Thank you. Copies of the motion have been circulated. Your motion is in order. To the motion. Mr. Dent.

Thank you. To the motion. Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I agree that we should develop a more long-range plan so that communities can submit their housing needs, and they know what they are going to build in the future. It also ties in with training programs so you can have a more co-ordinated effort, and in the end you can have some people trained to build the units and you can deal with fundamental issues to get people all housed properly, and then we will have a more productive society. So I do not have any problems with that motion.

To the motion.

Question.

Question has been called. All those in favour? Opposed, if any? The motion is carried.

---Carried

Point of order.

Point of order, Mr. Pollard.

Mr. Chairman, I am not sure you have a quorum.

I counted before the voting took place and I had a quorum at that time. General comments. Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. One of the concerns that was expressed in the committee, outside of the capital expenditures, is the way in which the Housing Corporation approached capital expenditures. In the past it is some of our belief that the Housing Corporation's concern was singularly to build houses at the cheapest and most effective way. The fact of the matter is that the Housing Corporation should be viewed the same way as we view other capital expenditures, and that is as an economic instrument in effecting employment and business opportunities throughout the NWT.

We think it is essential in the future, that in this idea of looking beyond just building houses, which is the priority, no question, there has to be a parallel train of thought that you have responsibilities outside of that, particularly in the smaller communities. It is our contention that there is a preoccupation with being a policeman rather than being a development officer. These are difficult times and we do not need any more policemen; we need people who will look at things from a developmental point of view and -- certainly from my point of view in my prior career -- and ensure maximum exposure for northern businesses. It is certainly not acceptable to me personally, and I think I can speak for the standing committee on finance, if we continue to give jobs and opportunities to outside firms that lead to little or no economic benefits in the Northwest Territories, never mind hire our people. It is essential, and I am encouraged by the Minister's commitment to work towards that goal. I hope his new president will also impart that belief down through the operation with the rest of the corporation employees. I am not as confident that they necessarily agree with that point of view. Thank you.

Thank you. Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to reassure the Member that the Housing Corporation's direction, and the direction they have received, is that they are here to help the communities develop. They are an economic instrument. They are not only here to build houses, and the word or direction has been sent out to employees that we are here to assist the communities to develop. There is no more of the mentality that we sit back and only inspect and police our contracts. Our project staff are instructed that they are here to assist the communities to develop as a community. That includes training programs and all the other things you can achieve from capital projects. That direction is very clear and I hope it is well understood. If people do not agree with it, then they can pack and go somewhere else, but if they are going to work for the corporation, that is the direction that they must work by. It is as simple as that. That is what we are all here to do: we are here to create jobs in the community.

General comments. Mr. Todd.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am encouraged by Mr. Morin's initiative and he should be commended for that.

---Applause

I wonder if I can indulge in passing a few resolutions prior to us going line by line with the capital expenditures. Is that okay, Mr. Chairman?

Yes, Mr. Todd.

Motion To Undertake Credible Housing Needs Study, Carried

I would like to move that the committee recommend to cabinet that a credible housing needs survey be undertaken as soon as possible, to ensure a fair and equitable allocation of housing units.

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the motion. Mr. Todd.

I think the motion is self-explanatory. It has been discussed many times. Clearly we have to get an up-to-date community involvement in the discussing of needs assessment, and I think we should move the question.

To the motion. Mr. Morin.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. At the present time we are just starting to redraft a housing needs survey and direction is very clear that the communities will be doing it. It will be done by the communities with the assistance of the Housing Corporation. It will be done in their language as well, because they are the ones that are going to do it and live by it. It will also be what their preference is. If it is HAP housing or public housing, that will all be in that survey, and it will be from house to house and everything should be encompassed in that survey, and it should be done as well -- that is what drives our need from CMHC, so it will be acceptable to them as well. So that is a good motion.

Thank you. To the motion. Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Chairman, I do not know what the intent of the motion is. I do agree with what the Minister is suggesting and that is that up until now the surveys have been done by the communities with the assistance of the district offices. I am wondering if that is the intent of the

motion or something other than what has been happening to date.