Thank you, Mr. Krutko, Mr. Handley.

Mr. Chairman, three of the individuals did most of the work on the power generation study. That study was completed at about the end of December, December 2000. In about March, it became very clear to us that there was an opportunity for us to look at our hydro potential and make that known as part of the bigger picture, what was happening across Canada and the United States. The same individuals were used.

I would have to look back at the exact dates, but roughly in March, looking at the Taltson River system and the potential that was there to have hydro provided to the south, particularly to Fort McMurray. From then on, we went on with looking at the complete picture of the hydro potential in the Northwest Territories.

So this was an extension. It was using the same individuals because of the work they had done and the expertise they have. I do not know what more I can say on that, Mr. Chairman. It was an opportunity to do it. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. You mentioned Taltson Dam. That is existing infrastructure that is in place now. Was that the focus of this review? What is the possibility of considering new initiatives?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Mr. Handley.

Mr. Chairman, in the case of the Taltson, there is some hydro generation there of roughly 20 megawatts. This was looking at the whole potential of the Taltson River, which would be closer to 200 megawatts. It is a fairly substantial expansion of that project.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Krutko.

With regard to these major investments that we are making looking at this strategy, is there any idea of when we may see some returns on our investment, when we actually see power flowing south and somebody picking up the bill for this?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Mr. Handley.

Mr. Chairman, hydro potential is a fairly long-term investment and a long-term project, when you consider the environmental reviews one has to go through. A lot of when we would see returns would depend on how quickly aboriginal leadership are ready to move ahead with projects. My guess would be that if we started working on the Taltson system today, we would probably be looking at five years from now to see a return. I think we are going to see a return gradually over the next 20 to 25 years as many of the potential sites in the Territories are developed. That is long term. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. That is the other concern I have. A lot of these plans and initiatives are activated in the life of this cycle, where we have two more years to go. You are talking about something becoming a reality, in this case, five years down the road. With new governments and new social issues and problems we see as legislators, we have a deficit situation and the case where the government has to review its priorities. Something that is long term usually does not see the light of day or it is going through a study or review. A lot of the studies and reviews by this government, a lot of money was spent. Consultants and lawyers made a lot of good dough on this review but at the end of it all, it does not bear any efforts to implement these studies.

From someone who has had to deal with social problems in our communities, you cannot cut it in regards to selling us on something when we know that money could be spent better with regard to helping with the day-to-day problems in the Northwest Territories and dealing with people problems. The infrastructure in a lot of our communities could probably use a lot of these dollars.

My view is that it is a great idea but if we are doing something that is going to exceed the life of this Assembly, we should try to implement things we know we can implement within the time frame that we have. We should cut back on the studies, knowing they are not getting us anywhere.

It is a great idea but the timing is just not right. I would like to know why we are spending money on these studies and reviews, knowing it is just going to continue to cost us more money. We do have to bear the financial light we are under right now. We realize that a lot of these mega-projects, as we know it, especially as the Government of the Northwest Territories, where we depend on our resources from Ottawa, probably will not bear fruit from this government because we cannot afford to establish a couple of billion-dollar projects as we are looking at here.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Mr. Handley.

Mr. Chairman, we have to keep a balance, as I said before, between the immediate needs we have and the long-term opportunities we have. The first diamond mine took us eight years before we saw diamond production. The gas pipeline is probably going to take us six or seven years from when we started to when we will see the benefits of a pipeline. So at the same time -- and I don't want to understate the importance of the short-term immediate needs people have -- we have to continue to look at long-term investment opportunities. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Nitah.

Thank you, Mr. Nitah. Mr. Handley.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Certainly one of the major steps we have to undertake is to continue the consultation with aboriginal leaders. I was on the phone with a leader today talking about one of the projects. I intend to meet with a number of them who are interested as soon as there is time to do it. So the continued discussion with the aboriginal leadership on how this can be developed is an essential step. We continue on with that without delay.

The second is, as the Premier has said, a need to look at the structure, how we are doing this. Certainly we have included funding for the next year, but we need to look at if there is a more efficient, more effective, more coordinated way of undertaking this. So internally, we have to look at our own structures as well.

I would say, Mr. Chairman, that ongoing consultation is the most immediate need right now. Aboriginal leaders are asking us to meet with them soon and I want to carry through with that. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Mr. Nitah.

Thank you, Mr. Nitah. Mr. Handley.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Certainly I will take that up with the South Slave leadership and the Member and others who are interested. If there is a will to do that, then I would be interested. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Ms. Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just want to put on record a few points because I have been advised by officials that I am not able to move a motion to delete $1 million out of a special warrant.

I do believe that this is an abuse of process in terms of what is meant for special warrant spending. I have always been under the understanding that it is for emergency spending. Every indication from what the Minister is saying here is that this is something that is ongoing; this is something that government sees as a potential area. I think there is a big question there as to whether or not a big portion of the money should have been spent before it was appropriated and that it should be put forward in the amount of $1 million as a special warrant.

Mr. Chairman, we have a department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development. As we are well aware, we know that Minister Handley is responsible for various projects. There was no way of knowing for us that he was undertaking this task under the authority of FMBS. We approved PYs for hundreds and hundreds of people. We have in the Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development hundreds of people. They have PR persons. They have communications advisors. They have oil and gas experts. They have energy people. We fund all that.

We have recently created an Energy Secretariat and the money that goes with it. It came as a total surprise to us that there was a totally separate project under hydro strategy and that all this money is spent.

Mr. Chairman, it is very annoying and it is misleading to say that if you support it and if you support revenue initiatives for this government in the long term and if you have a vision and if you believe in aboriginal consultation with aboriginal leaders, then you have to agree to the $1 million. I do not agree with that.

I travelled all of the assemblies this summer. I do not believe that I had a $1 million budget. I believe the Ministers here have access to all aboriginal leaders by phone at any time. They could meet. The government funds some of these aboriginal assemblies as well, portions of it, anyway.

It is really, really troublesome, Mr. Chairman.

For the Minister to say that we have been consulted all along is not entirely correct, Mr. Chairman. We would not be saying all that we are saying here if that was case, that we were well advised of what the government has been doing all along. We were not. If the consultation means that money gets allocated, sole contracts be given out, and all the road trips take place, then afterwards, if the Minister is just going to come and tell us "You have to approve $1 million because we have all spent it," I do not believe that is the true meaning of consultation.

I am also troubled by unequal treatment of sorts of Cabinet Ministers here. I cannot remember all of the initiatives and strategies, but I believe Minister Ootes had to do a somersault and jump sideways to get his Literacy Strategy for $1.2 million. We consulted through that process to death. Whether it is Social Agenda or anything else, all the other Ministers have to consult with the Members and have us included in the process. I find this to be a process where we have our hands tied and we are not allowed to do anything about it but to rubber stamp them.

Mr. Chairman, this is really a long-term project and I would not accept anyone suggesting that any reservation that I may have about this is due to my lack of vision or because I cannot see past my nose.

Mr. Chairman, there is a huge question about priority of the investment dollars. We do not have the money to strew around all over the place. The oil and gas project on its own is a humongous project. It is a $6 billion project. It is a project that we cannot manage without the involvement of multinational corporations. By all accounts, the hydro project will be a hundred times bigger than oil and gas.

There is a limit to what this government can do. I would really encourage the Premier and the Cabinet Ministers, when they get together at the end of the week, to really hunker down and think about how they are going to spend their money. We cannot be all things to all people. We cannot have our shops opened up and spread so thin that we are just feeding the industry of consultants. I do not mean in any way that people who are working on this project -- I am not questioning their work or their integrity. However, I think Minister Handley and Cabinet should look at all of the strategies and initiatives in energy related areas.

I am still very confused about where the Energy Secretariat fits in and where this project fits in. To me, that is all to do with energy. We did a strategic and operational review of the Public Utilities Board. Mr. Robertson did a study on electrical generation. I do not know what came out of that at the moment.

We have the Arctic Energy Alliance doing work for various departments. We have energy and utilities support programs under Public Works and Services. We have a fuel rebate. We have millions of things happening and I am hoping that at the end of this process, the Energy Secretariat or somebody that makes sense will take this over and have some focus and a focused message about what it is this government is trying to do.

Another question there is we do not even own this hydro project. I appreciate that there is a lot that needs to be done but I do not think this government can be accused of not doing consultation with aboriginal leaders. I think that is a red herring. We have very close relationships with aboriginal leaders on all fronts.

I think this has a lot to do with devolution and resource revenue sharing and prioritizing. It could very well be dealt with on the agenda for the Intergovernmental Forum or something, a lot of different things.

I hope that the Minister takes this as a very strong notice that a majority of the Members on this side are highly agitated and irritated. We do not see this sort of schizophrenic energy initiative and secretariat and policy and strategies and everything else. I think I have said what I wanted to say. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.