That is Mr. Dent's proposal. Are we all agreed?

Agreed.

---Agreed

Okay, if we can, we will turn to our legislative agenda with Bill 8. I believe it is Mr. Pollard's bill so I wonder, Mr. Pollard, if you would like to introduce the bill for us?

Introductory Remarks

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Good afternoon. Mr. Chairman, I would like to make a few brief remarks concerning Bill 8, which would amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act. The bill before you, Mr. Chairman, simply amends the act to require that indemnities paid to Members for the fiscal year 1994-95 will not be adjusted to accord with changes in the consumer price index.

My responsibility, Mr. Chairman, for this amendment is to introduce the bill in the House and carry it through on behalf of the Management and Services Board. The Management and Services Board approved the principle of freezing all indemnities for the next fiscal year only and recommended it to Caucus. Caucus considered the matter and, with the consensus of the Members in agreement with the principle, the bill was introduced.

The initiative, Mr. Chairman, of not proceeding with an increase equivalent to the consumer price index is not new to this Assembly. The Members have done this on two occasions, once in the fiscal year 1992-93 when there was a zero increase and once when the federal and territorial governments implemented the six and five per cent in the 1980s.

Mr. Chairman, this bill does not affect the annual increase to Members' living allowances and constituency allowances, which will be increased by 1.8 per cent effective April 1, 1994. The Management and Services Board and Cabinet fully support this amendment and trust all Members will be equally supportive. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Pollard, for your introductory remarks to the bill. Is there a committee chairman who would like to report on this bill? Mr. Ng.

Standing Committee On Finance Comments

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. On behalf of the Standing Committee on Finance, we reviewed Bill 8, An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, on February 28 and on March 2, 1994. Committee Members discussed this bill at some length and agreed that it should be moved into committee of the whole for further discussion and action. Individual committee Members may take this opportunity here in committee of the whole to raise any remaining concerns regarding this bill. Thank you.

Thank you very much, Mr. Ng. Mr. Pollard, do you have any witnesses who can help you deal with this bill in front of our committee?

Yes, Mr. Chairman. I would like to bring in witnesses if I might, Mr. Hamilton and Mr. Aitken. Thank you.

Do Members have any objections to the Minister bringing in his witnesses? Are we agreed?

Agreed.

---Agreed

Okay, Mr. Minister. Sergeant-at-Arms, would you make sure the witnesses are comfortable at the table? You've identified your witnesses for us, Mr. Pollard. If there are Members who have questions, you may ask them now. Mr. Zoe.

General Comments

Thank you, Mr. Zoe. Mr. Patterson.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to begin my comments by expressing my concern that although this issue undoubtedly will have some impact, perhaps a small impact, but nonetheless some impact on collective bargaining that will soon be going on with the public servants of the Government of the Northwest Territories, I believe strongly in the collective bargaining process and I think it would be unwise if not irresponsible of elected persons to now begin discussing that independent process in public in this legislature. I want to say at the outset that I am not going to play into the hands of one party or the other by speaking about the collective bargaining process in this legislature even during this debate. I think we should let the collective bargaining process take its own course.

There are some who have advocated fishbowl negotiating going on. I believe that most people who respect the collective bargaining process would agree, even strong labour leaders, that interference from politicians is not welcome nor is it at all helpful. So we should let that process take its course .

I would also like to say, Mr. Chairman, in responding to another part of Mr. Zoe's comments, that I am a Member of the Management and Services Board, I don't pretend to speak for that board today, but the board has been criticized for the method in which it consulted MLAs about recommending this legislation. I am sure, Mr. Chairman, that we can learn from this experience and, in future, the Management and Services Board can find better ways of consulting with MLAs and giving them notice of legislation that will affect their own benefits and also will have other implications.

The fact remains, as Mr. Zoe said, the matter was taken to Caucus. Caucus could have deferred or chosen to further study the bill and it was instead recommended for passage, partly with the new fiscal year in mind. So that happened. The process may not have been perfect, but we now have to deal with the bill today. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Patterson. Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Chairman, can I get a copy of section 23(1), 25(1), 26(2), 27(1) and 28(1)? Can I get a copy of those sections?

Maybe the Clerk could make those sections available to Members. Do you want to carry on, Mr. Gargan, while we arrange to get those sections or would you rather wait? Mr. Gargan.

Mr. Chairman, Members are requesting that we get copies before we debate.

Okay. I would like to call a break for a few minutes and we'll come back with those sections.

---SHORT RECESS

I'll call this committee back to order. At the break, Mr. Gargan, you had the floor. We now have copies of all the sections the Member requested, 23(1), 25(1), 26(2), 27(1) and 28(1). Mr. Gargan.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The reason for my request was to see what sections of this act we are looking at, those sections referred to that put a freeze on salaries and indemnities. Mr. Chairman, these are the sections that deal with ordinary Members, as opposed to Ministers, right?

Mr. Pollard, would you like to answer that question, please?

Mr. Chairman, the act freezes the indemnities to ordinary Members and the basic salary that Ministers receive as MLAs. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.