Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have a very short general comment and perhaps a question, if I may. I know this bill, with good intentions, would try to eliminate hassles of introducing legislation every time they need to collect $500 or more. However, my concern is that it seems to give a message to the social workers or other government employees to become even more careless in dissemination of government funds to individuals who may have been eligible at first but later become ineligible, through employment or uncollectable financial loans from the government. Will there be a policy or statement of intent somewhere from the government that available means will be used to collect the outstanding overpayments or loans, despite this bill being in effect, if it is passed?
Debates of April 1st, 1992
Topics
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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James Arvaluk Aivilik
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Mr. Minister.
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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John Pollard Hay River
I understand the concern. There is a limit of $500 right now that is available to the Minister of Social Services. There does not seem to have been abuse of that system at the present time, and I think raising the amount up to $1000 recognizes the increase in costs of things today and the fact that we are paying more money out in social welfare. So we do not anticipate any abuse of the privilege. But if the Member is concerned, I will undertake to make sure that there is a letter put around to departments to be careful of abuse in this particular area. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Thank you. General comments. Does the committee wish to go clause by clause? Agreed?
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Thank you. Clause 1. Agreed?
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Clause 2. Agreed?
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Clause 3. Mr. Gargan.
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Samuel Gargan Deh Cho
What is the section with regard to 10(1) of the Social Assistance Act?
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Mr. Minister.
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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John Pollard Hay River
Mr. Chairman, it is just taking the $500 limit out of the Social Assistance Act and putting it into this act, and then the FMB will delegate the authority to the Minister of Social Services to be able to continue to write off or forgive debts. Only this time it will not be $500; it will be a maximum of $1000.
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Thank you. Clause 3. Agreed?
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Bill as a whole. Agreed?
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Is it agreed that this bill is now ready for third reading? Agreed?
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Thank you. We will go to Bill 24. Is that the committee's wish?
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
--- Agreed
Bill 24, Financial Administration Act, No. 2
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Bill 24, An Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act, No. 2. Mr. Minister.
Minister's Opening
Remarks
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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John Pollard Hay River
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. An Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act, No. 2, is being proposed to respond to concerns that have been raised by the Auditor General and the standing committee on public accounts in previous years. Mr. Chairman, under the present act the legislation restricts authorized expenditures from exceeding the budget at the activity level. However, in each of the years since the Financial Administration Act was assented to in 1987, overexpenditures at the activity level have occurred.
The government has thoroughly considered this issue in cooperation with officials from the Auditor General's office. We have determined that it is unworkable to try legislatively prevent overexpenditures at the activity level. For example, it is common for the government to receive invoices subsequent to year end and in substantially larger amounts than were anticipated. These increased costs and other year end accruals can occur even though management has taken all reasonable steps to control expenditures. Rather than retaining legislation which is unworkable, the Auditor General and the previous Assembly's standing committee on public accounts recommended that the provisions related to activity budgets be amended. The government is proposing that instead of it being a breach of legislation for an overexpenditure to occur, such an occurrence be dealt with by management accountability and recording.
Mr. Chairman, with this amended legislation all overexpenditures will continue to be reported in the public accounts. The proposed amendments will also bring the act into tine with government standards and will hold management accountable for the actions they take.
Finally, overexpenditures that exceed the total department budget will continue to be a breach of legislation. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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The Chair Ludy Pudluk
Thank you, Mr. Pollard. Chairman of the finance committee.
Comments From The Standing Committee On Finance
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 18: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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John Todd Keewatin Central
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The standing committee on finance reviewed this bill, Bill 24, in its meeting yesterday. The committee was pleased with the Minister of Finance and his staff to appear at short notice. The Minister informed the committee that this amendment was recommended by the Auditor General of Canada and the standing committee on public accounts of the 11th Legislative Assembly. Mr. Chairman, the committee has no major concerns with this amendment and agreed to recommend this bill to the House.