This is page numbers 623 - 657 of the Hansard for the 14th Assembly, 4th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was chairman.

Topics

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi. Mr. Roland.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think the idea of pulling the Energy Secretariat and putting it in another area would be news, and to see where it would go would be interesting as well. One of the areas, and again it goes to the $550,000, devolution of government structures of $250,000.

I can understand the devolution portion, but one thing I have a concern with is, and again it goes back to the self-government and land claims tables. If we use Nunavut as an example, we tried to ensure that the federal government would pay their portion when it came to the development of Nunavut and so on. Is there a plan in the sense of ensuring that the federal government will reimburse our government in this section or is it a good-will gesture, so to speak, from this government? Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 654

The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Mr. Handley.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Joe Handley

Joe Handley Weledeh

Mr. Chairman, referring to this $550,000 -- or the $330,000 basically is what it is, for the Intergovernmental Forum, that is a GNWT contribution. We have a stake in this. We are a partner in this. We are not expecting that the federal government would pay us back that amount of money. We do have a clear understanding though that any incremental costs that occur as we get into self-government, but that is a different matter, that would be picked up by the federal government. This money is our investment in the exercise. Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 654

The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Roland.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Is this the nature of the work, that this style is considered very preliminary in the sense that it is not considered to be incremental costs? Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 654

The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Mr. Handley.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Joe Handley

Joe Handley Weledeh

Mr. Chairman, I think there are two things. One is, as we have said and as the Premier has explained as well, that part of it is helping aboriginal governments establish their capacity and their structure, how they are going to deal with devolution and resource revenue sharing. Part of it as well is helping us to understand what our relationship is with them on those two areas of devolution and resource revenue sharing. Certainly this is considered to be money that is being invested by this government in achieving the devolution, revenue resource sharing and the establishment of some sort of management regime to manage those initiatives. Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley. We are on Executive, operations expenditures, not previously authorized, Cabinet Secretariat, $1,400,000. Agreed?

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Agreed. We will go to Executive, operations expenditures, Financial Management Board Secretariat. Mr. Bell.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Brendan Bell

Brendan Bell Yellowknife South

Thank you. In the area of the directorate, the $800,000 for research, I am wondering if the Minister can indicate how much of that has been spent to date and whether the majority of that has gone to southern or northern firms, and whether primarily it was sole-sourced or competitively bid? Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Mr. Handley.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Joe Handley

Joe Handley Weledeh

Mr. Chairman, approximately $600,000 has been spent. I will ask Mr. Voytilla to give us the breakdown of those expenditures. Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Voytilla.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Voytilla

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The spending to date, and I would note that this is a special warrant because this work was urgently required, has been to Capital West Partners, $59,000 for economic feasibility studies; to a consultant in Fort Smith, Mr. Francois Paulette, to assist us in our work with the South Slave leadership on the hydro project; to Mr. Norm Olson, to work with us on the transmission line issues, $7,000; to Mr. Peter Lougheed, to assist us with the overall strategic planning and interprovincial issues that are associated with hydro development, about $16,000; to McLennan Ross, a local legal firm here, to work with us on the regulatory, taxation and corporate structuring aspects of hydro development, most of it specific to the potential for Taltson River development, which was part of the recommendations in the initial electrical review report. That is about $140,000. Most of that work was undertaken by their southern offices who have the taxation and the corporate structuring and legal expertise necessary to do the work.

There was money paid to Snowman Communications, about $70,000, with respect to the development of communications strategy and materials. There was $5,900 paid to the Manitoba Trade and Investments for the Government of the Northwest Territories share of the east-west transmission study grid, which was a joint interprovincial study that all the provinces and territories participated in.

There was $100,000 paid to Mr. Dave Morrison and Associates, who was one of the consultants who worked on the initial electrical review. This was to complete the public consultation and the resulting restructuring or adjustments to their recommendations on the electrical review study and to further the work on the hydro research. To Mr. Jim Robertson, about $90,000 for additional work on both the electrical review study and the hydro work. Mr. Fred Abbott, $43,000 for further work on the electrical review recommendations and on the hydro financing.

Those are some of the contracts that have been raised. Many of them are northern. Some of them are southern because of the type of expertise that was required on the project.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Floyd Roland

Thank you Mr. Voytilla. Mr. Bell.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Brendan Bell

Brendan Bell Yellowknife South

Thank you. Mr. Voytilla listed off quite a number of contracts and some $600,000 worth of work. I am wondering if the Minister can indicate if there is any of it that was not sole-sourced?

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Floyd Roland

Thank you Mr. Bell. Mr. Handley.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Joe Handley

Joe Handley Weledeh

Mr. Chairman, I believe that all of this was sole-sourced. I might add that we contracted with Mr. Robertson as a follow-up to the work that he had done on the electrical generation study.

The information and the advice we needed was very technical. As Mr. Voytilla has pointed out, a lot of it -- in fact, most of it is not available in the Northwest Territories. We relied on Mr. Robertson's expertise to give us advice on where we could turn for the best advice. We were also committed to reviewing hydro potential at all of the aboriginal assemblies over the summer. We were working in a fairly tight time frame to get good advice before we went out and did presentations to aboriginal communities. Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Floyd Roland

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Bell.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Brendan Bell

Brendan Bell Yellowknife South

This is why I did get into the criteria earlier in question period to the Premier and wanted to talk about the criteria for sole-sourcing. It can be urgently required, but it also has to be injurious to the public interest, whatever that means. I suppose this is all very subjective. We could suggest that just about everything that we do is urgent.

In any case, I do not want to go through all of these contracts. I just want to maybe pick one and have the Minister give me an example as to the criteria used. What is the sole-source explanation for using McLennan Ross as the barristers and solicitors for the $140,000 worth of work? If the Minister could give me detail on the sole-source explanation. Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Floyd Roland

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Mr. Handley.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Joe Handley

Joe Handley Weledeh

Mr. Chairman, we are confident that these sole-sourced contracts fit within the intent of the sole-sourcing guidelines. First of all, on the urgency one, we had an opportunity last summer. We continue to have that opportunity, I believe, to take advantage of the energy crisis that is being faced in North America, both on electrical and also on the gas.

In this case, we were looking at the hydroelectric potential of the North. There is a federal energy reference committee that is doing work. We wanted to ensure that the rest of Canada knew that we had this huge potential here worth hundreds of millions of dollars annually.

So in terms of urgency, I believe that there was an urgency and certainly a public interest in having good work done urgently.

In terms of capability, we went to the best sources of information. We had to get answers very quickly. Some of the specific work that we were looking at, for example, the Taltson work, was deemed to be urgent by the South Slave leadership. It was not only us but some of the leadership who are looking at these issues felt that there was an urgency to carry on with this. Thank you.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Floyd Roland

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Bell.