Before we commence with the orders of the day, I would like to bring to the attention of the House, my response to the point of privilege raised by Mr. Nerysoo on September 15.

The point of privilege raised by Mr. Nerysoo on September 15, on remarks made by the Honourable Stephen Kakfwi during his reply to an oral question by Mr. Nerysoo, as I have reviewed the unedited transcripts, and I find that the Honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, Mr. Nerysoo, does not have prima facie point of privilege.

However, my review of the exchange between the honourable Members led me to conclude that an important principle is at issue here. A Member's duties and responsibilities, on behalf of his or her constituents, is for each Member to decide on their own. It is not for any Member to interpret for another Member how he or she must carry out their duties. I trust that in future, all honourable Members will respect that principle. Thank you.

Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Kakfwi.

I would like to recognize, in the gallery, Chief James Firth from Inuvik, and Chief Peter Ross from Arctic Red River.

---Applause

I also would like to recognize in the visitor's gallery, Mr. Tony Campbell, and his grade 11 class from St. Patrick's High School.

---Applause

Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Morin.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to give an emergency statement.

Proceed, Mr. Morin.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the Minister responsible for the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation, I have received distressing news that the submission put forward by the Honourable Elmer MacKay, seeking reinstatement of federal funding for the new social housing units in the Northwest Territories, has been rejected by the federal Cabinet.

In February, 1992, in his budget speech, the federal Minister of Finance announced major reductions in the federal social housing programs right across Canada. These reductions would hold growth of the federal social housing budget to a maximum of three percent increase with no allowance for inflation. The cost of inflation must be funded from within the three percent growth factor. Reducing the funding available for new social housing construction by 23 percent in 1992, and a further 36 percent in 1993, for a total of 59 percent.

The impact of these federal funding reductions here in the Northwest Territories was to drastically reduce our cost shared new social housing units. There was 372 units built last year, and by 1993 the Government of the Northwest Territories will be funded to build 153 cost shared units.

I wanted to assure Members that we have continued to work to get the federal funding reinstated to its former levels. When I met with the Standing Committee on Finance, I told Members that we were engaged in serious and intense negotiations with the Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation. These efforts began right after the cuts were announced in the federal budget in April. I intended a special meeting of provincial and territorial housing Ministers to discuss the implications of the cuts. I also appeared before the Aboriginal Affairs Committee of the House of Commons in May. We found them supportive of our needs. This was followed in June by a meeting between myself and federal Minister responsible for the Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation, the Honourable Elmer MacKay. Minister MacKay listened carefully to what we had to say about our unique situation in the Northwest Territories, and we were able to convince him that our needs were urgent. Also, in June, I had a meeting of the federal, provincial and territorial housing Ministers. I urged the federal Minister and my colleagues in other jurisdictions, to recognize the unique and urgent housing requirements of the Northwest Territories. We got a positive and supportive response at that meeting. The federal Minister responsible for the Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation, the Honourable Elmer MacKay, made a submission to the federal Cabinet to address the funding shortage for new housing construction for the Northwest Territories, and the Yukon, on a priority basis. If approved, funding to the Northwest Territories would have been reinstated to the 1991-92 levels. Unfortunately, although we were able to convince the federal Minister responsible for the Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation, the Honourable Elmer MacKay, the federal Cabinet did not support the submission because there was no additional funding available.

Mr. Speaker, although I see this as a serious setback, I am still hopeful that further efforts on the part of this government will result in funding reinstatement. You will recall the federal government initially rejected us supplying the Business Incentive Policy to cost shared housing contracts. Our continuous efforts were finally successful in having Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation accept the Business Incentive Policy. The same may be possible in this case.

I am continuing my discussions with Mr. MacKay, and we are also pursuing this through the Government Leader directly with the Prime Minister, and with the other provinces, and the Yukon, who are all also seriously affected by the federal cuts.

In addition, I will work with Members to complete the development of the strategy to deal with potential of no federal funding being reinstated. The efforts today were concentrated on convincing the Canadian Mortgage and Housing Corporation, and Mr. MacKay, on our need for funding, and to have the federal funding submission put forward. The strategy being developed will maximize the new unit delivery within the funding available, while recognizing that the level of service, and the number of new units, may have to decrease from today's levels.

Later on today, I will be tabling the 1992 Housing Needs Survey. The survey confirms that housing needs are continuing to grow in the Northwest Territories, and this provides us with additional information to use in our efforts to have federal cuts reinstated.

Mr. Speaker, although the news today is bad, I will continue to work to change the federal position, and will keep all Members of this Assembly informed of our progress. I would appreciate receiving input from the Members to this Assembly. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Ministers' statements. Mr. Koe.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I would like to make a motion and move, seconded by the honourable Member from North Slave, that Minister's Statement 90-12(2) Federal Social Housing Budget Cuts, be moved into committee of the whole.

Motion is in order, Mr. Koe, to the motion, Mr. Koe.

Question.

The question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? Motion is carried.

---Carried

Ministers' statements. Members' statement. Mr. Nerysoo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today with the direction from the Ordinary Members' Caucus. Mr. Speaker, this House, including the Government Leader, should never tolerate disrespectful manners, and disrespect for the rules and practice of this House, which was demonstrated by a Member of the Cabinet. Mr. Speaker, what I am speaking about, is the manner in which Mr. Kakfwi dealt with a question posed by Mr. Gargan. Mr. Speaker, this House, or this side of the House, will not tolerate arrogance, or the insulting inconsideration given to Mr. Gargan's view, which is a serious issue. Or for that matter, issues raised by all Members, including in some instances, issues raised by Members of Cabinet. Mr. Speaker, the rules are clear on answering of questions. All Members are obliged to follow the practices, and respect of decorum, of this House, by rising to answer a question. Mr. Speaker, we own this side of the House, and know that trying to bend the rules is a fact of life, but complete ignorance should not, and will not, be tolerated. Mr. Speaker, we respect the right of the Minister to decide how or when he or she answers, but Mr. Speaker, as honourable Members, this side of the House will not tolerate the arrogance, aloofness, and disrespect that has been shown by Mr. Kakfwi when responding to a question, and the manner in which he dealt with Mr. Gargan. You can be assured we will deal with the continued existence of this type of attitude appropriately, and with dispatch if necessary. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Members' statements, Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I must tell the House today that I was dismayed by the way the Minister for Intergovernmental and Aboriginal Affairs answered yesterday's questions about the transfer of government programs and services to community self-government. I checked the unedited transcript just this morning to see if I had actually heard the Minister correctly. His response to my honourable colleagues from Inuvik and MacKenzie Delta essentially let us know that in eight and a half months, there has been no substantive progress towards establishing community transfer initiatives. From what I understood from the Minister's comments, all that has been accomplished has been a partial completion of a draft implementation strategy, and we hear that, and I quote, "a rather high level deputy minister's committee has philosophical or political differences, and is to blame for this." I have the Minister attributing the delay, and this initiative, to the honourable Members in this House, simply because we want to review and approve the media report recommendations on the Minister's implementation plan. Mr. Speaker, that is our job. When the Minister comes forward with the implementation details we will review them then, but it is not the fault of the Members on this side of the House that he decided to sit by and watch his rather high level deputy ministers run the show for the last eight and a half months, and then blame them for it.

Mr. Speaker, I can readily understand that in seven parts of the Northwest Territories there are going to be difficult constitutional matters, and philosophical differences, that we will need to form for part of the process leading up to community transfers. I fully support the Metis and Dene leaders in their desire to work these out, as they progress towards community or aboriginal self-government. In the east, Mr. Speaker, we have accepted the principle of public government for the last 20 years. Many of our communities are ready for community self-government now. This is the process that will power us towards the constitutional emergence of Nunavut. We cannot, and will not, allow the goal to be put on hold. The Minister should bring forward a paper, so that this House can move forward in reviewing it, and consulting with our community leaders. Thank you.

---Applause

Members' statements. Mr. Gargan.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have already spoken on two occasions regarding the federal government's initiatives on aboriginal justice and justice administration. I am concerned about the way the decision was made by the federal Minister of Justice to appoint the Northwest Territories Chief Crown Counsel as Director General for the Council on Aboriginal Justice and Administration. When she was questioned on April 8 about her judgement in making this appointment, the Honourable Kim Campbell told the House of Commons that "when I was in Yellowknife in September with the federal/provincial meetings of Ministers responsible for Justice, I had the opportunity to see how this individual was received in his community and how he was regarded by aboriginals and women in that community." Mr. Speaker, I have personally reviewed the agenda and list of participants who attended the federal/provincial meetings. There were no aboriginal women in the final list of delegates from the Northwest Territories. Department of Justice personnel have confirmed that the public input during the federal/provincial meetings was nil. No public organizations were invited to contribute. On February 25, 1992 I was asked by our former Minister of Justice, the Honourable Dennis Patterson, about this appointment. He has responded that he was generally aware of Mr. Avison's departure but was not precisely sure of his irresponsibilities. This response does not make me think that the Minister had been involved in government to government consultations surrounding Mr. Avison's April appointment.

Aboriginal people in the north and throughout Canada have waited a long time for the federal government to begin to address the many outstanding issues that surround the treatment of our people by the justice system. As a major stakeholder in any review of aboriginal justice, I would hope that our government would take the lead role in monitoring and providing input to the current federal initiative.

Mr. Gargan, your allotted time has elapsed.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can I get unanimous consent to complete the last paragraph?

The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Please proceed, Mr. Gargan.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, honourable Members. This could include ensuring that key figures in the projects have demonstrated the sensitivity, understanding and

credibility required to carry out that task. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I would like to take this opportunity to recognize in the visitor's gallery Mr. Willard Hagen, President of the Gwich'in Tribal Council; Chief James Ross of Fort McPherson; Chief Eugene Pascal from Aklavik; and Mr. Robert Alexi, Jr., the Vice-President of the Gwich'in Tribal Council. Welcome.

---Applause

Item 3, Members' Statements. Mr. Pudlat.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question that I would like to direct to the Minister of Education in regard to the Cape Dorset school. There is a proposal for the school in Cape Dorset. They are going to renovate or expand the school, and they are going to put in four new classrooms, but the teachers would like to see five classrooms.

The school in Cape Dorset is proposing that there should be five classes added every year. In 1986 to 1992, the population has grown in Cape Dorset. There were 44 new students that were born in 1986 and went into Kindergarten in 1992. So, for the school year 1992-93, the population will also have grown, and for the year 1993-94, there will be an increase in the population, and as well, there will also be an increase for the years 1994-95, and 1995-96. Because of this, in Cape Dorset, they are requesting more classrooms for the school. So, I would like the Minister of Education to think about this request. Thank you.

Item 3, Members' statements. Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It is unfortunate my colleague, Mr. Gargan, is not in the House, but Mr. Speaker, I did want to make a statement in respect to some of the comments that were made yesterday. I, as a Member of this House, certainly feel that it is critical that the component of cultural programs remain within the school system.

I have been reading a small notebook called the "Fiddle and the Sash" which was produced from the history of the Metis of the Northwest Territories. With that, there is a part of education in the church which I would like to read to the Members. I think it reflects some of the reasons why we, as Members, are going to pay respects to the late Bishop Piche tomorrow. It states:

"Until the 1950s most Metis children were schooled by the Anglican and Roman Catholic Churches. The churches ran residential and day schools with the financial assistance of the federal government. In the 1920s there were seven schools in the Mackenzie Valley. Children stayed in residence in the schools from grades one to nine, learning the basics of education, religion, skills such as: sewing; gardening; and wood crafts. Several former students showing the oblates of Mary Immaculate, O.M.I. and the Grey Nuns, have devoted their lives to the people of the north: Father Napoleon Lafferty; Patrick Mercredi; Sister Delilah Burke; Annie Cooper; Alice Delorme; Anne Mercredi; Agnes Sutherland; and Louise Tourangeau.

Many of the Metis Anglican students later served as lay readers and catechists for northern congregations. Sarah Stewart Simon along with her Gwich'in husband, the Reverend James Simon, ministered the Anglican faith to their people. Sarah, now at the age of 90, has served the church as catechist, interpreter, Sunday School teacher and organist. For her many years of religious dedication and service as midwife, she was awarded the Order of Canada in the fall of 1991."

Mrs. Marie-Jewell, your allotted time has expired.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I ask for unanimous consent to continue.

The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? There are no nays, please continue, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you. Thank you, honourable colleagues. I think that it is of critical importance that the component of culture be instilled within our children, within our students of our school system from as early an age as possible. Whether it be the parents, the teachers, whatever educators that may assist, I believe that parents will gratefully appreciate it. Thank you.

---Applause

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Antoine.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to tell the House of the concern about the activities of Patterson's Sawmill. On March 3, I asked the Minister, the Honourable John Pollard, about the purchase of the Patterson Sawmill in Hay River and he stated, and I quote: "It was not a government decision, although it is my responsibility and I will take full responsibility for it."

I asked him about the number of trees required to run this mill, he indicated it was six to eight million board feet per year, and later on indicated that it would take about 10,000 to 12,000 trees per million board feet.

You are looking at approximately 96,000 trees to be cut this year. I am concerned because you stated very clearly that no logging would occur in the Liard/Nahanni Valley unless the communities and the people of that area are in agreement and in full cooperation.

I am very concerned because the Patterson Sawmill filed an application for a land use permit to cut timber in the area traditionally used by the Dene of Jean Marie River. There was no prior consultation. This application contradicts the assurance that the Minister provided to this House on March 9.

The people of that region are opposed to letting the Patterson Development Corporation operation into that area. There are a number of reasons for the opposition, it is a traditional hunting and trapping area, and one of the main points is that the Patterson Sawmill was previously in that area, before the development corporation took over, and the previous logging in the area was extremely dissatisfactory because of their logging methods. The job, the clean up, a lot of it was left behind.

There is some concern that this may happen again. The area in question, Deep Lake and McGill Lake, are the head waters of Jean Marie River and it is very harmful to fish from the lakes there, for the people around there.

The Jean Marie River Council has passed a resolution against this application. What I would like to say is that I am representing my constituency here, and am opposed to this application.

Mr. Antoine, your allotted time has lapsed.

I seek unanimous consent to conclude.

The Member is seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? There are no nays, please proceed.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will be calling on the Minister to respect the community of Jean Marie River and also his own promise to the House, by directing the N.W.T. Development Corporation and Patterson Sawmill to withdraw Patterson Sawmill's land use application, so that we can deal with this situation in a more consultative manner. Thank you.

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Koe.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to congratulate the Honourable Stephen Kakfwi, Minister of Intergovernmental and Aboriginal Affairs on his successful meetings yesterday with the political leaders. I also would like to thank the Minister for meeting with the Delta and Gwich'in leaders, and the action which he will be taking in dealing with community concerns raised by those leaders on community initiatives. Mahsi Cho.

Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My Member's statement is regarding the community docks and wharfs. I will be speaking in my language.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The hunters in the communities all utilize boats because we know that there are high and low tides, with very heavy low tides and the weather itself is unreliable. The hunters, themselves, use their own canoes and they use big and small boats all the time. Canoes are very expensive to buy, especially for those who are unemployed. The outboard motors are very expensive, also.

People that do hunt with the canoes and big boats should have docks, if docks are available.

Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Mr. Kakfwi.

Proceed, Mr. Kakfwi.

Item 4, returns to oral questions. Mr. Arvaluk.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a return to an oral question asked by Mr. Bernhardt on September 15, 1992, concerning the admission requirements for teacher training at Arctic College campuses.

Teacher Education Programs in the Northwest Territories provide an opportunity for northern residents to enter the teaching profession through full time campus or community programs, or part time programs.

Admission requirements for east and west Teacher Education Programs, and their associated community programs, are similar. In both the east and the west, applicants must have a strong desire to work with children, be mature, responsible and reliable, and have graduated from high school or its equivalent.

In the west, applicants may also demonstrate an equivalent grade 12 ability by successfully completing standardized English and mathematics exams. In addition, western applicants must submit a letter explaining their reason for wanting to enter the teaching profession, a high school transcript, or college entrance exam results, and a letter of recommendation from a community leader, community education council, school principal or Director of Education.

Applicants in the Eastern Arctic Teacher Education Program must be at least 21 years of age, demonstrate fluency and literacy in Inuktitut, and have a high school graduation or its equivalent. Students who do not have grade 12 may be considered if they have a minimum of grade ten, two years successful experience as a classroom assistant, and a reference from both the principal and the community education council, or if they satisfy E.A.T.E.P. numeracy and literacy requirements.

The Western Arctic Teacher Education Program is --- and the reference from both the principal and the community education council, or if they satisfy each of numeracy and literacy requirements.

The Western Arctic Teacher Education Program is credited through the University of Saskatchewan and the eastern Arctic programs are credited through the McGill University. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I would like to recognize in the gallery, Mr. Randy Rivers and his grade 11 social studies class from St. Patrick High School. Returns to oral questions, Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a return to oral question asked by Mr. Nerysoo.

The previous Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs had reviewed the extent of damage in the MacKenzie Delta after this spring's flooding, to determine whether it was appropriate to recommend invoking the Disaster Assistance Policy. After an undertaking of this review, the Minster advised the Premier that, although the MacKenzie Delta did experience flooding, the extent of significant damage was not wide spread to extend necessary to make damage assistance payments.

This decision was based upon the fact that disaster assistance is not meant to provide insurance coverage. It is extraordinary assistance meant to help residents after major damage occurs. It was thought reasonable to assume that individuals should be able to restore their property to its pre-disaster condition without disaster assistance.

Mr. Speaker, I reviewed this matter, I assumed the responsibility for this program, and found that the existing policy does not provide for assistance in this particular situation. Thank you.

Returns to oral questions. Oral questions, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is posed to the Minister of Renewable Resources. Yesterday, before question period had expired, I was posing questions in regards to the status of the Trans-Boundary Water Agreement.

Mr. Speaker, I asked the Minister in respect to the status of the negotiations, and he basically indicated to this House that the Alberta government has not finalized, or they will not finalize anything, until they conclude an agreement with British Columbia. After reading the unedited Hansard, I find this totally unacceptable, and I would like to ask the Minister of Renewable Resources, does he currently have a time frame, in respect to the negotiating process, to acquire the Trans-Boundary Water Agreement? Thank you.

Mr. Allooloo.

Yes, Mr. Speaker. Our time frame, at this point, is to have a final agreement by spring of 1993.

Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Mr. Speaker, he is going to try and acquire one by the spring of 1993. I was told as an M.L.A., well over a year ago, they were going to try and acquire it last year. So, it is going to be two years, taking into consideration there is an abundance of development of pulp mills in the south. Is there any possible way that the Minister can make every effort on his part, to ensure that he speeds up the process, so that we can acquire a Trans-Boundary Water Agreement prior to the spring of 1993? Thank you.

Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The problem is that we would like to speed up the process as much as the Member is stating, but the Alberta government will not finalize the agreement until they have a Trans-Boundary Water Agreement between British Columbia and Alberta. The problem there is that they differ, the two governments, British Columbia and Alberta, differ, on levels that are acceptable to put into the agreement. The B.C. government would like to have higher standards in terms of levels going into Alberta. The Alberta government would like to have lower standards in terms of contaminants going into the province, and they are negotiating at the present time, but it is taking a while to come up with final agreements. The Alberta government has specifically stated that they will not finalize N.W.T and Alberta water agreement until they have an agreement with B.C. Thank you.

Oral questions, supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Mr. Speaker, I find it appalling that the Minister will take a back seat to another province, which is B.C., and yet, at the same time, allow all the pollutants to come down into our water, and our rivers. I would like to know whether the Minister can look at another option in respect to negotiating a Trans-Boundary Water Agreement even though Alberta is adamant that they want to acquire one with B.C. first. The Minister has a responsibility for our jurisdiction, and he should take every measure in respect to addressing the concern that we are expressing in this House. Thank you.

Mr. Allooloo.

Mr. Speaker, I will do my best to represent the Northwest Territories, our residents, and to protect the water quality. The problem here also is that our government, the Government of the Northwest Territories, does not have jurisdictions over lands and water with respect to the waters that are in the Northwest Territories, and to the lands that are Crown lands. The responsibility lies with the Department of Indian Affairs. In terms of our Trans-Boundary Water negotiations, Indian Affairs negotiates on behalf of the Government of the Northwest Territories, in the water quality agreements. So far, our government has been involved in quite a few committees that monitor the water quality, and also in terms of Environment Canada and putting up stations, monitoring stations, throughout the Northwest Territories. I

believe that we have a dozen committees that we are involved in, but the Government of the Northwest Territories does not have a legislative mandate at this point in respect to water in the Northwest Territories, but the federal government, Indian and Northern Affairs, as well as Environment Canada, and Fisheries and Oceans, have the responsibility in that particular area. Since we do not have the responsibility or jurisdiction over lands and waters in the Northwest Territories, we do not have legislation at the present time, although our government has been pursuing that responsibility be devolved to our government, from the federal government, for quite some time. We have not been successful, yet. Thank you.

Oral questions, supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister if he could advise this House, what is the level of standards that Alberta is willing to accept from B.C., that he is monitoring prior to addressing this issue? Thank you.

Mr. Allooloo.

Mr. Speaker, I would have to take that question as notice, and get back to the Member on the details of the negotiations between the B.C. government and the Alberta government. I will get back to her as soon as I can.

Question has been taken as notice. Oral questions. Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Intergovernmental and Aboriginal Affairs concerning the economic union proposals contained in the Consensus Report on the constitution agreed to in Charlottetown on August 28, 1992.

Mr. Speaker, as everyone knows, I have long been an outspoken proponent of strong and effective northern preference policies and finally we have had the political will under the current Minister of Public Works, to implement policies which ensure that the majority of G.N.W.T. contracts will be left to northern firms. This allows us to keep our limited resources in the north.

Now, Mr. Speaker, I have become somewhat distressed when I heard reports that these policies will come under attack when provincial and federal Ministers in November discuss inter-provincial trade. I would ask the Minister whether the agreement that we agreed to in Charlottetown, and the economic union proposals contained within it in any way weaken our ability to protect and continue to implement the G.N.W.T.'s policies on northern preference.

Mr. Kakfwi. Madam Premier.

Mr. Speaker, that was one of the last items that was talked about in Charlottetown, and Mr. Kakfwi had left at that time to come back north to another meeting. When the economic union was being discussed, the initial stage was to put it into the context of the constitution because there were a number of issues that were still outstanding, and the time limit made it just impossible to take into consideration some of the issues that we brought up, such as our ability to retain a Northern Preference Policy.

It was suggested that it would be dealt with at an upcoming conference so that we, as the Northwest Territories, could have our concerns properly addressed. On a number of occasions, at the Western Premiers' Conferences, I brought up the issue of concern, that we have to have the same privileges and protection as the provinces, which they had for 125 years so that they could build their economy.

The western Premiers agreed with us, it is on minutes, that they would support us in maintaining some type of economic percentage that we would be able to develop our economy, and we would have the same privileges that they had in the past. In the conference with all of the First Ministers it was also discussed, this particular concern. It was brought to everyone's attention that we intended to ask to be guaranteed, when we came to the First Ministers' Conference on the Economy, that this specific issue would be addressed, on how the Northwest Territories can maintain the maximum benefits of the few dollars that we have, and it was agreed.

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Todd. New question, Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Minister responsible for Transportation. Mr. Speaker, I would like to know if the Department of Transportation has any programs or provisions to assist communities in obtaining or acquiring community docks and wharves? Thank you.

Mr. Whitford.

Supplementary, Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to know the procedure and I would like to ask the Minister if the Hunters' and Trappers' Association within my riding, of Pelly Bay, Gjoa Haven, and Spence Bay, could be given the information on how to acquire these things?

Mr. Whitford.

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Antoine.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Minister of Economic Development and Tourism. Earlier today I reminded the Minister of the commitments he made March 9 about respecting the wishes of communities with respect to logging in the Liard and Nahanni Valley. Can the Minister explain to the House why Patterson Sawmill Enterprise, which was purchased earlier this year by the Government of the Northwest Territories Development Corporation for $1.4 million, has gone ahead and applied for land use permits on August 12 without the prior consultation with the people of Jean Marie River and Fort Simpson? Thank you.

Mr. Pollard.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Development Corporation, after having taken over Patterson Sawmill, now owns timber cutting rights in the Jean Marie River area and in the Cameron Hills. Each year, though, there has to be a land use permit if they want to go into those particular areas. There is no intention this year to do any logging in the Jean Marie River area. The intention was to go in there and clean up some of the debris from previous logging in that area.

I would apologize to the Member's constituents for the Development Corporation not having gone in and consulted before hand, and I will endeavour to get somebody down there, as soon as possible, to explain themselves to Jean Marie River.

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Antoine.

Yes, supplementary, Mr. Speaker. The application calls for new cutting in the Deep Lake and McGill area. Is the Minister aware of it? These areas were not cut before, and that the application indicates that they would like to go in there and log.

Mr. Pollard.

Mr. Speaker. There will be no cutting of timber this winter in the Jean Marie River area. If the Development Corporation thinks that it is going to do it, by saying this today, I am telling them that they cannot do it. They have not followed, what I consider, the procedure, which is consultation. So, I am making a commitment that there will be no logging. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Nerysoo.

Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. If I could ask the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs. Could the Minister indicate who I should contact, so that I can get the necessary financial support, for home owners who have serious insulation and structural damage, so that they can upgrade their homes to meet the winter conditions?

Mr. Allooloo.

Mr. Speaker, I believe that the Member could contact me, give me the details of the damages that occurred during the flooding, and I will review them again.

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Finance. In December, in response to a question to the economic proposals contained in the federal government's proposed constitutional package, the Minister stated categorically that he would fight any proposals that would weaken or eliminate the G.N.W.T.'s northern preference policies. Can the Minister tell me if that is still his and the Cabinet's position?

Mr. Pollard.

Yes, Mr. Speaker, it is our position. I cannot say that we are not concerned though, about Alberta's position at the present time, which points the gun north, and wants to gun down our Business Incentive Policy. It is of great concern, Madam Premier, and I discussed it this morning, and I will be making some representation to the Government of Alberta in that regard very shortly. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Todd.

Thank you. I understand that there will be a meeting of the provincial and federal Trade Ministers in November and that this policy will come under close scrutiny.

Will the Minister now give his assurances to this House, that he will not agree to any proposals that will adversely affect these important and vital policies without consultation of the Assembly?

Mr. Pollard.

Yes, Mr. Speaker.

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Pudluk.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This question is for the Minister of Renewable Resources. The people that hunt big game, such as polar bear and muskox, these sport hunters are taken by guides out to the land to hunt those big game.

I hear that the rates of the permits are going to be increased. What is the fee now for their permits since they have been increased? Thank you.

Mr. Allooloo.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In regards to sports hunting of polar bear, they have two different permits. They have two different licences that they have to acquire to go sports hunting. In regard to trophy fee, when they shoot a polar bear, they have to pay a trophy fee and the fee this year is about $500, from $250 to $500. Thank you.

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Pudluk.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The increase in the fee from big game hunters, will that touch the whole of the Northwest Territories? Thank you.

Mr. Allooloo.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This fee increase is for people that hunt polar bears and it is an increase to the trophy fee. Thank you.

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Justice. There are many small communities within the Northwest Territories that do not have resident R.C.M.P. These communities have expressed their concern about the lack of basic police services for a number of years.

There have been discussions in the House by previous Ministers about developing a program that would train by-law officers or other individuals within the communities to perform some of these R.C.M.P. duties.

Can the Minister advise the House, whether he has taken any action toward developing an initiative to provide increased policing services to communities that do not have resident R.C.M.P.?

Mr. Kakfwi.

Item 5, oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Todd.

Yes, Mr. Speaker. My question was not for a requirement of an expansion of the R.C.M.P. My question was, has the Department of Justice initiated the development of a program to train local by-law officers or individuals, within the communities, to perform some of the policing duties that cannot be performed because of the lack of R.C.M.P.?

I do not think my question was answered. Has the Department of Justice, or is the Department of Justice developing a local initiative program that would allow by-law officers or others to act in a policing capacity where there are no R.C.M.P.?

Mr. Kakfwi.

Item 5, oral questions. Mr. Antoine.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed towards the Minister responsible for Intergovernmental and Aboriginal Affairs. It has to do with your statement, the Minister's statement. I am glad that he is at this meeting, however, I am concerned because I represent a portion of the Northwest Territories that is not included in this committee that he has.

If this committee is going to be the driving force for community transfers and self-government models, then I am very concerned that the people that I represent are going to be left out. It seems to me that the people that are in this group have to accept the federal government's land claims approach, and at the same time denounce Bill Erasmus and the Dene Nation before they are included in this group.

We have chiefs in my region that have strong views on self-government as well as community transfers. I know that Bill Erasmus is there, but if this is the case where you have chiefs in different regions represented, then I would like to ask the Minister if he could include the Deh Cho chiefs in these discussions, especially if initial work plans and interim budgets are being considered? If Members of this committee want to have the opportunity to address this House, I think they should be included as well. Would the Minister indicate to the House if the Deh Cho and the region would be included in this committee? Thank you.

Mr. Kakfwi.