This is page numbers 513 - 544 of the Hansard for the 20th Assembly, 1st Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was communities.

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Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Julian Morse

Julian Morse Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you for your indulgence in allowing us an extra kind of -- to finish up our statements. I will try to be quick like I was yesterday.

So I left off on ITI and speaking to the economic vision. And just a few thoughts on that. I think I would like to see a timeline. I'd like to see that timeline be short and towards the beginning of this Assembly as opposed to toward the end. If we need to develop a vision, if we need to be implementing a vision, I want us to be implementing that vision, you know, today, and if not today, as quickly as possible, because I think if we're halfway through our term by the time we get a vision in order, it's not going to help us be strategic in our decision-making.

I also want to note about that, like, being strategic in our decision-making, if the vision that comes back is simply that we're going to do everything, I think that we haven't established a vision. The point of the vision is that we're going to have to be focused. We're going to have to make some decisions about what we are and are not doing, the direction that we're taking this territory, and I would really hope that that -- those decisions are based on evidence that we've collected and information that we use to make informed decisions about what's going to work, that we have evidence to support that.

And I think, again, I'm just going to note in this department, a lot of the measurables in here aren't outcome-based. Again, it's numbers of meetings held. This doesn't really tell us what we're achieving. It tells us what we're doing. But you could hold a lot of meetings and not achieve anything in any of them, so what are we looking to achieve in the meetings? Again, there's also kind of speaking in the business plan to supporting a diverse range of economic activities. But, again, what do we mean by this? I think that we need to be targeted and specific. There's some activities that certainly have more value than others. If we simply support everything, we're not really being strategic in the money that we're investing, we're not being strategic in this the directions that we're going.

Specifically in support for arts, again, I'd like to see us -- and this comment stands for the way that we fund NGOs also, but I want to speak to the arts specifically on this. I'd like to see us shift to more of an ecosystem-based approach to our thinking on how we're funding the arts. Recognizing that the number of artists or organizations funded doesn't actually tell us anything about the health of the sector, return on investment that we're getting. And recognition that arts is about culture also. It's not just about kind of growing industry, but that in some cases successful arts organizations are able to leverage a lot of federal funding. And that's not necessarily based on sales. It's based on the activity and the cultural heritage that they're developing. So I think we need to take a bit of a more holistic view of the arts and just note that -- you know, actually, I'm going to save my comments for a Member's statement about the ecosystem approach. But just noting that core funding for organizations is how we build up sectors. If we're just funding individual artists all over the place, we don't necessarily build the sector in a way that makes it sustainable and self-sustaining and give us that multiplier effect of the way funding can be -- the return on investment can be increased.

I'll share some short comments on Infrastructure's business plan. As the previous Speaker mentioned, we're being urged to pick a project. I think this is a wider discussion and -- but bottom line, I just want to note that there is a big disconnect between what we say we're planning to do and what we have the fiscal capacity to implement, and I feel like I'm, of course, preaching to the choir here. I mean, we've been -- the government's been telling us this since pretty much day one. But have we really stepped back and looked at some of these projects strategically and the work that Infrastructure is doing and said, you know, we're going to be strategic and focused about what we're doing, or, again, are we kind of trying to keep a number of things moving. I think that is a conversation that we have to have. I think also it's worth noting that a lot of these projects kind of have a very long timeline ahead of them. And we have mines -- you know, the closure of mines is coming in less than two years. I mean, we -- the downturn in the economy is coming quickly, and I think it's fair to say that none of the projects that are currently in the hopper are things that are going to immediately stimulate activity in the way that I think is being hoped that these infrastructure investments will make. So I think that we need to be kind of looking in a strategic way at that also. I mean, are we maybe trying to do things that are too big? Do we need to be focusing on the smaller pieces? And, again, as I noted yesterday, the foundation of the economy, building the foundation to ensure that we are taking the action to move forward in a positive way.

I'm going to move to Justice. Give me a second here. So Justice has been an interesting one for me to review. And I think there was some comments made today actually in the House when I was asking about this at the in-camera meeting, but I'll just refer to the House comments.

So we're establishing -- you know, reestablishing this territorial crime reduction unit. And you know, the Premier was saying today that we have kind of a high police-to-resident ratio, and I would just note that the numbers are showing an increase in crime despite that. And so what we seeing saying ourselves is that the approach that we are laying out here appears to not be working. And I think that we need to think about that a little bit. In some cases, you know, I'm just hoping that we're using an evidence-based approach to lay out our plans and that we are ensuring that we're putting the resources in the right place to get the results that we're looking for.

I just need to switch back to my other notes here.

Okay, and I'll share some short comments on housing, very high level. Looking at the housing business plan, I think when I first looked at this -- and this is getting a bit into budget conversation, and so I'll save my budget comments. But I was looking at it and thinking, okay, we said that we were prioritizing housing. It's a bit difficult to see in this budget. And I understand that looking at the business plan that the needs assessment is a key step towards obtaining federal funding for a plan. So I would like to see us, as a follow-up to the needs assessment, develop a long-term plan, developed in coordination with partners, and considering the federal funding that we can access, and would like that to become, yeah, the follow-up from the needs assessment. So I want to see us long-term planning. And, again, as opposed to kind of speaking to process in the business plan, what is the outcome that we're trying to achieve. We've got a needs assessment. That's telling us what is needed. And so obviously I'm hoping that the outcome becomes attached to the need that's identified in that, that that becomes the basis for our plan, and then we move forward in figuring out how we're going to fund it.

And another comment on housing, you know, I made a statement about this in the House in the last session -- or the last sitting of the session and will just say it again here. We are simply not funding operations and maintenance adequately to maintain our stock. And I think knowing that, we absolutely need to increase this item. I think if the Assembly wants to make good on our priority putting housing at the top of the list, this has to be on our radar. And we have to acknowledge that if we're not maintaining what we have, we're going to have an even bigger problem with -- how am I putting it? The needs assessment will end up kind of coming back on itself in the sense that we've identified what we need, but things are falling off on the back end. So we need to be maintaining what we have, building new to fill the gaps that we haven't filled, and hopefully wholistically moving forward with our housing plan.

So I'll leave my comments at that for now, Mr. Chair, on the business plans, and look forward to getting into the budget. And just to close, as I've said, I do hope that we, you know, create a process and find a time to dig into these with a bit more detail, being able to ask Ministers and departments questions about them and get through them because, know, it's a big document, and it's an important document, and I think taking a close look at this is a change that I'd love to see us implement, and I think it help us with effectiveness significantly. So I do hope that we can move forward in that way in the future. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 527

The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

Thank you, Member from Frame Lake. That was the first second round. I want to thank the committee for your general comments. I'm going to move the -- I'm going to go to the MLA for Inuvik Boot Lake.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Denny Rodgers

Denny Rodgers Inuvik Boot Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I move that the Tabled Document 94-20(1), 2024-2028 Business Plans, be referred to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight for further review. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

Thank you. The motion's in order. To the motion.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 527

Some Hon. Members

Question.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

The motion's been called. You're moving the motion? I'm going to go to the Member from Range Lake.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Kieron Testart

Kieron Testart Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I did want to speak to this because it is perhaps a new practice -- well, it is a new practice. So this is the first time the business plan's been tabled, and given the importance as kind of a guiding document for this Assembly, I think there is a need to do a more thorough review of the context of them.

My comments earlier today were more about the actual principle of the document and the technique around it rather than the contents. So I for one would like to do a more in-depth dive into what the government is committing to over the next four years, and I don't think we have -- we don't have the time to do that today. This format is -- I don't think this is the right format to achieve that. I do think the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight is an excellent place to do that. And I hope that the review of these plans will be in public and available to the public to see and hear their MLAs speak to what those commitments are, and also to have witnesses from the departments come forward and explain the decisions that were made. We've had great commentary from colleagues about those specific choices that were made and perhaps how they can be improved. And I think the best way to do that is by referring this to committee. It's going to be more work for us, but I think we're up to the task. So I do support this, and I thank the chair of the standing committee for bringing it forward. Thank you.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 527

The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

Thank you. To the motion.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 527

Some Hon. Members

Question.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 527

The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

Question has been called. All those in favour? Oh, sorry, sorry about that. I'm going to go to the Member from the Yellowknife South.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Caroline Wawzonek

Caroline Wawzonek Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Chair, my apologies. I think I just wasn't fast enough getting my hand up. Mr. Chair, just a very brief comment. Certainly, I know I'll just say for my own departments, I did find the comments today very helpful and wanted to encourage, you know, a couple of examples, again, drawing only really from my own departments, but it was just to say when I have my other hat on and not as Member for Yellowknife South, but it is a sincere hope that the business plans can be used in the main estimates reviews that we're about to go through. Having four-year business plans was something new only as of the last Assembly, and tieing them to the same timing as main estimates is new as of this process. So there are some growing pains in that process. It was something that I can say directors of policy and finance from across departments were very glad to see, certainly streamlines their work, rather than spreading it across the year but, more importantly, the main estimates provides the funding through which the departments do all of the things in the business plans, including the opening sections. So not every activity of every single public servant necessarily finds itself in the mandate document of the government, but every public servant is contributing to the core functioning of every department. And that is included in the opening sections of everyone's business plans, and it's often reflected throughout some of the background work that may be going into contributing to the mandate activities that are in the business plan.

So, for example, again, I'll rely only on finance, to the extent that there's questions around what kinds of recruitment activities there are, there is a section in main estimates for human resources, which then would be an opportunity to speak to what is happening in the human resources area and what they're doing to contribute to the mandate, what they're doing to contribute to retention of health care workers, for example.

In Infrastructure, I know there was mention specifically on the energy strategy. When the main estimates document comes forward, the energy and strategic infrastructure division has funding there, and it may well be an opportunity to ask what they're doing with their funding to advance that work and to see that it gets done quickly.

So throughout there was an opportunity here in saying that focusing on the business plans and not just the numbers in the budget, Mr. Chair, I hardly agree and, again, acknowledging this is the first time we've done it this way and acknowledging it's still a new Assembly, I sincerely hope that I -- I hope I'm not overstepping my speaking for my colleagues on this side, but I think we all want to speak to the business plans in conjunction with the, right now, proposed $2.2 billion associated with achieving all of the work in those business plans. So I hope we find a way that we can integrate that and also, of course, we'll look forward to what may come of committee's motion at accountability and oversight. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

Thank you to the Member from Yellowknife South. To the motion. Any other Members?

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 527

Some Hon. Members

Question.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

Question's been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? Motion's carried. Tabled Document 94-20(1) will be referred to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight for further review.

---Carried

Committee, do you agree that you have concluded consideration of Tabled Document 94-20(1), 2024-2028 Business Plan?

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Some Hon. Members

Agreed

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

Thank you. Committee, we have concluded consideration on Tabled Document 94-20(1). Thank you. I'm going to pass the mic to Inuvik Boot Lake. Thank you.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Denny Rodgers

Denny Rodgers Inuvik Boot Lake

I now move that the chair rise and report progress.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Richard Edjericon

There is a motion on the floor to report progress. The motion is in order and non-debatable. All those in favour? All those opposed? Motion carried.

---Carried

I will now rise and report progress. Thank you.

Committee Motion 4-20(1): Referral of Tabled Document 94-20(1): 2024-2028 Business Plans, to the Standing Committee on Accountability and Oversight
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Speaker

The Speaker Shane Thompson

May I have the report of the Committee of the Whole.

Report Of Committee Of The Whole
Report Of Committee Of The Whole

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Richard Edjericon

Richard Edjericon Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Mr. Speaker, your committee has been considering Tabled Document 94-20(1) and would like to report progress and motion carried that the consideration of Tabled Document 94-20(1) is concluded. And, Mr. Speaker, I move the report of the Committee of the Whole to be concurred with. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Report Of Committee Of The Whole
Report Of Committee Of The Whole

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The Speaker

The Speaker Shane Thompson

thank you, Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh. Do I have a seconder? Member from Great Slave. Thank you. All those in favour? Opposed? No opposed. Abstentions? Motion passed.

---Carried

Reports of Committee of the Whole. Third reading of bills. Orders of the day, Mr. Clerk.

Orders Of The Day
Orders Of The Day

May 28th, 2024

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Clerk Of The House Mr. Glen Rutland

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Orders of the day for Wednesday, May 29th, 2024, at 1:30 p.m.

  1. Prayer
  2. Ministers' Statements
  3. Members' Statements
  4. Recognition of Visitors in the Gallery
  5. Replies to the Budget Address, Day 4 of 7
  6. Acknowledgements
  7. Oral Questions
  8. Written Questions
  9. Returns to Written Questions
  10. Replies to the Commissioner's Address
  11. Petitions
  12. Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills
  13. Reports of Standing and Special Committees
  14. Tabling of Documents
  15. Notices of Motion
  16. Motions
  17. Notices of Motion for First Reading of Bills
  18. First Reading of Bills
  19. Second Reading of Bills
  20. Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
  • Minister's Statement 4-20(1): 2023 Wildfire Season Review and Planning for the 2024 Season
  • Minister's Statement 5-20(1): Emergency Management Preparation
  • Minister's Statement 17-20(1): Reaching Average $10 a Day Child Care in the NWT
  • Minister's Statement 24-20(1): Health Human Resources Recruitment and Retention
  • Tabled Document 93-20(1): 2024-2025 Main Estimates
  1. Report of the Committee of the Whole
  2. Third Reading of Bills
  3. Orders of the Day

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Orders Of The Day
Orders Of The Day

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The Speaker

The Speaker Shane Thompson

Thank you, Mr. Clerk. Colleagues, this House stands adjourned until Wednesday, May 29th, 2024, at 1:30 p.m.

---ADJOURNMENT

The House adjourned at 4:41 p.m.