northwest Territories as of September 15th. A lot of that is due in large part, Mr. Speaker, to the Youth Criminal Justice Act changes and our change in philosophy that came into being on April 1st of this year.

Mr. Speaker, I guess to sum it up, we really have made a decision not to incarcerate young people for many crimes if we don't have to. To try to deal with them in our communities, have community sentencing options, extrajudicial measures available for sentencing and this is a philosophy that certainly not everybody agrees with. I think maybe it's easier for us to stand here and say we have a more enlightened approach now and much more difficult if you've been a recent victim of a crime.

Mr. Speaker, this is a philosophy that will bear out over time as longitudinal studies show that incarcerating young offenders simply doesn't deal with the problem. Mr. Speaker, we've got these dwindling numbers in our young offender facilities and an increasing need for alcohol and drug treatment. I know the Department of Justice is looking at reprofiling some of our facilities. I think they've done so recently at the River Ridge Facility in Fort Smith. They've got a short term option they're looking at there, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I'd like to seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

Thank you. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his Member's statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Bell, you may conclude your statement.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you, colleagues. Certainly I think this is what the Department of Justice has to do is to make sure that if we don't have the numbers then we look at other ways to make use of those facilities. I think the Arctic Tern facility in Inuvik, which cost a lot of money and is relatively new, has less than 20 percent occupancy.

Mr. Speaker, what we have is Health and Social Services needs facilities, the Department of Justice has some facilities that are not full and I think this makes the case that we really need to have a social envelope Ministers committee. I'll be asking the Minister questions later in the day about the number of times that the social envelope Ministers have met in the past life of this government. Hopefully he'll be truthful with me because I don't think it has been very frequent.

Certainly the Department of Justice, I think, is doing what they can to reprofile these and assess the need the best they can, but it should be at a government level. The Housing Corporation should be talking to the Department of Justice, should be talking to the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, which should be talking to the Department of Health and Social Services. I don't think that's going on.

We have the Housing Corporation stuck with the Somba K'e facility because we've got no clients out there, Mr. Speaker, just as a further example. I know that our government has spent $120,000 through the Housing Corporation since June of 2002. No clients out there, Mr. Speaker. It speaks to a real interdepartmental disconnect in my mind and, I think, the minds of residents of the Northwest Territories. It needs to be straightened out and I'll have questions for the appropriate Ministers. Thank you.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe, Mr. Nitah.

Mahsi, Mr. Nitah. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake, Ms. Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yesterday I raised the question to the Minister of Health and Social Services about a constituency issue that has been outstanding for three years with no end in sight, it appears.

Mr. Speaker. I have another one today which the Minister has failed to act upon for almost the same length of time and it has to do with providing health insurance coverage for those suffering from Scotopic Sensitivity Syndrome.

Mr. Speaker, I first wrote to the Minister in the fall of 2001 and made statements and asked questions in this House. At the time, the requests were over $800 in reimbursement which was rejected. The Minister indicated that he was undertaking a review of extended health benefits, as well as the list of specified diseases and conditions that would qualify for coverage. Perhaps, Mr. Speaker, he felt compelled to give me a little carrot to hang on to, because in this particular case we're talking about a child who needed to be diagnosed and treated by a special pair of glasses so she could read properly and learn.

Since then, Mr. Speaker, I have written a number of letters and e-mails to the Minister and he has assured me that he would do a thorough review of the benefits and let me know. The latest letter that I received from the Minister is dated March 28, 2003, and I quote, "All of the concerns that Members have expressed about the supplementary health benefits programs during the current and previous sessions of the 14th Legislative Assembly has been documented. These are being addressed during the review that is currently underway. I will be bringing forward a progress report on this review to the Standing Committee on Social Programs prior to the upcoming session in June."

Mr. Speaker, it's now September and I haven't heard a thing and I have checked with the members from the social programs committee and I don't believe he has done such reporting. Mr. Speaker, for two years now the Minister has stated that in all things he must make careful, measured steps. We can't act in haste; we need to do it carefully and do it right. I would suggest to the Minister, Mr. Speaker, the clock is about to run out and the time to act is now, and I expect an answer from the Minister about his coverage and the results of his review immediately. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Kakfwi.

Mr. Speaker, I wish to recognize today in the gallery the secretary to Cabinet, Liz Snider, and her aunt from Hamilton, Ontario, Elizabeth Maus.

---Applause

Thank you. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Weledeh, Mr. Handley.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As Minister for the public service, I would also like to recognize the Premier's award recipients, and particularly those who are sitting in the gallery today. I won't name everyone, but the ones in the gallery I recognize: Anne Gunn, Keith Hickling, Karyn Hicks, Joe La Ferla, Mike Kalney, Brent Rausch, Ted McLeod and Len MacDonald. I'd like them to rise and be recognized. Thank you.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Ootes.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize a constituent of mine and an employee of our Department of Education, Culture and Employment sitting over on my right, Sue Glowach.

---Applause

Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Range Lake, Ms. Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize constituents of mine sitting in the gallery. Joseph La Ferla who has already been recognized, and his wife, Gertrude La Ferla, who is also a long-term civil servant. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it's not very often I get to recognize somebody from the community of Inuvik so, Mr. McLeod and Mr. MacDonald, welcome to this Assembly.

---Applause

Thank you. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. I would like to say welcome to everyone who has come here this afternoon. It's good to see you. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Deh Cho, Mr. McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today are for the Minister of Finance, regarding the issue of taxation for First Nations people. I wanted to ask the Minister if he could tell us if any personal or property taxes or fees levied against the First Nations people are being used for education. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Minister of Finance, Mr. Handley.

Mr. Speaker, it's my understanding that there are, in some cases, situations where parents are asked to pay fees in the schools for extra things that are needed in the system, but all parents are being asked to make those payments. I also understand that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment is reviewing their policy on that. In addition, all property owners in the Northwest Territories are billed for an education tax. This is a tax of general application and goes into the general revenue; it doesn't go directly into education or into a specific service. Thank you.

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. McLeod.

Thank you. Mr. Speaker, this year I had a number of constituents bring the property tax invoices in and it clearly states on the invoice that education taxes are being applied to aboriginal people, regardless of if you have children in school or not. I'd like to ask the Minister if he's aware that this is happening, and if he could tell us what portion of that is being applied to the schools. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Minister of Finance, Mr. Handley.

Mr. Speaker, yes, people who are paying taxes on their property will also be paying a portion that is for education. As I mentioned before, this is a tax of general application. The money we collect from education taxes goes into general revenue, and then we pay for the costs of education out of the consolidated revenue fund. The amount that we collect in total, Mr. Speaker, from education taxes right across the Territories is about $3.5 million. In total, this government spends roughly $200 million on education. So some of that money is for education but, as I say, it goes into the general revenue fund and then is voted by this House. It doesn't go directly to education as such. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. McLeod.

Mr. Speaker, it's not clear. My understanding is that this government receives transfer payments from the federal government to honour the treaty agreements the federal government has, and those transfer payments are clearly identified as money for education. Then, at the same time, we have invoices that are going out to the communities and to aboriginal people, treaty people, that state they have to pay a school tax. So in a sense this government is double dipping. We're getting money from one source -- the federal government -- and we're also applying a tax to people who have an agreement, who have a treaty with the federal government. I believe it's a contravention of the treaty. I would like to ask the Minister to explain how that works, because we have two sources coming in. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Minister of Finance, Mr. Handley.

Mr. Speaker, the only money that we get that is specifically for aboriginal people and a treaty right is for aboriginal health care. That is the only money that is linked directly to a treaty right. All of the other money that we get in the Northwest Territories through our formula is for all residents, it's not broken down to so much for treaty people and so much for other people. We get an amount of money based on our population and other factors, but it's for everyone. So there's only the one program that I can think of off hand that is strictly for aboriginal people, and that's for aboriginal health. There's none for education as such. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Your final supplementary, Mr. McLeod.

Thank you. Mr. Speaker, could I get the Minister to confirm then that this government receives no money for aboriginal education from the federal government? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Minister of Finance, Mr. Handley.

Mr. Speaker, we, through the formula, get funding for all residents in the Northwest Territories, so we get money for everyone; treaty people, non-treaty people, everyone. But that money is not broken down and identified specifically for status and treaty people versus for everyone. So we do not get money for treaty people specifically. I think we do operate a university/college entrance program. There's some money that we manage for the federal government, but that's a program we do on their behalf, it's not money that comes through our general revenue. But other than that, there is none that I'm aware of. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Minister of Health and Social Services with regard to my Member's statement. Mr. Speaker, as we all know looking through the budget, this government increased the amount of money by $26 million for Health and Social Services to the tune of $226 million in 2003-2004. Yet, Mr. Speaker, we see a decline in programs and services that are essential to services such as health and social services, alcohol and drug programs and also policing. Mr. Speaker, we, again, have a situation in the Mackenzie Delta communities where communities are put on notice that only emergency services will be provided. When will this government learn that we have a problem and find a solution to that problem? Can the Minister tell us what is the government doing to find that solution?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as the Member has pointed out, it is a problem. There is a problem most acutely in some of the smaller communities, especially in the Inuvik region. Mr. Speaker, we've made arrangements, short-term arrangements with the UNW, so we can hire agency nurses. We have committed to a review of the classification of nurses to hopefully better compensate them once that classification review is done. That work is expected to be completed by Christmastime. So we put in millions of dollars trying to beef up salaries of alcohol and drug workers. We put in money for mental health workers and we intend to recruit those positions which are empty and work on arrangements in communities for those people who are currently in place to get them to take advantage of the new classification. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister touched on the point that I would like to make. We are seeing that programs and services are declining and the positions aren't being filled by this government. We have money allocated to communities sitting with health boards. What are you doing to ensure that those health boards don't sit on dollars that should be implemented for programs in communities? Why is it that dollars aren't making their way to those communities and having those positions filled to provide these essential services?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I met two weeks ago with the board chairs and the senior staff of the department and authorities. One of the issues that was on the table was the vacancy rate, especially among the alcohol and drug workers that are going to be rolled over into community wellness workers. Now that the classification has been done and the job descriptions written, I have asked that we make every effort to put that money to use. It's retroactive to April 1st and the board chairs and CEOs were there and they have committed to do that very thing. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, one of the problems we've had in the Inuvik region is we have had situations where they have had to pay out of their own pocket to go to the Inuvik Regional Health Centre, in some cases getting medevaced out of the health centre because of not being diagnosed in our communities. They've made the effort on their own to travel to the regional hospital to get this service. As a department, are you willing to compensate those people who have taken it on their own to find that service at the Inuvik Regional Hospital where it's not being provided in our communities?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would be happy to commit to a review of every case the Member can bring forward outlining that specific issue and we will give it a thorough review and consideration. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Your final supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister prior to the adjournment of this House, could he come back to this legislature and explain how the government could cope with the situation we've seen again in the Mackenzie Delta communities where we've had closures of our health centres to strictly emergency services? I would like to ask the Minister who is responsible for health services, what is this government doing to ensure that will not happen again next year?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I will commit that prior to the rise of this House, I will get the information requested by the Member to him in writing outlining the steps being taken to address issues he's raised.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, Hay River is the second largest community in the territory and its hospital serves half of the NWT's communities. Mr. Speaker, I would like to know if the Minister thinks that the H.H. Williams Memorial Hospital is being used to its potential considering that no dental surgeries have been performed for five consecutive months. I want to know if the Minister is aware of this and does he have any plans or suggestions to remedy the situation? Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The chair was a bit concerned with the beginning of the question, however the second part of it let the Minister deal with that. You were asking an opinion and you shouldn't ask an opinion. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, Hay River is a key part of the health and social services system. The health centre there figures prominently in the services that we provide. It's funded to provide dental surgery. It is an issue, as the Member has pointed out in her Member's statement today. There is a backlog there and attempts have been made to hire a GP anesthesiologist. It's not one that we have a solution for as we are in a similar situation in many other areas of service delivery. Is Hay River being used to its full capacity? No.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. The chair is having some difficulty in picking up the sound here today. I hope the honourable Member got that answer. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I heard the Minister say he does not have a solution for the problem right now with respect to dental surgery. So in light of that, Mr. Speaker, considering an offer that the office manager of the Hay River Dental Clinic has made, she feels that the situation is dire enough for dental surgery that perhaps the clinic could hire their own nurses and anesthetists in order to take care of the backlog of emergency dental surgeries. Mr. Speaker, I am wondering if the government would fund a private clinic to cover the costs for what should be a publicly funded core service. Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the deputy minister for the department met in early September in Hay River with the Member for Hay River North, as well as the lady who runs the dental clinic and there was a discussion about the concerns. Out of that discussion, I understand, came a plan for the manager to sit down with the CEO and the health board in Hay River to discuss this issue and they haven't yet had a chance to do that. That meeting I don't think has yet to take place. I have had discussions with Mr. Delorey this morning about the concerns that I passed on to the deputy to make sure the meeting does take place so we can see what kind of common ground there is to address this issue.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is - and I will repeat it again - if the Hay River Dental Clinic thinks that they have access to nurses and...If the health board can't hire these people and they think they can, will the government fund a private clinic to go out and do this work, so that it can be done in a timely manner? I know about the meetings and I know about the problems with recruitment and retention by the Hay River Health Board, but people's teeth are rotting in their mouths as we speak, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as I indicated, when that meeting was concluded with the deputy, the MLA and the Hay River Dental Clinic, there was a plan, as I understand it, to connect up with the Hay River Health Authority which has funding to deliver the service, which I have yet to meet with the Hay River Dental Clinic to see what can be arranged. I think that's the step we should follow. If there is a plan that does come out of that, I am sure it will be acted on. At this point, I think it's premature for me to stand up and intercede before that meeting has taken place and we have the benefit of the full information from that meeting. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Your final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my office also had presence at that meeting. Mr. Miltenberger mentioned Mr. Delorey's office. Of course, we really work very closely together in Hay River and I appreciate that, but I would also appreciate it if he would keep me advised because this is an issue that's also important to my constituents. So will the Minister commit to apprising me to the outcome of that discussion and if it is not something that can be dealt with in a timely manner, we can revisit the offer of the Hay River Dental Clinic? Could the Minister confirm that's correct?

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, first, I would like to apologize to the Member for implying that she's not involved or interested in these particular issues. It was an oversight on my part. I recognize in the House that she's very vigilant in putting forward her constituents' concerns. I will keep her apprised of whatever takes place in this area, as I will the Member for Hay River North. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Item 6, oral questions. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, following my Member's statement in the area of government's purchasing programs, it has been for some time now that the government has started to use central purchasing as a way of reducing some of its cost, namely in the area of the technology services centre, as a way of pooling its resources from all departments. Mr. Speaker, something we have to consider is what are we doing to our small business throughout the Northwest Territories. Referencing the contract earlier, for example, that just closed recently, September 23rd, for purchases of 112 computers, 45 of which were supposed to be delivered to Inuvik. The contractors in the small communities are disadvantaged, number one, for cost of transportation on some of the goods, but it's always more difficult to compete against a larger company that has a higher volume. That's one of the benefits of being in the capital. You are on the doorstep of government and can win a lot of their contracts. I would like to know from the Department of Public Works and Services, is there intention to break up any of these computer contracts so that smaller businesses can have a chance to bid and win? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. The honourable Minister of Public Works and Services, Mr. Steen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The department is well aware of the concerns raised by the Member and raised by the business sector as well. However, Public Works did take the issue to the Senior Management Preference Committee with regard to how to award the BIP preference in relation to where the computers were going. In the first instance in March, all computers were going to Yellowknife, so Yellowknife had the BIP preference and they did win the contracts. In the second incident recently, there were two contracts awarded to Yellowknife again because the majority of the computers were going to Yellowknife. So Yellowknife bidders were given, again, BIP preference. Public Works and Services was advised by the Senior Management Preference Committee to prorate the BIP preference based on the number of computers gong to different regions. Like the Member stated, Mr. Speaker, those communities, like Yellowknife, that had most of the computers obviously got the benefit of the BIP as well. So they were the ones the contracts were awarded to. Public Works advised that as an example in the last purchase of computers, there was a savings of $55,000. That indicates to us that we should continue with large purchases rather than breaking the requirements down into smaller tenders.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister has given some information that, in fact, four large tenders that have gone out have been won by companies in the capital. This prorating BIP just confuses the issue more, I believe. Wouldn't it be better if we actually broke it down? For the last tender of 112, 45 were scheduled for Inuvik, 55 for Yellowknife and I believe five for Fort Simpson is the information I was provided. Mr. Speaker, the government may have saved $55,000 on this one tender, but if smaller businesses throughout the Territories cannot start winning some of these bids, then they are going to have to start letting employees go. Where do employees go? Either to the unemployment office or the income support office and then the government will have to pick up the tab there. So what benefit are we deriving for the NWT as a whole? Would the government consider breaking down these tenders, so at least the regionally-based companies can afford to bid these things?

Thank you, Mr. Roland. The honourable Minister of Public Works and Services, Mr. Steen.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I can commit to the Member that I will take this back to the department and we will review our purchasing programs.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Supplementary, Mr. Roland.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. While the Minister is doing that, knowing that the window of this government is quickly running out, I would like to know if he can provide information to the Members of this House with regard to the computer purchases this last fiscal year and how many have been awarded to companies outside of Yellowknife. Thank you.