This is page numbers 4111 - 4162 of the Hansard for the 19th Assembly, 2nd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was know.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

March 29th, 2022

Page 4128

Caroline Cochrane

Caroline Cochrane Range Lake

Chair, I do know that, from when I used to be the housing minister, that there are regular -- there used to be -- every few years, they kind of did a cross-departmental check to make sure that -- to see how many market housing needs were met -- were needed. I know that ECE has let us know that, you know, the education bodies let ECE know on a regular basis what they're needing, and I imagine Health has the same. I don't know when that was last done. So I think it might be something that needs to be looked at again. However, I would also caution that might not be the time right now until the Minister can actually have these meetings with the Indigenous governments, until the funding rolls out from the federal government to the Indigenous governments and to the Housing Corp, and we figure out what the Indigenous governments want to do with their money, if they want to get into market housing, which would be something that I would promote them to do to make it sustainable, then it would be kind of futile for us to do that. So I think, though, that -- I'm hoping the Minister would be open to -- yes, good. The Minister would be open to once we have the discussions with the Indigenous governments, find out what their plans are, that she would look at again doing a cross-departmental assessment of the needs in communities.

In saying that, though, I do want to say that when I was the housing minister the issue that I had as well, we asked all the departments what they needed and they gave us a list, and we put houses there. And then when I took over as the housing minister, those -- those same buildings that were identified by departments needed for nurses, teachers, etcetera, sat empty for years to the point that I got upset about it and said give them away to public housing, reuse them. So there's always a fine balance between assessing what the need is and what actually is the need because you might have three teachers -- my son's partner is a teacher and so you would think that you have three teachers and they all need their own unit, but then they get together and they meet each other and they decide to share one unit, and you got two units sitting empty. So there's a fine balance between saying this is the number we need and actually this is the number that we actually do need. So thank you, Mr. Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Ms. Weyallon-Armstrong.

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Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Jane Weyallon Armstrong Monfwi

Hello, I have a question. I have a question here. It says in here, in this report, that the working group established a working group, and it says it already established a working group to create -- to review existing employment opportunities in the small communities, etcetera.

I just wanted to ask the Premier if there is a timeline when to complete because the working group is in place already. Is there a timeline to complete and to -- so that there's more jobs created in small communities? You are aware that right now even, like, for Tlicho community and when you look at the health status report, it's not just Tlicho community; it's other community as well, that where unemployment is high. And people are using income support more. So I just wanted to know if there is a timeline because everybody needs jobs, especially in the small communities. And I just wanted to ask if there is a timeline. Thank you.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Minister Simpson.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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R.J. Simpson

R.J. Simpson Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Chair. So this is something that is ongoing. There are timelines listed in the mandate, and there's funding flowing every single year to the tune of over $4 million to small communities to create jobs. So hundreds of jobs are created each year, and the communities just need to opt in and they can provide those funds to different organizations within the community, even private businesses, to create jobs. We are working on -- in the coming fiscal year, those are going to turn into multiyear agreements so that communities can plan so there's some sustainability with those jobs. It's not just a one-off and perhaps you can plan a few years out and create some sustainable jobs. We need people to create jobs. We can provide money. But if we just keep providing money, it's basically a different form of income assistance. So we need to all work together to support businesses and communities to create their own industries. And so that work is happening.

In terms of some of the other work, the departments - ENR, ITI, ECE, Housing Corporation - are all working together on the working group to come up with different strategies to look at the gaps that exist. They all have -- are creating logic models to determine where those gaps are and then perhaps provide some more targeted supports. Right now it's a pretty -- the major support is pretty blunt. Millions of dollars a year for employment. And it has been relatively successful. And now we need to figure out how do we turn those temporary seasonal jobs into long-term jobs and eventually businesses and industries. Thank you.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Ms. Weyallon-Armstrong.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Jane Weyallon Armstrong Monfwi

Thank you. Okay, I just heard about the housing shortage as well. Housing shortage, I know that we want Yellowknife, we want the GNWT decentralize the jobs to the communities, to the outlying regions to the -- right now, is there any commitment from the GNWT to transfer most of these jobs that was taken from the communities, take it back to the communities, and let the community run the program and services? I just wanted to ask the Minister if there is a commitment from the GNWT to decentralize these -- most of these jobs that were moved from the small communities to Yellowknife. Thank you.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Premier.

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Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Cochrane

Caroline Cochrane Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I've heard that quite a bit. Decentralization is not one of our priorities actually. It's not in here. It's increase regional decision-making was in here. In saying that, though, I mean, there is a commitment. There is a -- like I said earlier, the Minister of Finance has made a commitment that we all want to see jobs in the communities. We recognize that, you know, like it was mentioned earlier, the stronger our smaller communities are the stronger Yellowknife is. It was made by a Regular Member, and I agree with that statement actually. And so like I said earlier, one of the things that isn't in here but it's being done by the -- by Department of Finance is that anyone that has a job in Yellowknife that can be done in the communities has that option now. That's never been done before. They have the option, if their supervisor allows it, that they can actually take their job and go into the community, wherever they want, and do that work from there. And like I said earlier, it's a one-way street. We're not allowing that to happen for people that have jobs outside of Yellowknife.

So I'm hoping that many people in the public service will hear this and will take us up on that. That is one way of decentralizing jobs into the communities. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Ms. Weyallon-Armstrong.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Jane Weyallon Armstrong Monfwi

Okay, well, thank you. Okay, the Premier said something about increase the decision-making. So who are these decision-makers are? Is it the local leaders, or is it GNWT? Who are these -- like, who are these people that they are targeting? I just -- I need to know because it's -- increase decision-making is -- I'm not too sure. They need to be clear on that. Thank you.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Premier.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Cochrane

Caroline Cochrane Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chair. If you look at the mandate that was done from this, the increase in regional decision-making, it will be done by the people that are in the regions. There was feedback that they felt that they couldn't make decisions, that they couldn't -- they couldn't be the final say, that everything that they had to do had to come through headquarters, and then when we did the review of their job descriptions, it's not true. So I don't know if that's a perception that's come from they're thinking that or somebody that was a supervisor in headquarters that got too heavy handed, but that is what we're trying to correct, is the misperception by people in the regions, such as local LHOs, education bodies, etcetera, that feel that everything they do has to come through headquarters, because that's not appropriate. People are paid at the same levels, and they are expected to do the same work. So they should have the same level of authority to be able to make decisions as somebody in Yellowknife. So that was what that mandate -- or that priority is about. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 4128

The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Ms. Weyallon-Armstrong.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Jane Weyallon Armstrong Monfwi

Thank you. I do agree with Premier on that because there are -- there's people out here that can do the job but it's always the Yellowknife or the headquarters, the deputy ministers, people there, the bureaucrats are undermining the local authority. So that's why -- like, if people are working in that -- like that, within that capacity, other people -- I'm sure they don't feel good about themselves about the decision-making. They are being undermined. And I do agree with the Premier what she said, increase the decision-making should be left, left alone and leave it to the -- to the people in the small communities or in the regions. That's -- yes, I just wanted to say that. That's just more of a comment, and I do agree, and that is very inappropriate. Yellowknife should not be having all the power and control. And right now, that's how we -- we see it like that. We see that Yellowknife have more power and control over small communities, especially small communities in the regions, and a lot of undermining too as well. So I do agree with what she said, and it's not appropriate, and I hope that lot of these decision-making will be done at the local level, and -- you know, and just leave it there. Thank you.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Premier, would you like to respond?

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Cochrane

Caroline Cochrane Range Lake

I'll take that as a comment. Thank you for the agreement. I think it's shared by many Members. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Ms. Weyallon-Armstrong.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jane Weyallon Armstrong

Jane Weyallon Armstrong Monfwi

Yes, that's it for now. Thank you.

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Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Mr. Edjericon.

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Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Richard Edjericon

Richard Edjericon Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Yeah, thank you, Mr. Chairman. I'm just thinking on this subject here anyway. It is good to see that ECE and ITI and NWT Housing Corporation are working together to -- to establish a working group. And I think it's -- I think it's a good idea that, you know, when you start looking at working together. But what's missing there is -- what I don't see there is Indigenous governments. And maybe the Premier could maybe let me know, you know, if we're going to do this, shouldn't we be working with the Indigenous governments on this? Thank you.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Premier.

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Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Cochrane

Caroline Cochrane Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yes, this mandate, the priorities were set by the Legislative Assembly, 19 Members that are in this House. Also the mandate was set by the GNWT. So it's only an internal document for us as this Assembly.

However, in saying that, I agree that it's really important to work with the Indigenous governments, and that's why we've started the Council of Leaders table. And in my opinion, one of the most progressive things we've done, not only the Council of Leaders, but also the modern treaty and self-government tables that are looking at implementation of their agreements. A big part of those implementations are the economic feasibilities of those agreements. And so those discussions have started in this Assembly, and I'm hoping that they will last for forever, because I think you're right, it has to be all of us together to do this. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Rocky Simpson

Thank you. Mr. Edjericon.

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Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Richard Edjericon

Richard Edjericon Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Mr. Chairman, and thank you for your comments from the Premier.

You know, the Housing Corporation's been -- it's 50 years now. They're looking at a celebration coming up here soon. And, you know, I've been in this field for some time and you know, working in the communities going back to 1986 in Fort Resolution when we were building HAP houses up to 1992 when Canada through CMHC decided not to build anymore public housing and cancelled the HAP program. But, you know, small communities are really dependant, you know, on new construction. And the thing is that what's been happening now is that in the last number of years, you know, the high cost of buying materials and labour and most recent, you know, the COVID and the fires in BC have driven up the cost per square foot cost. And, you know, the communities really depend on this seasonal work. And I know it's been going back to, like I said 1986 to last number of years, and you know, we got some good tradespeople out of -- out of the communities, even including electricians, etcetera. So what's happening now is that we moved away from, you know, stick-built construction to buying modular homes now. And to even think about the modular home going to a community, it doesn't take long to drop a trailer in the community. You could walk out of ten days to finish a unit. And what's the benefit to the people in the community in terms of if you say that we want to promote apprenticeship training, well, there's not much you could do in ten days whereas, you know, if you do one home, it could take you three months to build a home and if you do three units in one community, that's 90 -- that's 270 days I guess. So you got nine months worth of work if you build three houses in the community, and then you could really look at promoting apprenticeship training etcetera. So I just want to know is this going to be the new norm now, moving away from stick- built construction to going with trailers now? Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Question for the Premier.