This is page numbers 661 - 692 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 7th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was yellowknife.

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Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, perhaps the catcall is preventing me from finishing my response, but it does get rather winded because there need to be corrections all the time to some of the rhetoric from the other side. Let me make the point. The idea to locate a new facility here in Yellowknife was made last year. It was made last year. The idea to piece by piece replace the existing adult facility, the Yellowknife Correctional Facility, was also made last year. As a new Minister, I felt my job was to revisit those decisions to make sure that they were made in the best interest not only of the MLAs and their little constituencies but also the government, the inmates, many of whom are our own people, coming from our own communities, who have a right, I believe, to have adequate facilities provided to them during their incarceration, who have and we have an obligation to provide adequate services and support to them.

All things considered, these decisions made during Mr. Morin's time as a Premier, I think are good decisions. As to why he is saying they are bad decisions is beyond me. There is no need in making the point. There is really no need for me to consult on decisions that have been made over a year ago to these committees, but still we are building these facilities within the financial commitments made by this Legislature, this $30 million spread out over seven years, plus over $6 million committed through a PY financing scenario to build a young offenders facility. We can do both within that scope.

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin, your point of order.

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Don Morin Tu Nedhe

I thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday yourself, Mr. Speaker, laid the rules down in this Legislative Assembly very clear. Ministers are to answer their questions directly. We, when we ask our questions, are supposed to use our questions in the proper way. We have done that. I have listened to this Minister grandstand and pass the buck for the last five to ten minutes. I would like him to answer the question and follow your ruling to be direct and answer the question. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin, I did not make any rulings except to remind the Members regarding their questions and their preambles and also requesting the Ministers to be as brief in their response as possible. Also, if there is a clarification that is required, then we have to allow the Ministers to make those clarifications and also allow the Members, if they wish, to clarify, then allow that to happen too. But there is no point of order. The time is still on. Mr. Kakfwi, to the question.

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have indicated, through the statement from the Premier and myself that as soon as possible after the June 4th decision, to reprofile the major renovation to a replacement project that we had undertaken to advise the Standing Committee on Government Operations of this, but the decision, as I said, was made in June, 1998, and September, 1998, to locate the male young offenders facility here in Yellowknife and the adult male correctional facility that is presently located here was never intended to be moved, there has never been any discussion or consideration to move it. We simply decided to renovate it. An interesting point is, why

it never occurred to the previous Ministers or the Cabinet of last year, why the price tag of $30 million, who did not consider the time just to build a whole new project, but that is afterthought. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Morin.

Supplementary To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As one of the MLAs that represent one of those little constituencies, as the Minister said, I do have a concern about the Minister's approach saying not necessary to consult because we are doing the same as previous decisions of previous governments. Well, he should stand on his own two feet and take possession of the decisions he makes, but he lacks that political will or backbone. As far as the consultation process goes, the Minister said in this House previously, he made the decision that this building could not be built in any other community. He made that decision, so maybe now he can tell this House how he came about to make that decision. What process did the Minister use to consult with other regional centres or other communities of what they would put forward to this government, of what they would offer to this government in order to get this facility in their communities that would help them out economically? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as I have said, the Cabinet, in June, 1998, and September, 1998, I suppose, on the Financial Management Board Meeting, decided and made certain decisions and made certain financial commitments which were approved in the Main Estimates this year. It is not my prerogative to unilaterally revisit every decision made by Cabinet under my portfolio, but I have the prerogative to review decisions periodically to ensure they are current, that they take into account the circumstances in which we find ourselves sometimes six months or a year after a decision and, and I have done that. That is what resulted in my going back to Cabinet and FMB asking to reprofile this project from a renovations project to a replacement project. I must say that I did take time to look at the young offenders facility and asked why did the previous Minister of Justice and the Cabinet at that time, what basis on which did they make a decision to locate the young offenders facility in Yellowknife. I had extensive discussions and debate with my officials about it.

I have decided, in the end, that there are not sufficient arguments to be made that would enable me to ask Cabinet to reconsider this decision. It was never in my prerogative to ask Cabinet to consider relocating the male adult facility from Yellowknife to another one, but the Member asked and so I can say that there are many compelling arguments that can be made which will be supported by many of his constituents and mine as well. All of these people who are incarcerated require support programs and services, medical services, services which are available here in Yellowknife and most of which are not available in other places. The courts are located here. This is the central transportation hub for most of our communities. Inmates want that it be easy for friends, families, and relatives to visit them. They want to ensure that there is good program space and facilities for the young offenders and for adult male offenders as well.

I know they are getting impatient but, Mr. Speaker, the question was asked, what compelling reasons that we have to ensure that the facilities are located in Yellowknife. It was not I who raised the debate here. We could have a more extensive and relaxed conversation if it comes up in the standing committee. I can shorten by simply saying I have reviewed the arguments and the reasons, and in the interests of the inmates, the young offenders, the benefits that would flow to them that would not flow to them if this was located elsewhere and also the time constraints that we have by order of the fire marshal, our agreement to provide services to Nunavut that we proceed on the basis that FMB and Cabinet have approved recently. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. I again would like to remind the Members and the Ministers, a question must not seek information about matters which are secret such as decisions or proceedings of Cabinet but to remind Cabinet that when they respond on the proceedings of Cabinet which could be considered secret, then they have opened themselves to Cabinet process in which they must not respond to. I know the Members cannot seek it, but if Cabinet opens that opportunity, then they must respond to it. Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Morin.

Supplementary To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Don Morin Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It was interesting to listen to that long-winded speech with very little substance. The Minister said and the question was very clear, it was never answered in his little speech, but it was interesting what he said. Medical services, in Hay River, for example, are not good enough for YCC correctional people. I wonder if they are good enough for the people of Tu Nedhe. Are they good enough for the people of Hay River? I would think so. But the question was, and God forbid, if you ever had to have hardship on people in YCC or the staff of this government, that they would have to draw on the services applied south of the lake and move down there. But the question is, was there any process, within the Minister's review, of changing this from a renovation to a capital project, was there any process available for any community in the Northwest Territories, other than Yellowknife, to submit what they had to offer to attract that to their region or their community? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I disown whatever the Member had credited to me for having said it. I did not say those things, that is just what he twisted out of the good words that I provided to him as a Member of this House. But in response to his question, the answer is, there was no process. The decisions that were made by Cabinet were not for the Minister to change unilaterally, so I only enhanced them and

carried out the decisions made by Cabinet and FMB last year within the scope and the financial commitments made by this government and this Legislature. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Question 243-13(7): Consultation On Correctional Facility Change
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Ootes.

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to get on to another subject which is very important to our community, and that is in the area of adult education. I spoke earlier today about this area. We had a meeting with the Minister, Yellowknife MLAs and a group of adult educators who are providing services through various organizations. They are concerned about a number of areas, and I have referred to those. They would like to see the government have a strategic approach to adult education. They want to see the implementation of core funding to properly support the vision in adult education and to make multi-year funding available. Could the Minister provide us with an update, since that meeting, what he and the department have in plans to address these particular issues? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Miltenberger.

Return To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to commend my colleague for his continued interest in adult basic education and literacy and such. He is right that he and three of his colleagues from Yellowknife, and I did meet with the folks in Yellowknife on May 14th. There was a subsequent meeting on June 25th to follow up to the commitment made. Out of that particular meeting came the plan to coordinate a workshop that is being looked after by the North Slave Career Centre for August, at which time they are going to map out the plan for Yellowknife and where they go from here in terms of partnerships and better coordinating their resources.

On the broader issue of adult basic education there is, in fact, as we speak, a review being done and a plan being pulled together to lay out the priorities and direction and review where we have been, where we are, where we should be going as a government and a territory and how do we work with the colleges and the communities and the non-government organizations. That is being worked on. It is a working group made up of government people as well as people from non-government organizations. Thank you.

Return To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes.

Supplementary To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

I want to thank the Minister for following up on that action. He is well aware it is an important issue for a lot of people here in Yellowknife. There are a lot of people from the communities and our community, so it directly affects all of us here because they are our community people from throughout the North. My question, Mr. Speaker, is with regard to the multi-year funding which not only applies here but in other areas, not just in the adult education area. I wonder if the Minister can address that for me, in general terms, if the government will look at multi-year funding for specifically the adult education groups that may extend further and is that under discussion? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The issue of multi-year funding is being reviewed with schools, with all projects that are yearly funded, Healthy Children's Initiative and such, as well as adult basic education. I would like to point out to the Member that the majority or the bulk of funding for adult basic education at this juncture is funnelled through and delivered through the colleges and the learning centres in the communities and the campuses in the larger centres. The issue of non-government organizations is one that is still unresolved, but it is something that there is discussion and review on as well. It is a fundamental issue and how can we provide greater certainty to these organizations so that, in fact, they can plan more than six months or a year at a time. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes.

Supplementary To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In the course of the Minister initiating action by his officials and to look at this within concert with other organizations, does he have a time frame that he has set for his officials to provide a report or certainly to address this issue? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Question 244-13(7): Update On Adult Education Initiatives
Item 6: Oral Questions

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In fact, the work that has been done is well along, and I would suggest that within the next two months we should be complete and we should be able to show progress.