This is page numbers 2863 - 2918 of the Hansard for the 17th Assembly, 4th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was income.

Topics

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Moses. Mr. Yakeleya.

Norman Yakeleya

Norman Yakeleya Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

    1. Monitoring of program delivery in regional/community service centres is inconsistent

According to the Auditor General, ECE's monitoring of income security programs delivered by regional and community service centres is inconsistent. Managers in some regions visit community service centres to monitor general program delivery and spending. However, in most regions they did not monitor files in detail for compliance due to costs of travel, staff shortages and workloads.

The OAG found examples of good monitoring practices in some regions. In one region, the manager reviews random client files and documents results to ensure CSOs verified information properly and the file complies with requirements. Findings are presented to CSOs, highlighting areas in need of attention. Another region implemented a buddy system that matches CSOs to a designated staff member to whom they can transfer responsibility for files involving family members or friends. The standing committee believes a buddy system would also be helpful in peer mentoring and as a backup in case of absence or overload.

Recommendation 11

The Standing Committee on Government Operations concurs with the Auditor General of Canada and recommends that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment should ensure that regional managers and supervisors formally monitor client files. This monitoring should include regularly scheduled reviews of client files as well as the use of standard templates in all regions to help ensure a consistent approach. In cases where monitoring uncovers deficiencies or other issues, regional managers and supervisors should follow up formally.

The Auditor General also found that regional and community service centres set productive choice requirements inconsistently. CSOs in some regions thought 25 hours a month were required, while those in other regions thought no set hours were established. In some smaller communities, CSOs enforce a standard number of hours to avoid perceptions of unfairness.

Recommendation 12

The Standing Committee on Government Operations concurs with the Auditor General of Canada and recommends that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment should clarify program requirements for productive choices in its guidance to client service officers and clearly communicate them. Regional managers should also monitor compliance with productive choice requirements and take corrective action where necessary.

The standing committee considers that some flexibility is needed in the number of hours, because of differences in client's abilities and difference in the choices available in communities. The committee's main concern, however, was that the productive choices should be genuinely productive for the clients. They often are not, in Members' experience. More guidance is needed for clients in what is expected of them when they undertake a productive choice such as education, training or, especially, volunteer work. In addition to the Auditor General's recommendation, the committee would like to see a full evaluation of the productive choices component of the Income Assistance program.

Recommendation 13

The Standing Committee on Government Operations recommends that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment undertake a complete evaluation of the productive choice component of the Income Assistance program, as a priority, that the evaluation involve the community leadership and residents, and that the department provide options for change in the productive choices component of Income Assistance to the Standing Committee on Social Programs within the life of the 17th Assembly.

    1. Processes to identify and address inaccurate payments have not been followed

Compliance reviews of selected files for all four programs are required by policy to ensure clients receive benefits to which they are entitled.

The Auditor General found that ECE had not developed a strategy or framework to identify files for compliance review and had reviewed files only after staff identified a problem or risk. ECE completed 72 file reviews in the three fiscal years from 2009-2010 to 2011-2012, mostly on income assistance files; three were student financial assistance files. No compliance reviews were done for Senior Home Heating Subsidy or Child Care User Subsidy.

The standing committee was pleased to hear that the department has made progress on a strategy and framework for file audits, and is now undertaking file compliance audits in one community per region each year.

Recommendation 14

The Standing Committee on Government Operations concurs with the Auditor General of Canada and recommends that, in accordance with its program requirements, the Department of Education, Culture and Employment should review a selection of income security files periodically, to ensure that clients receive benefits to which they are entitled. The department should establish a framework to identify files to audit, based on predetermined criteria. Results should be reported to the director of income security annually.

Collection procedures for debts due to a department are required over a 90-day period under the GNWT FAM. If the debt cannot be collected, the department must forward the debts to Finance for collection.

The Auditor General found that ECE has not been following required collection procedures for overpayments of income assistance and 1,620 clients have received overpayments over the last 10 years amounting to about $2 million. Only $880,000 of this overpayment had been collected by September 2012. The department deducts $25 per month from client benefits to recover overpayments. It does not collect from clients who are no longer on income assistance.

Finance has established a six-year statute of limitations for the collection of debts. There was 26 percent of clients who were overpaid who faced no collection activity in six years or more. These debts could be losses for ECE. The department does not report these debts in its annual financial statements. ECE says it does not follow the required procedure because the CMAS database does not have a trigger to set the process in motion. CMAS notifies the CSO of an overpayment but does not track the age of the debt.

The committee recognizes that the department is working on solutions to some of its collections issues and expects to see results by December 31, 2013.

Recommendation 15

The Standing Committee on Government Operations concurs with the Auditor General of Canada and recommends that when the Department of Education, Culture and Employment identifies income assistance overpayments, it should comply with the Financial Administration Manual requirements for collecting them. It should follow collection procedures by issuing invoices and written notifications, per the required schedule, and forward outstanding debts to the Department of Finance for collection when required.

  1. Processes for managing remissible and repayable loans are incomplete

As of March 2012, $29.7 million in repayable student financial assistance loans was due to the department, and $6.4 million in remissible loans. The default rate for repayable loans was about 31 percent in 2012, according to the Auditor General. The committee is concerned at the high rate of default. Monitoring processes for student financial assistance loans rely on officials manually reviewing program reports and on the student or the educational institution notifying the department. There is a risk loans due for repayment may be missed.

Recommendation 16

The Standing Committee on Government Operations concurs with the Auditor General of Canada and recommends that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment should modify its management of student loans to ensure that identification of student loans due for repayment does not rely solely on student notification or manual review by officials.

Mr. Speaker, I will now turn over the report to the chair, Mr. Nadli.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Nadli.

Michael Nadli

Michael Nadli Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

  1. Front-line staff do not receive sufficient training

Income security programs and the ECE strategic plan require the department to train staff to fulfill their duties. CSOs must complete a two-week course to receive their statutory designation, with authority to assess client eligibility, evaluate their financial needs and issue payments. The CSOs had completed the course, but the department does not have an ongoing training and development program for CSOs. Student financial assistance case officers, for their part, receive a binder, but no formal training. The department has not fully assessed training needs of CSOs or SFA case officers.

Recommendation 17

The Standing Committee on Government Operations concurs with the Auditor General of Canada and recommends that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment should formalize current and future competency-based training programs for client service officers and student case officers. It should identify and provide core training so they can attain and maintain the competencies their job requires. The department should also ensure that staff members receive regular training updates, to ensure that they fully understand Income Security Program requirements.

The standing committee considers regular training opportunities to be especially important in view of the very high turnover rate for CSOs. The committee also expects the department to ensure that there is no interruption of service when staff are attending training. A backup system that is more than a 1-800 number is required.

  1. Data Collection and Analysis Towards Performance Assessment

The standing committee was reminded in a previous Auditor General's report that effective program management requires that:

  • performance indicators and program standards are established;
  • performance is measured and monitored against standards; and
  • issues are identified and action taken to improve programs.

The second major question the Auditor General asked in this audit was whether ECE assessed the performance of its programs in order to ensure objectives are met. ECE's efforts to assess program performance between January 2007 and September 2012 were examined, in order to include the 2007 reform initiative that emphasized new goals of self-reliance for clients.

  1. The Auditor General found that the department regularly solicits input from clients on program performance.

The department conducts ongoing client satisfaction surveys. During the review, the committee learned that 73 percent of income assistance respondents were satisfied with programs and services, according to the latest survey results. Members do not see 73 percent as a very good result. The department must focus on good client service. The survey results are valuable performance measures, and the committee would like to ensure they are eventually made public.

Recommendation 18

The Standing Committee on Government Operations recommends that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment report its income assistance client survey results annually as a performance measure in the departmental business plan.

  1. However, there is limited assessment of program performance

The department collects some relevant information through CMAS, including client characteristics and numbers, spending, and variances in program use and spending by community and region. The Auditor General found, however, that the department does little to track results.

The department had not established any targets or outcome measures for three of the four income security programs audited. It had only one target for Income Assistance: reducing the number of recipients in the 19 to 29 age group by providing supports for education and training.

The standing committee learned during the hearing that approximately 30 percent of the Income Assistance caseload is made up of recipients on assistance for more than one year. Additional monitoring and reporting would be helpful in determining the reasons for such a high proportion of recipients on long-term assistance and evaluating the department's success in meeting the self-reliance goal.

The department collects other information that could be used to measure whether Income Security objectives are being met; for example, the number of returning clients, length of time on benefits, and the number participating in productive choices. The department could also use info from its student financial assistance files to help determine the number of graduates.

In sum, the department has not formally evaluated the four programs to assess their performance, and ECE has not evaluated its success in meeting the new objective of client self-reliance since income security programs were restructured in 2007.

Recommendation 19

The Standing Committee on Government Operations concurs with the Auditor General of Canada and recommends that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment should:

  • establish targets and outcome measures that align with the overall objective for its income security programs;
  • review the data it currently collects on income security programs, to ensure it has the data required to measure whether targets and outcomes are being met; and
  • develop a plan to identify when it will evaluate its programs, to determine if the objective of its income security programs is being met.

Conclusion

The committee is encouraged that the Minister has accepted the Auditor General's recommendations and that the department plans to implement them. Members are, nevertheless, convinced that ECE's Income Security Program delivery and evaluation will improve only if the department's senior management devotes sustained attention, over a period of years, to carrying out the planned reforms and creating an organizational culture of client service.

The standing committee remains deeply concerned by the findings of this audit. It is the Auditor General's practice from time to time to review the results of past audits and report on whether recommendations are being implemented. The standing committee is hopeful that the Auditor General of Canada will conduct a follow-up audit of ECE's income security programs at a suitable interval. Meanwhile, the committee expects the Department of Education, Culture and Employment to report on its implementation of the recommendations on an annual basis to the appropriate standing committee.

Recommendation 20

The Standing Committee on Government Operations recommends that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment report to the Standing Committee on Social Programs by April 30th each year on its progress in implementing the recommendations of the Auditor General and this House with respect to income security programs during the preceding fiscal year.

The committee believes the department is committed to change, and encourages its senior management to work consistently towards creating a far more client-centred and accountable organization for the delivery of vital income security programs.

Recommendation 21

The Standing Committee on Government Operations recommends that the government provide a comprehensive response to this report within 120 days.

Mr. Speaker, that concludes the report of the Standing Committee on Government Operations on the Review of the Auditor General of Canada on the 2013 Income Security Programs.

Michael Nadli

Michael Nadli Deh Cho

I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Frame Lake, that Committee Report 5-17(4) be received by the Assembly and moved into Committee of the Whole for further consideration.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Nadli. To the motion.

Some Hon. Members

Question.

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Question has been called.

---Carried

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Committee Report 5-17(4) will be moved into Committee of the Whole for further consideration. Mr. Nadli.

Michael Nadli

Michael Nadli Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to waive Rule 93(4) and move Committee Report 5-17(4) into Committee of the Whole for consideration today. Mahsi.

---Unanimous consent granted

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Nadli. Colleagues, I'm going to take a 15-minute break.

---SHORT RECESS

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Item 5, returns to oral questions. Item 6, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Abernethy.

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Glen Abernethy

Glen Abernethy Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize two individuals who are on the Anti-Poverty Steering Committee, Ms. Bronwyn Watters and Ms. Julie Green, and thank you both so much for all the hard work you put into this strategy. Thank you.

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The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Abernethy. Mr. Hawkins.

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Robert Hawkins

Robert Hawkins Yellowknife Centre

Mr. Speaker, it gives me great pleasure to recognize the flood of seniors we have here today, recognizing the day it is. From the NWT Seniors Society, we have Barb Hood, executive director; Carly Aasen, project intern officer; Yvonne Quick, who is a program coordinator as well as an Arctic ambassador. Maureen Hall, also known passionately as Squeak, of course, is president of the Yellowknife Seniors' Society. Marg Green is a member of the Yellowknife Seniors' Society. We all call her Nana Marg, by the way. June Van Dine Arden is a board member of the Yellowknife Seniors' Society. Kim Doyle, who is no stranger to Members here in the Assembly, is the executive director of the Seniors' Society. Della Green is the coordinator of the Victim Services Program. Esther Braden is past-president of the Canadian Hard of Hearing Association chapter in Yellowknife.

I have a couple of other quick groups to recognize, some constituents in the gallery as well. I want to thank them, as Mr. Abernethy has said. Julie Green, thank you for staying, as well as Janice McKenna; and Status of Women, Lorraine Phaneuf and Annemieke Mulders.

The last group I'd like to recognize are Engineers Canada. They are having their national coordinating body for all engineer professions and they're having their meeting here in Yellowknife. I think I have seen probably 40 or so, in that range, walking around the building. I want to thank them for coming to the Northwest Territories and let them know that there are many towns and special places outside of Yellowknife, so don't be afraid to come back and visit them. Thank you again for choosing Yellowknife. They're having their AGM on Saturday. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Moses.

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Alfred Moses

Alfred Moses Inuvik Boot Lake

Mr. Speaker, I'd like to recognize my constituency assistant, Ms. Maia Lepage. I believe I did see her up in the stands earlier. She is also here chaperoning two Pages from Inuvik, Ms. Kyla Hvatum and Ms. Keisha Shaimaiyuk. They said they've been having a good time here in the capital as well as paging here in the Legislative Assembly. I'm really glad that they have had that experience and were able to come to Yellowknife and participate in the program. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Moses. Mr. Bromley.

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Bob Bromley

Bob Bromley Weledeh

I believe I still have some constituents from Weledeh in the House. Barb Hood, executive director of the NWT Seniors. I would also like to welcome the other seniors and other residents here. Aggie Brockman is here. Also Cominco, Greg Loftus, welcome, Greg. I would like to specially recognize my working partner for the last four years, my CA, Craig Yeo. Also, many of the seniors here that have been mentioned. Squeak is here. Welcome, Squeak. Also Marg Green, Della Green, Yvonne Quick. Esther Braden was here earlier. I don`t know whether she is still here. Lorraine Phaneuf, Annemieke Mulders. I won't put her in the seniors' category, but many of these are, of course, some are real workhorses for public interest and public health and benefit for our people. Julie Green is out here, so much work on the Anti-Poverty Strategy and other aspects. Bronwyn Watters as well. Welcome to all of those folks and any that I have missed.

I would also like to recognize the Engineers Canada. I understand they are going to have their Engineers Canada gala at the Weledeh School here in Weledeh on Saturday night. Welcome to Weledeh a little bit in advance there. Thank you for choosing Yellowknife. Mahsi.

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The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Ms. Bisaro.

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Wendy Bisaro

Wendy Bisaro Frame Lake

Thanks, Mr. Speaker. I'd like to recognize Jeff Corradetti, Frame Lake constituent. Thanks, Jeff, for coming to listen to us today. I would like to recognize the groups that came here, the seniors group that came. I don't think I need to go through the names. I'd like to particularly mention the members of the steering committee for the Anti-Poverty Strategy who are here and thank them for their work, and the Status of Women Council group who are here. Thank you.

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The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. I'd like to welcome everybody here and thank you for coming in for today's proceedings.

Item 7, acknowledgements. Ms. Bisaro.

Wendy Bisaro

Wendy Bisaro Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today I'd like to acknowledge Frame Lake constituent Mr. Ian Legaree, director of sport, recreation and youth with our Department of Municipal and Community Affairs. Ian, yesterday, received the Dave Ramsden Career Excellence Award. This is the most prestigious of the awards presented at the annual Premier's Awards ceremony and it recognizes the outstanding achievements of an individual with 20 or more years of experience in the GNWT public service. Congratulations, Ian. Well deserved.

Some Hon. Members

Hear! Hear!

---Applause

The Speaker

The Speaker Jackie Jacobson

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Item 8, oral questions. The Member for Hay River North, Mr. Bouchard.