This is page numbers 3165 - 3220 of the Hansard for the 19th Assembly, 2nd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was indigenous.

Topics

Kevin O'Reilly

Kevin O'Reilly Frame Lake

Thanks, Madam Chair. Yeah, I was looking for this information, actually, last night. I think it's probably in the neighbourhood of 8 or $10 million a year. Does that ballpark figure sound correct? And just a yes or no would be very helpful. Thanks, Madam Chair.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Madam Chair, I mean ballpark figure, I'll have to confirm. I don't want to say yes and then have to be on the floor answering for why the numbers are wrong. I'd prefer to be exact. So I'll commit to getting those costs to the Member in terms of what those payments and fees are. What's happened here is that the project was at a stage where the costs needed to be put -- to be booked, and so they were booked, and so now it's just ahead of schedule. It was in one fiscal year when it was expected and planned to be in the next. So not an unexpected cost, nothing new, and nothing adding in a way that we didn't plan for. Just didn't plan on the timing. And, fact, I mean, really, in some ways it's the good news that it's ahead of schedule, not behind.

We will get the exact breakdown of costs to the Member, though. Thank you, Madam Chair.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Minister. Member for Frame Lake.

Kevin O'Reilly

Kevin O'Reilly Frame Lake

Thanks, Madam Chair. Well, whether it was a good thing it was finished ahead of schedule, I guess that's -- perhaps others to weigh in on but certainly yesterday, I discussed how GNWT, in my view, has not completed a number of environmental management and wildlife-related plans in connection with the road opening that's happening today because it sounds like now the project was sped up. So that extra time that could have been spent on building this, stretching it out a bit a longer, would have allowed for maybe some of that work to get approved. So maybe I can get an answer as to why the project was sped up. Thanks, Madam Chair.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member. Minister of Finance.

Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, I think was already the subject of a fair bit of discussion between Minister Thompson and the Member already with regards to the project with regards to the work that's underway and/or already completed. I'm not going to restate all the answers that were given by my colleague. I can certainly turn it over to Minister Thompson and have him just speak to what work is outstanding.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

All right. Back to the Member. Member for Frame Lake.

Kevin O'Reilly

Kevin O'Reilly Frame Lake

Thank you, Madam Chair. I don't want to rehash that. I asked what I thought was a simple question, Madam Chair. Why was the project sped up? Can I have someone please answer that question. Thanks, Madam Chair.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, again, I'm not sure that I have detail as to the exact month by month or week by week timeline of the project. I can perhaps send this to Mr. Courtoreille who may at least have some breakdown of the variants and would have some understanding of the timing. Thank you, Madam Chair.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you. Mr. Courtoreille.

Courtoreille

Thank you, Madam Chair. The Tlicho All-Season Road was originally scheduled to be substantially complete today, on November 30th. That date hasn't changed.

To the timing comment that my Minister mentioned earlier, it's really about an accounting recognition of the amount of debt related to that P3 project and adjusting the long-term borrowing limit for the prior fiscal year. Thank you, Madam Chair.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Mr. Courtoreille. Member for Frame Lake.

Kevin O'Reilly

Kevin O'Reilly Frame Lake

Okay, thanks. I guess I'm still trying to understand, then, why was the debt then moved forward into the old here? Is that just somebody -- an accountant noticed that you had to book it all in the one year rather than another year; I'm just trying to understand this. Thanks, Madam Chair.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Member for Frame Lake. Minister of Finance.

Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Thank you, Madam Chair. So because of the fact that the road was able to -- well, again, the end date hasn't changed, but in terms of the timing of when some of the portions of it were complete, my understanding is that as a result of that, payments had to be made, and it was underestimated how quickly some stages of that project would go. When some of them go more quickly, the expenses incurred, the debt is then booked to the books, and that's what -- in doing that final reconciling at the time of doing year end, it was noticed that, in fact, they had exceeded the debt limit as appropriated under the 2021 dates. Thank you, Madam Chair.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Minister. Member for Frame Lake.

Kevin O'Reilly

Kevin O'Reilly Frame Lake

Thanks, Madam Chair. Yeah, I'm just trying to understand why this was not anticipated at the beginning of this project, why we're now trying to approve extra money for a financial year that's, like, six, eight months over now, ten months over, eight months, whatever. I just don't get why this wasn't planned from the beginning. Thanks, Madam Chair. And if anybody can help me, go for it.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you. Minister of Finance.

Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Thank you, Madam Chair. So, again, Madam Chair, it's not new money, it's not unanticipated money. It's not unexpected money. There's no new money. There's no new debt. It's the costs of the road and it's the cost of incurring the expenses on the road. What was different was in terms of the timing of when the expenses are showing as having been incurred based on the periodic completion leading up to today, which was always the expected date. And it takes -- there is a lag, you know, there is a lag in terms of when invoice's received. I've come to discover that it's at least a month by the time an invoice is received to the time when it is necessarily reconciled at the Department of Finance. And so it does take some time, and on a major project like this, it takes even longer.

When the final year end was done, that is the point at which they were able to determine that, in fact, as those expenses were being incurred, they had gone over in this fiscal year.

We have to come back -- Madam Chair, this has gone through the auditor general's office. This is an accounting matter. It's one that we've been told is not abnormal; we're not going to be, you know, subject to any sorts of notes. But I do need to bring it back to the Assembly to explain to the Assembly why there needs to be this adjustment. That's what we're trying to do here. Thank you.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you, Minister. Supplementary Estimates (Operations Expenditures and Borrowing Authorization), No. 4, 2020-2021, Department of Finance, total government borrowing authorization, proposed adjustment, $10,031,000. Does committee agree?

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

The Chair

The Chair Lesa Semmler

Thank you.

Committee, do you agree that you have concluded consideration of Tabled Document 466-19(2) Supplementary Estimates(Operations Expenditures and Borrowing Authorization), No. 4, 2020-2021?

Some Hon. Members

Agreed.