Thank you. The science tells us, the numbers tell us, all the work we’ve done with the communities and all the census information tells us that if we just carry on the next, within about two to three years, the Bathurst herd as a separate distinct herd will cease to exist if we just allow the hunting to continue. We have an obligation and a requirement to do the right things to protect the herd and at the same time respect the processes that are now underway with the Wekeezhii and to consult further with the

Yellowknives to come up with a longer term plan. This short-term emergency interim measure allows us to do that. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Your final supplementary, Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Once again, no one disagrees with the short-term emergency measures, Mr. Speaker, it’s about restricting the aboriginal right to subsistence hunting. When it happened with the cod fishing, they’re still allowed to fish for cod. So I’d like to ask the Minister to give that serious consideration and tell this House if he can commit to work towards that before March. Thank you.

Thank you. I’ll reiterate my commitment and information that I gave when the Member from Hay River South asked the questions. We have discussions underway. We have agreement with the Northwest Territories Metis. The Tlicho Government has supported our efforts for conservation. We have, and continue to have, dialogue and some clear proposals up for discussion with the Yellowknives and we are committed to hopefully resolving this issue in the not-too-distant future. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. The honourable Member for Weledeh, Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’d like to continue asking questions of the Minister of Environment and Natural Resources on caribou. I’d like to start with, well, temporarily setting aside the whole aboriginal rights issue, the urgency of the caribou. Does the Minister fully appreciate what the caribou mean to the Yellowknives Dene and all aboriginal people? Could he describe his understanding of what they mean?

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Maybe asking the Minister for his opinion. Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I stand here as the Minister of Environment and Natural Resources. I spent a lot of time over the last few years becoming very conversant in all the issues, mainly wildlife that we’re dealing with. Plus I’ve been around for a long time, long enough to know and fully appreciate the value and importance of caribou to the people of the Northwest Territories as part of the fundamental nature and character of the Northwest Territories and has helped define how the people have evolved over the centuries.

I appreciate that note of caution. I do understand that, as well, and I fully understand that the caribou are meaningful and spiritual as well

as in the physical and nutritional and emotional ways. And I think we all do in this House. But I’m wondering if that understanding was carried into the consultation process and, if so, during the consultation process did the Minister receive the go-ahead from the Yellowknives Dene for this ban?

The reason we’re still having these discussions with the Yellowknives, of course, is because we haven’t come to a final understanding and agreement on the ban. There is work underway, but, no, the Yellowknives did not approve or support the ban when it was initiated.

Again, this is by way of making sure that we’re all clear on why we are dealing with this issue today. I would for the record like to ask the Minister why he did then go ahead with the ban.

Emergency interim measures by definition, in my mind, we were faced with a need to make a decision to protect the caribou otherwise there would be a possible further precipitous decline and under the authorities that I did have or do have I made that very difficult decision to protect the herd and at the same time engage in the measures that were currently underway to find that area of accommodation and support among the aboriginal governments.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Final supplementary, Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Finally, I’d like to know – and I’d like to start by appreciating the Minister’s action along with that of the Yellowknives Dene to get together and talk about this, involve the entire community -- how will this process continue and how will support be gathered throughout the range of the Bathurst caribou to ensure that the solution is acceptable to all and put in place effectively and quickly.

I’d like to separate again the two fundamental issues. There’s the short-term issue of the number of months of the ban, which we’re going to sort out here hopefully in the next little while. The longer-range planning within the Tlicho and between the Tlicho and Yellowknives and the Northwest Territories Métis and all the other stakeholders to come up with a harvest management plan is a process that is in fact now underway. The dates have slipped where the Wekeezhii board has not been able to meet its initial targets, but that longer term process is absolutely fundamental to the well-being and survival of the herds and the involvement of all the aboriginal governments through a co-management process.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. The honourable Minister responsible for Environment and Natural Resources, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In the Sahtu Final Agreement, as it pertains to wildlife harvesting and management, it states there that the government shall retain the ultimate jurisdiction for the management of wildlife and wildlife habitats, and in emergency circumstances requiring immediate decisions respecting policies and regulations in respect to the harvesting of wildlife by any person, the Minister may make interim emergency decisions. We see this as an emergency. We’re fully committed. We’ve got resources ready to work with the Yellowknives. We’ve come to an agreement with the Tlicho Government where they’ve supported this necessity and the alternative measures. We’re working with the Yellowknives to come to, hopefully, a satisfactory conclusion. As well, to address the issue to make sure there is caribou available from other areas. At the same time doing the fundamental issue of protecting the Bathurst herd.

The right to hunt and provide food for our people, to teach them many different methods of survival of the aboriginal people. The issue here is in terms of the rights of aboriginal people to hunt for food for their families for their survival. In terms of the attitudes of governments of the past not to recognize aboriginal rights, this is the attitude I see of this government here in terms of putting a ban on hunting without proper consultation with the affected parties. Is the Minister, in terms of his decision with his staff in terms of having traditional knowledge, let the people decide for themselves how to handle the caribou, will the Minister give that to the people?

We fully respect and engage in the area of traditional knowledge. In fact, when the caribou work was

being done in the Sahtu, the Member’s riding, Colville Lake was given money because they didn’t really believe the government numbers about the decline of the herd and they were given money to in fact replicate and see what their numbers told them. They came back with the same information, that there was a decline. The Member helped negotiate the Sahtu Agreement where the quote I just made about where there are urgent circumstances, the Minister has the authority to intervene if it’s necessary and can be justified. We’re in the same circumstances here. The Member should appreciate that he contemplated, when he helped negotiate the Sahtu Agreement, that there is a conservation issue here that we are trying to deal with in the most constructive way possible keeping in mind the need to ensure that there is still the aboriginal right to harvest.

At the time of the negotiations I didn’t know Minister Miltenberger would be our Minister in terms of this issue here. I wanted to say that in terms of making reference to residents of Colville Lake, Colville Lake people, I spoke to them the other day, they had some words for it and I can’t say them in the House in terms of the issue of caribou. The Minister has indicated that. I’ll leave it at that.

I want to ask the Minister in terms of the impact of caribou in this here, has he really looked at the impacts of the diamond mines, vehicles that are going into the diamond mines, has that been given consideration in terms of he is putting a lot of weight onto the aboriginal people and that’s not fair. So I want to ask the Minister in terms of his discussions with the money over food in terms of the impacts of the mines and the vehicles.

The one thing we know we can control in the short term over this hunting season is the hunt, where we estimated that anywhere from 7,000 to 10,000 animals are taken out annually. When you only have 30,000 animals left, that is a significant impact. We recognize there are concerns about the mines, the resource development, the winter road. All those projects, I would add, have gone through a fairly thorough environmental assessment process...(inaudible)...but in fact we recognize, as we do the broader, longer term harvest management plan, the issues of cumulative impact and if we look at all the measures required to protect the herd, are the issues about traffic on the winter road and all those other issues related to the mines there for discussion? Absolutely.