Good afternoon. I would like to inform the House that I feel it is fitting for me to make a few brief remarks in the passing of a long-time employee of the Legislative Assembly, Mrs. Alma Cargill.

On January 8, 1992, Alma Cargill passed away at the age of 60 after a battle with cancer. Alma Cargill worked at the Hansard office of the Legislative Assembly for 15 years. She began working at the Hansard office in 1976 and worked there until the spring of 1991. Alma loved her work at the Hansard office and loved being involved with the Legislative Assembly. She never missed an opening of session. She was a loyal and devoted employee and is sadly missed by everyone in the Hansard office and the entire Legislative Assembly.

Alma is survived by her husband, Jim Cargill, an employee of the architectural division of the Department of Public Works, and her two sons, Douglas and Bob. I would like to offer our condolences to Jim and his family.

Orders of the day for Thursday, February 13, 1992. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Ningark.

Mr. Speaker, country foods are essential to traditional and subsistence lifestyles of many NWT residents. The removal of, or lack of confidence in, any part of this valuable resource has serious implications to northern people. The federal-territorial Slave River monitoring program, now into its second year, was established to determine the level of certain contaminants in the fish and water at the NWT-Alberta border.

Data from the analyses of burbot -- sometimes called loche -- livers and walleye, or pickerel, flesh indicate low levels of dioxins, furans and toxaphene in some of the samples. These compounds were also found in fish samples taken from Chitty and Leland Lakes, which are not connected to the Slave River. No contaminants were found in the water, and Health and Welfare Canada concluded that, based on the small amount of contamination found, there is no health risk. The fish are safe to eat at this time.

Mr. Speaker, the specific source of any of these contaminants is not known. They could be originating from many sources, including pulp mills, forest fires, and pesticide applications, and they are transmitted by air and water.

It is essential that we continue to closely monitor the fish and water to determine if contaminant levels are increasing or decreasing. Additional fish were collected over the past two months and have been sent to the lab for analysis. As well, the Slave River program has been expanded to collect even more fish samples over the next few years.

We expect the northern rivers study program, which looks at the cumulative impact of development on the Peace, Athabasca and Slave Rivers, to also collect and sample fish for similar contaminants. Both studies should give Northerners a better idea of the environmental quality throughout the whole basin. Thank you.

Ministers' statements. Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The development of a successful education system is based on a partnership between the home, the school and the community. In the Northwest Territories, this partnership has been strengthened by the efforts of many hard-working and creative teachers, as well as by many community people who are willing to share their time, knowledge and skills with our students.

To recognize outstanding contributions to education in the NWT, the Department of Education has established two awards programs.

The Partners in Education Award of Excellence program is designed to recognize non-teaching school staff, such as custodians, secretaries, teaching aides and bus drivers, we well as elders and other community members who volunteer their time. The Excellence in Teaching Awards program is designed to recognize any certified teacher, principal, vice-principal, classroom assistant, teacher consultant or curriculum staff.

Nominations for the awards are sent to the appropriate divisional board or school district for review. Nominees who meet the selection criteria receive a regional award. The boards then send the nominations of the top three candidates in each category to the Department of Education for consideration by a review committee. This committee recommends nominees who deserve a territorial award.

This year seven volunteers and 11 teachers will receive awards. The winners of the Partners in Education Award at the territorial level are: Corporal Dave Grundy and Darrin Myers of Yellowknife; Lynn Rollin and Joy Suluk of Arviat; Ray Sliney of Resolute Bay; John Tinashlu of Repulse Bay; and Laura Vital of Nahanni Butte.

Winners of the Excellence in Teaching Award at the territorial level are: Charles Lirette of Inuvik; Florence Sliney of Resolute Bay; Mary Aliqatuqtuq of Broughton Island; Jaqueline Beland of Coppermine; Elisapee Karetak and Christine Purse of Arviat; Kate McDermott and Winnie Pibus of Iqaluit; and Heather Nolsoe, Sylvia Seto, and Marnie Sherburne, all of Yellowknife Education District No. 1.

Charles Lirette and Florence Sliney have also been named the NWT recipients of the Marshall McLuhan Distinguished Teacher Award. These are national awards which recognize teachers who show innovation and use new technologies in the classroom. Mr. Lirette's name will be put forward as the Northwest Territories candidate to be considered for the national McLuhan Award.

Mr. Speaker, a good education system is the result of the co-operative efforts of many people. I would like to congratulate the winners of this year's Partners in Education Awards and the Excellence in Teaching Awards, and thank them for contributing to our schools. Thank you.

I would like to welcome to the Assembly today Bertha Allen, commissioner of the Western Constitutional Commission, and Gary Bohnet, the president of the Metis Nation.

---Applause

Ministers' statements. Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Todd.

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak out against the so-called "Northwest Territories Way" model for health care services proposed in the Strength at Two Levels document. I believe that this model is inadequate, and I am troubled by this government's intent to proceed with the implementation planning without the benefit of adequate public consultation, cost analysis or the involvement of health boards and professional associations.

Health organizations and the public at large from across the Northwest Territories have raised concerns about virtually every aspect of this health care proposal. They lack the confidence in the ability of the Stanton Yellowknife Hospital to function as a regional hospital. They are unwilling to witness the community hospitals being down-sized so that resources can be centralized in Yellowknife. We hear experts say that nurse practitioner models will not work.

In my own constituency, Mr Speaker, people are worried about the recommendation that our sick and elderly people should now have to travel all the way to Yellowknife for medical treatment instead of the long-established resource facilities in Churchill and Winnipeg, thereby doubling the flying time in some cases and increasing the medical risk associated with medevac travel.

The people of the Keewatin will not accept this particular part of the Beatty report. Public groups, aboriginal organizations, regional councils, professional associations and even the government's own advisory and management boards are revealing that they were never consulted when the proposed model was being developed.

Even the NWT Health Care Association, which, in my opinion, is a group that is too heavily influenced by the Stanton Yellowknife Board of Management to properly or dependably represent regional interests, has called on the Minister of Health to delay the implementation of the model until a comprehensive cost analysis can be completed and until the stakeholders in the health system can be adequately consulted. Similar positions have now been taken by the NWT Health Association, by the Keewatin and Deh Cho Regional Councils and by concerned citizens across the North.

Today, Mr. Speaker, I will also be asking the Minister of Health to respect these legitimate concerns and ensure that the implementation of the Beatty report...

Mr. Todd, your time has run out. This is about the seventh Member's statement in a row that has gone over the time limit. I would like to caution Members that the use of unanimous consent too often may indicate that the rules themselves are not adequate. I ask Members to try to respect the two and a half minute time limit. Thank you.

Members' statements. Mr. Lewis.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will be brief. I am very concerned about the overcrowding in the two Yellowknife high schools. I would like to point out that we would like to have the same rules applied to the accommodation of students in this city as is applied throughout the Northwest Territories.

St. Patrick High School was built in the mid-1950s. It is still standing and being used practically every day of the week. Sir John Franklin High School was built in 1958. Mr. Whitford, in fact, was one of the early students there. We have had many, many distinguished graduates come out of both of these high schools. I would like the government to take notice that not only do we have two high schools which are probably the oldest high schools in the Northwest Territories and badly in need of repair and upgrading, but also they are overcrowded. There is a problem of space which has to be addressed on an emergency basis. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Members' statements.

Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Dent.

Minister of Economic Development, Mr. Pollard.

We still intend to participate at the exposition in Seville this year, Mr. Speaker.

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Dent.

Mr. Pollard.

Mr. Speaker, if we had cut and run two weeks ago, our exposure would have been $2.5 million, not counting any suits that might have been brought against us by people that we have been dealing with. Our exposure to run the facility for the entire time that the exposition is going to be on, some five months, is $4.5 million, Mr. Speaker; that is if nobody buys anything. Thank you.

Second supplementary, Mr. Dent.

Mr. Pollard.

Mr. Speaker, the figures provided to me are the best that can be provided. I will be responsible for those numbers, Mr. Speaker.

Final supplementary, Mr. Dent.

Mr. Pollard.

Mr. Speaker, perhaps I should inform the House that we hired an outside independent consultant who had been a chartered accountant, who had been connected with Expo in Vancouver, and who had a lot of experience in this area, and we brought that person, Mr. Fred Abbott, to Yellowknife. We had him go through the department's numbers. We then sent him to Spain and had him go through the pavilion, had him go through the whole of the exposition over there, talk to the people who are providing support services, and Mr. Abbott reported back to us the numbers that I previously mentioned, $2.5 million if you do not do anything and $4.5 if you do it and nobody comes to the party.

I have not received Mr. Abbott's report yet, Mr. Speaker. But I will make that report available to the House as soon as I receive it. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Oral questions. Mr. Lewis.

Mr. Whitford.

Supplementary, Mr. Lewis.

Since this whole business of requiring people in this social field to be good role models for people that have problems, I would like to ask the Minister how we will police this so that we will know there are no secret drinkers or no people who engage in secret activity. What kind of policing takes place so we are sure the people who are required to obey the sobriety clause in fact remain sober?

Mr. Whitford.

Second supplementary, Mr. Lewis.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Since it is the government itself that imposes this requirement, not the local group that decides it needs to be monitored, how will the Minister be sure that no group will have signed this agreement to get the money, even if they have no intention whatsoever of obeying the sobriety clause?

Mr. Whitford.

Oral questions. Mr. Pudlat.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In regard to that topic, I have comments on that. My question is to the Minister of Social Services. I wonder if the alcohol counsellors in the communities were consulted before this was put into place. Were there information sessions? This has caused a lot of problems in the communities. I do not think the communities were informed enough before this was put into place. I am not saying that these people should stop drinking. I am just wondering if this can be policed. Will this be a good policy for the future?

Some communities have signed and some have not. This agreement came by fax and there seems to be some difficulty in where it came from. Do you feel they were informed enough before this was put in place?

Minister of Social Services, Mr. Whitford.

Oral questions. Mr. Gargan.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to direct my question to the Minister of Renewable Resources, regarding watersheds. Mr. Speaker, I do have a concern in the Western Arctic that eventually we might be faced with a situation in which the Mackenzie River could be polluted to a point where it would not be suitable for human consumption. Are there any studies at this point in time being done to identify where there is fresh water and whether or not those watersheds could be protected for future use? I am referring to lakes where there is fresh water, like Willow Lake, Drum Lake, Tathlina Lake. Those are all freshwater lakes. I would like to know if those areas could be protected in the event that the Mackenzie River does get polluted.

Minister of Renewable Resources, Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It is my department's mandate to make sure that the quality of water throughout the Territories is protected. My department is continuing to monitor the rivers and waters within the system of the NWT. We are also continuing negotiations with the Alberta government. We are trying to get the concern of the NWT residents across to the Government of Alberta. However, the negotiations broke down some time ago. We are still endeavouring to make sure that the honourable Member's concern and the NWT residents' concerns are adhered to by the other jurisdictions. Thank you.

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the Minister's response regarding the monitoring. Naturally, if there is monitoring going on, this monitoring would indicate whether or not we are getting more pollution in the water than would be acceptable for human consumption. My problem, Mr. Speaker, is that they can do the monitoring on the Mackenzie River but in the event that it does get polluted, what are the options? We should protect watersheds in all the regions so that we do have a second option; lakes like Drum Lake, Willow Lake, Kakisa Lake and Tathlina Lake are protected in the event that the Mackenzie does get polluted. Are there any initiatives right now to identify where we do have fresh water which has not been polluted or touched on at this point in time?

Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It is very hard to try and control the pollution coming from the air, from the pesticides, and forest fires. However, we are trying to do whatever we can to make sure those lakes that have not been polluted yet remain the way they are. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Oral questions. Mr. Koe.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed to the Minister of Education. This morning a press release was issued by the Northwest Territories Teachers' Association expressing concerns about the management and direction of the director of the Beaufort/Delta Divisional Board of Education. Effective tomorrow, February 14th, the teachers at SAM School, Sir Alexander Mackenzie School, will commence a work-to-rule schedule. What action is the department taking to deal with this issue?

Minister of Education, Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. So far I have not got all the information. I am told that when the teachers want to get more professional time, there is a process in place where a principal and the teachers can request additional professional days from their local education authority to get support, and that education authority could

come to me to request additional professional days. That has not happened so far. My assistant deputy minister was up there some time ago talking to parents and teachers with respect to this particular concern. Once I get the full information that I am requesting through my department, I will have a better answer. It should be soon.

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Koe.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. This issue is not new. It has been festering for a few months. I am aware of attempts being made to contact your office to get this approval and why was nothing done before this action has to be taken by the teachers?

Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am told that this is driven by union members. As I said, the process is there for teachers to request more professional days if they want. They can go through their community education council and the community education council would ask me. Then I would consider their request. That has not come about. I have not had any information from the community education council requesting professional days. Thank you.

Oral questions. Second supplementary, Mr. Koe.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can the Minister elaborate on the proper process that should be undertaken for these requests? Do these requests go to the local community education society? Do they go to the director of the department in Inuvik, or do they go to the Minister?

Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I thought I had answered that question. If the teachers want to have more time for professional time, if they are requesting more days, they have to go to their principal. If the principal agrees, he goes to the community education council and then the education council could, if they agree, approach me requesting a certain number of professional days. They do not go to the director, the ADM or the deputy minister. They go to the Minister. Thank you.

Oral questions. Last supplementary, Mr. Koe.

Are these procedures documented or written down anywhere?

Mr. Allooloo.

I am not sure if it is a policy or a directive, but it is the practice that we use. Thank you.

Oral questions. Mr. Todd.

Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the Minister of Health. When he appeared before the standing committee on agencies, boards and commissions in Fort Smith, he assured the Members that the proposals in the Strength at Two Levels report were only recommendations and he would not proceed to implement them until further analysis and community consultations had taken place.

Can the Minister assure the House today that he has not decided to accept the Strength at Two Levels proposed "Northwest Territories Way" as the model for health care delivery?

Minister of Health, Mr. Whitford.

Supplementary, Mr. Todd.

In that case, Mr. Speaker, would the Minister confirm that to date the "Northwest Territories Way" is a model that has been put together by the bureaucracy and with little or no input by the public or professionals?

Mr. Whitford.

Second supplementary, Mr. Todd.

I understand that we are in tough, difficult times, but I want to remind the Minister that we are talking about the

health of the people in the Territories. This is not delivering the water or clearing the streets. Is the Minister now willing to design a public consultation process for reviewing this "Northwest Territories Way" on health care?

Would the Government Leader like to respond to that?

I would like to note that the "Northwest Territories Way" and the other documents, in trying to reconcile how we deliver government services, are all part of a total package, and a consultation process will take place once a process is out. Any report that was provided by this government is not a bible that you live and die by. It is a fact that we have to take a number of recommendations to provide some direction on how to finally come up with the objective, as the honourable Member states. We have to deliver a service that is fair and equitable to all residents of the Northwest Territories, taking into consideration the regional differences. There is no intention of this government to take one report and rubber stamp it and say that is the way it is going to be.

There will be a consultative process, and there will be due respect to all the regional health boards so that they will be involved. It is of no sense to us to go without their input. The communities and the regions will be consulted and involved with the deliberations as we go forward. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Oral questions. Mr. Nerysoo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is a question for the Government Leader. It is a supplementary to the question by Mr. Todd. Is the consultation process also going to involve the Members of the Legislative Assembly when you are dealing with the review of the delivery of programs and services to the people of the Northwest Territories?

Madam Premier.

Mr. Speaker, it goes without saying that at several different levels, the Members of the Legislative Assembly are involved. They are involved at the standing committee level. They are involved in the process as to how we are going to deliberate. Changes have to be brought to this House. Yes, indeed, I would not think we would proceed, because we are only eight people here as cabinet and we would like to see that whatever we ultimately come forward with is something that not only reaches and encompasses the desires of people but also brings in as many people as possible so that it is understood that a lot of the decisions we have to make are decisions that have been accumulated in the last 10 or 15 years as we have evolved as a territorial government. Unfortunately, it would have been nice if we could have made these changes when we were in a healthier situation financially; however, I believe that with all of us working together and with total involvement, we can meet those objectives for the betterment of the people that we serve. Thank you.

Oral questions. Mr. Lewis.

My question is to the Minister responsible for Economic Development and Tourism. I listened with great interest to his Minister's statement yesterday about our fiscal position and his note that one of the things we may want to consider, much the same way the federal government is considering, is the sale of assets as one way of generating some revenue, thereby reducing some operating costs to ourselves. I would like to ask the Minister what he has in mind in the way of assets which we may want to sell.

Mr. Pollard, Minister of Finance.

Mr. Speaker, I was merely indicating to the House that we are prepared to look at the sale of assets. We have not compiled a list of the assets that we may wish to sell, but it is an option that we are looking at, sir. I do not have a definitive list.

Supplementary, Mr. Lewis.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It is pretty clear to me that people just do not invest in the Northwest Territories. We do not have all kinds of people wanting to buy in and do all kinds of things. There must have been something in the Minister's mind that would beguile some of these entrepreneurs that really want to get into things. Surely he can give one example of something we could sell, because otherwise assets would not appear here as something which could generate some revenue. All I am asking for is one example. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Finance, Mr. Pollard.

One example, Mr. Speaker, is that we could sell off some of the houses that we own. Thank you.

Oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to pose a question to the Minister of Renewable Resources. With respect to the transboundary water agreement with Alberta, would the Minister of Renewable Resources be able to give this House a status report on the negotiation of the transboundary water agreement that is now in process with the Alberta government? Thank you.

Mr. Ningark, Minister of Renewable Resources.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Once I have my officials prepare a report, I will do that. Thank you.

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Recognizing that the Minister indicated he would be able to give us a status report, Mr. Speaker, I would like to know if he now knows whether or not the negotiations are nearing conclusion, or are they still at the negotiating stage? To what degree are these negotiations taking place? Thank you.

Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The negotiations have not started.

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Mr. Speaker, on July 5th of last year, the previous Minister of the day had indicated that they were in negotiations with the Alberta government with respect to the transboundary water agreement. Therefore, initiations have been started with respect to this agreement, and I would like to know whether or not they are nearing conclusion. I would like the Minister to advise me. Thank you.

Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The agreement was never reached.

Oral questions. This is your last supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Recognizing that the agreement has not yet been reached, Mr Speaker, and recognizing that the Supreme Court judgment recently concluded, I believe last month, that provincial jurisdictions do not have total say over environmental areas that may impact other jurisdictions; and knowing that these waters will at one point in time come into our jurisdiction, I would like the Minister to advise this House when he anticipates the conclusion of these long, outstanding negotiations with respect to the transboundary water agreement. Thank you.

Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will take the question as notice.

Oral questions. Mr. Todd.

Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Minister of Health. Pertaining to the recommendations that the Keewatin Region Health Board forwarded in response to the department's expenditure management initiatives, I tabled seven recommendations in the House on December 16, 1991. The Keewatin Region Health Board recommends that the Department of Health develop a regional-based dental service and a travelling orthodontic program as opposed to using contract services and medical travel. Can the Minister advise the House today whether he is prepared to support this proposal, given that in the proposal it showed significant savings in dollars?

Minister of Health, Mr. Whitford.

I will allow Mr. Todd to re-pose the question. We will not count it as a supplementary.

May I suggest that the honourable Minister may want to go back to the Hansard of December 16, 1991, and the follow-up letter I sent him with respect to the initiatives and the lack of response I have to date. Maybe then he would understand the question.

That does not help us now, Mr. Todd. Mr. Minister, they want you to answer. I am only the Speaker.

The question is taken as notice. Oral questions. Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to direct my question to the Minister responsible for the Workers' Compensation Board regarding the definition of "principally engaged." There were approximately eight people, all non-native people, who were consulted with regard to the definition of "principally engaged." Most of it has to do with the working hours, the amount of money they made, and very little to do with the traditional activity. The money value is based on a European point of view. I am also a bit confused about some of the directives that the department has with regard to that.

I would like to ask if the Minister could clarify some of the problems I am having with regard to the definition that has been used. One of the requirements is with regard to the work days. This is new to me, Mr. Chairman. It was $10,000. If you made $10,000, you qualified for compensation. But now there is a working day included in that, and I missed it somehow. It says, "Where there is no income from any other source for a period exceeding 131 days during the 12-month period immediately preceding the accident, and where written verification is received from the Government of the NWT, and the person applying for compensation is a holder of a valid general hunting licence issued under the Wildlife Act." I would like to ask the Minister what that means. Does that mean if trapping season opens and you prepare your stuff and you fall on your head and break your neck, you are not covered and you would have to have been in the bush for 131 days before you do qualify for compensation?

Minister responsible for the Workers' Compensation Board, Mr. Patterson.