Roles

In the Legislative Assembly

Elsewhere

Historical Information Roy Erasmus is no longer a member of the Legislative Assembly.

Last in the Legislative Assembly December 1999, as MLA for Yellowknife North

Lost his last election, in 2015, with 21% of the vote.

Statements in the House

Committee Report 2-13(7) Report On Bill 15: An Act To Amend The Legislative Assembly And Executive Council Act July 26th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, Members of the standing committee echo the words of the Premier in his statement in the House of March 24, 1999:

Given the unique opportunities that we have, it is unfortunate that we have become sidetracked in a divisive debate over electoral boundaries. This debate has the potential of setting back everything we have been trying to build for the last 30 years, derailing the hard work of trying to frame joint priorities and to assert our independence from DIAND's rule. No one northern group can win at this debate but we can all lose.

Members of the standing committee regret that it has come to this. It is shameful that issues so central to the development of the North and the future of all Northerners -- aboriginal and non-aboriginal -- are being decided by the courts. They should be decided by northern people. The government had the opportunity to demonstrate true leadership and chose not to do so. In the words of one presenter "We feel betrayed".

The Constitutional Working Group had been working on the development of constitutional and governance arrangements that would be acceptable to Northerners and that would allow us to move forward as a strong and united territory. Consultations were put on hold in late 1998 pending further progress in the self-government arena. However, there is now a more urgent need to develop a principled means for public and aboriginal governments to work together, and to find a balance between individual and collective rights.

The NWT Supreme Court decision, the introduction of Bill 15 and the impending dissolution of the Assembly in a few short months combine to have serious consequences. Unrealistic time frames and pressures have been placed on all parties. The standing committee is very concerned about the long-term effects of this situation. The potential is very evident for relationships to be permanently impaired, trust destroyed and communities pulled farther apart.

As a result, it is the view of committee members that Bill 15 must be considered a temporary, stopgap measure only. It may be a necessary step in light of the current legal dilemma faced by the Legislative Assembly, the lack of action by the government and now the lack of time available. However, it should remain in place only until a more workable and acceptable long-term solution can be developed. Further, this Legislative Assembly must ensure that a process is set in motion so that a workable solution is reached soon, in partnership with all northern people, within the life of the 14th Assembly.

The committee has several recommendations which, taken together, will help to provide some assurance that the voices of people in the regions will be heard in the 14th Assembly, and ensure that momentum is carried through the next election and work on resolving these issues carries forward.

This Assembly cannot shrink from its responsibilities and hide behind court decisions. It must make responsible political decisions now for the future. We do not have the luxury of postponing these issues for the deliberations of a future Assembly. The committee's recommendations will institute a process so that work may begin on constitutional and electoral reform issues immediately after the upcoming election and so that some resolution may be achieved during the life of the 14th Assembly.

Sunset Clause.

Committee members feel strongly that Bill 15 must be an interim measure only, to allow time for a satisfactory solution to be developed. A sunset clause would provide that the electoral districts put in place by Bill 15 would be repealed on dissolution of the 14th Legislative Assembly. With no boundaries to take their place, the government would be required to act. The sunset clause would send a clear message to the Government of the Northwest Territories that it is urgent that it work with aboriginal and community governments and other stakeholders to reach agreement on governance in the NWT during the 14th Assembly.

The Committee is aware that constitutional questions may be raised if a sunset clause is implemented and the possibility exists for a constitutional "vacuum" at some point in the future. However, this is an area of the law that is far from clear. There is no need for an unconstitutional situation to arise, as the committee intends, and fully expects, that action will be taken to resolve governance issues in a manner satisfactory to northern people during the life of the 14th Assembly. In the committee's view, legislatures have a duty to act boldly when necessary.

The committee also recognizes that a legislature cannot bind itself. If a new system is not established through legislation before the end of the 14th Assembly, the government would have the option of introducing a bill to remove the sunset clause. The boundaries established by Bill 15 would then remain in place for the election of the 15th Assembly. However, this would at least be a very public action, and subject to public debate. The government would be accountable to the residents of the Northwest Territories for its failure to resolve these issues and introduce reforms.

Members raised the concept of the sunset clause with the Premier during the clause by clause review of Bill 15 on July 26, 1999. The rules of the Legislative Assembly allow Bills to be amended during a standing committee review if the Minister sponsoring the bill concurs with the amendment. However, committee Members felt that it would be more appropriate for such an amendment to be dealt with on the floor of the House, during the review of Bill 15 in committee of the whole. This would allow a full public debate to occur, in which all Members could participate.

Therefore, Mr. Speaker, the committee recommends that Bill 15 be amended in committee of the whole to provide that section 2 and schedules A and B of the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act are repealed upon the dissolution of the 14th Legislative Assembly.

Political Accord

Mr. Speaker, western MLAs and the Aboriginal Summit concluded over a year ago that a political accord on western territory issues is urgently needed. On June 4, 1998, the Legislative Assembly passed a motion "that the Government of the Northwest Territories begin discussions with the Government of Canada and elected leaders representing all the western Northwest Territories regional aboriginal governments as may be represented by the Western NWT Aboriginal Summit, to negotiate a political accord which would set out the ongoing relationship between the parties". The Assembly also requested that the parties make every effort to reach an agreement on a political accord by October 30, 1998.

A political accord would set out the roles and relationships between the parties, and set a framework for ongoing cooperation on constitutional and governance issues and major GNWT policy initiatives.

The political accord contemplated in June, 1998, was not developed, for various reasons including the withdrawal of the federal government from the discussions. However, during the past several months, members of the Aboriginal Summit and Western Caucus had agreed that work on a political accord should be renewed between the two parties and agreement reached as soon as possible.

Committee Members had expected that with the issues raised by the electoral boundaries court decision, the government would make increased efforts toward reaching a political accord that could be presented as a companion document to Bill 15. That has not happened. At the pace at which discussions are proceeding, an accord may not happen for a very long time.

A political accord could provide a structured mechanism for aboriginal governments to have meaningful input into GNWT decisions that affect aboriginal people. A political accord will eventually be overtaken by governance reforms, but until they are in place, an accord should be a key component of governing in the new western territory.

Committee Members believe, however, that the GNWT must demonstrate some real commitment, effort and resources to the process. The standing committee has been asking for a GNWT workplan with respect to the political accord since early June, 1999. If the GNWT is not going to focus its efforts on concluding an accord, Cabinet should make that clear.

If the GNWT is committed to the process, negotiations should take into account the recommendations of this committee later in this report for legislation establishing a Constitutional and Electoral Reform Commission. The political accord process would be an appropriate mechanism for the GNWT and aboriginal governments to develop terms of reference for the commission for implementation in legislation this fall.

Mr. Speaker, the committee recommends that the Government of the Northwest Territories develop a workplan with clear timelines for the negotiation of a political accord with NWT aboriginal governments for review by the Standing Committee on Government Operations by September 1, 1999.

Legal Reference

Committee members feel strongly, as outlined earlier, that issues as fundamental as the governance of the new Northwest Territories must be decided by northern people. However, there is now a Northwest Territories Supreme Court decision suggesting that the right to vote protected by section 3 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms is not to be read together with the sections which protect and guarantee aboriginal and treaty rights. This is of great concern to aboriginal people because of the significance placed on the inclusion of these rights when the constitution was repatriated in 1982. All sections of the Charter must be given equal weight.

Leave to appeal was not granted to the intervenors, and the government chose not to appeal. This decision is therefore binding in the Northwest Territories, and will colour all future discussions and negotiations with aboriginal people.

The interpretation of section 25 of the Charter and section 35 of the Constitution Act, 1982 is central to the relationship between governments and aboriginal peoples. This is as true in the rest of Canada as it is in the Northwest Territories. Committee members believe that this issue must be clarified. Since the government did not appeal the court decision, it has no further avenue in this case. However, the question should be referred to a higher court. A reference to the Supreme Court of Canada would clarify the legal principles involved for aboriginal people and all levels of government throughout the country.

Mr. Speaker, the committee recommends that the Government of the Northwest Territories urge the federal government to commence a legal reference without delay before the Supreme Court of Canada; and further, that the Court be requested to clarify the interpretation of section 25 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms and section 35 of the Constitution Act, 1982, in relation to the other provisions of the Charter and the Constitution of Canada, and in particular, section 3 of the Charter; and furthermore, that the Government of the Northwest Territories provide the Standing Committee on Government Operations with a proposed question to be provided to the federal government by October 1, 1999.

Regional Voice

Mr. Speaker, one of the consistent messages heard by the committee in communities outside Yellowknife was that if Bill 15 passes, there must be new mechanisms developed to ensure that the messages and issues specific to people in the regions are duly considered by the next Legislative Assembly.

Cabinet Composition (2-2-2) Proposal

As discussed, committee members heard views from many presenters on the 2-2-2 proposal, which would ensure regional representation on Cabinet. The proposal has also received support from some Cabinet Ministers. This balance could be achieved through political convention, or it could be formalized, either in the rules of the Legislative Assembly, or in legislation, in the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act.

Some individuals preferred that the proposal be implemented through convention, so that flexibility is maintained. However, Members of the standing committee feel strongly that the 2-2-2 proposal must be embodied in legislation if it is to provide some degree of assurance to residents in the regions that they will be adequately represented on Cabinet. Both political conventions and the rules of the Assembly are too easily changed, and such changes might more easily escape public notice. Legislation is not completely inflexible; it can be changed by the Assembly when necessary. However, to do so, a bill would have to be introduced, ensuring a level of public debate on the issue.

Two Cabinet Ministers should be selected from the constituencies of Nunakput, Inuvik West, Inuvik East, Mackenzie Delta, Sahtu and North Slave. Two should be selected from the constituencies of Nahendeh, Deh Cho, Hay River South, Hay River North, Thebacha and Tu Nedhe. The remaining two would be selected from Yellowknife.

The standing committee also considered the size of Cabinet in a 19 Member Assembly, if Bill 15 is passed. It is the committee's view that the size of Cabinet should remain at six. The Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act should be amended to ensure that the number of Members on Cabinet does not increase. In the opinion of committee members, this will provide a better balance between Cabinet and Ordinary Members, and the workload for six Ministers will be manageable. Those Members who feel that the duties are too onerous are not required to put their name forward for selection for Cabinet.

Therefore, Mr. Speaker, the committee recommends that the government introduce legislation to amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act to provide that the Executive Council of the Northwest Territories consists of six Members; and further, that the amendment to the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act require that there be regional representation on Cabinet as follows:

- two Cabinet Members selected from the constituencies of Nunakput, Inuvik West, Inuvik East, Mackenzie Delta, Sahtu and North Slave;

- two Cabinet Members selected from the constituencies of Nahendeh, Deh Cho, Hay River North, Hay River South, Thebacha and Tu Nedhe; and

- two Cabinet Members selected from constituencies in Yellowknife; and furthermore, that the government introduce the amendments to the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act to implement regional representation on Cabinet and to specify the size of Cabinet for passage before dissolution of the 13th Legislative Assembly.

Mr. Speaker, the standing committee also heard clearly that in addition to the Cabinet composition proposal and measures for regional economic development, models for governance should be examined that provide a measure of control to smaller populations outside of the major centres.

Various suggestions were made to the standing committee for further consideration. For example, an aboriginal or regional "Senate" like body could be created, to scrutinize proposed legislation and policy. Provisions could be put in place for a "regional veto" over actions that could be detrimental to a region.

There are many models that could be examined for adaptation to the Northwest Territories. For example, Australia's federal senate is composed of equal representation from the six states. There are 76 Senators, 12 from each state, regardless of the size, and two from each territory.

The Senate was constituted in this manner to ensure that the interests of less populous states would not be diminished in a parliament where the majority of the Members of the House of Representatives come from the two largest states. It gives the small states some protection from domination of the majority. Its main function is as a >house of review', and in practice, bills are amended frequently. The Senate also has nearly equal legislative powers to the House of Representatives, except that it cannot initiate or amend money bills.

Where a bill does not affect provinces, each delegate in the NCOP has one vote. Amendments made go back to the National Assembly for acceptance or rejection. Where a bill affects provinces, each province has one vote. In other words, there must be consensus within each province on the bill.

Members of the public expressed their conviction throughout the committee hearings that there is a vast range of possibilities to create a model of governance that truly fits the North. Members of the standing committee agree. The committee recommends broad constitutional and electoral reform later in this report, and detailed consideration should be given during this process to models for regional control appropriate to the North.

Mr. Speaker, early in the committee's review of Bill 15, the committee retained outside legal counsel specializing in aboriginal and constitutional issues to provide an opinion on the constitutionality of creating a separate aboriginal constituency within the city of Yellowknife. Members of the committee considered that separate representation may be necessary to ensure that the voice of aboriginal people in Yellowknife is effectively heard, particularly in relation to the development of self-government and how services to urban aboriginal people are planned, funded and delivered.

The idea of ensuring separate aboriginal participation in legislatures is not new. The Maori in New Zealand, for example, have had four guaranteed electoral districts since 1867. Aboriginal electoral districts have been suggested for many years in the federal system, and were recommended by the federal Committee for Aboriginal Electoral Reform and the Royal Commission on Electoral Reform and Party Financing (the Lortie Commission) in 1991.

In its report "Reforming Electoral Democracy", the Lortie Commission suggested that while aboriginal seats should not be guaranteed, aboriginal constituencies should be created by a process guaranteed in the Canada Elections Act. This would provide for the creation of aboriginal constituencies in provinces whenever sufficient numbers of aboriginal voters choose to register on an aboriginal voters' list. The commission made a series of recommendations detailing how the constituencies would be created. The commission commented that "the creation of aboriginal constituencies would build upon the Canadian tradition of accommodating both individual and collective rights".

The committee emphasizes, as did the Lortie Commission, and the Committee for Aboriginal Electoral Reform, that aboriginal representation is not to be considered as an alternative to aboriginal and treaty rights, including the inherent right of self-government for aboriginal people. Rather, effective representation in the NWT Legislative Assembly and self-government can be complementary forms of representation.

The committee's counsel, Mr. Kenneth Tyler, held the view that one of the proposals suggested by the committee could be implemented. The proposal would re-divide the existing four Yellowknife ridings into six constituencies with approximately equal non-aboriginal population, and permit aboriginal voters resident in the city to elect one member-at-large. Aboriginal voters would have the option of voting in either the aboriginal "at large" constituency or in the Yellowknife constituencies in which they reside.

Mr. Tyler provided a detailed letter to the committee. In his opinion, the Legislative Assembly of the Northwest Territories has the competence to implement the proposal under the existing Northwest Territories Act. Legislation creating an aboriginal constituency could be justified under the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms if it could be shown that the special situation of aboriginal people in Yellowknife requires particular measures to ensure their effective representation.

Mr. Tyler also carried out some work on the committee's behalf examining the legislative amendments that would be needed, in particular to the Elections Act and the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act.

Members of the standing committee were encouraged by the options available for the creation of an aboriginal constituency. Committee members recognize that widespread consultation would be required, and the proposal is not one that could be implemented in the short time left in this Assembly. The aboriginal constituency model has merit, however, and should be examined closely during the life of the next Assembly, within the context of broader electoral and constitutional reforms.

Mr. Speaker, it is clear to committee members that a process must be instituted to ensure that constitutional and governance issues are given full attention during the 14th Assembly. There is a great deal of work on the issue to build on. If we are creative, a model unique to the North can be designed and there is a vast range of experience throughout the world from which to learn.

At the moment, the Legislative Assembly is constrained by the authority provided to it in the federal Northwest Territories Act. However, if work on constitutional and electoral reform begins early in the life of the 14th Assembly, there should be sufficient time to have any necessary amendments to the Northwest Territories Act passed by the federal Parliament so that Northwest Territories legislation can be enacted for the 15th Assembly.

What the committee proposes is a large task. Other groups have made progress on developing these issues in the past, but there is now increased urgency. The 13th Assembly should pass a bill to establish an independent Constitutional and Electoral Reform Commission, to begin its work as soon as possible.

The objective of the Commission would be to develop a comprehensive constitutional and electoral reform proposal for consideration by the public at a constitutional conference. The basic elements of a formal constitution, as outlined by the Bourque Commission, are:

- The name and description of the geographic area to be covered by the constitution,

- A definition of the people to be governed by the constitution, together with a statement of their unique and shared experiences, values, interests and aspirations,

- Statements of any special rights and freedoms enjoyed by people governed by the constitution,

- A description of the orders of government, if any and the ways authority and responsibility are divided among the orders of government,

- The kinds of institutions which will make laws, decisions and settle disputes in these orders of government,

- How people are appointed or elected to serve in these governing institutions, and

- The way in which a constitution is amended.

The mandate of the commission should be broad and enabling. Much can be learned from the work that has been done on these issues to date by previous bodies. The commission would be expected to carry out public consultations and to keep the public informed of its progress. Some of the issues that the committee would expect to be before the commission for consideration include options for:

- regional and aboriginal representation in the NWT legislature,

- multi-member constituencies,

- aboriginal constituencies,

- guaranteed aboriginal representation,

- constituencies which reflect traditional land use,

- a regional government structure,

- the creation of an aboriginal ombudsman,

- providing a choice for aboriginal people resident in urban centers to vote in their home ridings, and

- structures for regional autonomy and the protection of regional interests, including options such as a regional Senate, weighted votes on money bills, requirement for regional approval on key legislation or policy affecting them.

Membership of the commission should reflect a fair representation of northern people, developed in cooperation by the GNWT, aboriginal governments and other stakeholders. The commission should comprise equal numbers of aboriginal and non-aboriginal people, with representation from women. It should be small enough to be a workable size. And I must stress, it must be properly resourced, and its members must be able to commit the time necessary to focus on such a large and complex task to its completion.

The standing committee recognizes that the work of the commission will entail costs, and that fiscal restraint will be a key theme of the 14th Assembly. However, this will be an investment in our future. The financial implications if nothing is done to resolve the constitutional gridlock are tremendous.

The committee heard during the public hearings, and it is public knowledge, that there will be no resource revenue-sharing arrangements if the rift caused by Bill 15 is not healed. Aboriginal people will not support any devolution to the GNWT under these circumstances. People in the communities and regions feel a great animosity toward Yellowknife, in particular. Never has it been more important to address these issues in a comprehensive and meaningful fashion. The risk lies in not acting.

In the past, when the GNWT has commissioned reports, after all the work has been completed and the recommendations made nothing is done. There is no process for moving forward.

Other jurisdictions have held binding referenda on questions of fundamental constitutional or electoral reform. For example, a binding referendum in New Zealand in 1993 resulted in the adoption of a mixed member proportional electoral system for the country. British Columbia, Alberta, Australia and Ireland each have legislation requiring a binding referendum to be held before any constitutional amendment is approved. The standing committee agrees with this approach.

The recommendations of the Constitutional and Electoral Reform Commission should be presented to the public at a broad-based constitutional conference. The main goal of the conference should be to develop a question or set of questions on constitutional and electoral reform to take to all Northwest Territories voters for approval in a binding referendum. The government should then be required to take steps to implement the results of the referendum as soon as practicable.

The commission should recommend, for resolution at the conference, the percentage of voters required to approve the referendum proposals. The commission may also wish to consider whether a mechanism for regional approval might be appropriate.

In the committee's view, the reform process should be able to be concluded within the life of the 14th Assembly with dedicated effort, adequate resources and a strict time frame. Members also feel strongly that there are too many ongoing strategies, forums, consultations and other >tables'. The Minister's Forum on Education recently completed its report and was followed by a Minister's Forum on Health and Social Services. An Economic Strategy Panel has been appointed to carry out consultations. There have been various formal and informal constitutional discussion tables. With a small population and a finite number of individuals available to participate, issues become fragmented and able people are pulled in too many directions. It is time for more focus. The committee encourages the government to scale down its initiatives wherever possible, and concentrate its attention over the next four to five years to resolving the critical constitutional questions.

The committee recognizes that any significant proposals for change during the next Assembly will require the concurrence of the federal government, assuming amendments to the federal Northwest Territories Act would be required. If the commission can begin its work in early 2000, the public should be able to consider its recommendations at a constitutional conference by June, 2002. This would allow a referendum and necessary federal amendments to be completed before the following election.

Therefore, Mr. Speaker, the committee recommends that the government introduce legislation for passage during the 13th Legislative Assembly to establish a Northwest Territories Constitutional and Electoral Reform Commission; and further, that the legislation give the commission a broad mandate and require the commission to develop a comprehensive constitutional and electoral reform proposal for consideration by the public at a constitutional conference by June 30, 2002; and furthermore, that the legislation require that recommendations for reform be submitted for approval by all Northwest Territories voters in a binding referendum; and furthermore, that the legislation require that any electoral and constitutional legislative changes approved by Northwest Territories voters in a referendum be introduced for passage prior to the dissolution of the 14th Assembly.

The recommendations made by the standing committee in this report reflect the views and suggestions made by the public to the committee during the public hearing process. The recommendations should be made a priority of the 14th Assembly. Members of Cabinet have repeatedly said in the House that they want a political solution. To quote the Premier, "building understanding of the issues and reaching a political resolution is critical if we are to move beyond this issue as a unified new territory".

If the government chooses not to support the standing committee recommendations, it has a duty to all northern people to present other options now for a cooperative process to resolve the current crisis. If it does not, it risks seeing the territory break apart. There is a very real and present risk that the rift created by Bill 15 will widen and the political, social and economic harmony shared by all of the people of the Northwest Territories will be seriously jeopardized. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, that concludes the committee's report on Bill 15. I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Tu Nedhe, that committee report 2-13(7) be received by the Legislative Assembly and referred to committee of the whole for further consideration.

Committee Report 2-13(7) Report On Bill 15: An Act To Amend The Legislative Assembly And Executive Council Act July 26th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Standing Committee on Government Operations is pleased to report on its review of Bill 15, An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act. Bill 15 was introduced for first reading in the Legislative Assembly on March 23, 1999, by the Honourable Jim Antoine, Premier. The bill received second reading on March 24, 1999, and was automatically referred to the Standing Committee on Government Operations for review. Under the rules of the Legislative Assembly, the standing committee had 120 days to review and report on the bill. The standing committee met on several occasions to discuss background research material and legal opinions commissioned by the committee. As well, the committee conducted public hearings on Bill 15 in Inuvik, Rae, Yellowknife, Fort Simpson, Fort Smith and Hay River, from June 14 to July 7, 1999, beginning with the presentation of the bill by the Premier in Yellowknife. Committee Members also met with the Chiefs and Council of the Yellowknives Dene First Nation on June 25, 1999, and attended the Dene National Assembly in Jean Marie River on July 8, 1999.

Prior to the hearings, the committee placed advertisements in every newspaper in the Northwest Territories informing the public of the committee's review, inviting oral presentations and written submissions and advising that applications for travel assistance would be considered by the committee. Public service announcements were also aired on CBC Radio, and notices were placed on the community television channels, where available. Media advisories were sent detailing the communities where hearings would be held. The committee also provided packages with boundary maps and other explanatory material about Bill 15 and an offer of assistance to appear before the committee to over 70 identified interested parties.

This committee report was prepared by those Members of the Standing Committee on Government Operations who participated in the public hearing process: Roy Erasmus, chair, David Krutko, Don Morin and James Rabesca. Members of the committee who participated support the views of the public that are expressed throughout the report. Jane Groenewegen, Seamus Henry and Jake Ootes did not participate in the public review of Bill 15 or the preparation of this report.

The Standing Committee on Government Operations would like to thank all of the individuals and organizations who made their views known to the committee at the public hearings or by written submissions. The comments and suggestions made were thoughtful and creative and were considered carefully by the committee during its deliberations.

Appendix 1 contains a list of witnesses who appeared before the committee. Copies of the written submissions received are attached as appendix 2.

Mr. Speaker, I will now turn the next portion of the report to my colleague, Mr. Rabesca.

Member's Statement 186-13(7): Resource Revenue-sharing Issues July 26th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to speak about a number of issues that are related to resource revenue-sharing. Mr. Speaker, for sometime now we have been hearing that we are going to be going into a deficit soon unless we find another source of revenues and we are looking to resource revenue-sharing or a Northern Accord that would bring control and benefits of northern resources to the North. I was interested to hear the Minister speak about the Community Government Leaders' Conference because I was also there. I heard aboriginal leaders saying that it is going to be difficult to get a resource revenue-sharing agreement because that is the last ace in the hole for the aboriginal leadership.

I think that this government needs to do something concrete to earn the trust of the aboriginal leadership if we are going to attain a Northern Accord. But what are we doing in this area, instead our government is talking about making it easier for development, making it faster for development to occur. Why should areas like my constituents who have no land claim, why should they want to speed up development? They do not. They want to slow it down so that they can be better prepared for when development occurs so that they can actually benefit from development. What else are we doing? We are passing Bill 15, five new seats to the larger communities and we know this has to be passed, but at the same time we need to provide the smaller communities with a comfort zone. We need to provide them with something concrete, now. Not just promises that something is going to happen after the next Legislature comes into effect and you have those new five extra MLAs. Mr. Speaker, what I am trying to say is that if this government hopes to attain a resource revenue-sharing agreement or better known as a Northern Accord, then we have to provide that comfort zone to the regions and the smaller communities now. Thank you.

--Applause

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters July 25th, 1999

Thank you, Madam Chairperson. I move that we report progress.

Item 12: Reports Of Committees On The Review Of Bills July 25th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I wish to report to the Legislative Assembly that the Standing Committee on Government Operations has been reviewing Bill 15, An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, and wish to report that Bill 15 is ready for consideration in committee of the whole. Thank you.

Question 228-13(7): Consultations With Northern Addictions Services Board July 25th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I remember well the discussions and I also remember very well that never, ever did the Social Programs Committee ever direct the government to put the Northern Addictions Board out of their own business and make them start doing some work in the area of children, which may not even be related to alcohol and drugs which has become the speciality of this board. They were the first board that provided these type of services. Now we are asking them go do something else, become an expert in another field. It is beyond me how anyone could go to a board like that and tell them to do that. My final supplementary question is, where are these facilities from which the gender specific programs were going to be and I suppose are still going to be run out of? Thank you.

Question 228-13(7): Consultations With Northern Addictions Services Board July 25th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Basically, they would have still been involved in their own building. Presumably, that is so they could pay off their mortgage before the government took it over or something. Could the Minister commit to providing us with some information on this master plan, perhaps a briefing because it just does not seem to be quite right that other people could dictate to a non-profit organization that they should change their focus from being an alcohol and drug addiction organization to one that deals with children no matter what is wrong with those children, whether they are schizophrenic or whether they are dealing with drug and alcohol? Could the Minister commit to this, please?

Question 228-13(7): Consultations With Northern Addictions Services Board July 25th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister has indicated that there would have been alcohol and drug treatment being done out of other facilities. What would the NAS board's new role be since they would have been basically kicked out of their own building? Thank you.

Question 228-13(7): Consultations With Northern Addictions Services Board July 25th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions are for the Minister responsible for Health and Social Services. It is a continuation of earlier questions on the Northern Addictions Services Rehabilitation Centre. The Minister had indicated that as far as he knew, the NAS board had been involved in drawing up the plan. He also indicated that the plan had included reprofiling the Northern Addiction Services Rehabilitation Centre to a centre that would work with children. What I would like to know from the Minister is whether the NAS board agreed to no longer provide alcohol and drug rehabilitation in their own building? Thank you.

Question 225-13(7): Reprofiling Northern Addictions Centre July 25th, 1999

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The information that I received is that the board and staff are basically presented with a plan that has already been drafted by some group, staff persons, or whomever, but that they really had no input into the formulation of this plan, whether or not they actually wanted to shut down their rehabilitation centre and turn it into some other type of facility for children. Would the Minister indicate whether this is actually true or what actually occurred there? Thank you.