Thank you, committee. We are on pages 8-32 and 8-33, community health programs, grants and contributions, $60.195 million. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Under 8-33, community health programs, $18.04 million, I would like to ask the Minister again in regards to those expenditures. Like I stated, in my riding there are some communities that don’t have social workers, they don’t have mental health workers, but yet someone is spending that money on behalf of those communities. I would like to know what happens to those dollars that is earmarked for a community by authorities and not expended in those communities. I would like to know, do you have a breakdown of that $18 million? How much is supposed to go to my communities, Tsiigehtchic, McPherson, and Aklavik? If there are none of those positions that is being provided, who is spending the money and what happens to that money if it is not expended in that community?

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Minister Lee.

We can provide the Member with the breakdown on not only what the money was budgeted for, but actual expenditure on each community by program. I have seen that before. I believe we provided that to the Member a number of months back, so we would be happy to give him the most recent update. Thank you.

What are the penalties for authorities or agents that don’t get the money, do not expend the money in those communities? Are there any penalties put on them by way of doing an audit or basically telling them that you are not going to fund them, your money will go directly to the community? I have a real problem with the deficits that have been running in the Inuvik authority over the last six years, which they got their budget to run their authorities. On top of it, this government spent $20 million in supplementary appropriations to bump up their budgets every year for six years. I think that is criminal by way of how that authority has been able to operate and yet your government doesn’t seem to do anything about it. I would like to know exactly what the consequences are of not spending that money where it is supposed to be expended.

The way it is set up now, the authorities get funding under different programs, whether they would be funded under their administration, and then the authorities that are

eligible get so much money for hospital services and then they get so much for health centres. They get some money under THAF. We get from pockets of money and we distribute them accordingly. I understand that there are some guidelines as to where the PYs and such, but I know the Member doesn’t agree with this, But for most authorities, they have the flexibility to move around money within their programs. Thank you.

Well, that is exactly my point. That is why programs and services aren’t being delivered in communities, because they know that they don’t have to spend it in those communities. They could move it around any place they want except for those communities it is earmarked for. I, for one, do not agree with that, because the money should be expended in those communities that it has been approved for. There is a formula that is basically allowed for each community to spend their dollars in those communities. Again, if that is the position of the ministry and the way that you deliver programs and services, I think that is a mistake. That is why programs and services aren’t delivered in a lot of our communities. It is because you allow that practice to continue where you can move money around any time you want on anything that you want to expend it on. I would like to ask the Minister again, are there rules in place to not allow that type of practice to take place so it is being expended in the communities that it is earmarked for?

I take the Member’s point. A motion was passed earlier to enhance services in communities. We will be responding to that. I think a way to solve wanting the issue of increasing services in communities does not have to be done by eliminating an option of the authorities to move their money around if they needed to, because sometimes they need to do that. Some of our authorities are governed by their board and the board trustees have to have some option to make some of those decisions. I don’t think that is necessarily the reason why there might not be some nurses in Tsiigehtchic. I think that issue could be addressed by answering to that motion that was passed earlier. I think it is really important that we leave some flexibility to the authorities to make some choices and priority decisions. Thank you.

I don’t know about you, but I think that the Beaufort-Delta Health Authority has been making some bad choices. I think that is why we are having this debate here in the House today. If the programs and services were being delivered in all communities fairly, we wouldn’t be raising this issue in this House. I would like to ask the Minister in regard to the breakdown of that $18 million again that she said she will get to me, how soon can you get it to me? Is it before you end this department?

We could get you the breakdown by the authorities by the end of today. In terms of what is allocated for each community, I think we are going to need a little bit more time. Thank you.

I have another question in regard to the non-government organizations’ programs and services, $2.8 million. Is there a chance you can get a breakdown of that and which organizations are receiving this funding in regards to non-government organizations?

For that, $2 million of that goes to Deh Cho Health and Social Services Authority, that goes to Nats'ejee K'eh; $807,000 goes to Yellowknife Health and Social Services Authority. Probably most of that money goes to Sally Ann and other A and D services that we fund. Thank you.

My next question is going to deal with the emergency shelter in regards to those services of $2.2 million. You mentioned Sally Ann gets the money on non-government organizations. Do they also receive money under the other listed items in regards to homelessness, strategic initiatives or investments?

Salvation Army gets funding for a number of programs. One of them is they do have a withdrawal management program there. People can go there and stay there. It is a residential treatment program and work on their alcohol and addiction. It is a set-up program. It has been there for a long time. I think we could provide a breakdown on shelters. It is broken down by authorities. I don’t have enough details here. I think I should undertake to get back to the Member on the details. Thank you.

It would be good to get a breakdown in regard to the NGOs and also the way the funds flow under this matter. I know, to use as an example is the Homelessness Strategy initiative, that some people might not think it, but in our communities we also have people who are homeless. Basically, we call them couch surfers. They go from one home to another night after night. They will go find a place to sleep. They end up on somebody’s couch and yet these people are not eligible for housing. They have been kicked out of housing. They have basically either been kicked out of the family and yet these people are also struggling in their communities to try and provide them with some shelter also. I know in the past we have asked for some sort of unique Homelessness Strategy for small or remote communities so we can also offer those types of people some means of shelter in communities. Either it is an older unit from the Housing Corporation or building them some sort of little independent unit. It could be just one little

bedroom unit, nothing fancy. But again, it seems like a lot of those dollars are being expended in regards to the youth centres, Sally Ann and other programs. I think that this program should allow for those other people out there who we do see having to walk the streets at night and basically not knowing where they are going to go to sleep, not knowing if they will be allowed into their relative’s home at night because of circumstance. I would like to ask the Minister, have you ever considered as part of the strategy and initiative for rural and remote communities for homelessness, people on our streets?

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, on the Family Violence Program the department funds about $2.2 million, and through that we fund shelters in Fort Smith, Hay River and in the Beaufort-Delta region, as well as some of the shelters in Yellowknife. Under the new Strategic Initiative committee funding, we are looking to invest $1.3 million more, and part of that funding speaks to the second phase of the Family Violence Action Program where we are looking to expand the services to small communities where there are no shelters. We want to work on children who witness violence as well as working with women who don’t necessarily want to be in a shelter. But there has to be some family violence issues or supporting the family and women who want to get some help with that.

Also, we have, over the last two years, expanded or implemented a program called Homelessness Territorial Contribution Plan as well as a small community homeless fund and that is directly related at expanding homelessness programs to outside of major centres. Under our program that we have in the department, we don’t have the funds or program to renovate or find a house but we do find little pockets of money, up to about 30 to 40 thousand dollars for communities who want to fix up somewhere just to make it adequate to host either youth or give them lunch or feed them warm food or something like that. But other departments would be responsible for increasing the numbers of housing.

Thank you, Minister Lee. Thanks, committee. We are on pages 8-32 and 8-33, community health programs, grants and contributions, $60.195 million.

Page 8-34, community health programs, information item, active positions. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Again, I would like the Minister to give me a breakdown on these different positions, based on P1, P2 and P3

and exactly what all you are doing in regards to Affirmative Action Policy in the department in that area.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Minister Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Under this program, most of the positions are located in Yellowknife headquarters and we gave a breakdown previously on what the breakdown is on those three categories and we will undertake to provide the detail for these 24 positions, if we can. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister Lee. Thanks, committee. Page 8-34, community health programs, active positions.