Thanks to the acting DM for that. I will look forward to reading that report. My last question has to do with indications in the budget that we’re getting an increasing number of applications for income support. It’s a trend that has been happening over the last several years and there are a number of reasons, I’m sure, why that’s happening. I’m not so concerned with the reasons because I believe they’re all valid, but I am concerned with whether or not the department has a strategy to deal with the fact that we have more and more people who seem to be needing income support and are asking us for income support. This is a huge dollar item in our budget. If we lived in a perfect world, nobody would be on income support and we wouldn’t have to spend that money. I would like to know if the department has a strategy or has any kind of a plan to try and reduce the amount of money we spend on income support by reducing the number of people who need to access it.

That’s good to hear. Thank you very much.

Speaking on page 10-27 we have Mr. Moses.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I, too, just want to make the same comments as my colleagues here in regard to the income support. It’s very disturbing to hear that the large clientele is between the ages of 19 and 29. That’s very shocking and disappointing. Kind of contrary to Ms. Bisaro’s comments, the line item for income assistance is down from last year’s estimates by $60,000. Is the department looking at, due to our economic downturn, the increase in our general rate application, the lack of jobs in the communities? Does the department see more applications for income assistance, and if so, how are they going to reflect it in their budget?

Thank you, Mr. Moses. To respond we’ll go to Mr. Devitt. We’ll go to Ms. Iatridis for that one.

I really applaud the department for trying to get residents off of income support and anyone that’s going through income support through their Productive Choices program. I just wanted to ask a question. Has this program ever been evaluated and have they ever seen the effectiveness of this program?

Thank you, Mr. Moses. We’ll go to Mr. Lafferty.

Mahsi, Mr. Chairman. We talked about the overall review back in 2007, made some changes, and now the Auditor General is going to make an actual review of our Income Assistance Program. More specifically on the Productive Choices program the Member is referring to, if it’s working, what’s working, what’s not working. We have been exploring some areas, as well, within our department and of course we need some support from the communities and also Assembly Members. These are just options that we’re throwing around.

We’re individuals working in the community, especially for the elders, getting wood or firewood or fish nets and other activities that they’ve been adapted to in the community. Again, it’s a liability issue that we have to be faced with. We have to deal with an axe and chainsaw and other equipment. Those are just some of the areas that we are exploring.

Our goal is, of course, to get people off income support. Every opportunity I get with my department, I’m always giving them a target that we need to get people off income support. I feel the

same as the Member does, and we’ll do what we can to continue pushing that through Productive Choices and through labour market agreements. Individuals fall through the cracks. If they don’t qualify for EI, then the funding is there for them. We’re doing what we can to assist those individuals so they can pursue productive choices.

I just want to make a quick comment on the Productive Choices program. I do understand that when clients come and get funding, that the two choices they could possibly do is get some counselling or go do upgrading. In some instances what I’ve been hearing is that anyone who’s going through income assistance will go get their counselling. It’s not an effective counselling. They’re going there to get, possibly, a document signed, and then they take it to the income support office to get their funding. So they’re using up space which is really needed, because we have mental health issues in the communities. Those are where we need to find those instances and find better ways of dealing with it, because not all but we do have some people out there that know how to play the system, and when they’re put into a program where they have to go to counselling, it takes away time for people who really need that counselling and who want to get that counselling. There’s got to be a more effective way.

The same with the school system. Clients who are asked to go do their upgrading, they’ll go to school, be there for the attendance, won’t fully participate, and in some cases disrupt the other students who are trying to get the education. Those are two specific instances that I’ve heard about that really need to be addressed for people that aren’t wanting to use these Productive Choices effectively, they’re affecting other people’s way of life and ones that really do want to succeed or get the help that they need.

I just wanted to make a comment on Productive Choices. In that regard, I’m really glad to see that the Auditor General is going to be reviewing this specific program and hopefully we can put actions to the recommendations that come out of that.

In regard to the four programs that are mentioned in this section here, would it be possible to get a breakdown of how many applications that we do get for the programs, for each specific program, and then how many are approved and at what percentage? Because in each program, I’ve talked to residents where they have been approved or have not gotten approved for certain programs like this that really do need it. At some point if the Minister would be willing to get that information to me, that would be appreciated. Thank you.

I totally agree with the Member on the Productive Choices. We need to closely monitor what’s working and what’s not working. We realize that some individuals do take

advantage and some are legitimate individuals that want to succeed in life. We need to closely monitor that and make changes reflecting that. We’ll continue to push that forward within our department.

And, yes, we’ll provide more detailed information on the four program areas, a breakdown for the Member’s review. We’ll definitely do that. Mahsi.

Committee, were on page 10-27, Education, Culture and Employment, activity summary, income security, operations expenditure summary, $39.668 million. Does committee agree?

Page 10-28, Education, Culture and Employment, activity summary, income security, grants and contributions, grants, total grants, $9.240 million. Does committee agree?

Page 10-29, Education, Culture and Employment, information item, income security, active positions. Any questions? Page 10-30, Education, Culture and Employment, information item, Student Loan Revolving Fund. Any questions? Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Just a quick question. I understand this revolving fund and I’m just wondering why the increase this year. I’m just trying to compare the two and, actually, I see the increase between ’10-11 and ’11-12 is roughly the same as between the most recent two years. I thought it was more, so I retract my question. No question.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Education, Culture and Employment, information item, Student Loan Revolving Fund. Any questions? Being none, 10-32, Education, Culture and Employment, information item, education authority program and services. Any questions? Being none, 10-33. Mr. Menicoche.

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. With regard to the Dehcho Divisional Education Council, there’s a reduction of four positions, as indicated in the details here. I’d just like an explanation from the Minister, please.

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. Minister Lafferty.

Mahsi, Mr. Chair. There have been some slight changes in the funding to various district education authorities. It all comes down to formula funding. The enrolment’s been down so that means some of the organizations are getting less money due to that fact. But we are closely monitoring that and working with the DEAs. Attendance is a big issue right now. It’s a challenge how we can rectify that. We will

continue to work with that, but the explanation is due to enrolment.

Has the department been tracking why the student numbers have decreased at all? Is it the older age group? Is it the younger age group? What efforts are they taking to analyze this, and maybe if there are missing children from school, to perhaps get them back in school. What is the cause of these numbers and the reductions? Thank you.