Good afternoon. Orders of the day for Tuesday, February 25, 1992. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Patterson.

Ministers' statements. Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Members' statements. Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I rise to speak on an issue of how a Member, particularly a Minister, spoke yesterday in this House. Mr. Speaker, the Member for Iqaluit conducted himself in a manner that I do not believe is acceptable to myself and to Members of this House. Mr. Speaker, I quote from Hansard, the comment said: "If it is skewed to the West, it should be called the western special committee on social..."

The concern that I want to address, Mr. Speaker, is the point that when we have a Minister who is responsible to look after the interests of all NWT residents with an open mind of fairness, and when we have a Minister that we place our trust in to develop policies, regulations and legislation for the future of our Territories, I am concerned that this particular Minister has the mentality of an East/West concept when developing responses to issues.

With these comments, Mr. Speaker, due to the attitude and the conduct he displayed toward Members, if the Minister wants to maintain any credibility in this House I would suggest that he consider apologizing for his inconsiderate comments. Thank you.

Members' statements. Mr. Patterson.

Mr. Speaker, I apologize for my ill-considered comments yesterday.

---Applause

Thank you, Mr. Patterson. Mr. Gargan.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I was shocked and dismayed yesterday with a response I received from the Minister responsible for the Status of Women Council during question period.

I am sure honourable Members will recall that I asked the honourable Member for Natilikmiot what action he had taken to seek the advice of the Status of Women Council on the shameful decision of our territorial court to grant Paul Quassa an absolute discharge. The Minister did not answer my question. He did not refer to the council or its executive director. His only comment was, "Since the decision has been made, on a number of occasions I have talked about this with my wife."

Mr. Speaker, this response is clearly unacceptable. The people of the Northwest Territories commit over a quarter of a million dollars yearly to support the council. The members of the council, and their staff, invest even more in terms of time, energy and devotion they bring to the cause. For the Minister to seriously suggest that he would not actively seek the opinions of this group of skilled and thoughtful Northerners because he had chosen to talk to his wife instead shows little respect for the members of the council or the work that they do. It also shows disrespect for women in general because it suggests that, unless you are married and have a husband who listens, your views will not be considered by this government. It is possible that the Minister may have been trying to make a joke with his answer. Mr. Speaker, this is not acceptable, either.

Throughout the Northwest Territories women, and men too, have taken note of the Quassa affair and what it says about both the justice system and our current constitutional political process. This is not a joking matter, Mr. Speaker, and the Minister should know that. We should take a serious position on the issue and should begin to rely on the advisory resources that exist within the Status of Women Council and our community organizations across the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Members will join me in welcoming Mr. Gary Bohnet to our Assembly. As we know, Mr. Bohnet is the president of the Metis Nation. Members' statements. Mr. Antoine.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, allegations about the 1990/1991 delivery of HAP houses for

three Nahendeh communities by the Liidli Koe Construction Association have caused discouragement and resentment within my constituency. I believe that the actions and statements of a disgruntled former Housing Corporation employee, and the highly selective and poorly researched coverage which aired on CBC's Focus North -- I call it the "Unfocused North" -- program, have directed a lot of negative attention on the Fort Simpson Dene band and the Liidli Koe Construction Association, and upon good people who have given their time and energy to assist their community.

I had originally decided not to dignify these inaccuracies and falsehoods with a response, but I would like to set the record straight. Mr. Speaker, the Dene band to which I belong has been involved in providing houses for the people of Fort Simpson for over 15 years. Our partnership with the public government -- first the federal government and later the government of the Northwest Territories -- has been in part based on what I believe are our rights and responsibilities set out in a treaty, Treaty No. 11, which was signed by our forefathers in 1921. Mr. Speaker, we made a decision to proceed with block funding arrangements several years ago because we believed the greater autonomy they represented were in keeping with the partnership and with our tradition of community self-sufficiency. When I became chief of the Fort Simpson Dene Band in July 1990, however, I inherited a number of problems within the housing infrastructure of our community. The Liidli Koe Construction Association, which is managed by the housing committee of the Fort Simpson Band Council, was struggling with a surplus of capital assets and a very severe cash shortage. Late block funding payments, received in July from the territorial Housing Corporation, had disrupted project schedules which were supposed to begin as soon as the snow melted in the spring. There were problems with some local contractors' attitudes toward meeting our project deadlines when they knew they were dealing with public funding.

Interpersonal strife and suspicion within the bureaucracy of the Housing Corporation was interfering with our ability to get answers and commitments we needed to do a good job. I think my time is coming to an end, Mr. Speaker.

It has come to an end, Mr. Antoine. The honourable Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Continue, Mr. Antoine.

Mahsi Cho. Because of the success the association had achieved over the past years, we faced the unique situation of having two other communities, Wrigley and Jean Marie River, ask Fort Simpson to take responsibility for the delivery of their HAP units there, as well. As a chief, the most useful contribution I could make was to have the best people in my community work on the band council's housing committee. We were fortunate that band councillors Andy Norwegian, Rita Cli and Ron Hardisty accepted the challenge of being on the housing committee. And I was fortunate to recruit Rene Lamothe to work for the housing committee as a project manager. In my role as chief, I asked this group to keep a tight financial rein on the matters and to use a common sense approach to meeting people's basic needs for housing.

Mr. Speaker, the housing committee made a lot of difficult decisions. I supported their decisions then, and I do now. I would like to commend these people for their contribution and to indicate to this House that it is truly regrettable to see the sort of misinformation and finger-pointing that has surrounded this issue.

But what matters, Mr. Speaker, is the bottom line; and the bottom line here is that Liidli Koe Construction succeeded in meeting its goal for 1990-91. It built and delivered 11 houses for families in three Nahendeh communities -- seven in Fort Simpson, three in Wrigley and one in Jean Marie River -- and people were able to move into their homes. And it delivered these homes at a lower average per unit cost than the previous year.

There has been some talk locally of a formal investigation into this matter. Personally, I would welcome any sort of investigation. We have nothing to hide, but it would not accomplish anything. I agree with the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation, Hon. Don Morin, when he says that our job now is to build houses.

Mr. Speaker, as a final comment, I would like to register my concern over the fact that internal Housing Corporation documents were turned over to the media, and that this government has appeared helpless to do anything about this abuse of confidence. I will have more to say about that issue in my statements later this session. Mahsi cho.

Members' statements. Mr. Pudlat.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would just like to tell my fellow colleagues that in the Baffin I am surprised to see that there is a female mayor in our community, and I am very happy to see that. There was an election to elect a mayor, and I am proud to say that the female who was running for mayor was elected. You can see that women are becoming leaders, and I would just like to say that I am very happy to see a female in our community who is a mayor. I am welcoming the new mayor of Lake Harbour, and I will be working with her. Thank you.

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. Lewis.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Like Mr. Gargan and Mrs. Marie-Jewell, I am also concerned about the way in which questions were answered yesterday. I am particularly concerned about the response made by our respected Government Leader on the involvement of ordinary Members in the implementation group for the Beatty report.

I will not quote, but I looked carefully through the unedited transcript of Hansard and listened carefully to her responses yesterday, but the implication is that the work that has gone to date is of such a highly technical nature that poor peons like us could not be involved because it was so technical and so complicated that we would not be able to get our minds around it. That is the implication from the statements that she made yesterday.

I would like to point out, Mr. Speaker...

Point of order.

Ms. Cournoyea.

Mr. Speaker, the Member is imputing motives to my answers to questions.

Is this a point of order, Ms. Cournoyea?

Point Of Order

Mr. Speaker, the honourable Member is imputing motives to my statements. I have total

respect for every Member in this Legislative Assembly. The technical nature that I referred to is that we are talking about the make-up and the process of setting up the implementation. Thank you.

On your point of order, Ms. Cournoyea, I will review Hansard and give a ruling on the point of order as soon as possible. I would just ask Members to be cautious when they are making Members' statements, as to the interpretation of their Members' statements, just to keep respect here in the Assembly. Mr. Lewis.

I will go on to describe then, my feelings about the response to questions that were asked yesterday. We had understood, as ordinary Members, that having received the Beatty report, we would be involved at that stage in doing something to implement whatever kinds of changes in programs needed to be implemented in order to achieve overall efficiency and to bring government closer to the people we serve. It was quite clear from the statement that was made yesterday that it was thought that the kind of work that needed to be done was of a highly technical nature.

The point I want to make, Mr. Speaker, is that we want to be involved at the level when decisions have to be made. We are not talking about technical stuff; we are talking about policy, programs, changes, and we do not want to be involved at the end when all the decisions have been made and they are at the stage where they are so irreversible that we then would be at the stage of trying to do the work that civil servants are employed to do, which is to implement things and go around and make sure that things are working properly. What we want is to be involved at the decision-making level about what we are going to do, not how it is going to be done. Thank you.

---Applause

Members' statements. Members' statements. Ms. Mike.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to offer my congratulations to the Pangnirtung Tapestry Studio as it celebrates 20 years of Inuit tapestry weaving. On March 28, 1972, Inuit hand-woven tapestries were introduced to the art-buying public at the Canadian Guild of Crafts in Montreal. Since that day, Pangnirtung tapestries have been exhibited and sold at art galleries throughout Canada and the United States.

The studio marked this historic occasion with a special exhibition of works from February 9 to February 22 at the art gallery at the Ottawa School of Art. The exhibition and sale featured new works by Pangnirtung tapestry weavers Olassie Akulukjuk, Igah Etoangat, Leesee Kakee and Kawtysie Kakee. The tapestries are interpretations of images by several Pangnirtung artists, including Malaya Akulukjuk, Annie Kilabuk, Lypa Pitsiulak and Ekidluak Komoartok.

The exhibition and sale was produced by the Uqqurmiut Inuit Artists' Association of Pangnirtung, with the assistance of Sinaaq Enterprises Inc., the development subsidiary of the Inuit Tapirisat of Canada. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Thank you. Members' statements. Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a return to Question O135-12(2), asked by the honourable Member, Henry Zoe. Further to my response to Question O135-12(2), I would like to provide the honourable Member with more information.

Yesterday I informed Mr. Zoe that the chief of Lac la Martre had received a letter advising the community that the construction of an office/warehouse complex was under review. This information was incorrect. The chief has been advised verbally by Mr. Bob McLeod, the assistant deputy minister, and also Mr. Len Hedberg, the district superintendent for the department. The chief has not been advised in writing, and therefore I cannot provide Mr. Zoe with a copy of any correspondence.

Returns to oral questions. Mr. Allooloo.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I have a return to Question O66-12(2) asked by Mr. Gargan on February 18, 1992 with respect to the use of common road salt, or sodium chloride, on the Fort Providence access road. The Member wished to know why the Department of Transportation would apply salt on the road on a relatively warm February day.

In 1987 and 1988 the Department of Transportation spent $1.5 million giving the Fort Providence access road a chip seal asphaltic surface. This road improvement has the advantage of giving a smooth, dust-free and safer driving surface. The ice blades which motor graders use to remove ice from gravel surface roads would destroy the chip seal surface. The only practical way to remove ice from an asphaltic surface is to apply road salt.

As the Member reported, Tuesday, February 4, 1992, was a mild day and rain was falling in the Fort Providence area. Although the rain was liquid at the time it fell, the rain water on the road was sure to freeze later in the day and evening when the temperature dropped. The department's road maintenance crew in Fort Providence took the appropriate action in applying salt to prevent the rain from freezing and making the road a dangerously slippery surface.

The Fort Providence maintenance crew did exactly as they are expected to do. The Department of Transportation does not wait for complaints from the public or for injury or fatality accidents before taking steps to keep the roads in a safe driving condition.

I wish to correct the Member's suggestion that the Department of Transportation spent $218,000 applying salt on the Fort Providence access road. That figure is the amount the department spent in 1990-91 on salt applications for the entire highway system. In the year 1990-91, the Department of Transportation spent $28,300 for labour, equipment and salt keeping the Fort Providence access road safe for the public's use.

Thank you. Returns to oral questions. Mr. Patterson.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is a return to a question asked by Mr. Arvaluk on February 12th about the problems with the water reservoir in Chesterfield Inlet. I received the letter from Mayor Titi Kadluk on February 4, 1992 and have sent a response to the mayor today. I have also provided the Member with a copy of my response. Thank you.

Returns to oral questions. Returns to oral questions. Oral questions. Mr. Gargan.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to direct my question to the Minister of Transportation. In his response with regard to the calcium or sodium chloride that has been spread on the road, the Minister did say that the department does not wait for complaints before they do that. They are looking after the public safety, and that is more important than the complaints that are being made. Mr. Speaker, the department has been putting the chloride on the road while it was raining so that it does not freeze. Mr. Speaker, this morning on the radio there is a forecast that rain is going to be falling again in Fort Providence. Can I get the Minister's assurance that they are now putting that salt on the road?

Minister of Transportation, Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not sure if my department is putting salt on the road currently. As I stated earlier, last week, before we begin to put salt on the road we would communicate what we are doing to the community. In the event that we will put salt on the roads at Fort Providence, I will consult with the community prior to commencing putting the salt on the road. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Speaker, the Minister indicated that last year $218,000 was spent putting salt, or chloride, on the roads, and 10 per cent of that was designated for Fort Providence. I would like to ask the Minister in which other areas this chloride has been applied.

Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will get the figures for the Member, and I will take the question as notice. Thank you.

The Minister has taken the question as notice. Oral questions. Mr. Arvaluk.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to direct this question to the Minister responsible for the Status of Women Council. As the Minister knows, the women started their association so they can have equal status in the workplace as well as in legal matters. I know that people make fun of women and that is part of their culture, but in the Inuit language there are words also that can intimidate women; it is possible to intimidate women by making light of them. If it is not just making fun of women, and if it is intimidating women, then it is possible to be charged for that intimidation, and it can be legally possible to follow through with it through legal means.

Minister responsible for the Status of Women, Mr. Ningark.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Since the time that Pauktuutit was formed -- I will be contacting the chairperson on the phone to discuss this matter with her. I will be contacting the Status of Women Council tomorrow and also the NWT Native Women's Association about the court cases we were discussing the other day.

Supplementary, Mr. Arvaluk.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Can the Minister then report to this House the government's absolute decision on the matter after the consultation with the groups?

Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. That is one of the reasons why I would like to communicate and have meetings with the Status of Women Council; with Pauktuutit, which is the Inuit Women's Association; and with the NWT Native Women's Association, and then I will make the report to this House. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Arvaluk.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question has not been answered. I would appreciate an answer. Will the Minister report to this House an absolute decision -- I do not want just a report; I want a report on the decision of the government, to this House, after the consultation with these groups.

Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, Mr. Speaker.

Oral questions. Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Minister of Education. Last week I asked the Minister if the Department of Education had a five-year plan. He answered, "Yes." I asked him if he could provide me with a copy of the plan. He answered, "Yes." My question is: When?

Minister of Education, Mr. Allooloo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will try to have the plan given to the Member this week. Thank you.

Oral questions. Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Speaker, I have not always agreed with every decision about funding arrangements and appointments to the Status of Women Council, but in recent months I have come to value the council's role as an advisory body. I would like to direct my question to the Minister responsible for the Status of Women Council of the NWT in response to Mr. Arvaluk, and that is whether or not the Minister has decided to seek advice from the Status of Women Council.

Minister responsible for the Status of Women, Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. After I reviewed my response to the honourable Member's question yesterday, I realized I must have misunderstood the question. Yes, I am going to be seeking advice from the Status of Women Council.

Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister of Justice, what is the status of the family law review committee?

Minister of Justice, Mr. Patterson.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the special advisor on gender equality, Katherine Peterson, has been working hard, with some assistance from staff, to do a public consultation process. I understand that she has now held community workshops in at least two communities in every region of the Northwest Territories. The final report and recommendations of the special advisor are due by the end of March 1992. I understand that she will meet that deadline. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, obviously the Minister was not listening. I did not ask for the status of the special advisor on gender equality; I asked for the status of the family law review committee.

Mr. Patterson.

I am sorry, Mr. Speaker. I apologize to the honourable Member. Mr. Speaker, the current status of the family law review is that a person who had been chairing the working group since its inception has left the Department of Justice to work in the Department of Social Services. That person has been carrying on with the family law review duties while, at the same time, undertaking new responsibilities for the Department of Social Services, so there has been a little difficulty in getting the report completed. The status today, Mr. Speaker, is that the report is now being edited. It has been put together, and it will then be distributed to members of the working group on family law, which includes the Advisory Council on the Status of Women, the Departments of Social Services and Justice, representatives from aboriginal organizations, and the legal profession. Once those comments are received, then it will be submitted back to the government for action. It is hoped that all of this will take place, Mr. Speaker, before the end of this fiscal year. Thank you.

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister did indicate in December that the individual who was the chairperson was an employee of the Department of Justice and is now working with the Department of Social Services. In December, the Minister indicated that the bulk of the work was near completion. He now states that he will be able to present this report to the House toward the end of the fiscal year. I would like to ask the Minister, when will the report be sent to the House? Thank you.

Mr. Patterson.

I will take the question as notice and get back as soon as I can, Mr. Speaker.

The question is being taken as notice. Oral questions. Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to direct my question to the Minister of Justice. Mr. Speaker, I will be careful with this question not to discuss the specific details of any matters which have been before the courts and may be subject to appeal.

My question to the Minister of Justice is: I understand that the chief counsel for the Northwest Territories will be leaving his post soon and that there will be a significant turnover of personnel within the Crown office. Is the Minister able to assure this House that the staff shortage and turnover within the Crown office will not influence the decision on whether or not to appeal the territorial court's ruling on the Paul Quassa absolute discharge?

Minister of Justice, Mr. Patterson.

Mr. Speaker, the honourable Member will appreciate that the Crown office does not report to me and therefore I am not briefed on the situation. However, I will, through my department, attempt to find out the situation, and I will report back to the House, as quickly as I can, the answer to the Member's question.

Did you take the question as notice, Mr. Patterson? The question was taken as notice. Oral questions. Mr. Nerysoo.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. A question to the Government Leader. In responding to a number of questions regarding the matter of Strength at Two Levels, you indicated that there were a number of additional documents and reports considered in developing the position that was put forward by the government. I am asking if the Government Leader could make available those particular documents to the Members of this House.

Ms. Cournoyea, Madam Government Leader.

Mr. Speaker, I will take that as notice and try to find out how much I can bring forward to the Member for his consideration.

The question is taken as notice. Oral questions. Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to direct my question to the Minister of Justice with regard to Personnel. I understand that the chief crown counsel is going to be leaving his post here in the NWT to take on a post in Ottawa regarding aboriginal justice. Is this correct?

Mr. Patterson. This is not within the Minister's direct responsibility, but if the Minister would like to respond to the best of his ability.

Mr. Speaker, I know that it is true that the chief crown counsel in the NWT will be leaving his present position next month. I am not precisely sure of the new responsibilities, but I think the Member is generally correct.

Oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a question for the Minister of Justice. In December I asked the Minister of Justice the status of the family law review committee, and he indicated that once this report was compiled, that it would be presented to him and the Minister of Social Services. Can he indicate to this House whether this report has been presented to the Minister of Social Services and himself?

Minister of Justice, Mr. Patterson.

Mr. Speaker, as I said, I understand the report is being edited at this moment. Neither I nor the Minister of Social Services has seen it as of this day.

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to also advise the Minister that I had asked a written question in regard to it, and in the same reply in December he stated to me that he would provide me with a response to the written question. So when will the Minister provide the House with the response to the written question?

Mr. Patterson.

Mr. Speaker, you will correct me if my interpretation of the rules is wrong, but I understood that when a written question is responded to after the session is concluded, that the procedure is to send the response directly to the Member and it would not necessarily go to the House. Mr. Speaker, my best recollection is that I did a written response to that written question directly to the Member, in care of the Clerk. So if she has not received it, it is not because it was not sent.

My understanding of how we deal with written questions is that after a session has prorogued essentially the issue is dead and the Minister, as a courtesy, sends the response to the Member. Oral questions. Mrs. Marie-Jewell.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister of Justice if he would consider providing this House with a reply to the written question given to him December 9th. Thank you.

Mr. Patterson.

Yes, I will do that, Mr. Speaker. It has been prepared, and it will be no problem to provide it to Members.

Oral questions. Mr. Zoe.

Mr. Ningark.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will take the question as notice and review the matter with the Minister

of Finance. Thank you.

The question is taken as notice. Mr. Koe.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Today is budget day in the House of Commons, and the federal Minister of Finance is scheduled to make a budget speech at 2:30 p.m. our time. This budget may have implications for our government's finances. Therefore, Mr. Speaker, I would seek unanimous consent to waive the rules to recess the House to the call of the Chair to hear the federal budget speech.

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to waive the rules. Are there any nays? There are no nays. I will take one more oral question and then we will recess the House. Oral questions. Mr. Antoine.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As many Members of this House are aware, the cost of food in the North is quite high. I just want to identify the community of Trout Lake as, I believe, one of the highest in the Northwest Territories, and according to the latest food price index published by the Bureau of Statistics, the cost of food in Trout Lake is 68 per cent higher than Yellowknife, and 68 per cent higher than what a lot of people in Yellowknife complain about. Mr. Speaker, the people of Trout Lake live a traditional lifestyle and do not have high income levels. People simply cannot afford to pay such prices for food.

My question is for the Minister of Economic Development and Tourism and deals with the store in Trout Lake that his department runs. Would the Minister commit his department to look at finding innovative ways to better manage food supplies in Trout Lake to lower the cost of food in this community?

Minister of Economic Development and Tourism, Mr. Pollard.

Yes, I would be glad to, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

We will now recess the House. Supplementary, Mr. Antoine.

Mahsi. Supplementary. One possible strategy is to truck food supplies into the community over winter roads and store it either at the store or another facility. This would lessen the amount of food supplies transported into the community by air. Would the Minister take this suggestion into account when he looks at the serious problem?

Mr. Pollard.

Yes, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

Oral questions. We will now recess the House until the call of the Chair, and we will freeze the question period clock like a football game.

---SHORT RECESS

I would like to call the House back to order. We are in question period, with 33 minutes and 12 seconds remaining.

Oral questions. Oral questions. One more time, oral questions. Item 6, written questions. Written questions. Mr. Zoe.

The Member has asked for unanimous consent to return to Item 5, oral questions. Are there any nays? There are no nays. Proceed, Mr. Zoe.

Mr. Zoe, would you please clarify, for the record, which Minister.