Thank you, Member from the Sahtu. To the motion. Member from Inuvik Boot Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm proud to stand here today and support this motion, support the seconder, my colleague from the Sahtu, and to support the people from -- the residents of the town of Norman Wells. This is, indeed, a crisis. We look at $40 a gigajoule of gas in Inuvik and I think that's a crisis. I can only imagine, to pay $6,000 to fill the fuel tank. It's going to be a crisis. It's a crisis now as temperatures get lower.

Mr. Speaker, the -- I mean, the precedent of -- if you want to call it bailing out a community or bailing someone out, we've done this in the past. We've spent an additional $30 million to build a windmill in Inuvik that's reducing greenhouse gas emissions yet not really providing any relief to the power grid up there for the residents. We provide -- we subsidize power every year, you know, in our communities. When the barge didn't get into Sachs Harbour, Mr. Speaker, a couple of years ago, we -- the NWT stepped up and we flew all the materials in there, including building materials going in there to build homes for local construction companies that had to go in there that didn't make the barge. So stepping up and doing something about this emergency now, I think, you know, we have no choice. Would it be great to get that -- to be able to get that funding from the federal government? Of course it would. But, again, we can't wait as my colleague from Norman Wells, from the Sahtu, has said. We need to act on this now. Whether that means, you know -- and I've talked about with our -- with my colleagues about how we could do this. I don't think by doing rebates to individuals or businesses. I think the administrative burden on that would be too much. We'd likely spend a million dollars there alone just doing that. I think, you know, the simplest way to do this thing is to reach out to Imperial Oil who is the provider in there. I don't know, I mean they typically barge their product in. Could they have trucked it on the winter road this time? Likely. We knew that the barge wasn't going to get in because we own the barging company. You know, I don't know what information Imperial Oil had. I know they've been a good corporate citizen in Norman Wells for many years. In my opinion we look at the cost, we find out from the provider what the additional cost was to get that fuel in there, we look at that number, we cut that cheque, and we ensure that the residents are paying the same as they always paid for the heating fuel and gasoline in the community. It's simple. We had an issue last week where Canadian North couldn't land in Yellowknife, went to -- couldn't land in Norman Wells because there was no fuel, ended up having to -- I think they ended up in Fort Smith at that time. So, again, to me we have to come up with a solution. It's not something we can delay. It's not something we can say let's reach out to Ottawa and see if we can get funding for, Mr. Speaker. It's something we need to do now. And I'm happy to support this motion. I'm hoping that as a government we step up, we look at precedents, we look at money we've spent previously on similar situations, and we get it done and make sure that when the minus 30 hits in about a month here, that people are not paying that much money to heat their homes. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, member from Inuvik Boot Lake. Member from Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I'll speak really quick. I rise to also give support to my colleague in the Sahtu region. We're talking about the fuel crisis at issue that was brought into the community for the Sahtu region on an annual basis, but to pay $6,000 for a fuel tank is just -- it's just not acceptable. Beyond our control through climate change, this year the water levels are really down. Because of that, MTS was cancelled and all the barges that were earmarked for the Sahtu region or to deliver fuel and groceries and all the goods and services have been cancelled. So, Mr. Speaker, the -- and on top of all that, there was a forest fire in the Sahtu region that, you know, had a huge impact in the Fort Good Hope area. And while that was happening, it also took up a lot of the fuel that was needed in the -- from Norman Wells to Fort Good Hope and so on. But right now, the high costs the GNWT replace the fuel that's in this community just to get us by until the winter road kicks in. But right now, Mr. Speaker, it's -- to pay at a higher cost and then pass on those costs to the consumers in the Sahtu region is just not right. It doesn't sit well with me. I'm deeply concerned about that. And at the same time, you know, we have to figure out a way as a government to step up to give support to my colleague in the Sahtu region and all the members that are there. Sometimes we have to put our differences aside, and we have to come together as a government to give support. And with that, Mr. Speaker, I will be supporting the Sahtu region. Mahsi.

Colleagues, we'll take a brief two-minute break.

--- SHORT RECESS

Thank you, colleagues. I will continue on now with the debate. Next on my list I have is from the Member from Range Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise in support of my colleague from the Sahtu. The people of the Sahtu are hard hit right now, specifically in Norman Wells.

I find the Member for Sahtu words quite chilling, it could be your community next. And I think -- and that's, of course, not disparaging against my honourable friend but I think the point is very well felt. After, you know, an unprecedented season of wildfires where 70 percent or more of the territory was evacuated, I think we all have that shared sense of anxiety that we are -- our lifestyles in the Northwest Territories are balanced on a knife edge, and all it takes is one shock to tip the scales one way or the other. $6,000 in fuel costs. Can you imagine, Mr. Speaker? I certainly can't. I couldn't afford to be in the Northwest Territories if that happened. And it's not just -- this is a crisis. There can be no other word for it, and a humanitarian crisis. This isn't a political stunt or a rhetorical flourish. This is a humanitarian crisis, the kind of magnitude that we see after a hurricane or an earthquake. The chaos that people feel in their community and the sense of unease. That anxiety isn't going to be solved by finding someone to blame. What we need now as the Member -- as my friend said, are solutions. And the solution is quite clear to me: We need to bail out this community. We need to provide that financial relief.

And when you think of it in real terms -- I did the calculations -- the total request is -- we have the -- the government has brought forward $1.8 million in a relief program for businesses, which is welcomed. But the $6.6 million that the community's now asking for is 0.3 percent of our total budget. 0.3 percent. Of course, all these things add up, and we have to prioritize. This is something I'm happy to prioritize. And we are -- we have the convenience of sitting right now and being able to bring forward appropriations on an emergency basis. I mean, you could spend via special warrant as well. But what's required now is not to apportion blame. It's to provide relief to the people of Norman Wells otherwise the people aren't going to stay in the community. I've spoken with my friend, and he tells me people are saying they will leave, and they will not look back. Because they can't. It's not that they want to leave. They can't stay. And no one should be forced into that situation in the Northwest Territories.

Everything is local in politics, they say, and in the Northwest Territories things are even more local. It doesn't matter that we live in such a vast territory. We all know each other in communities. We all feel the same thing; some more than others. And this affordability crisis, there's so many words we've heard that apply to it. Unacceptable, unimaginable, unthinkable, unprecedented. And all these things are true. And now the onus is on us as leaders of the territory to solve this crisis.

And you know, this discussion started yesterday behind closed doors, and I think it was a good discussion, and I'm glad we're doing it out on the floor today outside of the caucus Chamber. We have great discussions all the time where everyone jumps in, both sides of the House, but the public doesn't get the benefit of hearing them very often. This is a rare opportunity for all Members to speak and to share their perspective. And I hope we hear about the challenges that our friends on the other side of the House face in executing their duties as Cabinet Ministers. I know it's hard to balance budgets. I know it's hard to be responsible for those portfolios. But when there's a crisis, you must rise to meet the moment. And this is a crisis. This is a humanitarian crisis. There's no other words for it.

The Member from Sahtu has been raising this with us, his colleagues, for months now. This is not new information, but it has steadily gotten worse and steadily gotten to the point where we can't ignore it anymore. I hope that our colleagues and our leaders in Ottawa are listening and that they look at Hansard, and they see the unprecedented nature of this debate. This hasn't happened in recent records to have an emergency debate. And this matter, this crisis, is being elevated to that point for that exact reason, that we need people to listen, we need people to understand the crisis, the dire circumstances that Norman Wells and the people of the Sahtu are in. And it doesn't matter that where -- you know, and it's all the -- all the territory has to come together. It doesn't matter what constituency we represent. It matters that we are standing together when people are in need. And I know that if my -- that my constituents in Range Lake were faced with a similar crisis, that my friends up and down the Valley would be standing at my side shoulder to shoulder to help them as well. And that is what the North does best, we come together in a crisis, and we help people. You know, our compassion knows no bounds and our resilience knows no bounds. We can overcome this, and we can find the resources. And if it means we need to readjust other priorities, then so be it.

But as I say, now is not the time to apportion blame. Now is not the time to ask another level of government to solve the problem. We need to rise to the challenge today and deal with it now, deal with it urgently. We can figure out how to pay for it later. Whether it's a shift in other priorities or projects that have to be scrapped, but now is the timed for that relief to flow. We don't need to overthink this. Let's cut a cheque. Let's cut it today. Let's give the people of the Sahtu the relief they desperately need and save a community. Because that's where we're at. That's what a humanitarian crisis is. We do not want to see another community destroyed by climate change. Maybe not physically, but the fabric -- the social fabric of that community is under threat right now. And we can't afford that in the Northwest Territories, not again. And I won't be privy to it -- or I won't be a part of that if I can help it. And although these are just words today, Mr. Speaker, I hope they find -- they meet the mark and meet the moment and encourage our decision makers at all levels of government to make the right choice and to provide the relief that's so desperately needed for Northerners. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Member, to the debate. I'm going to go to the Member from YK Centre.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think if I remember correctly, I was going to try to look it up, but there's the Chinese character that refers to crisis, and comprises of two words if I remember correctly. It refers to danger but it also refers to opportunity. And to me, that's some of what we're facing here, is there's a lot of danger going on there but there's an opportunity to change that story to avert the further humanitarian crisis. I honestly don't think that that's an overstatement. It resonates with me. It resonates with anyone I talk to about this particular situation. And I think that, you know, when you're at the grocery store here in Yellowknife and you're bumping into people and they're talking about Norman Wells and how they afford food in Norman Wells -- I mean, we could talk about all communities but I mean, when they're talking about it right now, that tells me it's an important issue even in Yellowknife. I mean, you don't have to go very far to run into people to talk about this. But the point I'm making is people are talking about it.

I mean, when Norman Wells called a state of emergency and they need the department to help exercise that ability to get those authorities and opportunities that it creates. And I want the government to get behind them. They -- you know, and I think Member -- the Member for Sahtu is right. I mean, you know, we can continue to define the problem but we actually know what the problem is. We should be talking about, really at the end of the day, who is bringing what to the table.

I'd like to use the famous analogy I'm trying to keep alive which is if we were talking about kilometers and highway, currently right now as it's scheduled at just over $6 million, $6.6 million, whatever the number round about there is, it's really about two to three kilometers of highway. Who wouldn't support helping the families, the businesses, the community at large, for two to three kilometers of highway in the Northwest Territories? It resonates in a manner that really hurts and scares. You know, the fact that we're discussing it today is an enormous opportunity for all of us to address and send the message to the people of the Sahtu.

I've heard -- I've had some people tell me -- that people are considering the option of leaving Norman Wells. It's not because they think the town has -- they don't want to be there. It's not a case like that at all. The fact is they just can't afford to be there anymore. I mean, I don't think you have to -- like the old -- for those of us old enough to remember -- unfortunately, I'm starting to be one of them -- I remember the town of Pine Point having the sign when the town closed up. Now, it closed for different reasons but I get that visually -- visual statement of someone spray painting a sheet of plywood saying last one here, turn off the lights. I worry, affordability, it's going to be the last one here to turn off the gas type of thing.

I mean, as my colleagues have all said -- I mean, I could run through the House, but we've already heard it, $6,000 to fill up a fuel tank, and we know you have to fill at least one a month when it gets cold, who has that kind of job that can pay for that? That is just completely beyond any measure.

I like to think about numbers, Mr. Speaker, and one of the things that I often think about is, like, how do we reflect on this? Although I don't have the specific number at my finger when I want to say this, so let's view it in the essence of context as opposed to absolute accuracy. But we know that the Jackfish plant, because of low water, has been running, and someone has to foot that bill of the gas, and how long has that been going. And often I've heard -- although I haven't inquired because it didn't really matter -- it's a bad situation. But I've often heard that it's $50,000 a day in fuel, and they have to have three sets of trucks constantly rolling through on the road to do that. So, again, not worrying about necessarily the absolute accuracy but the principle of it is is it would only take three to four months of running Jackfish to equal the cost that the people in the Sahtu need in the sense of relief.

This Assembly votes for subsidy programs all the time. We don't like to call it that sometimes, but we do. We subsidize education. We subsidize health. We subsidize seniors. We subsidize people who need public housing. Like, it comes in many forms. That's what public governments do. And it's important that we use our resources as wisely as we can to try to help as many people as we can. And would we not be able to find this type of money within our budget? As rightly said, it represents point 3 of our current budget. I mean, it's -- it's well within an easy threshold, if not a rounding error, on our budget. We could do this. And I would say that it would be a shame if we didn't rise to the occasion.

So I go back to this: What are we bringing to the table?

The urgency of discussion is saying, folks, collectively, let's get excited to say what I could do and you can do and we can do to help the people of Norman Wells. Because without that, there will be one person who spray paints that sign and says last person out, turn off the gas.

So, Mr. Speaker, in closing, I want to emphasize that we could probably talk about this as the proverbial cows come home. The problem is we can't wait anymore. The people of Sahtu can't wait anymore. The people of the Northwest Territories want something done. This is not a perfect solution so please don't think it is, but sometimes you got to accept good at the cost of avoiding perfect because we know perfect can take a long time and it can threaten it. And as I can see right now -- I'm just shown a picture, sorry, Mr. Speaker, I still have time. I'm seeing a picture on a text that there's no more fuel in Norman Wells. So whatever resources they're in a competitive market and have just become way more expensive. And when you're flying fuel in to fly it out, in other words flying fuel in for planes just to fly out, I mean, it gets pretty expensive. So if the town no longer has fuel, based on this text picture I just saw, it's a real crisis and we need every hand on deck saying what can we do with housing, how can those folks help there, how can we direct energy, what can the folks in MACA do to bring to the table to find solutions? What can ITI or education do from their point of view? What can the Minister of Finance find ways to find money in budgets or redirect things or even say can we delay things so we can help respond this? What can ECE do? You know, that's the type of attitude, everyone has to say we're willing to give something up to help people in the Sahtu region. Everybody's got to find something. And I think if we all recognize that, that our goal is to collectively solve this problem, I think we're halfway there. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you to the Member from YK Centre. Next I have is the Member from Great Slave.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will add my voice to support the Member for Sahtu and the community of Norman Wells. Much has been said already, and I'm going to keep my comments brief.

About a year ago I was talking to people in my riding during the election campaign and we spoke endlessly of chronic and persistent cost of living issues then. I think my key message was the cost of living is skyrocketing, and people are struggling to make ends meet. The Sahtu's crisis puts this into stark perspective, Mr. Speaker. This is an exceptional problem in our territory that deserves immediate action and relief. Others have already said much about solutions, and I think the MLA for Sahtu's voice should be the loudest in what we're contemplating today.

I also want to echo my colleague from Range Lake's note that he hopes that the federal government are listening. Norman Wells is a canary in the coal mine for exponential costs that we are facing due to crises that are hastened by climate change. I fear that this is a preview of more to come without proper resourcing, and I would urge us to act quickly. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Is there any other Members from this side of the House that -- I'm going to go to the Member from Frame Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think, you know, a lot's already been said as the previous Member said. I mean, I don't want to fully reiterate comments that are made but certainly offer my support to my colleague from the Sahtu and the people in Norman Wells. I know this is a difficult -- a difficult situation to be in and I can't imagine, you know, facing costs like that and trying to figure out how you're going to balance the bills because the bills don't balance.

Something I wanted to speak to that I haven't heard much of yet, so I thought I'd just add some points rather than kind of reiterating ones that have been made is just, you know, the Member for Sahtu kind of spoke to the need for short-term solutions and need for long-term planning, so I wanted to speak a bit to the long-term because it's something I have been thinking a lot about. And I think long-term, we really need to be thinking hard about what we're doing to help build resiliency of our small communities, particularly the ones up the Valley, and reduce dependency of these communities on these barge shipments, reducing dependency on the need for all this fuel coming in from the south, because ultimately that's the problem that we're facing here is this dependency, and we need to be building the independence of our communities. So I've been thinking about what we have or perhaps a better way of putting it is what we haven't been doing to prevent things like this from happening. So in my mind, I think, you know, speaking to the current crisis and the low water levels, perhaps that isn't something we could have predicted, but the high cost of living, climate change, these are things that we've known about for a very long time.

You know, I think back to when I was a young student at Aurora College, I did a tech project where I was investigating the biomass potential of the Mackenzie Valley and I was out, you know, with my equipment measuring willows and trying to quantify, using some software, the amount of biomass potential in the Mackenzie Valley, and it's enormous. We have huge potential for heating fuel here in the North, and it's a local source. And that's something that I think is really important. And I really wish when we're facing a crisis like this that have put a bit more time and thought into -- and maybe some urgency behind putting solutions like that in place so that these communities don't end up in these situations. So that's something that's really been on my mind. I think that looking forward in the long-term, we've got to be forward thinking and not be getting caught off guard by these things that I think, you know, the low water levels was unpredictable, but the fact that cost of living was going to come to a head is predictable. It is. We know that this has been an issue for a very long time. It's an issue in my community also. And, you know, I spoke to a lot of people at the doors during the election. A lot of people were raising concerns about the carbon tax, about cost of living, about, you know, the pressures that they're facing and the decisions that they're having to make, the difficult decisions that they're have to make when they're looking at their bills and having difficulty making ends meet. And I still hear from residents about being able to make ends meet, and it's really difficult to hear, and it definitely gives me a sense of urgency. And you know, when I think about the carbon tax revenues that are currently being brought in, I think the first and fairest and best use for these, these kind of revenues, should be used to help people transition away from the fuels that are providing the high cost in the first place. And when I think about the potential for biomass and other solutions in the Sahtu, in the Mackenzie Valley, you know, there's opportunities here to build community resiliency, reduce living costs, reduce dependency on shipments from the south, and create permanent jobs and an economy that's centered locally with local resources. That's a huge opportunity. That would be a really positive thing for many of our communities, and it would also help us build resiliency against crisis because I think that we need to be thinking as leaders how can we prevent crisis, not just respond to it. That really needs to be -- we need to be ten steps ahead as opposed to playing catch-up. So I -- you know, right now, we're not in the position of being ten steps ahead. What we're talking about is a moment of having to catch up. But what I want us to get to is a spot where we are saying we saw this problem coming, we know that there's solutions that we can put in place, these are solutions that could build resiliency in our communities, and we are putting the work in to making sure that that happens.

So that's really all I wanted to say was that's kind of what's on my mind when I'm thinking about long-term solutions. You know, there's -- there's advantages and disadvantages in the territory, and both of them have to do with the size of communities that we're dealing with in a lot of cases. It's very expensive to service communities over a vast land mass, but one of the advantages that we have is that the communities are quite small and so solutions like district heat are, relatively speaking, easier to put in place in smaller communities than they would be in huge cities. You know, when I think about the challenges that, you know, giant cities are trying to face in terms of building the kind of resiliency I'm talking about, it's a huge challenge. In the Northwest Territories, we're talking about relatively small communities. So I think actually think there's a lot of opportunity there, so we need to grasp those opportunities, help communities build their resiliency, help build up the economy of these communities locally, and I think that that's one of the long-term solutions. So that's one of the things that was on my mind.

But I did want to say that I'm supportive of us getting solutions in place. I think the situation that the people in Norman Wells are in is just simply untenable. You know, Mr. McNeely's been very eloquent and very determined in making sure that MLAs are well aware of this mounting crisis, and as the MLA for -- we're all forgetting the different districts today. The MLA for Range Lake pointed out the -- you know, the MLA for the Sahtu has been very vocal about this, has been, you know, e-mailing Members all through the summer. Like, this is not something that he's been quiet about. So all credit to that MLA for representing his constituency while he certainly hasn't been silent. And I do support us taking whatever measures we need to support people in Norman Wells and make sure that their costs are covered. Thank you.

I want to thank the Member from Frame Lake speaking to the debate. Next on my list, I got Member from Monfwi.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this press news release of October 16th from the Government of the Northwest Territories, it states: Climate change is a serious threat to our territory's economic, environmental, social, and culture held with the NWT. Experiencing rapid warming at up to four times the global rate and an increase in extreme weather event.

And I do sympathize, Mr. Speaker, with my colleague and the people from the Sahtu region where with the high cost of living. A lot of people that I know, they're working really hard. They're working to pay bills. And a lot of them do need fuel for heating and to provide food for the family to offset the costs. And living in the small communities, in the small remote communities, it's difficult for a lot of people. Even in my region, I have two communities, two fly-in communities. You know, with Wekweeti -- with the community of Wekweeti, the ice road was opened for one week and not enough time to bring in a lot of supplies. So for long-term solutions, what I would like to see is that -- yes, I will -- I do support this motion. But what I would like to see is that for long-term solutions, we need to start doing -- think about what to do with connecting the whole of the NWT where possible because even if we built more roads to small communities, we won't be in this crisis situations. We need to do more for small remote communities. And, yes, I do agree with a lot of the comments that were made where just because it doesn't affect me, doesn't mean that, you know, we cannot help and support. I do help and -- I do support and sympathize with the people of the Sahtu region because a lot of them are our friends and a lot of them are our families, and they're families with kids. You know, we have to think about that. And I do agree that I don't think I would like to see Norman Wells where at one time it was a thriving community just like my colleagues have said. We don't want to see it become a ghost town. And if it happens to that, how many other communities are going to follow? Especially the fly-in communities that rely on winter -- on the ice road, on the winter road. So therefore I really do support all-season road, and I will -- as long as I'm here, I'm going to keep advocating for all-season road to all the remote -- to the small remote communities. Thank you.

Thank you, Member from Monfwi. To the debate, next on my list is the Member from Mackenzie Delta.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I too are in support of my colleague from the Sahtu region as he speaks. As we are here, the Sahtu is dealing with the crisis, like my colleague just stated that the town of Norman Wells is out of fuel, so the residents need this government to step up and deal with this crisis.

This summer when Fort Good Hope was experiencing wildfire, Fort McPherson residents stepped up and they provided food and other essentials, and they boated it down to Fort Good Hope to assist them. That's the kind of help that we provide for each other no matter what region we are from. So we have to put all those aside. Just imagine the full-time employees are having a hard time dealing with having to pay for fuel. They can't make ends meet. These circumstances are different too because we have people in that region who are on the fixed income, the elders and the disabled who can't even meet this arrangement. So we have to make every effort to have our government meet these needs of the Sahtu.

It's evident that the Sahtu region will be losing resource people because they can't afford to stay within the Norman Wells or other communities in the Sahtu region. These are essential people that the residents of the Sahtu need on a daily basis. So, you know, with the low water levels over the past two years, there should have been a contingency plan put in place so we can deal with -- have something ready, readily available for any region that may have to deal with some emergency measures such as Sahtu's dealing with now. We knew about the low water levels a couple years ago and something should have been in place at this time. Every day we wait, we put the lives of the residents of the Sahtu in jeopardy. So we need all levels of government to step up, and starting with the Government of the Northwest Territories, to start making plans to help the residents of the Sahtu. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Member from Mackenzie Delta. To the debate, next I got on my list here is the Member from YK North.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker -- Mr. Substitute Speaker. Okay, first, I want to acknowledge that definitely this is a crisis. When people in Norman Wells are in danger of losing their housing because they can't afford to heat it this winter, we already have enough of a homelessness crisis and a housing crisis in this territory. We certainly cannot afford to make it any worse. But to avoid repetition, I just will try to focus on some points that haven't been mentioned yet by my colleagues.

So there are two different issues here. First is the issue of how we provide immediate relief to residents and businesses that are based in Norman Wells; and second, what is the longer-term solution going forward so we assure that we don't get ourselves into this situation again. I would argue that the two issues are actually linked because the way we choose to respond now to the immediate crisis will set precedents that do impact our longer-term options impasse. And I want to emphasize this is not about blame, but we need to understand how we got into this situation before we can figure out how to get out of it and how to avoid repeating this crisis.

So while the GNWT was planning ahead for projected low water levels and was trucking in fuel to all the other Sahtu communities over last year's winter road, Imperial Oil, the main fuel supplier to Norman Wells, apparently did not have the same incentive to plan ahead. Undoubtedly, they incurred significant extra costs by flying in fuel but we don't actually know, we can't verify, we don't have a regulatory mechanism, to help us know exactly what those extra costs were and to ensure that price increases are kept to the bare minimum rather than adding to Imperial Oil's profits. And we know there's a long history of large corporations that are in monopoly positions taking the opportunity during crisis situations to jack up prices and not lower them again. We saw that during the COVID crisis with grocery stores significantly raising food prices, and they have not gone back down. And even our federal government still has not been able to hold them accountable for those increased prices.

So the problem that I see with cutting a cheque to Imperial Oil is that we have no way to guarantee that they still won't unfairly raise prices from what they were previously while pocketing some of the government's subsidy as profit. They could cite all sorts of reasons that they need to raise their prices at any time, such as inflation, anything else, and how would we know if those reasons are valid? So I fear that we wouldn't have any recourse if the prices still go up even after full government subsidies to any increases that we expect at this point. And if we signal to a private company that's in a monopoly position that this government has bottomless pockets to subsidize whatever is necessary in terms of fuel costs, we are putting everyone in a very dangerous situation. So whatever we do, we need to set clear limits on the subsidies we can provide to Norman Wells.

In terms of the longer term solutions going forward, as I indicated earlier in my Member's statement, we do have opportunities to more ambitiously support, first, energy efficiency and conservation measures, as well as the transition to renewable fuel such as the wood stoves and pellet stoves that could help end the community's dependence on oil and diesel. And to prevent the situation from occurring again, I would propose that the GNWT could, and perhaps should, take over fuel services for Norman Wells and any other community where there is a fuel monopoly. The GNWT fuel services division already provides fuel to communities where there is no private market, where no private suppliers would step in and offer that fuel. I would argue that there's also no private market in communities where there is a monopoly. Because a monopoly is not a market. So when it comes to a product such as heating fuel that is needed to meet people's basic needs, it's such an essential product, the GNWT cannot continue to be put in the position of needing to bail out a huge multinational corporation that is in a monopoly position and controls people's ability to meet their basic needs simply, perhaps, because that company has failed to plan ahead and that has such a huge impact on the opportunity and its ability to meet its basic needs.

So I don't in this moment have all the solutions to this crisis and certainly we didn't have much notice of this particular debate, but those are the thoughts that I wanted to offer by way of caution as we move forward and try to figure out a way out of this crisis. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you to the Member from YK North. To the debate, next on my list here I have is the Member from the Deh Cho.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I too -- I lived in Norman Wells a few years ago, and people probably know that I lived in Norman Wells, and even back then the cost of living was high. So I cannot imagine what it's like today. And to know that right now that Norman Wells has run out of fuel, that's a crisis, that's an emergency situation. And there's no time to play around with people's lives today right now, to try to figure out -- wiggle around and figure out whether or not this company's doing that, that company's doing this. There's no time to figure that out. If this was your family, what would you do? That's what I'm -- that's what I'm thinking about. So $6,000 a month for fuel, no water, no barge. Norman Wells is a predominantly independent community. They don't -- people there are probably the most independent people. To ask for help, takes them a lot to ask for help. People know that, know that about Norman Wells. So if they could fix it, they would. They're in a crisis now. This has been going on for six months, no barge, no -- it's been unheard of. So right now, if you had no food, if you have no gas, if you have no oil, you're going to starve and you're going to freeze. It's cold outside. Not everybody's using propane or pellet stoves. And I'm not going to ask people to go out and cut wood in this day and age. We have to ask fuel -- it could be done, it could be delivered. So I'm not going to ask people to go out and cut wood today. It's cold out, it's getting cold out. So we have to have a discussion. We have to have this discussion. It's an emergency for the people in Norman Wells. Let's look at setting some clear limits, seeing what we can do, how we can do it, and when we could do it, not -- it's got to happen soon. That's -- this is the reality of this crisis situation right now. That's what I'm seeing.

I will support Norman Wells. I'll support the people of Norman Wells. They're asking for some help. I'll do that. They're -- it's just like us, I would do that for us. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you to the Member from the Deh Cho. Next on my list, I got the Minister of Finance.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, not everyone might be watching would have seen although they would have heard the vote. I do want to note and make the point that Cabinet although didn't speak initially to the motion did make a choice together that we would stand and support having this motion brought to the floor. We wanted to have this opportunity for everyone, including Members on this side of the House, with me, as an opportunity to speak to voice the recognition of what is happening in Norman Wells.

Mr. Speaker, everyone is voicing support for Norman Wells. I hope there's absolutely no doubt that everyone supports Norman Wells and has concern for the situation. I want to lay out a bit of the work that is happening already within government and some of the steps that I think are coming on the horizon of what will be happening next.

And, Mr. Speaker, this is not only a crisis in Norman Wells. Norman Wells, of course, is the hub community. They service the region of the Sahtu. When they are affected, the entire Sahtu community is affected. And I made that point to Imperial Oil when I spoke to them this morning, to just lay out that context, that this is going to affect the entire Sahtu. The more that one region is impacted, others are as well. Just as we saw last year with the evacuation of wildfires. This territory is deeply interconnected, and something that's affecting one small community affects us all.

Mr. Speaker, this is not as easy as just saying write a cheque. A cheque to whom and a cheque to what amount? Mr. Speaker, we want to find a solution that supports residents so that they can stay in their homes, stay in their homes comfortably, heat their homes through the winter, and do so in a way that is sustainable until we get the winter roads in for the resupply. But this is a crisis. It's a crisis that's affecting the whole of the Northwest Territories. It is having a huge financial impact on the Northwest Territories. Low water is affecting us in terms of the barge season. It's affected us in terms of there being a $14 million loss in terms of the revenue we would normally get. But it also affects us in terms of the ferries that have struggled this summer, in terms of roads that are struggling. In every single corner of this territory, there is a need to repair permafrost slumpage up to Tuktoyaktuk, challenges on the Dempster. It impacts the delivery of programs and services and contracts. We are in a dire situation right now in the Northwest Territories, Mr. Speaker, and we are feeling it financially.

NTPC is feeling it deeply right now in terms of what's happening with low water and the costs that are being incurred by the government just to try to keep power rates at the rate that they're at which is the highest rate of anywhere in Canada. We're subsidizing folks down to being at a Yellowknife rate. And I know this isn't necessarily about power rates but, Mr. Speaker, if Imperial Oil pulls out of Norman Wells, I'll tell you it's going to be about power rates real past because NTPC's going to be asked to supply. So there's all sorts of crises, and there's so many of them that are interconnected, and the players are interconnected. We can't just look at it as one thing as government. It is our responsibility to look at the whole of the territory, the whole of the crisis, how did we get here, how will we get out, and what's going to happen next. So I wish I could just simply stand and say don't worry, we're going to solve it tomorrow. But there is a real situation happening right now that we have to look at holistically as a government to make sure that we get this right, and we get it right into the long term.

So, Mr. Speaker, I do want to lay out a little of what we've done right now to date. It started lasting year. It started almost a year ago when we first saw that because of the barge situation in 2023 we were going to have to airlift, and it was the Government of the Northwest Territories that scrambled, that coordinated, and that found a way to make sure that the fuel got into Norman Wells and to the Sahtu region after that barge season so that nobody ran out of fuel before we got the winter roads in. We then were able to accelerate the winter roads and beef them up and make it so that we could plan for more trucks, more deliveries, we got the fuel deliveries into all of the fuel services division serviced communities. Fort Good Hope had to have an airlift because they were at the front lines of a wildfire yet again this year. That cost is being borne through the disaster assistance fund, no change. So the other Sahtu communities are seeing no change to their fuel rates since the June update after the winter road season. All of their fuel rates are expected to remain stable until they get the winter roads in this year.

We're already planning for the winter roads. And all of this costs money, Mr. Speaker, and it's costing extra money right now because everything's -- everything's been challenging and to bring those roads up to the level that they're at to be able to have more trucks on them, heavier trucks on them, more loads go in, it took a lot more work.

Mr. Speaker, we remained in contact, the Government of the Northwest Territories and Department of Infrastructure specifically, remained in contact with Imperial since last year. We had a lot of good meetings with them when we were still coordinating the airlifts last Christmas. Those contacts were very helpful. We've maintained them, and we stayed in touch all the way through our resupply last year up to the time when the barges were cancelled and leading to the moment when the barges were, in fact, cancelled right to the very end as we were getting information from the coast guard, from our senior captains, we were not delaying in getting that information in to any of the other partners. So folks in the Sahtu region, again, a lot of them had already planned through the winter road season, the different stores and suppliers had planned to try to get as much up as they could. And we tried to in every way possible to provide that assistance.

And then, Mr. Speaker, that brings me a little closer to now. So we certainly have known as of this summer that there was likely going to be a resupply by air going in this -- going in sometime this fall. Quite frankly, I would have expected it would be much later in the fall. I'm saddened that it is this early because that extends the period of time that we're going to be dealing with the cost of fuel coming in by flight and not having been able to wait until the winter roads. So ITI's met a number of times in the community, talked to a number of the suppliers, tried to identify a way where we could provide a relief package that would keep the costs down in the community, keep the costs of supplies down in the community, and that's where the $1.8 million program came in so that we could offer that to folks, to the business community, and they can then pass that on by keeping their costs down rather than passing all of their costs on to residents. We've also now are in a position to say that the rates for the senior home heating subsidy are going to be going up monthly so that ensures that all seniors who qualify for senior home heating subsidies will continue to see fully 80 percent of their costs covered. And in addition, Mr. Speaker, the income assistance programs are going to ensure that they will be paying actual heating costs and making sure that their measurements are attaching to the local market basket measure which is going to need to be adjusted when these costs go up. So those things are happening for the residents in the community as well.

This summer, Mr. Speaker, we airlifted 90 loads into Tulita to continue the work on the Tulita health care centre. Not only do we need that project, but we need the jobs to keep everyone employed and keep community employment up in the region. All of this comes with costs.

And so, Mr. Speaker, we're talking about how easy all this is, and it should be simple, but, Mr. Speaker, I want to speak a little bit about responsibility.

It is not about blame. There are residents who need to heat their homes as we're heading into winter. It's not about blame. But, Mr. Speaker, there is some responsibility here, and we certainly have, as a government, done everything to make sure that we were supplying the communities that we're responsible for, communicating with the contractors for the communities where we're not. We want to ensure, and we have to ensure, that we use public dollars responsibly. As I've said, our fiscal situation is dire. Climate change challenges, emergencies, crises, continue to befall us every year, every summer, in multiple communities at a time, and we have to have the capacity to respond. So when we do respond, we need to ask ourselves, who am I going to get that cheque to? Is it going to be on an income threshold? Will it be different if someone has used energy efficiency? Will it be different if someone has mitigated their costs? Do I provide cheques to companies that are going to continue to earn a profit on the sale of fuels? Or do I find some other pathway forward by which we can ensure that people are heating their homes?

Mr. Speaker, I certainly don't want to be seen to be blaming Imperial Oil overtly. I do want to question responsibility. I do think we've asked some good questions here today. We did have a good call with them today. We put it to them that this is a time to step up. As someone who's been in that community for 40 years drawing oil out, and now we need that oil to go back in. And, Mr. Speaker, they did take this away, and I'm expecting -- we've asked to meet with them again. I expect we'll be meeting with them again in the next few days when they've had a chance to go and see what opportunities they might have.

Similarly, Mr. Speaker, the federal government is actually a government -- the only government, not this government -- that's made any profit or any royalty off the Norman Wells oil field over the last 40 years. And, again, to their credit, they marshalled last week Members from multiple departments to meet with myself and Minister Cleveland and MLA from the Sahtu. We sat with them for a long time, talked through the challenge, talked through the problems, put to them the estimate here of $6.8 million, but really putting to them the idea that they need to help us find a path forward to support the residents who are going to be affected. Again, we've seen some follow up from them already just as of today, but I'm expecting that more is to come in the days coming.

So, Mr. Speaker, with all of that said, I'm left, again -- I want to emphasize for the residents that there is a lot happening. There is a lot of plates that are in the air. We are keeping them spinning. It is urgent. That's -- we all stood today to respect and the fact of its urgency. The asks are in. But I am looking to some sense of responsibility certainly with the federal government in particular. We are in a dire state, and the idea of moving a project and cancelling a project, Mr. Speaker, this budget was -- is very difficult to say where we cut a project, which project do we cut, which program do we turn back on. We are in dire need up here. Every project is urgent. Every project is on a risk base scenario. There's not an easy one to move or to cut, and so I am looking to colleagues in the federal government and to partners in Imperial Oil, and I want to assure them that -- the members of the Sahtu -- residents of the Sahtu, we're going to keep looking to them, keep working with them until we find a path forward. Thank you.

Thank you to the Minister of Finance. Any other Ministers want to speak to the debate? Seeing no further hands, okay, thank you. Seeing no further wanting to speak, I will adjourn the debate and return to the orders of the day. I want to go to written questions. Written questions. Seeing no written questions. I'm going to go to written questions. Mr. Clerk.