Thank you, Mr. Pudlat. Orders of the day. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, earlier this week one of my colleagues rose to talk about when the next territorial election should be. He said two years ago he argued for an early election but there was no interest. Mr. Speaker, many things have changed over the past two years. The most important to me, as a Member of this Assembly, is the decline in public confidence both in the government and the Legislative Assembly and many things have contributed to that decline.

In the rest of the country, governments are balancing their budgets and reducing their debt. Here, the government has budgeted itself out of an accumulated surplus and into a situation where we will have a debt of $38 million. This comes at a time when the federal government is trying to deal with the national debt. If our federal budget is cut by a large amount next year, we will be in a very bad deficit situation.

As well, in this time of financial trouble, we need to consider the additional cost of holding a by-election in the riding of our former colleague, Mr. Arvaluk. If a spring election were held, the government would not have to spend our limited resources on this by-election. Residents of the riding could elect a new representative as part of the general election. Two years ago, Mr. Speaker, the government had its negotiations with the UNW settled. Now public service employees are about to enter into their second year without a new contract. In fact, we are aware that the government and the UNW have had to go to arbitration.

In the past two years there have been frequent changes to the Cabinet and leadership of the Assembly. For example, when we take the department of MACA, it has had five different Ministers in the past year and a half and a total of seven new Ministers since this Cabinet was formed. Mr. Speaker, although Members adopted a code of ethics and a statement of zero tolerance for violence...

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to continue my Member's statement.

The Member for Thebacha is seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Please proceed, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you. Thank you, honourable Members. Mr. Speaker, although Members adopted a code of ethics and a statement of zero tolerance for violence, the public perception is that these are not being followed. Particularly in the last year, public inquiries, criminal offences, violent situations involving alcohol and, most recently, lawsuits involving Members of the Assembly have frequently been in the news. People are wondering when these things they read are going to come to a stop.

A concern has been raised that if an early election is called, current MLAs will catch potential opponents unaware and will have an unfair advantage. Mr. Speaker, I do not believe this will be the case. All northerners who are interested know this is an election year. Anyone considering running for the Assembly is probably already thinking about it and preparing. I even know that one of my opponents is having an election meeting on February 27th, which I commend him for. In fairness, I'm even giving him free press. This is a democratic process which we enjoy as Canadians.

Decisions about the timing of the next election, Mr. Speaker, are usually made in private. However, Mr. Speaker, I agree with Mr. Lewis that this issue should be decided through public discussion in this Assembly.

---Applause

I sense that the public would prefer to see an election sooner, rather than later and, therefore, I am considering introducing a motion to have the election this spring.

---Applause

Mr. Speaker, it is crucial that the people have confidence in their government and in their Legislative Assembly. We must be sure that the people support our efforts on their behalf and the only way to do that is to have a mandate from the people. I believe an early election will give this whole Assembly a very clear and new mandate. Thank you.

Hear, hear.

---Applause

Thank you. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Dent.

The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Please proceed, Mr. Dent.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Lewis.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Four years ago, Mr. Chairman...Sorry, Mr. Speaker. Four years ago, the government established a round table on the economy and the environment and agreed to develop a policy on sustainable development. The government, in 1991, disbanded the round table on the economy and the environment and it still has no clear position on sustainable development.

Our Special Committee on the Northern Economy in the 11th Assembly made a strong recommendation to this government to get its act together to prepare for major economic development. The Government of the Northwest Territories has no policy on sustainable development and lacks focus in addressing the major projects associated with mineral development.

I mentioned previously in this House the problems we face because we have no policy on sustainable development. Any time we raise mining and mining issues, we are deemed by many to be in support of development at all cost, full-steam ahead and don't worry about the consequences. If we raise environmental issues, many assume we are anti-development and very likely raving radicals.

Our government has had ample opportunity to develop a sustainable development policy, which everyone has the chance to buy into. It hasn't done this, Mr. Speaker. We have only a very small say in the development of mining in the Northwest Territories. What small say we do have, must be coherent. We can't speak in an ambiguous way. Without a policy, it is becoming a free-for-all. The public really doesn't know who is responsible for what. Before we do take over mining from the feds, we had better have a sustainable development policy, Mr. Speaker.

The Minister of Renewable Resources in his statement yesterday, made reference to sustainable development, but we are still waiting to hear whether the government has any intention of developing one. Thank you.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Lewis. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Koe.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yesterday in committee of the whole, the committee approved amendments to Bill 6, An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products Tax Act. The Petroleum Products Tax Act sets the rates by which the tax on various petroleum products are calculated. The only issues concerning some of my constituents when it comes to purchasing gasoline products is that of the road tax imposed on the price of a litre of gasoline. This government currently has a two-tiered tax system based on where the fuel is delivered. There is a zone A or on-road tax, and a zone B, an off-road tax. I believe zone A taxes are 10 cents a litre and zone B taxes are six cents per litre.

Mr. Speaker, my concern is that there are many hunters, trappers, fishermen and other people who spend a lot of time out on the land. Most of these people purchase gasoline for their outboard motors, skidoos and four-wheelers from in-town gas stations and suppliers. They have to pay the 10 cents extra tax on this product. However, the majority of their travel and use are off-road, in the bush or on the tundra. They use the gas for subsistence gathering or to supplement their traditional lifestyles.

Mr. Speaker, I don't think that this is fair. I know in agricultural country, farmers get breaks on their gasoline taxes and are able to use something called "purple gas." I am not sure if the east coast or west coast fishermen also get breaks on their gas, but in the north we should definitely look at changing our taxation levies on our gasoline products to support our hunters, trappers, fishermen and people following traditional pursuits.

I strongly urge the Minister of Finance to review these on-road and off-road taxes and maybe even consider dying the colour of our gasoline to assist our northerners in maintaining healthy lifestyles through the purchase of cheaper gas. Mahsi.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Koe. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Ballantyne.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, like my colleague, Mr. Dent, I would like to talk about the rising crime rate in the Northwest Territories, especially here in Yellowknife. For the last few years, I, along with other MLAs, have talked about the rise in crime; the increase in the use of drugs and the numbers of break and enters in Yellowknife. We have made many statements about the problem. The Minister has told us many times that the problem is being studied. We have projects in a few communities regarding community policing.

The Minister has also made a commitment for more police in this year's budget. As my colleague has said, what we would really like is the Minister and the department to look at some innovative approaches to community policing that don't cost a lot of money. We need more police and the Minister has committed to more police, but at some point in time, at $150,000 for an RCMP officer, that won't be the only way we are going to solve this problem. The Minister has committed to sit down with the Yellowknife MLAs, the mayor and the police. Before that meeting, I would like to have the Minister take a very serious look at some of the options that have been put forward; changes to the police act, auxiliary police, enhancing Crime Stoppers, et cetera. A concept I have put forward a number of times is trying to find some kind of a program in cooperation with municipalities to cost-share clerical support for the police. It would be a lot cheaper than hiring new police officers.

The point we are making, as the Yellowknife MLAs, is the problem is serious. People in this town are taking it very seriously. We recognize that dollars are limited, so we really ask the Minister to sit down with his staff and really crunch some numbers and some of these suggestions we have made. When we get together in this meeting, we can go forward with some concrete approaches. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Ballantyne. Item 3, Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Mr. Kakfwi.

Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, oral questions.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have a question for the new Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs. I would like to congratulate him on his appointment.

Mr. Speaker, last fall there was a lot of controversy about the awarding of the Arctic Winter Games to the city of Yellowknife. In the furore of this process of securing a bid for the Arctic Winter Games, the members on the Arctic Winter Games International Committee which represent the Northwest Territories both resigned. I would like to ask the Minister, when will he be making appointments to the Arctic Winter Games International Committee?

Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs, Mr. Ng.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I've written letters to all Members of this Assembly and to a couple of other organizations requesting nominations be put forward for consideration as there are two board members that our government appoints to the Arctic Winter Games International Committee. One of them, by by-law, has to be a senior government representative and the other individual is normally selected by the Arctic Winter Games International Committee with the two nominations that come forward from the department. After I receive interested nominees, then I'll be making a decision on that, and I anticipate that that will be done before the end of March. Thank you.

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Koe.

It's interesting that one of the appointments has to be a senior government representative. I assume when you say that, that could be any government representative or any government employee from any department. Or, does it have to be from the sport and recreation division of MACA?

Mr. Ng.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It's my understanding that the individual who would be the government representative would have to be in the capacity of sport and recreation; a senior government official from that area. Thank you.

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Koe.

Mahsi. So that really limits the choices then that are available, and I think I disagree if that's one of the criteria. What other criteria will be the Minister be using to select the other position? If the criteria is already established for one of these positions, what criteria will the Minister be using to select the non-government appointment?

Mr. Ng.

I'll probably have to consider whether or not that individual was from the Inuvik area. No, I would consider whether or not the individual has a broad, general background in sports and what kind of community support and territorial support that individual would have and his qualifications. Thank you.

Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Koe.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. It's nice that there will be some criteria, and, of course, I would prefer someone from the Inuvik region, but being a Member of this House and representing all residents of the north, I hope that everyone has an equal opportunity if they're capable. I'm just wondering again, what time frame are you looking at with soliciting nominations and then when are you going to consider making an appointment?

Mr. Ng.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The nomination call letters have gone forward now, so I expect within the next couple of weeks that we'll receive them. As I stated earlier, prior to the end of March is when I anticipate making a decision. Thank you.

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Minister responsible for the Power Corporation. Mr. Speaker, we all know that the PUB has made a decision with regard to adding a rider to the power rates for the low-water rate; better known as low-water rate rider, on our Power Corporation bills. This initial decision was to recover some $4.8 million which was expended here in Yellowknife. I want to indicate to the public that my constituents are very concerned about this and did not agree with the decision, however, are accordingly paying their power bills.

Mr. Speaker, this particular decision to allow for the rest of the territories to absorb this $1 million cost and the $3 million to be absorbed by Yellowknife residents...Can the Minister indicate to this House if she knows the percentage of this $1 million cost to other territorial residents which should reflect on their power bill? Thank you.

Madam Premier.

Mr. Speaker, I'll take the question as notice.

Thank you. The question is taken as notice. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Lewis.

I hope this question, Mr. Speaker, to the Minister responsible for Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources won't aggravate the whole environmental development debate. I would like to ask the Minister is it true that in this year's estimates -- since I'm not privy to all the finance stuff since I don't belong to the Finance committee -- is it true that he has an environmental analyst planned in this year's budget?

Minister of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources, Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm not sure off the top of my head whether we have a provision for an environmental analyst. I will look into that; I can't remember, quite frankly. I know that the department is taking a great deal more interest in environmental issues as they relate to exploration because it is becoming very high profile and we need to be much more proactive in making sure that the mining industry meets the requirements of the different types of panels that are before us, like the EARP panel that is currently reviewing the BHP application. This is done in a spirit of cooperation in trying to expedite timely decision-making on the issues surrounding the development of the industry as it relates to the environment. Thank you.

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Lewis.

(Microphone turned off)...does have -- and I know he's very well aware of it -- provision for an analyst and the Minister has given us an explanation of why he wants to have that. I would like to ask the Minister, since we already -- and I quote some people in the mining industry -- have "environmentalists up the yin yang in government," why is this government adding even one more?

Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I don't believe that we're adding an environmentalist to the staff complement. I think what we're doing, which we haven't done in the past, is taking a much more active interest in the environmental aspects of the industry, if I'm correct. And we're trying to assist the mining industry and others in moving forward with their applications to develop different mines and different infrastructure. We're trying to assist them so that we can move quickly to meet the requirements of the environmental review-type panels that the industry has to face. Certainly, it isn't our intent to add to the growing environmental groups, as there are enough of them out there. Thank you.

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Lewis.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Department of Renewable Resources -- and I don't have the precise numbers -- has a large number of people involved in environmental matters and they have them because there is a concern that industrial development has to be balanced and it could have an impact on wildlife. So, what I would like to ask the Minister is, what impact can wildlife have on the industry? Since you now want to have your own, are you afraid of moose knocking over people or bears killing people? What is the purpose of you having an environmental person in your department? So that the mining industry will be protected from these animals?

Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Well, I thought I had answered the question by saying that one of the shortcomings, if you want, of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources in previous years was our inability to give the industry -- which I believe we're advocates of -- the right kind of advice that relates to the applications they have to put before hearing committees. I believe that is a proactive approach which this government and certainly my ministry endorses. That is our intention with this position and with the resources we are going to give to it. It is not to take away from, it is to add to the kind of expertise and support we can provide the industry to expeditiously meet the requirements of the environmental review committees. Thank you.

Thank you. Final supplementary, Mr. Lewis.

Thank you. This is the budget session, Mr. Speaker, and I've already been told that we have lots of people who are great at analysing things. So, I would like to ask the Minister, instead of adding to the public service, did he consider the possibility of seconding somebody from somewhere else inside the government so we wouldn't have to increase the costs to this government of adding more staff?

Mr. Todd.

Mr. Speaker, it is my understanding that Mr. Lewis and some of his colleagues from Yellowknife want to see an orderly, expeditious development of the mineral industry. I believe this position enhances that, it doesn't take away from that. It provides us with the expertise to provide advice to the industry so it can hopefully avoid some of the delays we have seen recently because the industry didn't address all the issues the RERC wanted, and that was the BHP application. I suppose we perhaps could have considered secondment. We didn't and that's why it is in the budget. Thank you.

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Ballantyne.

Thank you. I have a question, Mr. Speaker, for the Minister of Economic Development and Tourism and it also has to do with diamond mining. I'm not as concerned as my colleague about the process or about this particular position, but what I am concerned about, though, are what steps the department has taken to look at the possibility of value-added jobs, whether they are in a sorting facility or in a cutting factory. At the end of the day, what my constituents are worried about are some real jobs and some real benefits. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Economic Development and Tourism, Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We're currently doing some of that research and investigating under the Department of Energy, Mines and Petroleum Resources, actually. I believe we've hired some of the top knowledgeable diamond people in the world and I say that without risk of being questioned on it. Right now we have these people working on evaluating, sorting, polishing, et cetera. In the reports they are doing for us, they are showing us the net fiscal benefits should these activities take place.

Again, if it were to be viewed that some of this work could be done in the north we would, once a decision to develop a diamond mine has been made, have to sit down and negotiate with the mining industry to determine what we could do in the north. But, it is certainly our intent to encourage and prepare documentation that shows that some of this work can be done. Thank you.

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Ballantyne.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister is aware that estimates have been done about the loss of government jobs in Yellowknife because of Nunavut, and they are somewhere in the order of 300 jobs. My understanding is that a sorting factory could probably provide 100 to 150 jobs, so it could be a very significant addition to Yellowknife, if that's the way it comes out. My question to the Minister is, has the Minister made it clear to BHP that our government will aggressively pursue these value-added opportunities to stay here in the Northwest Territories?

Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have explained to BHP -- as a matter of fact, I met with Mr. Hickman earlier last week -- that with or without an accord, if there is no value-added fiscal component to this development that we are going to be heading towards a difference of opinion about whether this development should move forward or not. Thank you.

Thank you. Supplementary, Mr. Ballantyne.

Thank you. To follow along the same line of questioning, I, along with other people, have a real concern because the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs has that responsibility and I'm not convinced they hold dear the interests of the Northwest Territories as deeply as our government does. My question to the Minister is, has the Minister made it very clear to the Minister of Indian and Northern Affairs that we consider it imperative that we have some of these value-added opportunities here in the Northwest Territories? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would hope that we have made it clear. I've certainly spoken to the Minister about the issue of the mineral accord, in general. We all know that, to some extent -- and only to some extent -- that diamonds are driving the agenda a little more aggressively than perhaps it has in the past. We've indicated to him at some length -- not only myself, but my colleagues, Mr. Pollard and the Premier -- that we would like to see significant value-added benefits accrued from this development. I want to reiterate what I have said on a number of occasions. These are northern diamonds, therefore some benefits should accrue to northerners. Thank you.

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Dent.

Minister of Justice, Mr. Kakfwi.

Thank you. Mr. Dent.

Mr. Kakfwi.

Mr. Kakfwi.

Thank you. Final supplementary, Mr. Dent.

Thank you. Mr. Kakfwi.

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions.

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Nerysoo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. That is a detailed question that I don't have the statistics for. It is all statistical and it has to be dealt with in the context of the information the honourable Member is reading from.

Thank you. Mr. Nerysoo, are you taking the question as notice?

---Microphones Turned Off

Mr. Zoe.

Mr. Nerysoo.

No, Mr. Speaker. I indicated that the information the Member is using is statistical and I don't know the basis on which the question is being asked. I don't know the information that is being used. Therefore, it is very difficult for me to respond to the honourable Member. It requires a technical response.

Mr. Zoe, will you clarify your question?

Mr. Nerysoo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The problem is, with great respect, the honourable Member has to look at all the labour information in its context. I can indicate to the honourable Member that the results of the 1994 labour force survey indicated both positive and negative developments and I think that the honourable Member is only pointing out the negative.

The highlights of the survey results are as follows: the unemployment rate went up from 16 per cent in 1989 to 17 per cent in 1994, however, it is very difficult for job creation to keep up with the large number of people who join the labour force every year in the Northwest Territories due to both the population increase and the rising participation rate; second, the participation rate for aboriginal people increased from 56 per cent in 1989 to 61 per cent in 1994. This means that aboriginal people are more interested in wage employment and are pursuing wage employment more actively. Aboriginal people made some gains in the overall employment share, from 38 per cent of the total employment in 1989 to 39 per cent in 1994.

The overall labour market of the NWT performed well to absorb so many new workers with only a slight increase in the unemployment rate and a small improvement in the employment/population ratio. The problem is that the information that the honourable Member has does not consider all these factors, and if you look at all the highlights, obviously there is both growth, and in some cases a reduction in the employment opportunities.

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Premier. Mr. Speaker, last year with regard to the Cabinet, they had given direction with respect to the fire management program. Direction was given to a Minister on how to address a component of the fire management program. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Premier, are there any written procedures and guidelines which govern a Minister's actions in carrying out the decisions of Cabinet, aside from the general, broad direction provided by Cabinet? Thank you.

Madam Premier.

Mr. Speaker, there would be records of decision. Any other policy matters that came out of the records of decision would be available for direction in the fire management program. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Maybe the Premier didn't hear my question. I would like to ask again, are there any written procedures and guidelines which govern a Minister's actions in carrying out the decision of Cabinet, aside from the general, broad policies and directions that are provided by Cabinet? I would like to know whether there are any guidelines that you have as a Cabinet. Thank you.

Madam Premier.

Mr. Speaker, I may not be understanding the question, but to my knowledge there are no written procedures to follow what would be available for a Minister to carry out his duties, in addition to those records of decision or general policy guidelines. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you. So is the Premier indicating to the public that if there are no written procedures or guidelines, Cabinet Ministers are fully on their own when they're attempting to implement a Cabinet direction? Thank you.

Madam Premier.

Mr. Speaker, as I have indicated before, there are records of decision and there are also general policies. On those decisions, it's expected that the Minister will carry out those responsibilities and those directions that had come out of these policies and records of decision, unless the record of decision had indicated that the Minister had additional provisions that would direct the Minister to come back to Cabinet for reconfirming a certain aspect of the record of decision. Thank you.

Thank you. Final supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Recognizing that, basically Ministers attempt to implement Cabinet direction in a vacuum because of the absence of written procedures or written guidelines, no policies to adhere to, even though there are policies with a general direction, as the Premier has stated, on the decision; basically, it appears that Ministers are implementing Cabinet direction in a total vacuum. Would the Premier consider developing written procedures and guidelines for her Ministers when implementing Cabinet direction? Thank you.

Madam Premier.

Mr. Speaker, I wouldn't suggest that Ministers were carrying out their responsibilities in a vacuum. Most Members generally complain more that there are too many policies, too many directives, too many guidelines; that often there's not that flexibility to bend to circumstances as they arise.

I believe that the general procedures are on how business is carried out, and the policies are part of a department; for example, if we looked at forest fire fighting, there is a very long procedure on when a fire gets fought, when it doesn't get fought, what type of guidelines a Minister would follow in running the forest fire prevention program. To put in another level in the procedures, I don't know how that would be done, but I will certainly look at it and just see if that would help circumstances. However, there are already quite a large number of procedural guidelines that Ministers have to follow. Thank you.

Thank you. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Pudlat.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is directed to the Minister of the Housing Corporation. In April 1995, I understand that rents will be increasing. I just want to ask the Minister what kind of structured rates they will have when increasing the rents, as my constituents would like to know more about this. As we all know, the housing rates will be increasing. I just want to know what differences there will be in 1995 from previous years. This is my question to the Minister. Thank you.

Mr. Morin.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The new rent scale will come into effect on April 1, 1995 and it will vary from the old rent scale by quite a bit. In some cases, rent will decrease for some of the lower-income people in social housing. For elders, the rent will be $1 a year. But, for family members living with them in social housing, their income will

be assessed. Also, there will be a new cost-of-living adjustment for all people living in the Northwest Territories and higher-income people will be encouraged to move into home ownership. I can arrange a complete briefing for the Member if he would like that done and then he will be right up to date on the issue. Thank you.