This is page numbers 1055 - 1110 of the Hansard for the 19th Assembly, 2nd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was going.

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Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Kevin O'Reilly

Kevin O'Reilly Frame Lake

Thanks, Madam Chair. I'm trying to understand why we're spending $72 million for renovations on a building that we're not even going to own at the end of the day. This is part of a weird P3 arrangement that I could never really get to the bottom of in the last Assembly.

Can someone explain to me why we have to spend this much money on renovations when we're not going to own the building and we're going to have to lease the space afterwards? Is that what this arrangement is all about? Thanks, Madam Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member for Frame Lake. Minister of Finance.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Thank you, Madam Chair. I would be more than happy to offer that explanation, but to be quite frank, I do not have that contract or those arrangements in front of me and was simply not anticipating to be defending the entire P3 arrangement around Stanton today. I will be more than happy to give that answer, but I think I can really just commit to getting that detail. I am not going to be in a position to answer that fulsomely today.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Minister of Finance. Member for Frame Lake.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Kevin O'Reilly

Kevin O'Reilly Frame Lake

Sure. Thanks. I didn't anticipate getting into this level of detail in some of these things, as well. I take it, then, that the Minister is prepared to provide that information following this discussion. Thanks, Madam Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member. Minister of Finance.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Sorry, Madam Chair. The answer is yes, but there is a fairly large question there around getting into the justification for a project that, again, began in the 18th Assembly, and there is possibly a bigger conversation around why we would have a P3 project in general.

Yes, I will commit to getting some more detail about the nature of the project and the nature of the agreement, the pros and cons of the agreement, and the benefits thereof. If that is a satisfactory commitment to the Member, then that is where I am at. If I am missing something, I will be corrected, I'm sure.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Minister. Member for Frame Lake.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Kevin O'Reilly

Kevin O'Reilly Frame Lake

Thanks, Madam Chair. I am happy to take that commitment from the Minister. I just want to correct one thing. This is actually something that was started in the 17th Assembly, or just before the election, maybe. I just want to know why we are spending $72 million on renovations for a building that we are not going to own and then we have to lease back space out of it. It just doesn't sound right to me, but I'm happy to get the Minister's explanation following this meeting. Thanks, Madam Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member for Frame Lake. Did you have any further questions? All right. I will go back to Member for Thebacha.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Frieda Martselos

Frieda Martselos Thebacha

Madam Chair, I just want clarification also, now, with this P3 with the $72 million. We are not going to own it. Even with some of these modifications and renovations, and further on with the tenders, the government still puts the tenders out, or does the owner of the building have a say in who gets the tender? Could you give clarification on that, please? You are not very specific in your answers even to other Members today. I would like being specific. When you're putting a building up or doing a renovation, even with the planning, usually you're very specific, even if you're going to be doing it in a negotiated contract. You have not been very specific exactly with your answers, and I want to make sure that you answer me specifically with what you are going to be doing.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member for Thebacha. Minister of Finance.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Thank you, Madam Chair. There is an ongoing project to renovate the Stanton legacy building, and right now, there is a $9,782,000 carry-over that is being requested, because that is an amount that was cash flow last year that wasn't used up in that period. The Department of Health and Social Services is asking to carry it forward to continue the project that is under way. Right now, that is what I have in front of me. I don't have all of the project specifics in front of me, because that would be part of the capital planning project that would have been approved, as I have said, under the 18th Assembly and planned, it sounds like, under the 17th Assembly.

Our own capital planning process will be in draft form before the Members next month, at which point there would be, I imagine, a very detailed breakdown of exactly where the projects are at, and what stage they're at, and what the current cash flow projections are going to be for the next year going forward. I am happy to have that conversation again at that point, in terms of looking at where we are at in these projects and determining if, in fact, we want to continue to have these projects on our capital plans.

For the moment, all that is being requested is to be able to continue the work that is under way, and that was previously approved. I have already made a commitment to another Member as far as determining and providing information on the pros and cons of this overall project. Again, I will be happy to get that and make that commitment. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Minister of Finance. I just want to remind Members to keep their questions focused to the carry-overs and not the overall project of the P3. The Minister has already agreed to provide us information if we have more questions on the P3 process. We have that commitment already. Member for Thebacha.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Frieda Martselos

Frieda Martselos Thebacha

We won't ask questions on the P3, but the results of this P3 are tremendous. We are in a COVID-19 pandemic, and many of our communities don't even have procedures that were actually offered in our health centres. Yet, we are putting $72 million in the end, probably negotiated contract and not tender, not own the building, and I can't even get bloodwork analyzed at the Fort Smith health centre. That is disgusting. You know? When you do these things and don't do it in a proper way of transparency and accountability, it's disturbing. I don't have any further comments, and I don't have any questions, but it's something to think about. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member for Thebacha. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Steve Norn

Steve Norn Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Mahsi. I'm just thinking, I have a quick question about the Stanton legacy building. They are split up into two different line items for just under $9.8 million and another one for just under $6.2 million. Why are they split up the way they are? It seems like they are both going towards the same building, but it's just south of $16 million. We are just going to sign off, and I would like to know a little bit more about it. Why were the numbers split up into the two items? Marsi cho.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member. Minister of Finance.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Thank you, Madam Chair. I am going to turn that one over to the assistant deputy Minister, Mr. Koe.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Mr. Koe.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Koe

Thank you, Madam Chair. Yes, they are two separate projects, because one is around the base building and, obviously, getting the Stanton building upgraded so that it is a building that meets all the standards of a building of that nature for today. The other project is the renovations to get that building renovated for the long-term care facility and services that will be operated in there; so they are two separate projects. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Mr. Koe. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

June 9th, 2020

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Steve Norn

Steve Norn Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you for the response. Can you just expand on what base buildings are, just so I understand a little bit better? Thank you.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member. Mr. Koe.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Koe

Thank you, Madam Chair. The base building modifications, and that's the word for it, were to get, you know, things like all of the materials that were in the building out, whether there was hazardous materials in there or not, but to get those out. The project was to get that building to a suitable situation so that the workers can come in to do those renovations for the long-term care facilities and the other facilities that will be in there. Thank you, Madam Chair.