I have a few comments I would like to make about this particular department. I'm generally quite supportive of the approach that the department is taking. I, probably ad nauseam, have made a number of observations from my own point of view in this House about what's happening in the country and how we really have to find new sources of revenue. I've talked about the Quebec situation. Whatever way it goes, whether Quebec stays in or goes out, there's going to be a new look at how the federation is put together and there's going to be a lessening of the federal government's power.

There's a lot of talk about the federal government turning over to the provinces block funding for health and social services and education, which again lessens the federal government's power.

My fear is that if we don't get as many powers and as many responsibilities and as much control over our resources as possible in the next very short period of time, I don't want to predict what the future is going to be like for the Northwest Territories. Because those in the territories who think it's going to stay the same as it is now are wrong, absolutely wrong. I want to be on the record now when history looks back at this time when we had an opportunity to do something, that I said very strongly we should do something, that we have to move ahead, we can't sit on our hands and we can't pretend that the world is staying the same.

I, for one, even though politicians are afraid to say it, support mining exploration, I support mining, I support utilizing our oil and gas reserves here in the Northwest Territories. I think it's critical that all of us have to look at utilizing these resources, because without them we have nothing; we're a welfare state; we're irrelevant.

I, for one, commend the Minister on the approach he's taking. What I would like to say is that the debate about mining is done at an absolutely ridiculous level. There is one group that says if you support mining you're against the environment; that's nonsense, it's absolute nonsense, this is the 1990s. We're not talking about developing mines the way we did in the 1950s or the 1960s. A modern mine with all the environmental technology can have a minimal impact on the environment of our land.

So this is not a matter of either you're for mining or you're against mining. I, for one, am for responsible mining. I think that distinction has to be made. It's like you're put in one camp or the other. You're either for it or you're against it. It's absolutely ridiculous. We have to have mining up here. We don't have other forms of revenue. Therefore, if you acknowledge that as the basic premise, the second premise is we will make the mining companies use the most modern environmental technology possible. It's a given.

So I hope that whenever we debate this in the House you can be both; you can be pro-mining and you can be pro-new environmental technology. You can do both, and I have no problem saying I'm supportive.

I was just at a conference in Vancouver and talked to a lot of the exploration people who work here in the Northwest Territories. The word I'm getting from most of them is they're really fed up and frustrated. There are so many different groups they have to deal with up here. The federal government...and who knows if they're for or against mining.

Our government has some responsibility in some areas, but it doesn't have responsibility in other areas. There are discussions on division, discussions on self-government. All these discussions, all these initiatives are important and they have to happen, but in the meantime the investment potential in the Northwest Territories is right now being looked at with somewhat of a jaundiced eye. So I think we should be very aware of that.

At the end of the day, I think that it's possible for all of us here in the Northwest Territories to pursue legitimate goals whether they're self-government goals, whether it's the goal of division, whether it's the goal of putting together a public government here in the west. But at the same time, we all have to agree that in order to finance all of these good ideas we need investment dollars and we're going to need mining. There's no doubt about it. So I think all of us should agree that we are going to work together to allow development to go ahead, development that takes note of the environment and uses the modern technology available now to mining. But we can't sit on our hands and say let's wait until we figure it all out up here, because it may be another decade. By that time, I tell you, there ain't going to be nobody coming up here. And once they're out of here, exploration money goes anywhere in the world. Once they're out of here, if people think they're going to come back...I think sometimes we live in a bit of a fool's paradise.

There's mining potential all over the world, all sorts of places where mining investment is moving right now. So I think that we have to be responsible, but I also think we have to be aggressive and pursue our opportunities. Because if we don't, other places in the world are going to think lucky for them that we're such fools.

I want to say again that I think the fact is that the Minister has done very good work bringing the aboriginal groups together. I think we're beginning to see some meeting of the minds. I think there are a lot of very clever leaders in the Northwest Territories; pragmatic, realistic leaders who also understand that in order to achieve your dreams you have to be able to pay for them. And I think the Minister has done a good job bringing those leaders together, so I for one support his efforts. I really urge the aboriginal leaders to have a look at this and let's find some mechanisms so everybody can protect their interest, but we can all move ahead and we all can slowly take off the yoke of the federal government. The stream of money we have from the federal government, inevitably, is going to be diminished in the years to come. I think we all have to recognize that.

So I really hope that a diamond mine is built here in the Northwest Territories. In our trip to Africa, we visited the most modern diamond mine in the world: Venetia in South Africa. I think all of us on the trip were quite impressed with the technology used in that mine, and the possibilities that are available to BHP or other producers here in the Northwest Territories. Putting in a diamond mine in the 1990s is very different from building a diamond mine 50 years ago.

Diamonds, of all the minerals that can be mined, are really the most environmentally benign. They don't use chemicals. Essentially, you have a hole in the ground; a pile of gravel. In Venetia they have new techniques so that as they are actually using the mine they are reclaiming it. So they are not waiting till the end of the mine in order to do that. They are actually reclaiming parts of the mine as the mine is producing. In Venetia they have created a game park many times the size of the actual mining area and they are reintroducing the elephant, lion and other animals that haven't been in the area for many years. It's interesting that in this one particular area of South Africa, this mine has actually added value to the environment as opposed to taking away. There is a hole in the ground for a few square kilometres but there is a much bigger area that has actually been repopulated with animals. So, with some imagination and some realistic approaches to the problem, there are all sorts of innovative ways that we can enhance the environment using the revenues generated from mining.

I would hope that the environmental groups don't spend all of their energy opposing mining. I hope that they can use some of their creative energy to come up with some examples and

ideas of how the revenues generated from mining can be put to good use to protect wildlife and to protect the environment.

Basically, Mr. Chairman, I just wanted to say a few words about my thoughts about mining, the mining industry and the departmental initiatives. I think there is tremendous potential in this area, and I guarantee that if we don't take advantage of that potential, 10, 15 or 20 years from now people are going to be asking, why not. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.