Thank you. The motion is in order. To the motion.

Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? Abstentions? The motion is carried.

---Carried

Consideration of the department summary has been deferred. We'll take a short break.

---SHORT RECESS

Committee, you have agreed to review the Department of Industry, Tourism and Investment next. Does the Minister wish to bring witnesses into the Chamber?

Yes, I do, Madam Chair. I hope I have the right department's witnesses imminently waiting. I will find out shortly, I think.

Thank you, Minister. Sergeant-at-Arms, please escort the witnesses into the Chamber. Minister, would you please introduce your witnesses.

Thank you, Madam Chair. We have Tracy St-Denis, assistant deputy minister of ITI, and Nina Salvador, who is director from ITI, as well. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. The committee has agreed to forego general comments. Is the committee agreed to proceed to the detail contained in the tabled document?

Committee, we will defer the departmental totals and review the estimates by activity summary, beginning at page 35, economic diversification with business support, with information items on page 36. Any comments, Members? Member for Hay River South.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I am pleased to see the construction of a new fish plant in there, processing plant. I am just wondering where we are in either the tender phase or the construction phase at this point. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member for Hay River South. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. This file is finally advancing, and I am happy to say that there is now a request for proposals out, only just recently. Once that comes back, obviously, the matter will proceed. It will be a design and build, so we will get the design process going, at which point we will certainly get back in touch with MLAs. Essentially, the file is now proceeding. Thanks, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Hay River South.

Thank you, Madam Chair. With respect to the design, have there been any changes since the original design? Has it been downsized by any chance? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Yes, there have been some changes. I will turn it over to the assistant deputy minister in a moment, but the changes, I just want to say, are good news in that it was after a review that was done by Memorial University with a view to ensuring that we are, in fact, being as efficient as possible in the design proposal that is available. The changes that are there do make it a more efficient design request, a more efficient processing plant, and also will ensure that there is capacity for more value-add in this plant, namely that it will be able to be certified. With that, to the specifics of that downsizing, if I could ask to turn it over to Ms. St-Denis, please.

Thank you, Minister. ADM St-Denis.

Thank you, Ms. St-Denis. Member for Hay River South.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to confirm: is this plant going to be a federally inspected plant, where we can sell product into southern Canada? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Yes. That is the intention, is that it will be designed in a way that it can be approved by the CFIA. I do not control that approval process, but that is the intention, is that it will be designed in a way that it can meet that level of inspection. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Member.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I will ultimately turn this back over to the ADM. I think just to start, in case I miss anything, there certainly was a process that delayed this because the receipts that we had back on the tender were significantly over budget, but that gave the opportunity to go out and make this a more efficient plant. I'm not going to go so far as to say it's a combination. I think one fact led to another, and it ultimately turned out to be a better product. If I could just check and see if there is anything further the ADM wants to add.

Thank you, Minister. ADM St-Denis.

Thank you, Ms. St-Denis. Member for Hay River South.

Thank you, Madam Chair. The equipment that's going into this building, my understand that it was purchased before any design was done or in place. I'm just wondering if this equipment was new equipment that is going in there or is it used. The equipment that was purchased, will it fit into that building? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. There is some pre-purchased equipment, but as to the specifics of it, I'll turn that over to the ADM, please.

Thank you, Minister. ADM St-Denis.

Thank you, Ms. St-Denis. Member for Hay River South.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to talk about the operation of the facility. Will the GNWT be operating it, or will another entity be operating that facility? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Ultimately, it is intended that the Tu Cho Fishers Cooperative are expected to be the operators of the facility, and an MOU was recently signed with them just over the past summer. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Hay River South.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Talking about the reduced size, what impact did that have on the fishermen? The fish coming off the lake is not a lot. It's probably a million pounds or less. My understanding is: there is quite a bit of that catch coming out of Yellowknife, as well. What is the chance of that facility running at 100 percent during the first year? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I will turn over to the ADM in a moment, to see if she has any specific numbers. I do want to just note that, although the size of the catch may not be large, we want to put this position, this project being within that of regional economic development strategies that for those groups, and those communities who are impacted by this opportunity, that it does still have a significant impact on their local economic strategies and local economic opportunities. As to the specific numbers about what this might get to in the first year or the anticipated numbers in the first year, again, I'll ask Ms. St-Denis to take that, please.

Thank you, Minister. Ms. St-Denis.

Thank you, Ms. St-Denis. Member for Hay River South.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Another question is: we're building this new plant, and it's part of the revitalization strategy. I'm just wondering how this plant is going to translate into increased return to the fishermen. Thank you.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. This plant gives the opportunity for the fishers that are utilizing it to access markets that they can't currently access. For example, in terms of domestic market, it won't replace those fishers who are already out there providing to a local market, but it does provide access to, such as, the corrections facilities or healthcare facilities, places that require the fish to be approved and go through formalized processing. It similarly is going to provide an opportunity to access markets down South. Again, because we are doing our processing locally, it will ultimately be able to change the way that the fish are being priced. Further, last one, last comment from me, Madam Chair, is: again, the vision is that this will allow for alternative types of products such as roe fish and fertilizer. Really, a much more whole-of-industry approach so that even a lower-grade catch can still be utilized to find access to the markets. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Did you have any final comments?

Thank you, Madam Chair. I would like to ask what will happen with the existing plant that's being used right now? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I'm going to put that one back to the ADM, please. Thank you.

ADM St-Denis.

Thank you, Ms. St-Denis. Committee, are there any other comments on this? Member for Yellowknife North.

Thank you, Madam Chair. In general, I am supportive of this plant. I do have a number of concerns about whether this is just throwing a lot of infrastructure money at an industry that may not actually be able to meet the demand. I know the fishing strategy revitalization identifies trying to bring new fishers into the industry. Many are retiring, and they simply can't find people to replace them. I know some of the fishers in my industry have expressed concerns about the possibility of Southerners coming up and starting to enter that industry at the expense of others. Specific question is: when I look at the fishing zones, quite a significant amount of the quota is on the northern end of the lake. Key to that is having remote pickup locations such that this plant is useful to them. Are there any plans for that, and is that infrastructure included in this line item here? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I'm just quickly returning to the line item and while I flip let me just reassure the Member that there are intended to be pickup locations in both Yellowknife and Port Resolution, which are reflected in the capital plans for the department. There is also intended to be work being done in Fort Providence not included in this particular plan because that's being done largely through the community themselves or directly through the community themselves. The point being there would be these three different collection points, particularly, for the purposes of the plan, Fort Resolution and Yellowknife. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Member.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I think those pickup locations are central to making sure this plant can actually reach capacity. Simply a comment to the Minister that this infrastructure, in and of itself, is not going to revive the fisheries. I feel like that is obvious, but there is a lot of concerted effort that needs to be done both by the Tu Cho and the Freshwater, our GNWT procurement of whether we can get fish into hospitals, whether we can start encouraging people to buy local fish, getting it into restaurants. Much of that work is started in the strategy, so can I just get a response from the Minister of how the revitalization strategy is proceeding in that all of the other key areas of strategy that will actually justify this multi-million-dollar plant are on track? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I entirely agree with the Member's comments, and I am honestly still learning a fair bit about this strategy myself and came at it with not dissimilar questions, so I am happy to report that I have certainly turned a corner in terms of my hope for this, that I think that there is tremendous possibility and promise and opportunity. As I said earlier, I think in response to the MLA from Hay River, it may not be a tremendously huge contributor to the entire GDP of our economy, but it has a tremendous potential for those communities that are going to be most directly impacted.

As far as what is happening, then, with the strategy, there is already work underway, and I think it was mentioned, winter training plans right now. There are other training plans that are set to start in the spring of 2021 for potential plant workers. There are already other discussions underway with the Tu Cho fishers to increase their training and their recruitment and capacity, and ongoing discussion between all the parties. Certainly, a vision that I would have would be to bring the fishers together as much as possible to have some collective communications about what else needs to get done to move this strategy forward to their success.

Finally, one last comment, Madam Chair, is that, if this plant can indeed be CFIA certified, there may be some opportunities to use it for agricultural purposes other than just the fish. Quite a lot is happening, and there is some movement, as I say again, that the strategy is moving forward, the training is moving forward. I think we will start to see that play out over the next few months. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Are there any further comments to this page? Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.

Marsi cho, Madam Chair. I am kind of disappointed, though, looking down the list for this department, and I do not see anything from my riding. I did have some questions. I know I saw somewhere during our committee meetings, that there is some stuff there for Little Buffalo River, but I just want to see if there is going to be any work done in terms of long-term work in that area. Marsi cho, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Is this under the economic diversification?

[Microphone turned off] ...ahead.

[Microphone turned off].

Okay. My apologies. Maybe we can return to that later, then.

Okay. Are there any further comments on the Industry, Tourism and Investment, economic diversification and business support? If none, I will call the page. Department of Industry, Tourism and Investment, economic diversification and business support, infrastructure investments, $11,148,000. Does committee agree?

Committee, please now turn to page 37, tourism and parks, with information items on pages 38 to 39. Does committee have comments on this? Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.

Thank you again, Madam Chair. I will just repeat my question. Like I said earlier, I was disappointed to see nothing in my riding on this list, a long list of projects. I want to turn my attention to Little Buffalo River. It's just outside of Deninu Kue. I just want to see if there is going to be any work on that, that area and that park, that area there, in that vicinity. Marsi cho.

Thank you, Member. Minister of ITI.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I had already started to think through that there is, and I just wanted to mention that there is the work happening with respect to the Fort Resolution collection station as it feeds into the fishing strategy. As for that park specifically, it's not in the 2021-2022 capital plan. I am just trying to see if I can find where it might fall into future plans. I do have the long-term plan in front of me, but I am not finding it, Madam Chair. I might turn it over, I am not sure to which of the two witnesses, but one of the two of them may have the answer. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. ADM St-Denis.

Thank you, Ms. St-Denis. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.

Marsi cho. I really appreciate that, to just get something in writing and to see what that long-term plan is on that area. Marsi cho.

Thank you. Are there any other comments to the tourism and parks? Member for Monfwi.

Masi, Madam Chair. This North Arm obviously has been in the books for some time now, so I am just wondering where it's at. Has that been completed? Because there has been some work done; there has been some construction on the campground, public day use, fencing, and also the loop. I am just wondering: has that been completed? I have a follow-up question, as well, Madam Chair. Masi.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. There is still some work underway on the project, so not quite completed yet.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Monfwi.

Masi, Madam Chair. I think 80 or 90 percent is completed, I believe, and hopefully, by next year, next summer, before next summer, I am hoping that this will be completed. Madam Chair, my next question leads into a long-term goal and objective of this department with respect to North Arm on the south side. The Minister and I were supposed to go there, but there has been a change of plans. I was going to show her which area I was referring to. It's North Arm Park, towards Yellowknife or Edzo, and then there is one that is on the south, southern side. It's connected, but there has not been any development on the other side. A lot of people from Yellowknife for some reason go to North Arm in Edzo, maybe because it's free. I don't know. Because there is a fee here, and we do not have a fee in North Arm Park, so a lot of people from Yellowknife do go there, camp out, and some overnight with their campers, and we have people coming from south, as well, at times, getting wood or going on a trip. That camp is always, especially on a weekend, it's always full, completely full. My constituents utilize that area, especially with the COVID cases now, so people are out there camping, and it gets full, so people coming from south, they continue on to Yellowknife.

I think I just want to reiterate to the Minister because, eventually, we will take a trip there to show her that one area. ADM would know exactly what I am talking about. It's on the south side of North Arm. If there is going to be a plan in place to devolve that area because it's a beautiful spot, similar to the Long Lake here. It used to be a swampy area. They took out all of the rocks, and now it's a beach, so similar. Why couldn't we do that in a small community, outside Edzo? We have a beautiful facility here. We could have similar because it is growing, North Arm area. Just wondering if there is a plan in place within the next five-year plan to focus in those areas because it gets too full almost every weekend and, obviously, we would like to have tours. Even Yellowknife people go there, so is there a plan in place for there, Madam Chair? Masi.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. The short answer is yes. I am looking forward to getting there, and I should talk to the Member after. I just want to make sure that we are going there at a time that is safe in light of the discussions at the beginning of session today, that this week might not be the week to go. However, let's have that conversation. My phone has been lighting up from those who are participating, seeing what we can do to get out there. I do want to get out on that trip. I am looking forward to getting out there, so we are going to go. I will make that commitment first. We will get ourselves there so that I can see it myself and the senior staff who are with me will see it.

Yes, one of the things that is happening right now with North Arm Park is discussions with the Tlicho under the agreement for infrastructure plans, so that conversation is being had with the work that is already under way. That conversation will need to be had with future work, but there are plans already in existence and awareness in existence of the need to expand to a camping loop. I think the commitment really is one to just make sure that we are having that conversation as those plans develop, and I certainly will commit to keeping the MLA in the know as that gets going and as that moves forward. He obviously gives all the reasons why that should happen. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Yellowknife North.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I am always happy to see parks infrastructure, and I'd like to thank all of the work that our parks group does. Getting the season open and extending it this year was great work. What I'd like to see long-term, though, is extending the season into some sort of winter camping option. If you go pretty much any direction in Yellowknife, you hit tent frames all over the place. They're on the sub-islands. They're up the Ingraham Trail. I know the Department of Lands has a strategy coming to remove quite a lot of those tent frames because they are unauthorized structures; hundreds, in fact, which is going to create a huge demand that we simply cannot fill. I think the Department of ITI has a role to play. If we can let people put their tent frames up in a winter park, whether that be Prelude or the North Arm or any of these other parks, they will do it. I recently visited Iqaluit and the territorial park there, you rent a tent pad for the year. You get to put your tent frame up, and it's a really great community experience. My question for the Minister is: are there any plans to implement a winter camping season? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. This year, when the park season was extended by, I think, only a couple of weeks, the cost of doing so was $226,000. It does certainly come with a cost. While this year was a great opportunity to try that out and to see what the impacts were, particularly in a time when there were so many local residents not able to travel, it still needs to be balanced against what the costs are and against what the actual usage is.

For this year, what I have asked is that we try to see whether or not we can do some sort of modified planning around the winter season, to provide that sort of opportunity, particularly now where people aren't able to travel. At the same time, as soon as that happens, the concern we get from the other side is that we're interrupting one of the areas where we have some of our small and medium-sized businesses in the tourism industry who provide access to these kinds of experiences themselves. There is a bit of a balancing act to be found here, and I think the best I can say is that we'll see how this winter goes and see whether or not there are some opportunities to create those options for local residents without impeding access to opportunities for the small and medium-sized businesses that operate in that sector, as well. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Yellowknife North.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Yes. I guess I want to clarify. What I'm picturing is not that the department go out and buy a bunch of yurts and then start renting them for a fixed fee, because, in my riding, Aurora Village, essentially that is their transition for this winter. There are businesses doing that. What I am looking for is a place where residents can legally put a structure for a period of time, and usually those are tent frames up here. This runs into the issue of: sometimes, those are somewhat legal, and then they get a frame, and then they become illegal. I think this needs to be regulated. I think parks has a role to play in this.

Some of our territorial parks are not just campgrounds. I think about Hidden Lake Territorial Park, one of our largest territorial parks. Perhaps there's a way to allow some sort of temporary structure permits within territorial parks. Perhaps there is a way to give people an eight-month thing. I'm not asking for the full staff to be there, and that there be this cost of hundreds of thousands of dollars to let people put up a winter tent frame. Perhaps I could just get a commitment from the Minister that, as this demand increases as we take down tent frames from Lands, that ITI will work with them. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Two things, Madam Chair. Firstly, the reason that there needs to be staff on-site is that, first of all, the washrooms and facilities and garbage facilities still need to be manned, even if it is below zero. There is also increased vandalism that tends to occur in the parks in the winter, with people cutting down more trees. It can't simply be that there is no staff there.

The second thing, and the thing I will commit to doing, is going back and having a conversation with stakeholders and colleagues in tourism, I'm thinking of the NWT Tourism Association, and see if this is an area where they can perhaps provide us with some guidance and provide us with some ideas that would benefit local operators and provide some opportunities but not impede on the areas where some of them are trying to move their work. Let me go and have a conversation with those folks and see if there is something that can be done. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Frame Lake.

Thanks, Madam Chair. I see in the budget here that there is supposed to be a wayside park number 1 on the Inuvik to Tuktoyaktuk Highway. I've had an opportunity to drive the highway now a couple of times. I'm kind of surprised that we don't build these things into the original design, but can someone tell me a little bit more about what this is going to actually be? The pull-outs on the highway now, they make the shoulder a little bit wider. I'm hoping that this is actually going to be a place where people can actually pull off. There might be some interpretive panels. There might be, I don't know, a place for people to do some things. What is this all about in the capital estimates? Thanks, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I think this really is meant to be essentially a fairly basic site with the pull-off and some essential basic facilities there, but let me see if there is anything else that I'm -- yes. Sorry. Basically, they have a very basic pull-away, not necessarily an interpretive centre, which would be a fairly significant investment that is not contemplated here. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Frame Lake.

Thanks, Madam Chair. I don't think I was asking for an interpretive centre; maybe interpretive panels, like we see on the highway even now between Behchoko and Fort Providence. Can I just get a little more detail about what this is? The pull-outs that you see on this highway now are marked with signs. It's like the shoulder is about two feet wider, and they call it a pull-out. If I was driving that road from the South and I thought there was going to be a pull-out and all you see is a wider shoulder, it's just a little bit misleading, maybe. Is this actually going to be somewhere where you can actually pull your vehicle right off the highway, like a loop? What else is going to be there? Is there going to be an outhouse or picnic tables, or something? What is this all about? Thanks, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Sorry, my apologies there. I did misunderstand. Yes. The intended vision, if you will, is that there is a pull-out sufficient to park a vehicle, have a picnic, have the interpretive signage, and actually be able to utilize this as a space, a washroom facility, more than just the roadway on the side; something a little more than that. I understand, right now, there are some conversations happening with the local hunter and trapper association. Once that is done, this can move forward and be something that is actually usable as a space, I think more in the line of what the Member is envisioning. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Are there any further comments to this section, tourism and parks? Seeing none, I will call the page. Industry, Tourism and Investment, tourism and parks, infrastructure investment, $3,102,000. Does committee agree?

Thank you, Members. Please now return to the departmental summary on page 34. Industry, Tourism and Investment, 2021-2022 Capital Estimates, $14,250,000. Does committee agree? Mr. Norn.