Thank you, Mr. Chairman. We will make sure that we send a letter to all the client department and government offices that renovations will be kept to a minimum, and we will make sure that your concerns are expressed to them.

Thank you. General comments. If not, does the committee wish to go page by page? Mr. Koe.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just a couple of comments on what my colleagues have been saying, again, that this is one of the departments that has direct expenditures in every community. A lot of the major projects are visible ones, where people can go to work in the morning and do something and get paid for it, and there are a lot of casual wages related to the construction projects. There is also the contract work, and the one that the Minister is quite aware of, related to use of natural resources, the piling. There has been

a tendency, I think, to use imported piling, steel or whatever other material they use these days instead of wood piles, or the logs. Various regions in the North have sufficient logs and timber resources that can be used, and I think the Minister is well aware of the positions of the people I represent, and their feelings that where we can, the department, for any kind of construction, should use available local resources. These resources are not only for piling but for rough timber and supports for construction, for utilidors in Inuvik or whatever, for sidewalks, things like that. Way back, years ago, there used to be good winter projects, or these make-work projects, using local resources to build sidewalks and wharves and whatever else, using local labour and timber.

The other aspect, in line with that, and I know you mentioned it in your preamble about buying North, using North, hiring North, designing North. I had mentioned it in a few other areas, too, where, as much as possible, we should use the local or NWT resources and expertise. You made a statement today about the fact that we are exporting our expertise to Russia now, and it is there. We just have to utilize more and more of it, wherever it is available, and the more local the better, and in many cases, regionalize. I know the business incentive program is looking at localizing a lot of it, but in many cases it almost becomes a detriment, because most firms are regionalized rather than in a small community. They work out of a community like Inuvik or Rankin Inlet or lqaluit rather than the smaller communities. Consequently, two or three companies are competing for the same contract within the region, but they may not get the extra five per cent, whatever it is that is proposed in the new business incentive policy. We do not want to discriminate, I guess, against the local contractors, but they should be equal and have fair opportunity at contracts.

So I support the initiatives you are taking, and as John mentioned, the proof will be in the pudding this summer, and not in this round but in the next round, when we go through this exercise. That is all I wanted to say. Thanks.

Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I agree with the Members, Mr. Koe and Mr Todd. Talk is cheap, and you need action; you need jobs in the communities; and I would like to thank the Member for bringing to my attention this issue of pilings in the Inuvik area. Wherever available, DPW will buy northern pilings, and they will use them on their projects. That is a guarantee.

When we were developing the proposed business incentive policy and one part that was accepted by the previous cabinet was 15 per cent northern and five per cent local, so that is what everybody told the previous government to do, I guess, and that is what was done, and that portion of it seems to be working fairly well. It needs improvement, and we have submitted that to cabinet. Thank you.

Thank you. General comments.

Page by page.

Directorate

Buildings And Works, Headquarters, Total Capital,

Agreed

Page by page? Okay. Page 10-11, Department of Public Works, detail of capital, directorate, buildings and works, total region, $60,000. Agreed?

Agreed.

--- Agreed

Buildings And Works, Total Capital, Agreed

Total buildings and works, $60,000. Agreed?

Agreed.

--- Agreed

Directorate, Total Capital,

Agreed

Total activity, $60,000. Agreed?

Agreed.

--- Agreed

Mr. Koe.

Before we get off this, again, whether it is under this activity or not, a general comment in terms of construction and size of capital projects. Again, it ties in with the business incentive program, but also the capabilities of contractors, especially local contractors who may not be able to put up the security for the bid -- I think it is a five per cent bid bond and a five per cent security bond that are required in a lot of contracts, A lot of our contractors do not have the bonding, and because of the size of the contracts they cannot put up a lot of the front-end moneys. I have mentioned it to the Minister before, and I will reiterate it, that where possible the size of contracts should be broken down so that local contractors can bid with the bigger contractors.

In a lot of cases your bigger contractors come in from the South; they can afford the security bond; they have proper bonding, and the smaller contractors cannot compete for large contracts, so where possible, break them down so that your local contractors can compete and be a little more successful.

Thank you. Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. That is a problem for smaller businesses starting out -- the security issue. DPW is right now working with the Department of Economic Development and Tourism to try to address that issue as well as the construction association. We already are trying to break contracts down and make them smaller so that people can bid on them. We will continue to try to do our best, and we should have something, hopefully this year, for consideration of cabinet so that our northern businesses can benefit and get the jobs. Thank you.

Thank you. Total activity, $60,000. Agreed?

Agreed.

--- Agreed

Project

Management

Buildings And Works, Headquarters, Total Capital,

Agreed

Page 10-13, project management, buildings and works, total region, $575,000. Agreed?

Agreed.

--- Agreed

Buildings And Works, Total Capital,

Agreed

Total buildings and works,

$575,000. Agreed?

Agreed.

--- Agreed

Project Management, Total Capital,

Agreed

Project management, total capital, $575,000. Agreed?