Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, again, we are looking at trying to get units in place in Inuvik, Norman Wells and Fort Simpson. Again, the Inuvik Petroleum Show is coming up here in the next couple of months. That means getting it up to Inuvik, setting it up and I guess we will figure it out then exactly how they've met the transportation logistics of getting it from Calgary to Inuvik over the winter road and whatnot. So we are looking at doing that at this petroleum show; if not, the next one. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Pokiak.

Thank you. If I could go back to what Mr. Yakeleya was talking about earlier about the Trades Access Program, earlier the Minister indicated that ATCO are looking at roughly 70 people to go down to Calgary. I'm just wondering if the Minister can elaborate a little more in regard to whose costs for travel for these people, the accommodations, and are they geared towards the graduate students, or are they looking towards high school students? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Pokiak. Mr. Minister.

In regards to the ATCO, 70 people. They're short 70 people in their plant right today just to meet the orders that they require, and they are looking for people with different skills in regards to trade skills and also they are looking at people in regards to labour skills, also. Again, it's for anyone who wants to move to Calgary or whatnot and sit down in regards to different companies from ATCO's structure and looking at ATCO Frontec and other companies that they do work with. Again, it's something we're working on to see if we can develop a training program, get people interested and see if they're willing to stay in the South, work in the plant for a number of months or whatnot, come north and do the conversions. Again, this is an employment opportunity that's out there if anybody wants to take it.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Pokiak.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I'm just wondering about who will pay the costs for the individual to actually fly down to Calgary, find a home to stay down there. Will ATCO take care of the cost, or will the Housing Corporation be responsible for the cost of it? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Pokiak. Mr. Minister.

No, Mr. Chair, that cost will have to be burdened by the individual that wants the job. Again, they can go to ECE or Human Resources Canada to see if there's dollars there to transfer them to a job opportunity, relocation costs by way of those programs that we already have in place. So there are departments and programs out there for that. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Pokiak.

Thank you, Mr. Pokiak. Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, again, it's an opportunity if anyone wants it to put an application in with ATCO and they see you're qualified, call them up and if they want to hire you and fly

you down there, it's their cost, if a person wants to make that arrangement. But, I think, like I don't want to confuse the other aspect of the human resource program that we're trying to develop with them because that is to develop the skills we're going to need to do the conversions in the communities and we want to identify people in the communities that are able to do the conversions, but give them the basic skills they're going to need to do these conversions. That will happen prior to us doing the conversions at the end of the project. So that's something we're developing with them. It's not in place right now. We are working on it, we're having discussions on it, but again, I don't want to confuse the issue with the 70 jobs that are available at ATCO right now and what we're doing by way of developing a human resource plan to deal with the human resources we're going to need to do the conversion. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Before I go on -- I've got Mr. Braden and Mrs. Groenewegen -- I just wanted to mention one thing and that is we spend a tremendous amount of time, I'm as guilty as anybody on spending time on Novel, it's not included in spending in the budget and if I could as committee if we've got a specific ask of the Housing Corporation in terms of the Novel project and where it's going and what we'd see I'd like to suggest that we make that ask and we move on with our budget deliberations. I've got Mr. Braden next. Mr. Braden.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I believe I'm going to try to satisfy your suggestion. Indeed, the discussion has covered a lot of ground here and I'd like to put two asks before committee before the Housing Corporation on this to see if we can move it along. The first one, Mr. Chairman, relates to an aspect of this that Ms. Lee was talking about just a little while ago, and that is the verification, the testing of this concept and of the negotiations that are underway, and as the Minister says, have yet to be finalized. I think it is quite reasonable for the Minister to say look, we're still considering this, the corporation is not at the point yet where it has something to put forward for real tangible consideration, but it will get there and I'm anticipating relatively soon, or within the next fiscal year.

Mr. Chair, I think, to my satisfaction anyway, we've probed the idea enough. We have advised the corporation of where many of our essential concerns are and my ask of the corporation is that when it gets to the stage when the planning committee, that is CMHC, ATCO, the Housing Corporation, whoever else, when this committee deems that negotiations have reached a certain point where it needs to be aired that absolutely it comes before committee, but also at that stage that it cooperate with a third party fully independent, feasibility review of many aspects of this project, a lot of which have already been aired here. I've been making a bit of a list, Mr. Chair, and I would suggest the things I want to see in that third party review would cover the technical, engineering and financial risks and benefits, the lands issues, energy and operating costs over the life expectancy. Market suitability, Mr. Chairman, are these units really going to meet the demands and be flexible and versatile enough for our needs? It is essential that we look at market disruption. Having this many units come into our market in such a short period of time is going to create a huge wave of some kind both before and after the units are delivered. What will that impact be? The other aspect -- and I'm going to come back to it -- is northern manufacturing. So that's my first ask, Mr. Chair, is that a third party feasibility study, which, as Ms. Lee said, is standard process for virtually every kind of initiative we undertake that this be done and that it be considered an integral part of the planning process and the cost, which I suggest Mr. Chair should be assumed by the Executive or maybe ITI, but I want to see it separated from the corporation and any of the parties that have a vested interest. Let me stop there. Is that a realistic ask and I'd suggest a conclusion on that point that we don't need an answer today. If you want to consider that and come back to us at some point during our deliberations that's fine.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Mr. Minister.

I can't commit to that today, but I will definitely report back to the committee once we have the findings from the other committee to make the presentation to whichever committee it's going to be, the AOC, Social Programs or whatever, but I think that in order to allow for an understanding of where they're going, I think that the technical committee that is in place right now should be the one doing the presentation to the committee by way of AOC or Social Programs. I do commit to that because they're the ones that are dealing with all the numbers, they know all the facts. Also, in regards to the independent review, I don't have a problem with that. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Braden.

The independent review, that was the critical part of the ask. The second one that I would like to put forward, and for me this is an absolute, this is not a negotiable aspect, I would need to know to what extent, not if, but to what extent this project, this initiative, will result in a permanent northern manufacturing increment that will be part of the legacy of this project. Mr. Chairman, for something the size and the significance of this, to us to even begin to think that we should entertain this while all of the labour, all of the manufacturing, all of the material, supplies are going to be vested in a Calgary factory is unacceptable. There must be some northern manufacturing component to this. The other aspect that I think that we need to consider is that housing is ever present, it's ongoing and if this Novel project and the concept and the economies are such a good idea, then why don't we create something that is going to be sustainable on the ground here in the Northwest Territories and our sister community to the south in Hay River I would even go so far as to say that is the natural place for it.

Will you bring us as part of your plan a northern manufacturing component?

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. We are looking at all the alternatives that are out there and one of them is looking at the options and the opportunities that will spin up from this project. So we are already, like the Member from Hay River mentioned, we are already in discussion with the business community in Hay River and

which it's ATCO that's the one that's basically talking to the business community. Basically through our review of the total program, once we do the assessment, that as long as there is no additional cost to ourselves or the product at the end of the day, I don't see why we can't do it. We're already doing it. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Braden.