Thank you, Member. Minister.
Debates of Feb. 24th, 2021
This is page numbers 2083 - 2120 of the Hansard for the 19th Assembly, 2nd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was health.
Topics
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
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Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Shane Thompson Nahendeh
I guess this is going to be one of those "I agree to disagree" with the Member. This is our commitment, the Northwest Territories' commitment to the Wek'eezhii part of the plan. That's our commitment. That is our understanding. This is what we have to pay, and we are honouring that. We have worked with the federal government, we have worked with the Indigenous governments, and this is what our costs are. This is something that we are honouring. We have worked with them, and we are able to do it. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Rylund Johnson Yellowknife North
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm happy that we have a new Public Lands Act. I look forward to the day when it's implemented. I'm looking for an update on when we will see some changes in how we assess and we essentially tax land. I think it's fair to say right now that there are some inconsistencies in the system right now. You pay 5 percent on a residential lease on Commissioner's land and 10 percent on a recreational. Many people live on their recreational leases, and if they actually were allowed to, they would then pay less tax. Then we have territorial lands, and both are appraised differently, using different methodology. It's fair to say that we're hoping to clean all of this up with the Public Lands Act, but I'm hoping the Minister can give me a timeline on when we will see some changes on lease fees. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Shane Thompson Nahendeh
Thank you. My understanding is: we are 18 months away from getting everything done, completed. The team is working diligently. We are on schedule, from my latest report today I received. We do have a template that shows us where we are, so right now, we are on schedule to be done. It will talk about leases, lease fees, not taxation. Please understand, taxation belongs the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs. I know the Member may not like that answer, but that is the reality of it presently. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Rylund Johnson Yellowknife North
Admittedly, I don't fully understand this, Mr. Chair. Can the Minister help me clarify? My understanding is that Commissioner's land uses the Property Assessment Taxation Act. Territorial land uses a different metric created by the Department of Lands. Is that going to change? Are we going to have one metric for how we assess value and then charge a fee? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Shane Thompson Nahendeh
The answer is yes, but for further detail, I will turn to the deputy minister, with your permission. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Haener
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The department is in the midst of broad public engagement and land pricing has probably been the vast majority of comments that we've received as part of that process. We are aware that there is a great deal of concern about this, and it is our objective to take more time to look at how land is assessed and priced and to create a unified process and approach and not have multiple approaches. One of our inherent underlying principles in the work that we're doing on the regulations is to support greater transparency, so we do want to have a process that is clearer to individuals, as well. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Rylund Johnson Yellowknife North
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Can I get an understanding of how improvements to land fit into the assessment? Are we taxing improvements presently on Commissioner's, recreational, industrial, commercial, and the territorial lands? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Shane Thompson Nahendeh
Thank you. The Member is asking about taxation again, and that's not our department. That is Municipal and Community Affairs' responsibility and how they assess the taxes. The question that he is asking, he will probably have to reach out to the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs to get clarity on that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Rylund Johnson Yellowknife North
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I do have a lot of issues with how the taxes are calculated, as well, but no, sorry. Right now, you pay a lease rent, and your lease rent is based on 10 percent or 5 percent or some other different methodology. I believe the lease rent is the Department of Lands. That lease rent, which is a percentage of the assessed value, does the assessed value for the multiple different types of lands we've created include improvements to land is my question. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Shane Thompson Nahendeh
I would get clarity for how we assess the leases from the deputy minister. Thank you.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Haener
Thank you, Mr. Chair. For most leases, there is a five-year periodic review of the lease rent that is charged, and for that, we do rely on some information provided to us from Municipal and Community Affairs to assist us with that lease rent review. My understanding is that Municipal and Community Affairs' process does include potential improvements to the land, so there is a factoring in, given the process that we follow. In terms of going forward, because I think there was interest in pricing going forward, we do have to, as I indicated, determine what that process is going to look like in terms of the value of land going forward and whether it's based on the assessed value of the land or not and how improvements factor in. Those are definitely items that we will have to consider as we move forward on regulation development. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2099
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2100
Rylund Johnson Yellowknife North
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yes. I think a lot of work needs to be done here. I recognize that Commissioner's land that falls under MACA does tax improvements. Then the territorial land on which we have our own evaluation, I get different answers depending on where you are and whether there is any market in that land or the improvements have any value. There just seems to be inconsistency depending on who decided whether the land has any value because we're using two different assessments. I understand that we will have that resolved, hopefully, in 18 months. Where I was also going with this is: in the Department of Lands business plan, one of the goals is to develop criteria for assessing applications for agricultural uses of land. How many agricultural leases do we have presently, commercial leases that are using agricultural land presently in the Northwest Territories? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Committee Motion 79-19(2): Tabled Document 286-19(2): Main Estimates 2021-2022 - Lands - Corporate Management - Deletion of $303,000 from Grants, Contributions and Transfers, Defeated
Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 2100