This is page numbers 507 - 550 of the Hansard for the 15th Assembly, 4th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was program.

Topics

Members Present

Honourable Brendan Bell, Mr. Braden, Honourable Paul Delorey, Honourable Charles Dent, Mrs. Groenewegen, Honourable Joe Handley, Mr. Hawkins, Honourable David Krutko, Mr. Lafferty, Ms. Lee, Honourable Michael McLeod, Mr. McLeod, Mr. Menicoche, Honourable Michael Miltenberger, Mr. Pokiak, Mr. Ramsay, Honourable Floyd Roland, Mr. Villeneuve, Mr. Yakeleya

---Prayer

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The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Good afternoon, Members. Welcome back to the House. Orders of the day. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Hawkins.

Point Of Privilege

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Robert Hawkins

Robert Hawkins Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Pursuant to section 20(1) of the House rules, I wish to rise on a personal matter, to clarify, in my opinion, what appears to be a one-sided report of the media on an issue as of late.

Firstly, dealing with my supporter's issues that had been in the media, my supporter had used a personal vehicle, a Winnebago, to carry my sign on it during the election campaign. It was not a campaign office or anything else that's been suggested or implied in any way. My supporter, Mr. Dolynny, I believe, is owed a true apology by the press, because their depiction created and surrounded his involvement in the campaign. He drove his personal vehicle to and from work. That's it.

Mr. Speaker, size apparently does matter, because the reporter didn't seem interested, in any way, that my competitors had posters and campaign material and vehicles to show their support. But apparently, in my case, it seems to matter.

I am dismayed that they would suggest, in any way, that rules have been broken in this regard, and the fact that they choose to embarrass the supporter of a campaign on the single fact that their vehicle was larger than anyone else's seems to be sad.

Let's put the facts on the table. The vehicle was on the road for less than two weeks. He drove it from home to work each day, parked it on the street, and at the end of the day, he did a loop down in the community and then went and parked it. It was in transit approximately one hour each day. There were no timers on this. That is just the simple reality. He went to work and went home. There is no reference of personal vehicles of supporters in the Elections Act that needs to be accounted for, let alone a Winnebago. So are we changing the rules just to embarrass a single MLA? I don't know.

The spending report, I think, in the news, tends to ignore minivans, trucks, SUVs, and any pictures on cars, yet it seems to focus in on the one vehicle I had on the road as driven by a supporter by himself. So why change the rules for one person? There was one vehicle driven by one supporter only. Besides, does this reporter feel that we should blame creativity in pointing it out? Again, size

matters. I don't think that was the issue at all. There could be some hidden agenda, I don't know.

There was no money or management of any kind that transpired while this vehicle was on the road. There was no contribution of any sort. Again, the supporter drove his personal vehicle. In my awareness, I don't believe I broke the election process at all. If we are going to start dragging supporters through the mud, I think we do a disservice to the election process by asking for supporters. I have maintained all along, that if this reporter feels that supporters should be listed in the election briefings and reports, then maybe we should have that matter discussed. You know what? There is nothing that states that.

On the other matter, Mr. Speaker, the story appeared to be singly focused with an agenda with a predetermined outcome from the start. I first heard about this inquiry from a reporter in June, because an access was being inquired about. Only a few weeks later, in July, I finally got a phone call from this reporter. On two occasions I had offered to give any information, such as my travel report, any applicable documents, such as the Conflict of Interest Commissioner's letter to me, my letter to the ITI Minister, and the letter from Aurora World Corporation. I offered this, but they seemed not to be interested. I made the point amply clear, when I was being taped in my one-hour interview, which seems to be going to a super extent of showing how willing I am to talk about this issue, yet my clips on the TV are very short.

What MLA, or political figure, would deny, Mr. Speaker, an access to information request by a reporter? That is something they could get on their own, so why would I draw that type of attention? From the start, I was willing to give any information that they requested, and I was quite open about this issue, but they weren't interested.

In terms of the invite -- I don't have much more, Mr. Speaker -- the letter came to the Legislature addressed to me from the vice-president of the Aurora World Corporation, not Mr. Dolynny, which the story seems to imply. If they had accepted those letters, they would have seen that. This letter came to the Legislature and requested me, and any other MLA, to be part of this tourism mission. So there was no conflict, as I see it. Everyone was invited, if they wanted to participate. The reason I contacted the Conflict of Interest Commissioner, Mr. Ted Hughes, was because they were offering market rate, which was $400 plus tax, which equals about $700. That's very low, so I thought it would be very prudent to contact the commissioner on this issue. Mr. Hughes' written reply instructed me on a few issues, and I will read this in summary. First, copy a letter to the ITI Minister, which I did; and second, if all MLAs were invited at the same special rate, he didn't see a problem. So we are drawing conclusions on this.

In closing, Mr. Speaker, the travel issue, as it was, was truly a judgment call within the constituency ability that I have to use my budget to help promote my constituency where I felt it was important. I felt it was important that this industry, from our government, invests about $100,000 a year, yet it returns over $16 million, and I have heard it's going to return over $20 million in this next year. That's something important to my constituency.

I want to finish by saying I have always maintained that if I am wrong, I would be happy to correct my election statement at any time. I would be happy to seek any advice directed to me by Mr. McLean to make this a fair process. I have never denied that, and I have always said that very loud and clear.

So I am very disappointed by the newscast portraying that some unscrupulous act has happened. I am tired of this, and that's why I brought this statement forward today. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Item 1: Prayer
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The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The Chair would just like to remind Members on points of privilege, that the rules clearly state that you have to be clear and precise on the issue of privilege. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Premier, Mr. Handley.

Joe Handley

Joe Handley Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, a little over a year ago, the government released its strategic plan: Self-Reliant People, Communities and Northwest Territories - A Shared Responsibility. This plan was based on a vision and a set of goals established by this Legislative Assembly.

The GNWT, along with many partners, have been working hard, over the past 16 months, to advance the priorities and actions contained in this plan in order to achieve these goals and realize this vision.

I met with Caucus last December. I made a commitment to report on our progress each fall and make the report public. Later this afternoon, I will table the 2005 progress report, along with a detailed companion document: 2005 Compendium of NWT-Wide Measures.

The progress report is the first of its kind. It demonstrates, in one document, the major achievements of this government since taking office two years ago. It shows how these accomplishments support the priorities of the government and, ultimately, the vision and goals of this Legislature. It also provides detailed information on activities that support the 73 actions identified in the strategic plan, so that it is clear to you, the public we serve, what work is being done and how it supports the direction set by this Assembly.

It is equally important to know, Mr. Speaker, whether the collective efforts of the government and partners are actually making a difference. There is not often a direct relationship between action and results, and changes for the better are often realized over years, or generations, rather than a single year. However, it is vital we understand where we are today, and if we are changing for the better.

The compendium presents a broad picture of how well we are doing in our territory at this time. Selected measures and indicators have been identified for each of the five goals of the strategic plan. Where available, information from past years has also been presented so that we are able to measure progress.

Mr. Speaker, these documents contain a lot of very useful information about the work of the government, and the status of our communities and territory. This update on the strategic plan gives us all a better understanding of where we are in advancing our agenda and the work that remains to be done with our partners. It is my hope that these two documents will stimulate thinking and discussion about our next steps, so that we make informed decisions about where to focus our energies in our last two years in office.

Mr. Speaker, I wish to take this opportunity to thank GNWT employees for their contribution to the government's achievements. I would also like to thank the non-profit and business sectors, as well as aboriginal and community governments, for working with us to advance many of these actions. I would also like to recognize the Members of this House for your input at many stages of the government's work, and your desire to achieve the vision of "self-reliant individuals and families, sharing the rewards and responsibilities of healthy communities and a prosperous and unified Northwest Territories."

We have accomplished a great deal in a very short period of time. But we also know much remains to be done; for example, we must deal with the persistent, destructive social issues found in many of our communities, and look at ways to bring down the cost of living. We must be ready to take advantage of economic development opportunities that are at our doorstep, while protecting the health of our land, wildlife and people. We must invest in our children and youth, the future of our communities. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister of Finance, Mr. Roland.

Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to advise Members of new information the government has received very recently, which has required us to review our fiscal situation and revise the fiscal outlook I provided to this House on October 14th.

As Members are aware, the federal government administers income taxes, both personal and corporate, on behalf of the Government of the Northwest Territories. On Friday, October 21st, the Department of Finance received information from the federal government that our corporate income tax collections for the 2004 taxation year are approximately $30 million less than previously estimated. This reduction has also affected our forecast of corporate income tax revenues for 2005 and for future

years, and significantly reduces the budget surplus figures I provided to Members on October 14th.

I would stress that these are preliminary numbers.

Nevertheless, Mr. Speaker, this revenue reduction is very disturbing news, given that the NWT economy is growing rapidly. With the level of economic activity we are seeing, we would expect tax revenues to grow, as well. We will be working with the Canada Revenue Agency to determine the reasons for the decline.

The uncertainty we face with respect to our tax revenues is magnified by further uncertainty surrounding our formula financing arrangements with Canada for 2006-07 and beyond. Until we hear the recommendations of the federal Expert Panel on Equalization and Territorial Formula Financing and how the federal government intends to act on those recommendations, our fiscal outlook is difficult to predict.

This situation points, more than ever, to the need for an adequate resource revenue sharing agreement with the federal government. Such an agreement must provide the Northwest Territories with enough revenues to withstand the impact of sudden changes to our fiscal situation.

In this environment, Mr. Speaker, it is only prudent that we examine the expenditure side of our budget. In fact, the fiscal responsibility policy that this government adopted earlier this year requires us to bring spending in line with our revenues. We will be looking at means to do this. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Item 2, Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this past weekend, I attended the annual conference of federal/provincial/territorial Ministers of Health in Toronto.

The primary focus of the meeting was to follow up on a number of specific commitments related to the implementation of the 10-year plan to strengthen health care, signed by all First Ministers in the fall of 2004.

I would like to take a few minutes to provide an update on some of the key discussions that took place, those of significant national interest, and those that are of particular importance to the NWT.

Wait Times

The issue of wait times received significant media coverage across Canada in recent weeks, leading up to the meeting. A "wait time" is how long you must wait for a specific medical procedure, from the time when the procedure is formally booked in the hospital until it has actually carried out.

At the 2004 First Ministers' meeting, it was agreed that by December 31, 2005, benchmarks for wait times are to be developed for the five priority areas: cancer, heart, diagnostic imaging, joint replacements, and sight restoration. "Benchmarks" represent the maximum amount of time patients should be waiting for specific procedures.

At the meeting, the provinces, territories and federal government confirmed that a first set of benchmarks will be completed by December 31st.

Several jurisdictions across Canada, including Ontario, Alberta, Saskatchewan and Nova Scotia, have wait times listings and registries posted on the Internet. The NWT will have a similar capability in 2006 for procedures performed in the NWT, beginning with basic wait list information early in the new year and more detailed information, similar to the Alberta wait list registry, by the spring. For medical procedures the NWT residents receive in Alberta, they can access the Alberta web site for information.

National Pharmaceuticals Strategy

In follow-up to the National Pharmaceuticals Strategy announced in 2004, Ministers reaffirmed the commitment to continue to work towards protecting Canadians from financial hardship due to catastrophic drug costs. This issue has been recently highlighted nationally by media coverage of a number of rare diseases, including Fabrys disease, which requires expensive drug therapy.

Ministers agreed to expand the common drug review to work toward consistency regarding which drugs are covered by provincial/territorial health care plans.

Pandemic Influenza Emergency Preparedness

Building on the Canadian influenza pandemic plan released in February 2004, the topic of ensuring that Canada is better prepared for a pandemic influenza outbreak was also discussed at the meeting. The federal government gave an overview of the international conference on global pandemic preparedness that it is hosting in Ottawa yesterday and today.

Crystal Meth

Ministers agreed that a collaborative approach is needed among federal, provincial and territorial governments as well as stakeholders in Education, Justice and Health, to address the issue of crystal meth in our communities. The federal government has agreed to explore how to control the chemicals used in manufacturing methamphetamines.

Blueprint For Aboriginal Health

Of particular interest to the NWT and our two northern neighbours was the discussion on the draft blueprint on aboriginal health. At a September 2004 meeting of First Ministers and national aboriginal leaders, direction was given to develop an action plan to improve health service for all aboriginal peoples, to close the gap between the health status of aboriginal peoples and the Canadian public.

Over the last number of months, each jurisdiction, as well as the various national aboriginal organizations, has conducted consultations and prepared submissions to form the basis for the national blueprint on aboriginal health. Once finalized, the blueprint on aboriginal health document will be presented at the November 2005 First Ministers' meeting on aboriginal issues. The NWT continues to send the message that the federal

government needs to acknowledge its fiduciary obligation for health services for aboriginal people, and that any new initiatives arising from the blueprint need to be accompanied with financial resources to implement them.

Mr. Speaker, as we try to do at every national meeting we attend, I met with my territorial counterparts, Minister Leona Aglukkaq from Nunavut and Minister Peter Jenkins from the Yukon. Along with our officials, we took time in Toronto to discuss a number of issues of mutual concern to determine how we may best work together to present a strong, united northern voice at the national table.

One of the outstanding issues for all three territories is the progress towards the finalization of the transfer of funds related to the territorial health access fund committed by the federal government in September 2004. Department officials of the three territories met in Ottawa yesterday with senior officials from Health Canada, Northern Secretariat, to continue to move this forward. This has been a lengthy process and negotiation, which will hopefully be concluded by the end of this calendar year. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya,

Beverage Container Program
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Norman Yakeleya

Norman Yakeleya Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I want to speak to you about the lack of beverage container recycling facilities in the Sahtu. Woody Allen once said, "In Beverly Hills, they don't throw their garbage away, they make it into television shows."

Well, the Sahtu must be like Beverly Hills, because I wouldn't be throwing away our garbage either; we can't afford to. November 1, 2005, is when the container program is supposed to begin. As far as I know, there isn't one facility in the Sahtu that will take our containers or refund our money.

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An Hon. Member

Shame.

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Norman Yakeleya

Norman Yakeleya Sahtu

So this means that my constituents and I are either going to be stockpiling our bottles in our limited housing, or throwing them away at a personal loss. Mr. Speaker, we already suffer a high cost of living. I don't understand how the Minister of ENR can rationalize going ahead with this program until all the communities can recycle. This is not fair to the Sahtu. We need a recycling plant, too. Mr. Speaker, I am really scared that this is the precedent-setting mood. What programs are allowed to merge, and what programs will, probably, in our case, exclude our segment of the population.

Mr. Speaker, I agree with recycling 100 percent; I agree with protecting the environment 100 percent; but I don't agree that 75 percent of the Territories should be able to recycle and get refunded, while the rest of the population, such as the Sahtu, has to pay for it, just like many other things that they do in the Northwest Territories. Mahsi cho, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Nunakput, Mr. Pokiak.

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Calvin Pokiak

Calvin Pokiak Nunakput

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Like my colleagues, I believe that the Department of Environment and Natural Resources should be applauded for introducing the NWT beverage container recycling program. This program will reduce the amount of garbage in our landfills.

However, Mr. Speaker, there are problems. I did receive a number of calls, prior to session, from businesses like the Northern Store and Co-op, as well as concerned citizens, over the fact that implementation will mean that prices will go up to pay for the cost of the recycling program. Many NWT residents rely on income support and will suffer because of the increased costs to purchase beverages.

In my region, Mr. Speaker, there will be less work because the industry has scaled back in their operations. This means there may be more people on income support. Mr. Speaker, this is big concern for local residents and vendors. There are also concerns with how the refund program will work in the smaller communities that are not on the regular highway system.

Mr. Speaker, Tuktoyaktuk has a recycling program in place right now, but it is voluntary and no one gets paid for turning their empties in. How will they get refunds once the program starts and they are paying more for beverages?

Mr. Speaker, as the MLA for Nunakput, I would like to request this government to reconsider the implementation of the program until such time as the refund programs are set up. Nunakput residents already pay the highest for food; we don't need to pay more. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Pokiak. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I want to talk about day care. We have watched many day care centres open and, subsequently, close their doors. We have to ask ourselves why.

We talk about support for families and women in this Legislature, and is there anything more important to a student, or working mother, than knowing that her child or children are in good caring and capable hands? We need standards; we need reporting mechanisms; we need program guidelines; and we need safety and quality control. I don't know how many Members of this House have had the responsibility of caring for someone else's pre-schoolers, but, Mr. Speaker, it is a very demanding job that requires a high degree of commitment.

Day care workers are required to be temporary mom or dad, nurse, teacher, cook, referee and counsellor, and the list goes on. For the owners or managers there is the additional role of business manager, bookkeeper,

accounts payable, account receivable, invoicing, ordering supplies and groceries, and dealing with the challenges of the CCRA, GST remittances, and timely reporting to potential funders such as the GNWT.

As a government, we need to look beyond issuing the edicts of how things shall be done. We need to see if there are ways that we can come along side and offer support; yes, even in a hands-on way to operators who may have an invaluable service to offer to the community, to working or studying parents, but who need a little support to help them meet all the rules and requirements related to their undertaking.

If day care is done right, providing good programming, educational materials and equipment, nutritional snacks and lunches, trained staff and proper staff child ratios, day care is a non-profit business. In order to plan even one month in advance, an operator needs to know how many children will be in their care; they need to know that their sources of revenue are going to be consistent and reliable, and there should be no such thing as a daily rate. There should only be monthly rates for spaces, and this should also include the support from ECE programs. This should be all payable in advance, based on spaces available and the number of children who will be attending.

Mr. Speaker, I think, as a government, we need to recognize the importance of access to quality day care services. We need to recognize that some families may require support to access that service, and we need to recognize that direct financial support may be the only thing that will make the difference between success and/or failure of a facility. We need to think creatively about how we can remove barriers that hold people back from bettering themselves and the lives of their children.

So far, Mr. Speaker, I don't think we have done that. Either we don't believe it's important, or we just need a woman or a mother on the other side of the floor in that Cabinet. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Some Hon. Members

Ohhh.

---Applause

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake, Ms. Lee.

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Sandy Lee

Sandy Lee Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, day cares in the North are closing. They have been closing in Yellowknife, and many other places, because of the inadequacy in funding. There is not enough money to find and pay for suitable locations to run them, and when a group of dedicated volunteers get together and get a centre going, they quickly learn that the subsidy they receive from the government is not enough to keep the facility going.

Day care funding is inequitable in so many ways. Some kids need more attention than others, and when kids don't show up, for some reason, the day cares are not paid. Goodness knows, these day cares are not operating on a podgy core funding budget. Day care workers are notoriously underpaid. When all these centres fail, the government puts up their hands and say, "Oh, golly gee, I wonder what happened."

Instead of picking an action to find the solution, they look around to see who they can blame, Mr. Speaker. First, it's the federal government: "Well Mr. Speaker, the federal government announced their $5 billion program months ago and everyone here knows that is always an uphill battle to get ourselves outside of the per capita financing formula box."

It would have taken a well organized, concerted effort on the part of the entire Cabinet to fight this battle and win it. So where has this Cabinet been all this time, Mr. Speaker, why such a surprise?

Last week, when answering questions, Premier Handley kept saying that he needed financial records from the centre, as though there is some kind of financial wrongdoing. When asked, Minister Dent tells me that there is no such suggestion, it's just that there is not enough money. So then what was up with all those questions from the Premier, and why does the department keep sending letters to the day care, asking for things that they don't understand? Why don't they try to spend the time finding solutions and assistance?

The lack of ability to move on this file on the part of the Minister is very disturbing, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday, when answering questions to Mrs. Groenewegen about a possibility of giving the day care contributions directly to the day care itself, the Minister says he will consider it, but he has to get the request from the centre.

His wait-and-react attitude is really getting on my nerves, Mr. Speaker. What is up with all the things that we are saying -- the Status of Women Council, Members Lafferty and Groenewegen -- is he not listening? He even suggested that he didn't get any direction from the Social Programs committee. Well, if he thinks that he can get more action out of this side of the floor, Mr. Speaker, I will happily give up my seat and take over his seat...

---Laughter

...and show him how I can do things without waiting for the world to fall apart. Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to complete my statement.

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The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude her statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Ms. Lee.

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Sandy Lee

Sandy Lee Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There are so many more disturbing excuses that have been made in this House, and I am going to pursue that further. I can also tell you that I received an e-mail from Minister Miltenberger on this issue, that basically states that what I say here or what we say is completely irrelevant, and I am going to make sure that the Members on that side know that what we do matters, and that people out there want us to address these issues. I intend to pursue that for the rest of the day and the rest of this session. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Item 3, Members' statements. The honourable Member for Great Slave, Mr. Braden.

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Bill Braden

Bill Braden Great Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. This past weekend, on Saturday, I spent a few hours with some other volunteers bagging groceries at the local Co-op store as a fundraiser. It was a very successful afternoon, Mr. Speaker, but as I was packing the groceries along the conveyor belt there, it was hard not to notice the number of containers, cans and packages that go through the grocery tills and, of course, in our homes that contain the food that we eat. In another seven days, Mr. Speaker, we are going to be passing along, for any beverage that people choose to buy in these containers, an extra 15 cents apiece. If you are a mother that goes through several juice boxes a week, you might find yourself several dollars behind because of that expense. If you go through a few cans of pop or juice at home, if you go through any other kind of beverage, you are going to be paying an extra 15 cents apiece.

Mr. Speaker, it is interesting that the information there that has already been circulated on this program, and that we are going to see more of, suggests that there is maybe 10 cents that one is going to be out of pocket. The reality is that it is 15 cents that is coming out of the consumer's pocket. They will get 10 cents back if they live in a community, Mr. Speaker, where there is a depot, or they can take that container back and get refunded.

Mr. Speaker, I have had quite a bit of traffic from constituents who are really alarmed at the unfairness of this program as we know it today where, especially, really in the small communities, there is a huge unfairness going on here, because those consumers will not be able to take their containers back and get their refund, yet they are going to be charged. People in the bigger communities, including Yellowknife, have got a good system, and we can rely on that. We certainly support the efforts that are behind this program for recycling. But we have a major problem to fix in its implementation at the small community level, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

---Applause