Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Krutko.

It is social housing with regard to people with moderate incomes, which is people at the lower income range. It is more structured towards those people.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Mr. Ramsay.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I know earlier in the questioning the Minister had said anyone over the age of 50, but again, where is the list of clients? If it is a seniors' complex and was being referred to as a seniors' complex, and I know the Hay River Seniors' Society is involved in the project, then why are you including the word "senior" in this complex at all? What's the real story here, Mr. Chairman?

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. It is getting pretty confusing, but it is a proposal that's being developed with the seniors' society in Hay River and a private company. We have not seen the proposal. The final proposal has not been given to us. We have not seen that proposal, so we're sort of speculating on a lot of these things. Until we see the final proposal, then we will basically have to assess it. But right now there is no final proposal. Again, they said they're going to go back, take another look at it and then get back to us. We haven't seen anything.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Mr. Ramsay.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think the Minister gets the point that I've been trying to make, and that is that I think it's important that everything is looked at prior to $450,000 of public money going into a project that, you know, whether or not it's supposed to be a seniors' complex or not is anybody's best guess right now because I don't think the Minister even knows that. I'll leave that there, Mr. Chairman, if I could.

I don't want to have to get back on the list, so I'm going to switch gears here a little bit and talk about something that's actually been the topic of discussion here, the Novel housing proposal with ATCO Structures. I'm in the same mind as my colleague, Mrs. Groenewegen, on this. I'm supportive of the overall concept and what it means in terms of housing and the availability of housing here in the Northwest Territories. But just for the record -- and I know the Minister doesn't have to answer this and I'm just going to comment on this -- I agree wholeheartedly with my

colleagues that any and every business opportunity that is available to northern businesses has to be taken. When you're talking about a project of the magnitude of what's being proposed, I think it's absolutely necessary that the government go out there and try to drum up as much business and support for this project as it can and where you're going to get that support is from the business community. I'd encourage you to do that.

The other thing I want to mention about this project is, and it's similar to that of the seniors' complex, in that the seniors' complexes get built in communities and nobody ever moves into them. I'm glad to hear that there are some residents in some of them now, but I think the Housing Corporation has to go out there and try to identify people who are going to purchase these units and people who are going to move into them and try to make that distinction of what's going to be a homeownership unit and what's going to end up being public housing. I think that, to me, is a very important aspect of this. It can't be overlooked. The earlier that the Housing Corporation or agents of the Housing Corporation can get out there into all the communities where these units are going to be located, and start identifying family X, Y and Z that are going to be able to purchase these units, the better off you'll be in the long run. I think that work has to start almost immediately, and that's how that project's going to be sold.

I don't have as much reservation on it as some of my colleagues. I'm in support of it. I've seen the conceptual design of it. I've been in the factory in Calgary when we were down there for an oil and gas conference. I've seen the finished product, and I do think that it will address the housing shortage in the near term and in the long term here in the Northwest Territories. So I'm encouraged by what I see there, but again, it's with some caution here that we have to go about this and make sure we do all of our homework at the front end so that we don't get the big nightmare at the end. I'd like to end with that, Mr. Chairman. Thank you very much.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Krutko, would you like to comment?

I'd like to thank the Member for his support, but I'd also like to recognize the issues the Member raised because it is very prudent that we do our legwork. We do realize that we have to understand what the logistical issues are going to be. We have six years before we look at possibly taking ownership of this concept, but I think we do have a lot of legwork to do. We have to get into the communities; we have to talk to the business community; we have to also talk to the different departments who will be involved, such as MACA and the Power Corporation and other sectors of our economy. Also the business community is crucial, because the business community, at the end of the day, have to be aware of these opportunities that will come by way of these conversions after the pipeline project is over, and hopefully the companies that do work on the pipeline will be able to take advantage of these opportunities close to the communities, or in the communities, so that they can have work after the pipeline project is over.

Again, I'd just like to thank the Member for his question. I definitely agree with the Member's questions, and we have to do due diligence in regards to how we proceed, and we do have to be prepared at the front end. We do have six years to do this, but again, we do have to involve a lot of people out there. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Mr. Ramsay.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, we have thought of that. Also, we are talking to different people that are involved in marketing and selling of houses and whatnot. So we are open to any proposals, or request for proposals, from anyone out there to look at that business opportunity.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Next I have Mr. Yakeleya.

Mr. Chairman, on the Novel manufactured homes, the Minister is looking at a percentage of...and I support Mrs. Groenewegen and Mr. Ramsay in terms of getting the most benefits out of this deal, a stage in the Northwest Territories. Is the Minister now, to date, can he say that through the amount of training, employment, supplies or things that are going to be benefit the communities in the Northwest Territories, the regions, a percentage of employment is going to certainly come out of this for the Northwest Territories. There's a level that we have to maintain; training or suppliers in the North that are going to supply these readjustments of these manufactured homes into homes that they're going to sell in the communities.

What I guess I wanted to ask, Mr. Chair, is how soon...It's only seven years away, or eight years. How soon are we going to start seeing people from our region going down to ATCO and to the schools? I mean, there's no plans enforced. He talks about training programs. When he says there is training available, what's in the community now to say yes, we should get some people, especially the young population in my region, up and running and to take these training programs. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, Mr. Chairman, I have been talking with the Minister of Education, and we do have a few pilot projects that we have been working on in high schools and that, at Smith, Hay River and Fort Providence, in which I was looking at trying to expand those to other regions so that we can put them in other high schools to offer trade access programs in our high schools so that in six years we'd get these up and going, we will have people interested in the trades.

People have some skills in regards to carpentry, plumbing or with those different trades. But I think it's important that we identify those young people now -- they are in our high schools -- and work them into the trades area so that in six years those students that are now in grade 8 or 9 will be able to take advantage of not only the pipeline opportunity, but an opportunity to basically do these conversions in our communities. Then that's where we see the benefit of this project taking hold, it's in the community by way of site development work in regards to the work that's going to be needed in regards to the transportation from where these camps are going to be located into our communities. So there's an opportunity for trucking companies. Also looking at the whole area of the conversion itself. Like I said, we are working on a proposal to develop a training component of the total proposal so we can be able to...

(Microphone turned off)...but the power's gone out. We might have to take a short break here at the moment so they can get everything restarted for recording purposes. Thank you.

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Thank you. We can resume the Committee of the Whole meeting after a short break. I understand that Mr. Yakeleya was up for now. He was asking about the Trades Access Program and how it will affect the communities without programs. Maybe I can ask Mr. Yakeleya to continue. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Going back to the training again, our people in the North here train for these amount of manufactured homes that are going to be converted into liveable homes in our communities. We have a young population in my region. Even as of 2004, kids 10 to 14, there are 280 kids. Children or youth from 15-24, there are 383. There is well over 600 youth in my region from that age. I am asking in terms of the trade access. There is a small part that will go to trades. There are going to be other job opportunities. Getting these units into our region, like I say, Little Chicago is going to have a big camp there and modifying some of those units into our communities. I support the concept to meet to get on to an action plan right now, today as we speak, in terms of having these trades access programs into our communities. Even ATCO, we haven't seen anything from ATCO saying, are we too far in advance to have that kind of discussion to identify some people in our region in the North that would go down into Calgary, or are there some other things hinging on the deal? I am speaking in general, Mr. Chair, without much information in terms of these manufactured homes.

I have one more question after that, Mr. Chair.

Mahsi, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, before the break, I did mention that we are trying these different access trades programs in the high schools in Fort Resolution, Hay River and Fort Providence. I think it is important that we are working with Education to see how we can expand the trades programs. Again, we have been talking to ATCO and also other companies we are working with to identify training as one of the components of our business relationships. I think it is also important that there is real opportunity, especially in the small communities, for going into the trades program because of the number of duties that it provides. Even at ATCO's request, they are looking for 70 people right now. They were asking us if we knew anybody in the North who is willing to go to Calgary and work in the plant. I think there are companies in the same scenario. I think it is important that we do work on this, but I think, for ourselves, even as a Housing Corporation, we realize we need a lot of people even in our local housing operations, people with the different trades tickets, from carpenters to electricians. We do have to work with communities, with the different departments, Education, and basically formulate some program that we can work on to ensure that young people are able to get into the trades, but also given the skills that they will require to get them there.

We are committed to expand the Trades Access Program. I mentioned it in my community visits. I have mentioned it to committees that we are looking at expanding the program that we presently have in Hay River to other high schools in the territory and to offer this as an opportunity for the high schools to provide such a program in regards to the Trades Access Program. In order to meet the demands, we are looking at in the future. I think we have to get to the younger people in our high schools and our communities and offer them an alternative to business opportunities which includes trades.

We are open to that. We have been talking to community leaders and different educators. Again, that opportunity is there and it is there for the taking. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Yakeleya.