Thank you, Mr. Chairman. With me today I have, on my right, Debbie DeLancey, the deputy minister of Municipal and Community Affairs, and Laura Gareau is on my left, who is the director of Corporate Affairs.

Thank you,

Mr. McLeod. I will now open it up to general comments. Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Just with respect to MACA, I’m glad to see they’re before us here in Committee of the

Whole. Some general comments are that over the last couple of weeks I must have given the House about 30 petitions, and I think about 29 of them were MACA-related. Many of the petitions there were related to the sports, youth and recreation and the community development positions that MACA had slated to delete.

I’m very pleased to see that MACA and the ministry were very responsive. I’d also commend all the people from my riding, my community, who took the effort to take pen to hand and write their signatures on the petitions. In some small way they had an effect on how the department was going to decide these positions. They did take the time to say, “Okay, well maybe” and revisit the fact that the regional recreation coordinator positions are very important and play a significant role in our communities and our regions. They’ve decided to keep them.

With the delivery of sport, recreation and youth programs in our region, I do have to say that there’s one component of that department that was not addressed when people filed their petitions with me. In my riding we have a youth worker. The intent was to save the sports and rec department. When I

travel to the communities, these front-line positions are in the communities delivering the sports, rec and youth programming, which is very important to the people — well, it is very important to government too.

How we’re going to deliver those programs…. I do not believe we’re going to deliver them from headquarters, which seemed was going to happen at first. I’d just like to say, the youth position is still very important in my riding and I think in all the regions too.

I believe the youth component of our sports and recreation cannot be set aside and revisited at a later date. I think we’ve got a continuous momentum. We’re attributing dollars to youth programming. I know that MACA and the government stated it time and time again in our vision and mission statements that youth is very, very important. To not have anybody deliver those programs, what kind of message are we sending?

As we deliberate youth programs in our communities in Committee of the Whole, I’ll be working toward getting a motion from this side of the House to help the Minister of MACA work toward getting the youth position reinstated and, even in the upcoming budgeting plans, providing youth workers in our other regions. There’s lots of value in that. With that, I’ll leave that subject alone for now.

One of the new issues for me is — and I just brought it up recent the other day; I think it was in question period — the quality and type of water in our water reservoirs in small communities. Our residents from two of my six communities so far are very concerned about the quality of water. I know we’re making strides in addressing that. But for me, it’s a standard. Some of the water’s really discoloured. They’re saying it’s safe, but if you’re getting discoloured water put in front of you there, you question the quality of it.

I’d like to just bring it to the Minister’s attention and say: Look, we’ve got to work toward — well, I’ve got a glass of water here before me — having it nice and clear. Even though it’s potable, it’s got to be visibly appealing as well. We’ve got the technology. It’s just how do we make it better for the communities to have that type of quality of water in front of our people? Needless to say, the quality of water is very important, not only in our jurisdiction but in all the jurisdictions across Canada. How it’s delivered to our smaller communities is equally important. We’ve got to work and strive toward that, Mr.

Chair. I’ll leave it at that for my opening

comments right now.

Thank you very much, Mr. Menicoche. Mr. Ramsay.

Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I’ve got a few comments I want to make to the Minister and his staff.

First of all, there were a lot of tough decisions that had to be made in the area of reductions within the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs. I commend the Minister and his staff for coming up with them — I don’t agree with all of them — but I think it was a very good effort on behalf of the Minister and his staff to reach the target that was given to them. Again, I appreciate their efforts.

The big thing for me is that there’s no impact community government funding, and I think this is a key thing. Communities need that stable and secure funding in order to operate.

The one concern I do have is with the cuts to the School of Community Government. We’ve always got to keep an eye on capacity building at the community level. We need to ensure that programs and opportunities for training are available to communities that need them. I’m going to be closely following how this plays itself out. I know Aurora College is going to get involved in the delivery of some programs and some training for communities; I’m interested to see how that will work out. I think it will be successful. I do believe Aurora College should play a role in the delivery of programs and training opportunities to communities. I look forward to seeing more there.

I wanted to also thank the department for the reinstatement of the rec coordinators. It didn’t come as a recommendation, but you heard from a number of Members that that was a concern in many of our communities and the ridings we represent. I was glad to see the department took a second look at that and decided to reinstate those rec coordinators.

Many of my colleagues have talked about the necessity for this government to focus some attention on youth and the issues surrounding youth in the Northwest Territories. I know Mr. Beaulieu, Mr.

Menicoche and a number of my other

colleagues have spoken about the need to be spending more in the area of youth. It’s something that I think needs to be addressed. Perhaps it could come through strategic initiative funding. We need to earmark some money to get it in on the ground level so we are having a positive impact on the youth in our communities.

There are some communities out there, Mr. Chairman, that are absolutely struggling with youth gangs, drugs, alcohol, and youths roaming the streets late at night and causing fires and vandalism. We really need to reach out to those kids and give them something positive in their lives. It’s going to take spending some money to do that. I

think we have to come up with a game plan to address that, and I think it should happen through the strategic initiative funding. As money becomes available, we should try to coordinate that. I look forward to the Minister and his staff working with our committee and other Regular Members to ensure we do serve the youth of the Northwest Territories to the best of our ability.

The other thing I wanted to mention while I’ve got the floor, Mr.

Chairman, is the community

emergency management coordinator. I’m having some difficulty with that reduction. We all know full well that disasters take place. There was a flood in Hay River, a flood in Aklavik a couple of years ago. We need to make sure that when disaster strikes, communities have somebody to fall back on. They need to have that peace of mind. To me, that’s what it is. It’s peace of mind for communities to know there’s somebody who’s going to pay attention. We should all be paying attention, but there’s somebody there who’s going to walk them through things, who’s going to be there to take them hand in hand and walk them through the process and get them the help they need. Again, I’m not quite sure about the reduction in the community emergency management coordinator position. That’s something we’ll be discussing a little bit later, Mr. Chairman.

I just wanted to leave off by thanking the Minister and his officials — I think MACA — and also the Minister of Public Works. He’s done a good job at managing both of those departments.

Thank you very much, Mr. Ramsay. I call next on Mr. Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. It would be really easy just to repeat what these two said, so I’m not going to waste time saying the same things, with the exception of the recreation positions.

I was sad when the original notifications went out to the employees. We heard that a bunch of the recreation positions were going to get cut, given that it was in our strategic plan. I’m very happy the department reconsidered, and I’m very happy the department put those positions back in. I think they’re incredibly important to the youth of the Northwest Territories.

I share the same areas of concern as Mr. Ramsay. In addition, although I don’t believe that MACA’s necessarily the right department to be the central department or the central spokesperson for the voluntary sector of the Government of the Northwest Territories — although I believe the voluntary sector should be speaking to a central body, probably somebody in the Executive as far as a point of contact for the entire sector — currently it is under MACA.

I have to say I was a little disappointed that the voluntary sector was pretty much completely ignored, specifically the VSI — the Voluntary Sector Initiative. I think that project, that group, had significant value and provided great opportunities for this government to step up and work with a central coordinating body for the voluntary sector in the Northwest Territories, to move forward and find those relationships that will be important for the GNWT and the voluntary sector. I’m quite disappointed the support to the Volunteer NWT is non-existent. I’m disappointed the Volunteer NWT is shutting their doors. I think it’s a loss to the Northwest Territories. I think it’s a loss to the government. I think it’s a loss to everybody. I think we had an opportunity to develop a really solid relationship. Sure, we would have had to kick in some money, and I think it’s a little short-sighted that we didn’t.

I’ll probably be asking some questions about that, and as usual, I’ll be asking my questions about position reductions as well. That’s it.

Thank you very much, Mr. Abernethy. I’ll call next on Mr. Beaulieu.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I’m pleased at a lot of things here, in the department, also. I’m happy the New Deal’s in place. I’m happy the department increased capital for communities by over $5 million.

I guess the issue of having some of the groups…. Some of the communities that are taking the New Deal can’t own assets or property. I’m not 100 per cent sure which it is. I believe it’s buildings, but I think roads and other systems can be worked on. I hope the department would come to, maybe, if need be, create some sort of legislation that will allow the Dene bands to own GNWT assets like other larger municipalities, cities and towns and so on. It would be a good hurdle to get over to give equal access to the New Deal by all communities.

In Tu Nedhe, neither of my communities can own assets because they’re under the wrong act. One is actually under a federal act because one continues to be a band. Capital, I think, would be easier to deal with. Dealing with a band and the settlement council, I would find that…. I guess the only issue that potentially could be there with this type of funding is a cash-flow issue. If the department’s arbitrarily cutting the budget into equal chunks and handing it out throughout the year, it may not allow the band or settlement council to flow their projects out the way they want to. Maybe that’s something we could be cognizant of.

I want to repeat what both Mr.

Ramsay and

Mr. Abernethy touched on. Youth, to me, is a very, very important area to spend money on. Of all

strategic initiatives, I believe that the ultimate strategic initiative is to spend money on youth. I don’t think we’re doing that. I didn’t see the department…. Although I’m not sure that youth is actually…. I mean, the youth budget that the Minister of MACA had is, I believe, in excess of $1 million. I’m not sure if that’s actually a MACA program, but that is one area where I thought the government could look at expanding, even to the extent of putting some human resources in that area and getting some youth workers into the regions.

I thought that was something this government could do. I thought that was something that was strategic, and it would be something that was so important to the youth of all the communities across the North — to try to give the youth equal access to everything that is available in the Northwest Territories in this area. I thought that at least for this year, the department could look at putting more money into the youth budget.

I’m not talking about a huge contribution in youth corps or anything like that. I’m just talking about the money the Minister has to set the youth budget. I do believe it’s around $1 million. I would have liked to see that budget proposed in order for us to do an effective job. I’m trying to, I guess, put these key individuals into place at the start so that these guys can then start that whole process of working on capital issues, working with schools, working…. I mean, there are all kinds of possibilities.

Some of these youth workers are gym teachers. I mean, we’re suffering for gym teachers in small communities. One thing I’m asking Education to do is to try to move their PTR or do something with their PTR to put some sort of base expenditure into a community meeting with all of this essential stuff — I include physical education — in the curriculum. Maybe that’s something this department could work with the schools on.

I think there’s an opportunity here to be pretty strategic with the youth. I think our returns are real quick; kids grow up real fast. When you’re looking at putting a 17-year-old guy on the right road, five years later he’s a productive adult. I think that’s what we have to try to do. We have to try to achieve a lot of productive adults out of the youth we have today; maybe we won’t be facing some of the social problems we’re currently facing in small communities.

I guess, in general, social problems are spread across the whole North. I guess it’s not quite as apparent when there’s a large number of people living in one location. With that, I look forward to going through the Mains. That’s all I have.

Thank you very much, Mr. Beaulieu. I’ll call next on Mr. Hawkins.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Although it’s highlighted by other Members, as you go along you end up repeating some of the other stuff, but it’s certainly worthwhile repeating.

Mr. Chairman, I’ll first start with the Minister and staff. I find this is a model department when it comes to responding to MLA concerns. I put that out as a compliment and a point of notice to the other departments to make sure they follow this department’s example of timely responses. Even when they can’t get back to you, they let you know. Mr. Chairman, this is a model department.

Mr. Chairman, the other thing is the emphasis on the ability to work with the Minister. Although I don’t sit on the EDI committee, the Minister and his staff are certainly willing to listen to Members such as myself, and I find it very positive. We don’t get a chance to send him little cards of thank you and all those things, but exactly once a year it’s our chance to say they’re listening, and we appreciate it.

One shouldn’t expect emotions, though, Mr. Chairman. I’ve talked to the Minister in the past about this. You know, we don’t see eye-to-eye on this issue, but there’s certainly respect over the problem. Although I respect the work that’s designed and done through the School of Community Government — it’s an extremely valuable service — I would prefer to eventually see it migrate into Aurora College. I stand firm on that issue, because I believe all our college training…. Sorry. Aurora College should provide all our training programs throughout government. You know, it seems odd that we’ll create internal programs that develop training models and whatnot. To me, that defeats the whole purpose of having a college that, I stress…. I think it is our method to move forward on education in the territory, and I truly support what the college represents. Someday I think that will be a reality, but I suspect today won’t be that day.

Mr. Chairman, there’s just one other area I do want to highlight. There will be detailed questions coming forward later on the community emergency management coordinator position. As mentioned by Mr. Ramsay earlier, you have to look no further than the Hay River little disaster, there, with the flooding and whatnot, to see how important his role is in our work and for the protection and readiness of our people. Without this type of expertise at the helm, it makes it very difficult to all-of-a-sudden flip a switch. An average person may be able to grab a textbook, but it’s this type of expertise that knows how to implement these things without unnecessary delay.

The justification I’ll be looking for is how they would have come down to decide that someone in this area isn’t required. I’m sure it’s a matter of just getting some details. I’m sure it won’t be long before the Minister realizes the error of his ways.

But that’s it, Mr. Chairman; I’d hate to see us lose that skill and ability. Ultimately, it puts not just one community but all our communities at risk, which puts our territory at risk. You take that skill and coordination away and, like I say, the service just turns into a textbook. We could make the same argument for most other services we provide. But, you know, we really need the skilled eye, the human touch in these things. When that phone call comes in, we need someone ready to go who is familiar and experienced in this area.

Mr. Chairman, there is one last note I almost forgot to mention. I do want to highlight and discuss the good work done regarding municipal funding. Our mayor here in Yellowknife has spoken in his role as the municipality’s president. They speak in favour of this budget because of what support it offers municipalities. The New Deal is coming forward in a positive way, as I understand it.

Mr.

Chairman, this is good work for our

communities in that even when times are tough, in times of cuts, the communities are protected, because they have a smaller avenue to raise revenues and to adjust to changes as quickly as we could possibly deal with them.

With that said, Mr. Chairman, I thank committee for the time for my opening comments. I will have very interesting and detailed questions regarding that community emergency management coordinator. Like I say, although I don’t think we’re getting into that detail tonight, let’s give the Minister one more night to sleep on it and maybe change his mind.

Thank you very much, Mr. Hawkins. I’ll call next on Ms. Bisaro.

Thank you, Mr.

Chair. This has

become a recurring theme. Many of the points I’m going to make have already been mentioned, but as I stated to one of the other Ministers earlier this week, they’re important to me, so I’m going to mention them. I did want to start off as well by thanking the Minister and his officials for the approach they took and the clear and concise way in which they communicated to the committee the rationale they’d used for making these reductions. I found the briefing to be one of the best I’ve observed, and it was refreshing.

In no particular order, I am also concerned about the amount of money we’re spending on our youth. It’s a major priority in our goals and objectives. I don’t know that it’s necessarily MACA’s fault, but in

terms of the government as a whole, I don’t think we have in this budget put enough emphasis on contributions toward youth programming, coordinators, facilities and so on. I think it’s something we need to consider, particularly in the next budget. I’m okay with the way things are here, but we certainly can’t reduce funding or facilities or staffing in terms of youth and youth programming any more than we already have.

I also am against the elimination of the emergency planning coordinator positions. I mentioned it in the House in a statement at least once. I feel that position provides a lot of support to communities whenever a disaster occurs. With communities taking on a lot of new responsibilities under the New Deal, which I do support, I think it is incumbent on the government and on MACA to make sure communities are not being stretched beyond their human capacity. We can’t rip out the supports the communities have been using over the last two or three years all at once. I think MACA understands this, but the removal of this particular emergency planning coordinator, to me, is a bad move.

I think that support can’t be provided elsewhere, and it’s my understanding that there’s nobody else in the department who’s going to take over these activities. So I have a concern there. I must say I have been advised that the territorial planning coordinator will do it, but I’m not so sure that position will have the hands-on back and forth with communities that the planning coordinator does.

The School of Community Government has been reduced to a certain extent. I appreciate the explanation that the department is going to focus the school on high-priority programming and eliminate some of the programs that can be accessed elsewhere. I commend them for that approach, but I think we have to be extremely careful about reducing the programming of the School of Community Government too far. The northern communities rely on the School of Community Government to train their officials. We have to remember that. We have to make sure the programs the School of Community Government is offering are programs our local governments need and want. I would caution the department not to reduce the School of Community Government. If you’re going to do it, do it very carefully.

I also have to speak very strongly against the loss of funding for the voluntary sector initiative. It was a paltry $10,000 as a strategic initiative, and that $10,000 is now no longer there. It’s only a piece of the unfortunate demise of Volunteer NWT. I think that organization is one that lost support from not only MACA but the whole government. There were other avenues where the several departments could have gotten together and made volunteers an important element. I’m done.

Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Next on my list I have Mr. Robert McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I’m not quite ready to join this group hug yet, but I will give credit where credit is due. I’ve been going on with all the other departments about the size of headquarters. One of the first things I noticed with MACA was the reduction of a number of people at headquarters — or positions; I don’t know if they’re vacant. It’s still a good thing to see. I notice the balance between Yellowknife headquarters and the regional area offices is starting to balance out. I think it’s a good thing. MACA should be one of the few departments where it is balanced out.

Where I really have a concern, again, is the number of positions cut in the Beaufort-Delta and, in particular, in Inuvik. They’ve been hit hard. I know there are a few vacant positions; I’m not sure if these were it. I could fight to have every one reinstated. I’ve always said, understanding that reductions are necessary, that we’ll take our fair share. That’s the word there: we’ll take our fair share. We’ve been hit awfully hard; MACA in Inuvik is one of the departments that has been hit fairly hard. My understanding was that it provided services to the communities. I’m not sure what the thinking is on that. If they plan on providing these services to the communities out of headquarters, I can always get to those details later.

As far as some of the training for the communities goes, I notice a lot of folks who come down to Yellowknife for training, and I think that’s something that can be administered or done out of the regional offices. It would save a lot of travel time and travel money bringing them down here. I’ve noticed quite a few, actually. I see the School of Community Government’s gone down a bit. I’m not sure if that’s where MACA was going with this — to have more of the training done at the regional level. If that’s their thinking, then I think that’s a good thing.

Other than that, it’s been said a couple of times before…. And at first to even consider taking out the rec coordinators, after we’ve run a program in the Beaufort-Delta Aurora College for how many years to train recreational leaders, and some good graduates came through there. The person who was doing it out of Inuvik was just a top-notch individual who enjoyed what he did. He did it because he enjoyed it, not because it was a job and he was paid to. To consider taking the positions out in the first place, I think, was very poorly thought out. It goes against what we’ve been saying are our priorities of the 16th Assembly, in particular our youth. I’m glad to see it go back in again, and I think with the resistance you got not only from the Members…. I think the public had a lot to do with this, because it was something that was very near and dear to them. I’m glad it got straightened out, because we had the message out there that youth

are our priority. I think by keeping these folks, we’re actually saying the youth are a priority and we’re going to prove it.

Other than my concern with the positions in the Beaufort-Delta — in particular Inuvik; I know they’ve been hit awfully hard.... I think we lost a Lands person

and some community planner, somebody

who works with the communities. We’ve lost too many people. We’ve got an oil and gas person, I think, who’s on the hook, and yet they continue to add more oil and gas people in Yellowknife. I can’t figure that one out for the life of me. Anyway, I think you’re moving in the right direction, especially with balancing out between headquarters and regional office. I will commend and compliment you on that.

Those are my opening remarks. I probably will have a few questions when we get into the detail.

Thank you, Mr. Robert McLeod. I understand I have a couple more. Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much,

Mr. Chairman. I move that we report progress.

A motion is on the floor to report progress. The motion is in order and is not debatable.

Motion carried.

I will now rise and report progress. Thank you, Minister McLeod, and thank you to your witnesses. Mr. Sergeant-at-Arms, please escort the witnesses out of the Chamber.

The House resumed.

Item 21. Can I have the report of the Committee of the Whole, please, Mr. Bromley.

Mr. Speaker, your committee has been considering Tabled Document 37-16(2), Main Estimates 2008–2009, Volumes 1 and 2, and Committee Report 7-16(2). I would like to report progress with three motions being adopted.

Mr.

Speaker, I move that the report of the

Committee of the Whole be concurred with.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Do we have a seconder for the motion? The honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, Mr.

Krutko. The

motion is on the floor. The motion is in order.

Motion carried.

Item 22, third reading of bills. Item 23, Madam Clerk, Orders of the Day.