Thank you, Madam Chair. I guess I want to start a little more high level. We're looking at $16 million for tourism and parks. In the wake of COVID, we're not going to see the same industry at all that we've seen in this fiscal year. Can the Minister speak to: are we going to spend all this money? A lot of these programs just simply don't work in the current reality, and I very much think we need to see an increase in this section, but it needs to be framed as a tourism bail-out. I think a lot of the current programs are designed for a world that is not the current one. If the Minister could just speak to how this $16 million we're approving has changed and is expected to change? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. First of all, I should sort of again preface that these are estimates from pre-COVID. It was not part of the process to have us update them with respect to the COVID lens, so, just to state that. One of the things, though, is we can't abandon tourism right now, saying that there are no tourists coming and therefore we should be spending this money elsewhere. We need to be ready for when tourists do start again returning. Some of this work will be towards our tourism diversification products, which was already something that we were planning to do, and we will continue on. Of course, the entire GNWT now has to have the COVID lens on any of our spending. That does include the Department of ITI.

One thing that we are doing and we've decided to do to continue on and help with the economy, as well, is we are going to continue with our small parks infrastructure and our small projects. One of the things that we will be doing is spending our money towards improving parks, mainly in the communities, and doing small infrastructure such as kitchen shelters, picnic tables, tent platforms, things like that. We do plan to use the dollars within the tourism budget to sustain local and northern business, as well as to help our operators make it through. Some of this money will be reallocated to the removal of the tourism fees that was just announced recently. We will not be charging operators who are not operating any licence fees, and we'll also be waiving, as I mentioned to you, all of the liability insurance requirements if they are not operating. We have 27 small capital projects that we are considering to be our economic stimulus and, like I said, mostly focused on small communities. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. Member.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Additionally, we charged all of our tourism operators $500 to get started up. I don't think we should do this in the first place, but can we refund that money or get rid of that fee? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I think that is in line with what we were already talking about with the fees. I will take that back to the department and just get back to you with an answer. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister. Member.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I guess I'm going to share a bit of a personal anecdote, here. Last summer, I ran a sailing tour business just kind of on the side, and I did a few thousand dollars in tourism. It was nothing, but I had to pay $500 to get a licence, and then I had to pay about $2,000 to get insurance. Anyone who just wants to start an on-the-side tourism business, really, it doesn't make sense. You either go all in or all out. I think right now our regulations are killing that kind of small tourism operator. For example, right now, if you wanted to start a walking tour in Yellowknife, you would have to pay $500, and then you'd get $1 million insurance, which doesn't make sense. We don't require insurance for any other business licence. For some reason, we created a Tourism Act and we decided to overregulate tourism. My question for the Minister is: can we get rid of the requirement to have the $1 million in public insurance in the regulations? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I don't know of any business, really, that can operate without some sort of form of insurance. As a very risk-adverse engineer, I am going to say that really scares me, to hear that we would then be entrusting people. I do acknowledge in the case in point, or the example, a walking tour, it does seem somewhat ridiculous. However, I don't anticipate that that case actually comes up very often and that most of our tour operators are taking people in vehicles, they're taking them on the water, they're taking them on the ice, all things that have large amounts of risk involved and do require a certain amount of insurance. I'd love to live in a world with no insurance, but we don't. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. Member.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I think the Minister would be very surprised at the number of businesses that don't operate with insurance. It's largely up to the business to decide whether to take on that risk or not. There are all sorts of businesses that decide not to have general liability insurance. It's an interesting decision by the GNWT to essentially step in and mandate that these operators have to have insurance. I can see reasons for it in certain cases. Perhaps the Minister can commit to review that section. I think, especially now, there are plenty of tourism operators who are paying very, very expensive insurance premiums that make no sense and probably won't make sense for the next couple of years. I know I have tourism operators who are stuck with insurance bills and no clients. Could I at least have the Minister to commit the requirement that we have everyone having $1 million in public liability insurance be reviewed given the current COVID reality? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. We definitely can look at that and review. I did just want to point out that we are only one of two jurisdictions in all of Canada that does require tourism licences. The reason we do so, there are a few things. It's not cheap to come and do a tour in the Northwest Territories, so, if we don't have some sort of form of regulating the tourism operators up here, the damage that potentially could happen to our reputation as a destination would be insurmountable, I think, if we were to have people operating willy-nilly. I guess I shouldn't say that anyone who is not operating with insurance is operating willy-nilly, but that is one way that does assure our visitors that there is some measure of safety that is being followed. As well, part of our Tourism Act does require consultation with Indigenous organizations, so that was a way that we could ensure that people were not out on the land, desecrating sites or taking advantage of places where they should not be. I think that the requirement to have the licence in the act is very needed. I do see and acknowledge what the Member is saying. I'm scared when I hear that people are operating without insurance, but you're right, that is an individual's risk to take on, not mine to dictate to them, I guess. In this case, the department felt that it was needed. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Yellowknife North.

Thank you, Madam Chair. As you said, only two in Canada have this thing. Most jurisdictions, you have to get your municipal business licence and you go out and run a business. I guess I have no issue with the actual licence. I have the issue with the fact that we are imposing extra costs on small business operators. I think that the duty-to-consult aspect is great. Having a clear record of all our operators is great, and this is a process to do that, but we've essentially put an extra cost for it on small business operators. At some point, any smart business that runs into a requirement to get insurance, whether if you have land, if you have vehicles, if you're on boats, you have the Transport Canada regulations. There is no shortage of other areas regulating this. You can't drive a vehicle without insurance. I think that we have added an extra specific public liability insurance, a very specific type of insurance, and I don't think we really considered that. We just went, "Oh, this is what is required." Once again, given the reality that some of my tour operators have certain insurance for their lodges that may not meet this requirement and then they have to go out and find an additional policy, once again, we're just putting an extra burden on them. I think, going forward, we have to do everything we can to support our northern tour operators. Another question for this section I have is: there are a few million dollars here for tourism. I understand that quite a bit goes to the NWT Tourism Association. One of my issues with the NWT Tourism Association is it does a lot of great marketing work, they do a lot of great work, but their membership doesn't really distinguish between northern companies and southern companies. As the northern tourist industry has grown, a lot of those longstanding southern companies, I think, are starting to unnecessarily and unfairly compete. They have guiding tours that are very specific or certain licences to run, such as hunting and guiding. They already kind of have an advantage. I was hoping if the Minister could commit to looking at how much we spend in tourism that actually goes to northern tourism businesses versus southern tourism businesses. The problem here is that BIP exists, but it doesn't really figure into this entire world and the way we are spending our tourism dollars. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Yes, I definitely will commit to looking at this. There is the argument, and I have had lots of conversations with tourism operators in the last while, of if there is a business and they have an asset in the Northwest Territories, they spend money in the Northwest Territories, they employ Northwest Territories people, and this, again, is a larger conversation we're having in procurement, as well, where is the line of you could have the company owned by the guy in the Northwest Territories who is then hiring everybody out of the South and all the money is flowing out, or you can have it the other way around and you have this southern-owned business that actually is spending and keeping more money in the North. This is the complex situation that I find myself in with both hats on at this point. I commit to reviewing that for the Member. I did just also want to say that, if you do know of operators who have a very small business where the $500 fee is onerous, then have them please come to us and have that conversation. I don't think that there is any reason why, at times, that there couldn't be exceptions made for hard cases. Thank you very much, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. Member.

Thank you, Madam Chair. I will. The problem is: the examples that I have are probably people when just decided to never get a tourism operator licence. And we all know that, as this legislation came on, there was going to be an education piece and there was going to be slowly walling people in. I think there is a reality that plenty of members especially in the communities are running tourism businesses without licences. I don't want, all of a sudden, us to crack down on them. The person who was just doing a small, part-time thing, all of a sudden, it's not even profitable for them. I think there needs to be a look at that kind of really small, start-up business because that is how tourism businesses start.

In regards to the debate of southern verses northern getting tourism dollars, I get that. I think, probably, the most important factor there is whether they are actually employing northern residents. At some point, I guess it doesn't matter if they are located somewhere else, but if they are simply a business that doesn't hire any northern residents and doesn't reside here, I would like some sort of policy to be in place that preferences our other businesses, recognizing we have that principle in procurement. We have that in the Business Incentive Policy. If the Minister could commit to looking into a policy that would apply that same lens and obviously there is nuance and there is a bit of a debate to how we spend our tourism dollars, I think that would go a long way. Can I get that commitment from the Minister? Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Member. Minister.

Thank you, Madam Chair. Yes, I commit to looking into whether we can create that policy. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Thank you, Minister. You have one more? Okay. Short.