Agreed.

--- Agreed

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, having been advised of the total amount of the debts that are about to be forgiven by this government, this causes me some concern. However, I realize that the government made every conceivable effort in this case to collect money and then decided that perhaps these figures should be forgiven. Once they are forgiven, there is no way that government can collect the money from the creditors, from the businesses.

I also understand that the Minister has stated that in some cases when a company declares bankruptcy, then the debts are forgiven. But I'm wondering, Mr. Chairman, sometimes when a company declares bankruptcy, then most of the assets are liquidated. I'm wondering if, in some cases, the government collects money through the liquidation of the property of the said company. When I look at the receivables, it is almost $500,000; $452,282.30, in this case. Has the government collected some of the money that was owed to the government from the companies that we are about to forgive? Has there been some success in collecting a portion of what is owed from the companies to the government? Thank you.

Mr. Chairman, yes, the honourable Member is correct. There is a negotiated settlement. Even in some of the bankruptcy cases, we've managed to acquire

some settlements and financial recovery for this government. Thank you.

Thank you. Supplementary to the same Minister. I think I heard Mr. Erasmus indicating -- correct me if I'm wrong -- that some of those companies that we are about to forgive are in fact still active in the business community. That is my question. Thank you.

Yes, I think some of these businesses are still active in other fields, that's correct. My honourable colleague is correct.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Having been informed that some of these businesses are still running and operating, my question is how did the government determine to forgive these companies that are still active? Perhaps there is a possibility of collecting the money that rightfully belongs to the government. Thank you.

Mr. Chairman, I think it's important to point out that in some cases the forgiveness or the negotiated settlement may have come about because of restructuring of the companies, for example. I think that in other cases it's a variety of reasons, depending on the condition of the loan and condition of the settlement. Because one has negotiated a settlement with respect to a loan, it is normal corporate practice, for example, that in some cases where you can actually keep the company alive by restructuring the debt, by making changes in the management, et cetera. So there are a variety of settlements that have been reached here by the different organizations, whether it's the Business Credit Corporation or others. That's the reason some of these companies are still around, even though they may have been forgiven some debt.

In most cases, I think it would be fair to say that we've restructured with these companies their debt and the reorganization of the companies so they can continue to survive, deliver services, employ northerners and pay corporate income tax. Thank you.

Thank you. My final question to the same Minister. Before we forgive the companies, there is, in fact, a channel to go through; that is, to write off the debts. Were these companies, in the numbers, written off for a period of time before they were actually deemed to be forgiven? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Every effort is made to try to recover any loans that are outstanding to this government by the different organizations. This forgiveness really comes about as the final chapter in writing off the debt, because we fundamentally believe that we can't recover it and we've done it through a variety of processes. One is through a negotiated settlement, two is bankruptcy and three is what we believe is in the public interest. So this is the last bell that we'll toll with respect to the collection of this debt, and this is a means in which to clean it off the books, Mr. Chairman, and to ensure that there's transparency in the exercise. That's why it comes before the Assembly, so the public at large can see it. Thank you.

Yes, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Voytilla advises me that we do use a northern collection agency that I believe is residing in Mrs. Groenewegen's constituency of Hay River. We also use our own legal people and our own financial people to try to recover the debt. Thank you.