This is page numbers 4179 - 4230 of the Hansard for the 16th Assembly, 4th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was community.

Norman Yakeleya

Norman Yakeleya Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I, too, would like to make comments on the recent 2009 Community Housing Needs Survey. Last week we finished with the Minister of the corporation in terms of the budget. When I left and went upstairs, I received a phone call from a distraught senior in Fort Good Hope. She’s a retired social worker, she’s a senior, and she was looking for help with the Housing Corporation. She had to go through the whole bureaucratic administrative process and the application and the whole information gathering. She rushed to get all this information together so she could get the application into the office to receive assistance. She said when she got back from one of the communities, she opened a letter from the Housing Corporation and was just devastated because of the rejection by the Housing Corporation.

This senior here has a busted water tank, the pipes were all frozen, her grandchildren have to take showers and baths outside of her house, they have to use a honey bucket, they have to borrow a water tank to put it through the house. She said she gives a lot of her good work to the government and this is how they’re treating her.

In the 2009 survey the Sahtu region is at about 41 percent followed by Nahendeh at 32 percent, in the department of adequacy, which is about the physical conditions of places to live in a house with basic facilities to provide a safe and healthy place to live, such as running water, hot water, using the washroom, serious defects in the structure of the house. This lady here was really devastated, because she asked how she could get help. She’s worked with the Housing Corporation, she’s been a government employee, she’s retired, she just wants to live comfortably. This type of weather is cold and this type of application takes 10 to 12 weeks to get approval and be processed.

I’m going to ask the Minister how to administer the program so that people like this can receive assistance right away under emergency care or seniors care so she doesn’t have to live like this anymore.

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, acknowledgements. Item 7, oral questions. The honourable Member for Kam Lake, Mr. Ramsay.

David Ramsay

David Ramsay Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’ve got some more questions today for the Minister of Transportation. It goes back to my Member’s statement talking about the Deh Cho Bridge Project. Obviously the government’s coming back looking for another $15 million because of the increased costs on the second half of the project, the superstructure, as it’s called. I’d like to ask the Minister today why exactly the government, who is project manager now, is negotiating with one company. Why hasn’t this gone out to tender, given the cost of this superstructure? Why are we negotiating with one company?

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. The honourable Minister responsible for Transportation, Mr. Michael McLeod.

Michael McLeod

Michael McLeod Deh Cho

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Member has been pretty clear on his feelings on this project and he’s even taken a page out of what’s happened in the New Brunswick government not too long ago about the pants on the ground statement. I’m glad he didn’t try to sing it.

Mr. Speaker, it’s pretty obvious why we are negotiating with one company. We have very limited time to make this project work and if we had gone to a competitive process, of course, we would be adding to the construction period. We’d have to prepare the tender documents and all the related material that’s required to go to a public process, and that probably would have added another year to the construction period and also to the bottom line of what this bridge is going to cost. Thank you.

David Ramsay

David Ramsay Kam Lake

Mr. Speaker, the industry folks I’ve talked to say that it’s unprecedented in this country for a project of this size to be negotiated with one company. In fact, I know our time is limited but, Mr. Speaker, it would appear to me that the other thing that’s unlimited is our ability to spend money.

Mr. Speaker, I think we’ve spent enough on this project. I think the Minister and this government should duly and rightfully go to the marketplace and get the best price for the remainder of the work on the Deh Cho Bridge Project. I don’t care if it takes six months. I don’t care if it takes a year. If it’s $10 million or $12 million less than the price that they’re, so called, negotiating with this one company, I think the people of the Northwest Territories deserve better than just going to negotiate with one company, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

Michael McLeod

Michael McLeod Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, obviously, I disagree with the Member. I know he doesn’t care about how long it would take. We would have to translate that into what it would cost,

added cost to what’s already built in to this supp that we have yet to bring forward. We would expect a good portion of what the $15 million ask is, is already interest and cost of delaying the project. We would have to add that amount to another year of delay and that would be quite significant, Mr. Speaker, over and above the $15 million. Thank you.

David Ramsay

David Ramsay Kam Lake

Mr. Speaker, obviously the government hasn’t learned much. It negotiated a contract with ATCON, allowed the Deh Cho Bridge Corporation to negotiate a contract with ATCON, and we all know where that’s gotten us. I want to ask the Minister, who ultimately calls the shot on whether this project would go to tender and which project team is doing this. Is it the former Deh Cho Bridge Corporation project management team or is it our project management team, Mr. Speaker? Because I’d like to know that.

Michael McLeod

Michael McLeod Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, the project is being developed and moved forward under my watch. I assumed the responsibility for this file a year and a half ago. I take full responsibility for anything’s that’s transpired during that period. We are calling the shots. We’ve moved into a project management position. We have new people and a new team put in place. Also, we have negotiated a new contract along with a redesign. So, Mr. Speaker, we have turned that corner and we are anticipating some good results as we move forward. Thank you.

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Your final supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

David Ramsay

David Ramsay Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I disagree with the Minister on this. I really think that, like I said, we owe it to the public, we owe it to the Members of this House. The project is in such a mess that I think we’ve got to look for a win where we can get it. I think we could have gotten a win, given the current economic climate in western Canada and getting other companies out there to bid on this project, so I disagree with the Minister on that.

I’d like to finally ask the Minister, what is he negotiating this contract with this one company on when, you know, I haven’t heard that the design work has concluded. So I’d like to know exactly what he’s negotiating and with what design. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Michael McLeod

Michael McLeod Deh Cho

Thank you. I apologize to the Member if he hadn’t heard that we have concluded the design. We’ve said it on a number of occasions and we’ll say it again: The superstructure has been concluded. There is still some electrical work and toll collection portion along with the catwalk that has to be finalized. We expect that will be another two weeks. There’s enough there to move forward for shop drawings and a negotiated contract with the company.

Mr. Speaker, I have to state that we’ve taken every avenue to make information public. The Member is quite aware that I have made every effort to ensure that Members had whatever documents I had to share so that they could be involved with this project. Mr. Speaker, I don’t pretend that the project has not had its share of problems.

When I assumed this department, this file a year and a half ago, I made a judgment that I needed to provide whatever support I could to make it work, and that’s what we’re doing now. There are still challenges, but we still feel this is a project that can be concluded in the next couple years. Thank you.

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya.

Norman Yakeleya

Norman Yakeleya Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Minister of the Housing Corporation. I want to ask the Minister, in terms of the Housing Corporation, in terms of the policies and the programs that the Minister is responsible for, I want to ask him in terms of how do we help a lady like this that is in a bad situation in terms of her house in regard to the conditions she lives in in Fort Good Hope.

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. The honourable Minister responsible for the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation, Mr. Robert McLeod.

Robert C. McLeod

Robert C. McLeod Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, without having the name of this constituent, and if the Member would provide that, then I would commit to the Member that we’ll follow up with it and see if there’s anything that we can do. Pretty well all of our programs are application-based, so there’s that process that we need to go through too. But if the Member is willing to provide me with the name and the details, then I can commit to him we’ll follow up with it. Thank you.

Norman Yakeleya

Norman Yakeleya Sahtu

I appreciate the gesture from the Minister in terms of this specific person. Now I want to ask, in terms of the administration and the flexibility of this program, he’s supposed to be simplifying these programs, the government and the Housing Corporation administration. Does the Corporation have an appeal process in place where if there’s an application that does get rejected, that there can be an appeal process to a body rather than just to the Housing Corporation?

Robert C. McLeod

Robert C. McLeod Inuvik Twin Lakes

Mr. Speaker, at this particular moment there is no official appeals process in place. However, we are putting the work together to come up with an official appeals process and our intent is to have that in place by the next program application cycle. Thank you.

Norman Yakeleya

Norman Yakeleya Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, in regard to the next program cycle, in between now and the next program cycle, I mean, this is only one of many concerns I have from the region. And certainly I will probably ask the Minister again, is there an interim appeal process or do we just go to the process that we’re doing now, MLAs coming and seeing the Ministers?

Robert C. McLeod

Robert C. McLeod Inuvik Twin Lakes

Mr. Speaker, going to the MLAs and Ministers should be a last resort. However, without an appeals process in place, we’re seeing a lot of that and we’re hoping to get away with that. If this could be dealt with at the district level, that would be our preference. They would be able to speak to the district director and make an appeal to them and see what comes out of that. Hopefully, by the time we go through the next application cycle we’ll have fewer and fewer appeals being made to the Ministerial and MLA level.

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Your final supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Norman Yakeleya

Norman Yakeleya Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in terms of the process between now and the next application cycle, in terms of going to the district, is it also possible that the applicants could go to the local housing authority boards in terms of working out some type of an appeal process? I know that’s something that could be considered rather than to the district office. Would the Minister look at something in the interim?

Robert C. McLeod

Robert C. McLeod Inuvik Twin Lakes

Mr. Speaker, these are the Northwest Territories Housing Corporation programs so we stay away from using the LHOs. They have their own process that they have to deal with as far as rentals go. So as of right now there are, basically, a couple of options: they could speak to the district manager and then, as we’ve seen in many cases, a lot of them are speaking to the MLAs and that’s being relayed to the Minister. We do try and follow up with all the inquiries we get and see in each particular case what the situation was, what was the reason it was turned down. Until we get the new official appeals process in place, right now these are their only two options. Thank you.

The Speaker

The Speaker Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Member for Frame Lake, Ms. Bisaro.

Wendy Bisaro

Wendy Bisaro Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions today are addressed to the Minister of Transportation. I would like to follow up on my statement with regards to my take on the bridge. I have some questions for the Minister relative to the monitoring of the project by the GNWT. Since the concession agreement was signed, from the time the concession agreement was signed until the end

of last summer when I believe the government took a greater interest in the management of the project, I would like to know from the Minister what kind of monitoring of the Deh Cho Bridge Project and of the Deh Cho Bridge Corporation was undertaken or was being done by this government. Thank you.