Thank you, Mr. McLeod. It appears, committee, that we’re concluded with general comments. Does the committee wish to proceed to detail?

Thank you. I’d ask the committee to turn to page 5-41, NWT Housing Corporation, information item, financial summary information. Mr. Blake.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just a quick question on the housing for staff. I see it’s not going to be funded this year. I know there’s a huge need in the communities of Aklavik and Fort McPherson and I’m sure many other communities. I just wanted to know why that wasn’t being funded this year.

Thank you, Mr. Blake. Mr. McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. We have had limited success with that.

We’ve had some communities actually put some units in place. We are looking at other options as far as working with the communities to provide staff housing. It is part of the overall framework that we’ve come forward with. We’ll be having more discussions with committee on that. Recognizing the fact that we still have some communities where the incentive might have helped them try and put something in place for their professionals. We’re always willing to look at it on a case-by-case basis.

No further questions.

Page 5-41, NWT Housing Corporation, information item, financial summary information.

Thank you. Page 5-43, NWT Housing Corporation, information item, corporate summary.

Thank you. Page 5-44, NWT Housing Corporation, information item, active positions by region. Mr. Yakeleya.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The tours that I’ve been having in the Sahtu region – and I know this came up in the 16th also – this issue

here is with the district office in the Sahtu. One of the questions that came up in our communities was the value of having the district office in the Sahtu situated in Norman Wells.

I know the communities talked about moving some of the techies to the communities because the issue came that when the technician, it might improve. Some of the technical staff members come into the communities and they only stay the limited period of time and seem to watch the clock saying the plane is coming and they can’t stay very long. They come once in awhile. The advantage of having them stay there all the time would completely help them understand the programs, understand the applications, and having these positions moved to the communities under a universal partnership agreement. This is one level of bureaucracy that we have in the Sahtu and some of them see that these positions could be moved right into the communities and funded by people in the communities.

I know this request came some time ago and it didn’t get good traction with Housing as to not having these positions moved to the communities. I just want to raise that with the Minister.

I’m not making a request because I certainly haven’t done enough research, but I certainly know that this has been a long-standing issue in the Sahtu communities. I just want to make sure that this issue is still alive with the government, even if they don’t agree with it, that this is what the people want. Until we start making some improvements to having the technicians stay longer in the

communities. They may have improved. I’m not too sure. I certainly get complaints from Colville Lake and some other communities.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think if you look at the active positions by region, you’ll notice that the Housing Corporation, probably within all departments, has most of our people spread out over the regions. Then if you count our LHO employees, we’ve got about 130 in all the communities across the Northwest Territories.

We have tried to provide more support to our district offices so our people can get out into the communities more. One of the things we’re working on, one of the initiatives we are working on right now, is working with our LHOs to try and get them more involved in all aspects of the Housing Corporation. We feel that we’re taking some steps to address some of that.

Our preference would be to have most of our technical folks in one central location within the region so they can all work together. It’s just a matter of trying to get them out to the communities and maybe stay a little longer and then work closely with the communities and LHOs to try to get them more involved in a lot of the programs that the Housing Corporation delivers. That is one of the initiatives that we’re working on right now. As soon as we have more information on that, I’d be willing to share it with the Members.

I certainly appreciate the Minister’s comments to look at the district office and to look at where the technical advisors could actually stay a little longer. They are making improvements. I made this point here because when I was in Deline, I talked to some of the people there, and basically one of the persons that I talked to actually had to tell the technical person – the techie they call him – to stay and come to my office because I need to talk to you and not to go back to Norman Wells. That’s the only way I got the attention of the techie.

We need to do something with the attitude of the technicians when they go into the community to stay and listen to the people. We can’t just say something and expect them to know this. They’re not around there.

I’m glad the Minister is saying that the LHOs are maybe slowly going to start to know and assist through the district office what’s expected. Things are not always run according to the theory. In practicality, it’s a little more challenging. That’s what I want to keep the Minister apprised of that. These techies are very important. But if they’re always, their mind is on catching the 4:00 flight or 4:30, they’re not totally there with the client. They’re

rushing through it. Fill out this application and go see. Some of the LHO staff don’t even know that they’ve got an additional job on there. That’s why I’m asking and I think the people are asking. These techies are very important and they’re good people. They’re good people. I like them because they mean well. For some things maybe they’re under pressure by the district office or the regional manager or financial constraints saying they’re costing extra fuel and more dollars if you stay longer in Tulita or Colville Lake. It’s going to cost us. It’s all on budget. That’s why I’m asking and that’s why the people are asking. If it’s not done properly, then maybe the techies should be coming out of the communities and not so much situated in one regional office in Norman Wells. Maybe we could look at cost-savings or making our money go more efficiently or effectively in the communities of Good Hope, Colville Lake and the other communities of Deline, Tulita and the Wells.

I’m just raising this as an issue, and that’s what the people are asking. Again, I believe the staff here is going to work on that issue. If not, rest assured, I’ll bring it up again at the next budget time.

I’ve heard the Member’s comments and I’m told that we will have some discussions and work with our district office and try to give more support to our district office so they can spend more time out in the region. Then again, working with the LHOs and seeking a lot of input from the LHOs, because they do have a lot of local expertise that we need to tap into. Thank you.

Page 5-44, NWT Housing Corporation, information item, active positions by region. Any questions? Page 5-47, NWT Housing Corporation, information item, executive. Mr. Bromley.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. My questions here are on policy development. I know the Minister is aware of the interest and the financial incentives of having wood heat in our public housing. Somehow there are a lot of jurisdictions around the world that have figured that out so that there is off-the-shelf technology, and insurance companies and liabilities are adjusted with the reliability of those systems. My first question is: Can we not find a way? I know this is a challenge but I also know it’s being done elsewhere. Can we not find a way to develop a policy and start realizing this opportunity by way of, I guess, engaging our tenants in part of the utility costs, as well as reducing our energy costs, total energy costs and other benefits? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister McLeod.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. We have to look at all options as far as the NWT Housing Corporation goes. I would be very careful, and we have to do our homework obviously, I’d be

very careful as far as putting woodstoves into every public housing unit. If there are other options we could look at like a biomass central heating system for some of our multiplexes, then we need to start going in that direction first.

We’d have to do some research to see what other jurisdictions are doing. We’re a whole different kettle of fish up here and our situation is not quite the same as what they are in other jurisdictions, but it would warrant, I think, more research as far as our looking at different sources of heating. Wood pellet, as the Member has raised on a number of occasions, would be one option, but at the same time, we have to make sure they’re cost competitive.

I believe in alternate energy as much as the next guy, but I want to make sure these are all cost competitive without massive subsidies that we’d have to be paying out. It is one though that warrants, I think, more research.

One of the things we want to look at right away is how could we incorporate biomass into a central heating system and use that in some of our multiplex units, which is the direction we’re going in the future. Thank you.

Thanks for the comments from the Minister. Those are good comments and I totally agree, you know, if we can do it on a larger scale than just individual units, that’s definitely where the Housing Corporation should be coming from. He also said we would have to do the work. I think that’s what I and others have been asking for all along, is to do the work required to… Actually, I’m not saying throw an individual woodstove into every house without the work being done. I am asking for that work to be done.

My next question is sort of related to that. I’m very pleased to hear the Minister’s comments on his interest in the central heating systems, though, and I hope he will bring that to committee soon and follow up on that. I think it’s a real opportunity for saving money and so on with due diligence on the economics of it and so on.

The option for a work/rent exchange or some other mechanism of engaging tenants, as we’ve discussed in the past, did not come through strongly in the new strategy I’ve seen, and I still see lots of opportunities for that sort of thing, engaging our tenants. Is there any further work being done at the policy level to explore options there? Thank you.

Just going back to Mr. Bromley’s original… We have some initiatives that we are working on as far as the energy efficiency part. I have a partial list here. Probably the easiest thing to do instead of me reading if off with the numbers and everything, I’ll supply it to committee,

and I think you’re going to be pleased with some of the initiatives and the first steps we’re taking.

As far as the policy on working off arrears – and I think that’s where the Member was going – we have had some discussions on that. We are putting something together here to see how it works. There are issues we have to work through, but I think that at the end of the day, we’re looking forward to trying to get some initiative like that going, because a couple of pilot projects in the past have worked fairly well. There are other outstanding issues that go along with this particular one, but we need to work through those and see if we can get this one on the ground so we give tenants an opportunity to work off a portion of their arrears. Thank you.

Thanks for the Minister’s comments again. That wasn’t exactly where I was headed. I think, when we have able-bodied people who are paying $32 per month or whatever the new amount might be, who are unemployed but willing to work, it seems legitimate to either require their participation if there is a way we can responsibly ask for them to contribute, and in a way, I’m thinking almost like an informal apprenticeship program or something, that both contribute to the maintenance of our housing infrastructure and the development of our tenants’ skills for those that are willing and able.

Another option would be a rent exchange, so instead of paying rent, to have the opportunity to provide the rent in forms of labour and at the same time, again, improve their skills and so on. That’s sort of where I was going and wondering if there was any inclination or activity in the policy development area in that respect. Thank you.