Thank you. Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. There is a home improvement program, and then there is that emergency repair program that seniors can apply for, and then there is the senior citizens' repair program. As well, there is a HAP senior citizens' repair program, and there is a special project that is going to be designated specifically to serve the seniors -- small economical houses that they could live in, because it is far better to have people live in their own homes. They make dry meat or have their own little warehouse or smoke house. They are a lot happier, and that is the way they are used to living, so we should encourage it. Thank you.

Thank you. General comments. Mr. Koe.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My fourth area deals with general contracts of building and erecting houses, and again this is an area where there have been a lot of comments and discussion over the years. My concern in a lot of the contracts that come out, is that they generally are fairly large contracts dealing with a number of units for a certain area, and my suggestion is that rather than have large contracts, you get them down into bite-size chunks so that local contractors or small contractors can have a chance at getting the contracts.

Another area, and I know it is one of the goals of the corporation -- or I think it is a goal -- is to have design, supply and erect locally where possible rather than supplying them somewhere else, shipping them however, and then having only erection contracts in the community.

Another area of major concern is the supports or the pilings for houses. There are a lot of tenders for piling, and there has been a tendency, I think, in some places, to use metal pilings or else getting logs shipped in or barged in from somewhere else. The Member beside me here talked about the numerous number of logs in his area, and I know in certain areas in the Western Arctic and in the Delta there is a lot of piling available. People have been supplying this piling since Inuvik started away back in 1955, and it provides a means for jobs for people and they can take the small contracts.

So generally, I like the corporation to incorporate the design, supply and erect locally by logs, instead of shipping them in and trying to package the contracts into bite-sized portions.

Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, we are very sensitive to this piling issue. Pilings should come from the NWT if they are available; I agree with that 100 per cent, and we are trying to make sure that does happen. If somehow some of it slips by us this year, guaranteed, it will not slip by us next year. We are trying to make sure the pilings come from the NWT because that leaves dollars in the North.

We have many different ways of contracting. Design, supply and erect contracts are done, and labour only where they only supply the labour, and then the NWT Housing is the project manager and supply, ship and erect. So some communities and areas prefer one or the other or a mixture of them. That is the way they get the most benefit. If your area is design built, we could look at doing that in your area on the next contracts, if that is what they want to do.

Mr. Koe.

I understand there were some pilot projects last year in Inuvik where they did supply and erect or construct the houses locally, and I think it was quite successful. It was a significant savings per unit because of the way it was done. The local supply stores benefited and the local contractors benefited.

Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Was that the one in Fort McPherson and it was design, build, ship and erect in Inuvik. I will check into that and we will report further. I remember who all got the money out of that contract.

General comments. Mr. Koe.

In terms of these contracts, I can recall back when I first started with the government I was settlement secretary in Fort McPherson in 1971, and the housing association at the time got the contract to build, construct 17 units, and all they did at the time was bring in the general superintendent and the professional trades people, but everything else was done with local labour. I think this is the type of trend we are looking at going back to.

Mr. Minister.

Yes, I agree with the Member. That is one way to maximize local labour and it benefits the community. They are doing that again in Fort McPherson this year.

Mr. Arngna'naaq.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just wanted to make a few comments because I was encouraged yesterday. The motions that were made yesterday -- the Minister indicated that he was in agreement with those motions. However, I would like to speak to those motions in that some of the contractors that I have spoken to regarding the building of houses and government contracts have indicated to me that there is one concern that they consistently have, and that is in hiring northern native people they find that they are never sure that their employee will be at work the next morning, especially the hunters. Sometimes the hunter goes out and is weathered out.

This is one area that has been raised by a number of different contractors when I spoke to them, when we spoke about northern contractors and how we would like to see more of them getting the contracts that are given by the government. I am wondering if there is any way that we could create some incentive to hire Northerners, as far as contractors are concerned.

Another concern that was raised is that when they hire Northerners there is a time line that is set by the government that is too strict, too rigid, that they are not able to extend a contract period. And if a contractor has many native people hired and some of them are hunters and are not able to get back, is there not a way we could maybe ease up on the time lines that are created by the government when they have native employees.

Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. You know there are many contractors and many different approaches when they go to work in the communities. But I know in some of the smaller communities I worked in, you have to sit down and meet the people, talk to them, if it is moose hunting season or whaling season or whatever, you have to try and work around those things. Whether it means that men work 12 hours a day for so many days and take so many days off, or whatever. But those are the things a contractor should work out with the community.

We, as a government, are also looking at spreading our contracts out longer so we can get more training involvement in it, and we will be developing training programs and they will be in place for some pilot projects this year, I am hoping, and a lot more next year. That way we will get trained people and capital projects will be spread out over a longer period of time so that communities can benefit. But also, communities will have more control so that they can sit down and look at their priorities. In my area, for example, moose run from around a certain time and that is the time you have to take off work to go and get meat for the winter. Everyone knows that so they work around that. That is basically how things should be done.

Thank you. Mr. Zoe.

Housing Needs Survey

Thank you. Mr. Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Maybe I did not make myself clear yesterday. The survey will be done by the community. It is not only going to be done by the staff, and I will make sure that staff is involved with the community in doing it, but it is going to be the community survey so they are going to be the key players in it. I must ensure that we have Housing Corporation staff because this survey not only derives the community need, but it derives our need to CMHC. That is the approach that I am going to be taking.

Mr. Zoe.