Mr. Chairman, I have on my left the Deputy Minister of Justice, Geoff Bickert. On my right, the Assistant Deputy Minister for the Solicitor General Branch, Nora Saunders.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Are there any general comments? Mr. Arngna'naaq.

Thank you, Mr. Arngna'naaq. Mr. Minister.

Most of the money that we have for operating these types of facilities are in the O & M budget. What we have right now, we are funding through the wilderness programs for young offenders. They are done through contract with people like Elijah Erkloo in Pond Inlet, the Tungait young offenders wilderness camp in Iqaluit, Wilfred Jackson camp outside of Fort Good Hope and Jimmy Maring just outside of Aklavik. We also have some program dollars being spent on correctional institutions that are able to provide wilderness programs. Both the Baffin Correctional Centre and the Isumaqsunngittukkuvik have active land programs.

The Yellowknife Correctional Centre is developing a guiding program, which would allow inmates to enter the second year of an Arctic College program. This is guiding for outfitting and fishing camps. Those are some of the ones that we have. We are having discussions with communities that are expressing an interest in trying to develop programs or proposals that might turn into projects, which we would be prepared to fund, if we have a need for them. We are trying to expand the number of options we have, especially for open custody children who require less supervision and are less of a security problem than the secure custody children, but also to try to keep children as close to home as possible, to give the people of those children a chance to take a hand in giving them some guidance and some support at times that they find very troubling.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Member for Kivallivik.

Thank you, Member for Kivallivik. Mr. Minister.

We have had responsibility for these for about a year and a half now. The Member will appreciate that the capital plan, the programs, the facilities and the staff we inherited, are all responsibilities that we have taken very seriously. We have tried to take a methodical approach to deciding what to do with them. For instance, in the case of bush camps, we have kept them running, but we have had extensive discussions with these operators and groups that run them. We had discussions with other people who are interested in such ventures and have started work toward developing certain common, standard operating procedures and guidelines so that operators know what it is we're looking for when we enter into contracts with them.

We are trying to create sort of a level playing field for these contractors, to ensure that the young offenders are assured, as well as the parents, the public, and Members of the Legislature, that there are some clear parameters to what we are willing and are not willing to accept. As a general rule, the wilderness camps that we have, and have had, are seen as good, positive experiences for us. We're just trying to find ways to be more supportive of the operators and those people that wish to make such proposals.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. General comments. Mr. Ningark, then Mr. Koe.

Thank you, Mr. Ningark, Member for Natilikmiot. Mr. Minister, did you want to comment on that? If not, I will move on to Mr. Koe. Mr. Koe, Member for Inuvik.

Thank you, Member for Inuvik. Mr. Minister.

Mr. Chairman, the previous capital items that were included were put there by the previous department that was responsible for corrections. One of the things that I became aware of, as the Minister responsible for corrections, is the real lack of any firm information base, on which to make projections. There is, in fact, a real inadequate information system, which I think the Standing Committee on Public Accounts or Standing Committee on Finance recognized over a year ago. We are working on that. We are trying to make sure that the information we need to manage corrections is readily available. I think we have just about completed that.

In short, there was no way for me to substantiate allocating capital monies the way it was. That's why there has been such a major deletion, to the tune of over $20 million. I couldn't substantiate it. The basis of the planning is unknown to me. What I have set out to do is, following the tabling of the master plan, agree that the process we're going to follow is to determine what kind of capital money we need to maintain and upkeep the present facilities we have, to take into account the impact that division is going to have on the territories, and to plan for communities and regions, asking for specific ways in which we can give community-based programs and facilities an equal chance to get in on the capital plan.

In order to do that, we, first of all, needed to get approval by this Legislature, by the Standing Committee on Finance and Cabinet, for that direction. Now we think we are close to an agreement, the planning will be done and made available to Members, I hope, by next fall. It will substantiate what a new five year capital plan will look like, how much money we think we need to upkeep the present facilities to get maximum use of them, what type of regional and community programs and facilities to budget for, to support our projects, and to be clear about accepting division. That is something that is going to affect our planning in a major way.

There is nothing in this programming process yet, to help us articulate what our O and M projections are going to be either. That's the other area of work we need to do.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Koe.

Thank you, Member for Inuvik. Mr. Minister.