Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this amendment to the motion would result in a territorial election being held in the middle of June rather than late in October as proposed in the main motion. As I said, I want to advise the House that proposing this amendment is

done for a number of reasons and I'll just repeat some of my reasons that I had initially indicated in the motion.

First, it would provide the new government with sufficient time to complete the necessary fiscal planning that will be necessary to bring forward a budget that adequately contends with the federal cuts and other financial challenges that must be addressed in the upcoming year.

Second, it provides the people of the Northwest Territories to provide this House with a renewed mandate; one that will be necessary to legitimately proceed with finalization and implementation of key government initiatives like the northern accord, the airport transfers and the negotiations of a new funding formula arrangement with the Government of Canada.

Mr. Speaker, I want to state up front that I'm fully aware that this amendment may cause some concerns for my honourable colleagues, particularly my honourable colleagues from the eastern Arctic, because I know that spring months are important for harvesting families, family and cultural renewal. Some Members who follow this debate might suggest that it would be unfair to community residents if the election date occurs when many families are on the land for spring hunting. Yet, if Motion 12-12(7) passes without an amendment, the fact is that much of the election campaign will still be occurring during this important season for the Members from the west. However, whether they're planning to stand for re-election or not, honourable Members of this House will know that in many communities electioneering will take place both throughout the spring and the summer. No matter when the actual voting date is scheduled this year, the absence of some sectors of the community is a factor in this election. I think it will be less disruptive for the communities. It will ensure that each candidate's message is delivered more clearly to voters. And if the campaign is confined to the period from the end of April to mid-June, the process will not be dragged out and delayed until October.

As I said, Mr. Speaker, for years in the Dene communities they have found that fall elections are just as intrusive, I guess, as some of the people who say spring elections are for the eastern Arctic Members. The fall election for many of the Dene and the Metis are important time frames when many of the Members go out hunting moose and harvesting berries, I know it's my time to hunt chickens, and it does take away our time from campaigning. However, Mr. Speaker, I guess the main benefit to amending this motion is to allow for a spring election that would provide more time for the new government to craft a budget that takes into account the fiscal realities of our situation. We have to ensure that there's adequate time for planning, for consulting and for preparing. We simply cannot cheat the budgetary process by cramming it into the short time frame that a fall election would create. At the same time, I think we have to recognize that in order to face the challenges that confront us now we must have the full confidence of the people of the Northwest Territories.

Mr. Speaker, with that, I believe that I look at honourable Members and ask them to really face the facts, look at our fiscal restraints, look at our fiscal picture and seriously consider the best and the betterment of the people of the Northwest Territories that we should look at seriously considering supporting an earlier election rather than later. Thank you.

Thank you. The seconder, Ms. Mike. I would like to remind the Members to speak to the motion itself, not to make comparisons with the fall election when we have an amendment with regard to a spring election. Stick to the dates that the amendment is targeted to. Ms. Mike.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm seconding this motion because it makes sense to call an early election. From what I heard from the federal Minister of Finance, the Honourable Paul Martin's budget speech a few days ago, our government will be getting very large funding cuts from Ottawa in the 1996-97 fiscal year. It will take time for our government to prepare for those cuts. Should we have a spring election, this will allow the new government enough time to properly plan and prepare for these funding cuts. Our government will not be able to make these kinds of cuts in a hurry. If we are to be fair and reasonable and, above all, be a responsible government, then we should allow the new government as much time as possible to decide how to handle the cuts so the impact can be minimal. I see no other way to do this but to have an election sooner rather than later. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you. To the amendment. Mr. Patterson.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I don't know whether I have the same interest in this matter as other Members since it's no secret that I'm not going to be running again for re-election, but I would like to reassure Mrs. Marie-Jewell that I'm looking forward to a life after politics and I'm not particularly stuck on serving out my term to the last hour.

I think I'm neutral on this issue. What I would like to remind Members is that we debated and discussed this matter at length at our Caucus workshop in Fort Smith last year. And, while I know it wasn't formally announced, Members did agree at that time that we considered the issue of a spring election and decided against it. I think many of us, as I have, have told our constituents -- who have been asking, and that's a lot of questions directed to sitting MLAs now when the election will be -- that it will be in the fall. I think we have to consider that there are other people out there who are considering running in the election this fall, perhaps running against some of us in this room. They are planning their lives and their personal commitments around this fall. I think this amendment, if it passes, will take them by surprise and it will be seen as an advantage to incumbents. That is going to be the reaction from some people. That's the reality.

The other point I'd like to make, Mr. Speaker, is we're not like jurisdictions where there are political parties and the government of the day can call an election as it deems appropriate. For better or for worse -- as Mrs. Marie-Jewell pointed out, I believe, in her remarks -- we have a four-year term set out in our constitution, which is the Northwest Territories Act. That is the law and it can only be abridged in extraordinary circumstances. In fact, as I understand the procedure -- since we have considered holding early elections over the years -- in this Assembly, we would only be able to hold an early election, as proposed in this amendment, if we got approval from the Governor-in-Council, the federal Cabinet. So, even if we were to approve this amendment -- which I will not be supporting for reasons I'll outline -- we would still have to persuade the federal government that there were extraordinary circumstances or reasons to call a spring election.

Now, as I understand from Mrs. Marie-Jewell, what she is suggesting is we have a fiscal crisis and that is one of the main reasons we should hold an early election. Can you imagine after Paul Martin's budget and after the reaction to it -- and it has been seen as changing irrevocably the nature of the federal government, and is going to result in the lay-offs of tens and thousands of public servants -- the Legislative Assembly of the Northwest Territories persuading the Government of Canada that there's a fiscal crisis that should provoke an election? If we're having a fiscal crisis that should provoke an election, then there should also be an election called in Canada because of the fiscal crises facing the Government of Canada.

---Applause

I don't know if that argument will go over big in Ottawa, Mr. Speaker, if we were to make it.

Mr. Speaker, I don't believe there is a justification on the basis of fiscal crisis. I think we need to pay attention to our fiscal situation, as we've done over the last three years. I, frankly, have every confidence that Mr. Pollard will continue to deal with the financial issues responsibly as he's done up to now. I think we have some work to complete in order to lay the ground so the new Assembly can deal responsibly with those fiscal issues. One of the things that we would have to deal with, I think, is balanced budget legislation. Another thing I would like to see us deal with is a thoughtful transition plan. And I would respectfully suggest to Mrs. Marie-Jewell that we are going to need a little more time than her amendment would allow if we are to do that work.

I have listened carefully to her arguments. I think part of her arguments are premised on the fact that new blood will better be able to tackle the current situation. I'm not sure that's true, Mr. Speaker. I believe that every legislature deals with pressing fiscal and other issues, and I would like to suggest that we have been given a mandate to represent our constituents and deal with the current issues of the day. We are not lame; we are alive and well. In fact, I would say we are in full flight. At the moment, we are tackling issues that are on the point of resolution.

Mrs. Marie-Jewell suggests that we need a new Finance Minister to finish the formula financing, that we need a new Energy, Mines...

Point of order, Mr. Speaker.

Mrs. Marie-Jewell, your point of order.

Point Of Order

Mr. Speaker, my point of order is that the Member is imputing motives which I did not suggest in my remarks. Thank you.

Mr. Patterson.

(Microphone turned off)

Can I have order, please. Mr. Patterson.

Mr. Speaker, I will withdraw the comments that were offensive, on the condition that Mrs. Marie-Jewell stops heckling me while I'm trying to speak.

---Laughter

---Applause

I would like to also remind the Members to speak to the amendment. Mr. Patterson, you are making a lot of statements with regard to the main motion. Can you try to speak to the amendment itself, because you will have the opportunity at some point to speak to the main motion. Mr. Patterson.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, what I infer from the arguments for an early election is that new players are required to deal with the current issues of the day: the formula financing negotiations, the mineral accord and other fiscal issues. I would like to suggest, Mr. Speaker, that if we don't have an early election, as suggested by the amendment, and we continue on, we will be relying on John Pollard who knows Paul Martin, on John Todd who knows Ron Irwin, and on Nellie Cournoyea who knows Jean Chretien, rather than on new players we don't know who will take some time to get up to speed.

Mr. Speaker, I think there's a downside to calling an early election this spring and the downside is we will have new players to deal with the formula financing negotiations, new players to deal with the northern mineral accord, and a new government to respond to the Nunavut Implementation Commission report in March. I feel much more comfortable that we will have a chance of resolving these critical issues based on the tremendous work that has been placed on dealing with them over the past three years. So, I think I agree that we should look at the interests of the people of the Northwest Territories. I don't know if the best interests of the people of the Northwest Territories are served by a sudden and surprising change of players. I agree we're dealing with critical issues. I don't know if it's time to change the coach, the quarterback and your key linebackers when you're coming up to the Grey Cup, Mr. Speaker.

One final comment. The Member for Thebacha referred to the by-election in Aivilik as being an expense that will be incurred if we don't have an early election. Mr. Speaker, I understand that the mayors of the three communities have advised the Premier that they will await the next election, that they're content to be represented through the good offices of the neighbouring MLA, the Honourable John Todd. So I'm not sure that this is a problem affecting that riding.

Furthermore, Mr. Speaker, the Member referred to the law respecting elections, requiring the Commissioner to issue a writ. I believe the Commissioner is required to issue a writ when a seat is declared vacant, but the law is not clear as to when that writ shall spell out an election. The writ could spell out a general election for the fall or a general election earlier.

So I don't think we need to get the issue of the seat in Aivilik mixed up in dealing with this amendment.

In conclusion, Mr. Speaker, I think this would be a sudden surprising unexpected development that would impede the resolution of some very critical issues, rather than enhance the resolution. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you. To the motion to amend. Mr. Dent.

No.

To the amendment, Mr. Ballantyne.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. First of all, I think it's healthy that we're having this debate here in the House and not in Caucus. Everybody gets to state their points. I think so far everybody for and against has had valid points. I've given this quite a bit of thought, not just this term but the last couple of terms that I've been part of this Assembly because we've had this debate in one form or another as long as I've been here. Normally, a year before, people agree that they'll have a fall election; then, as they get closer, some people don't want to; and then, we ultimately go back to a fall election.

There are a number of reasons for that. One is with all the pros and cons, the fall seems to be the most convenient time for the greater group of people to have an election. We've had this debate hundreds of times, but it normally comes back to the fall. That's the first point I want to make.

The second point I want to make is we have always gone, as long as I can remember, in four-year cycles. At least when I become an MLA and I vote for the Premier and vote for the Minister of Finance, I expect them to have that traditional four-year mandate to complete their tasks. I think that if we prematurely end that mandate, we're doing an unfair service to the government's opportunity to complete their task. I think you should really judge the government at the conclusion of their four years because, as we all know in politics, especially nowadays, some things take a long time, a lot of work, you have to get to know a lot of people. So a lot of things can happen in the last six months of a government's mandate.

I think arguments can be made on both sides about whether it's an advantage or a disadvantage for incumbents to have an early election or a late election. I think that many of my constituents would find an early election as a surprise and unfair. I'm sure there are a number of others who would say fine, go ahead with it. But I think the majority of my constituents are expecting a fall election because that's what we've had, and any opponents to any of the Yellowknife MLAs are gearing up with a fall election in mind.

Another point that I brought up in this House a number of times is the next government and Legislative Assembly are going to be operating under different parameters. I think the division agenda will drive the next Assembly. I think it's imperative that this government and this Legislative Assembly, for the remainder of their term, finalize as many of these agreements as they possibly can. I think it's going to be more difficult for the next government, with the division agenda driving the Assembly.

I won't go through all the different items on the government's agenda but my colleagues have talked about a northern accord and I think a northern accord is key. I think there is absolutely no chance of getting a northern accord before this summer. Even though the chances after the summer are problematic, at least we have a chance, if we have a fall election, to have a northern accord. There's no doubt in my mind that our Finance Minister will be able to get a formula financing agreement by the summer and I think it would be very unfortunate if the next government came in -- if we had an early election -- without a formula financing agreement in place.

As Mr. Patterson has said, nowadays, without a party system our government really depends on personal contacts with the power brokers in Ottawa. Mr. Pollard has a personal relationship now with Mr. Martin, the Premier has the same with the Prime Minister and it would take months, if not a year or more, for the next Government Leader and Finance Minister to establish the same sort of contacts.

Mr. Speaker, this is just a list of issues that the Financial Management Board Secretariat are trying to do by the summer. They want to: finalize the development and implementation of a GNWT human resource planning strategy in the summer of 1995; implement a pilot employee assistance program in the summer of 1995; complete the consultation process and review of the affirmative action policy in the summer of 1995; review the sexual harassment policy by the fall of 1995; complete a review of the management framework for grants and contributions by the fall of 1995; develop an GNWT informatics plan in accordance with the GNWT informatics strategy by the fall of 1995; develop program evaluation standards in the summer of 1995; and, develop and pilot a new results measurement and reporting approach in the fall of 1995.

I think it's really important that all of these initiatives, which have taken months and sometimes years to develop, get finalized. Because we all know what happens, a new government comes in, there are new priorities and all of this work could be lost. I think it's very, very important that this government is given the time to complete the tasks they have worked on for the last three and a half years. I, for one, think we should stick to our tradition of having an election in the fall, and I will not support this amendment. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you. To the amendment. Mr. Pudluk.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a brief comment to the amendment. This amendment is one that I will not support either; my reasons being, having an early election by June 12th will cause people to rush around, both the people who will vote and the people who have to get ready to be elected. I know we have been looking at a fall election and my people understand already that the intent is to hold an election in the fall of 1995. People have already accepted that.

If we try to make it different now and change it to June, it is obvious, at least in my constituency and in the surrounding communities, that half of the communities' population will not be in the settlements -- in October, people start returning to the communities -- and people who are out on the land for traditional activities won't be able to be contacted by telephone. So, they wouldn't even be able to vote by proxy. Although they could do it this way: you could use the XBX CBs. In the western Arctic, they're called bush radios. This would be the only way that it could be publicized and people would know who got elected. Even though when you vote, you do it by secret ballot.

Furthermore, the people who are out on the land for recreation or for vacation are taking their holidays and they will be included in the Baffin South MLA's constituency. You could also contact the people by helicopter and bring the ballot box around, but that would be very costly. Because of the difficulties that are occurring, this government is well into the work they have to do and they can continue to pave the way for the work they have to complete. The amendment is one that I will not support because of these reasons. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you. To the amendment. Mr. Antoine.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. (Translation) I'm going to be talking in my native language. There is a proposal now to have an election this spring, on June 12th. That is okay, however, I don't agree with it. So for that reason I am not going to be voting in favour of this.

When I visited the communities I told people that the election will be this fall. By that date it would be exactly four years we've been here, and I had already told them that and now they are saying something different. I wanted to raise this because I don't agree with it. The reason I am saying this is because when we are elected, we are elected for four years and we sit here on behalf of all the people who voted for us. The Ministers and the MLAs are elected for four years.

We have heard the budget report from the federal government and our funding is cut dramatically, by at least $58 million. They informed us that they are not giving us the usual amount. The message we recevied is very serious. A great deal of work has been done to priorize the funding cuts and where and how this money will be spent. Our Finance Minister is familiar with people from Ottawa and has worked well with them. Our leader, Nellie, also works well with the Prime Minister, and some Ministers here know the Ministers from Ottawa. We have received a very important message about our budget and if we have to change things because of this, I think the Ministers here who are familiar with the federal Ministers should be the ones to work on our budget. If we have a spring election and we get new elected Members in here and new elected Ministers put in place, it will be like starting all over. They won't be familiar with the Ministers from Ottawa.

Now we are talking about working towards a new government, they call it the transition plan and they asked the government to develop legislation for us. They told us that they would do this for us, but are able to get on it only this summer. They are also working on a lot of other issues. Ottawa is working with all the different provinces. So for this reason if we hold an election before they work out a transition plan for a new government, and we get new elected Members working before this plan, I think things will get very difficult.

I really don't mind when the elections are held, however, I had already told my constituents that after four years an election will be held in the fall. For that reason, this motion before us saying to have an election this spring in June, I'm not going to be voting in favour of this. Thank you.