Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I move that the Standing Committee on Finance recommends that the Department of Justice include a second women's correctional facility, preferably in Nunavut, in its five-year capital plan.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
In the Legislative Assembly on November 1st, 1994. See this topic in context.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you. Your motion is in order. To the motion. Do you have something to say, Madam Premier?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
October 31st, 1994
Page 661
An Hon. Member
Question.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
The Chair Brian Lewis
Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried.
---Carried
Mr. Antoine.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. That concludes the Standing Committee on Finance report from the review of the 1995-96 capital estimates for the Department of Justice. Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Antoine. The Minister requests the House to allow him to bring in witnesses. How do you feel about that?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Kakfwi, you may bring your witnesses into the House and seat them at the table.
For the record, please introduce your witnesses.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu
On my left, Mr. Chairman, is the deputy minister of Justice, Don Avison. On my right is the director of financial and management services for the Department of Justice, Louise Dundas-Matthews.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi. Do Members have any general comments, questions or statements about this department? Mr. Ng.
General Comments
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to ask the Minister with respect to his introductory remarks, on the detail of the five-year capital plan that is being developed. What kind of time frame is the Minister looking at for finalizing this plan?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Kakfwi.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
The Chair Brian Lewis
Any general comments? Are you ready to go into detail? Mr. Pudluk.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
Ludy Pudluk High Arctic
(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just a brief question before we get into details of the budget. We have inmates being sent out to institutions and are sometimes sent to penitentiaries in the south. I have been asked by a resident in one of my communities concerning an inmate from a penitentiary in the south who is a northerner. The request was, was there a chance of having him relocated to the north. What is the process when you receive requests like that? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Pudluk. Mr. Minister.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 661
Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu
Mr. Chairman, the advice I would give to the Member is, if he gets a request, to write a letter to me about it and we will see what we can do to respond. The intent in federal legislation and in ours, in both the operating principles with correctional Services Canada and ourselves, is inmates, as a general rule, should be kept as close to home as possible. That is the way we try to operate. We have been
dealing with these requests on a case-by-case basis, which is probably the way to keep going. That would be my advice.
Registries And Court Services
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Kakfwi. General comments. Are you ready to go into the detail?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Line By Line
Registries And Court Services
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
We are on the detail of capital, 06-9. Building and works, headquarters, total region, $20,000. Total building and works, $20,000. Total activity, $20,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Community Justice And Corrections
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Page 06-11. We are under community justice and corrections and we are on page 06-11. Buildings and works, headquarters, total region, $79,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Fort Smith, total region, $79,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Sorry, that should be Fort Smith, total region, $7,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total buildings and works, $86,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Fort Smith, equipment acquisition, total region, $24,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Inuvik, total region, $24,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total equipment acquisition, $48,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total activity, $134,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
We will go back to page 06-7, department summary. Capital expenditures, $154,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
That concludes the Department of Justice. Do Members agree that we have concluded this item?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you very much, Mr. Kakfwi, and your witnesses. Mr. Dent.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would recommend that we continue on with consideration of Committee Report 10-12(6) and Bill 1, in particular, with the Department of Transportation's capital budget.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Are Members agreed?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Minister, do you have any opening comments?
Department Of Transportation
Minister's Introductory Remarks
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 662
John Todd Keewatin Central
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, I have some opening comments. Mr. Chairman, and Members of the Legislative Assembly, I am pleased to put before you, the Department of Transportation's proposed capital budget for 1995-96.
I am encouraged by several positive statements Members have made about some of the Department of Transportation's major capital projects this year: the highway reconstruction and paving program; airport improvements under the strategic transportation infrastructure agreement; community access roads; and, the Mackenzie Highway extension to Wrigley.
I want to thank the Members for their kind comments. It's nice to hear that we can get things right once in a while. More than that, I want to return the compliment and thank the Members for their helpful assistance and cooperation -- let me stress, cooperation -- both inside and outside the House. As the Minister of Transportation, I have received a lot of advice and support from the Members in making our transportation programs work well.
At $36.3 million, the budget before you today proposed to spend $1 million less in 1995-96 than we are spending this year.
With a smaller budget, we have had to consider each and every capital project to decide on those which should go forward and those which we have to defer. These are difficult decisions to make but, in view of our financial position, they are decisions which have to be made.
As we go through the capital programs, I hope the Members will see that we have applied our limited capital dollars to achieve the greatest advantage in pursuing our economic objectives.
The 2,200 kilometre highway in the Northwest Territories is our largest asset in the transportation system. With proposed expenditures in 1995-96 of $19.8 million, highway construction accounts for the largest portion of the department's capital budget.
The highway reconstruction program has made substantial progress over the last several years in improving the main corridor between the Alberta border and Yellowknife.
Including this past year's reconstruction program, now almost two-thirds of the 526 kilometre route has a paved, asphalt surface.
For 1995-96, the department plans to continue with the reconstruction of Highway 3 between Fort Providence and Rae-Edzo. Consultations with the North Slave communities will take place on the planning and alignment of the remaining section between Rae-Edzo and Yellowknife. The proposed expenditures in 1995-96 on Highway 3 amount to $7.7 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 663
Some Hon. Members
Boo.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 663
John Todd Keewatin Central
Excuse me? The department will continue the reconstruction, widening and improved drainage of the Dempster Highway near Fort McPherson at a cost of $2.3 million. The budget also schedules $1.4 million to place an asphalt surface on a 20-kilometre section of Highway 5 west of Fort Smith.
The Department of Transportation will put a permanent bridge over the Poplar River on Highway 7 south of Fort Simpson at a cost of $2.2 million. Bravo.
More than half the people in the Northwest Territories live in small communities that are not on the all-weather highway system. For these communities, air services are the main transportation link. Most of the people in the Northwest Territories would consider the Department of Transportation's
airport program as the most important program the department delivers.
The 1995-96 capital budget includes $10 million for new airport development and airport improvements. The Department of Transportation has negotiated two cost-sharing capital construction agreements with the federal government, which have enabled the department to pursue an ambitious multi-year airport construction program. In 1995-96, the new airports at Fort Good Hope and Snare Lake will be in their final stage of completion while the major earthworks will begin at Deline. This budget will also complete major upgrading at Coppermine and Pelly Bay.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 663
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 663
John Todd Keewatin Central
The 1995-96 budget allots a total of $4.6 million for improved airport electrical and lighting systems, mobile maintenance equipment, equipment garages and air terminal buildings.
Most prominent is $3.4 million for new air terminal buildings at Cape Dorset and Rankin Inlet along with terminal renovations and enhancements scheduled at Chesterfield Inlet, Clyde River, Repulse Bay, Sachs Harbour and Sanikiluaq.
One of my primary goals as the Minister of Transportation is to develop more local transportation infrastructure in the communities. Last year, we increased the community access road budget from $300,000 to $650,000. The community transportation facilities contributions policy has been successful in involving communities in the design and construction of local access roads. Work on local road projects proceeded this year in Jean Marie River, Baker Lake, Arviat, Igloolik, Pelly Bay, Taloyoak, Broughton Island, Resolute Bay and Arctic Bay. The 1995-96 budget proposes to increase the community access road program again to $750,000. This will support continued work on the projects under way this year and contribute to the proposals the department has received from Gjoa Haven and Whale Cove.
The community access road program has generated growing community interest. With the participation of more communities, I am confident that the program will achieve the target I set for it of delivering $1 million worth of local roads by 1996-97. I am similarly pleased with the progress made under the community wharfs program in building local marine infrastructure. The breakwaters, wharfs and landings the program delivers involve modest capital expenditures compared to most infrastructure projects, but they achieve marked improvements in the safety and security conditions for local small craft.
The budget allocates $2.3 million to the community wharfs program in 1995-96. The program will continue in the third of a four-year project to build a breakwater and harbour in Pangnirtung. Work will be completed on the new landing areas and wharfs in Pelly Bay, Rankin Inlet and Whale Cove. 1995-96 will begin the first of a three-year project of harbour improvements in Coral Harbour.
In summary, these are the highlights of the Department of Transportation's 1995-96 capital budget. On the whole, I believe the budget presents a balanced program of capital initiatives in highways, airports, community roads and wharfs. As I mentioned at the beginning, it is a reduced budget from 1994-95. Nonetheless, the projects included in the budget represent substantive improvements and further progress in the development of our transportation infrastructure. Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
Some Hon. Members
Ohh.
---Applause
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Todd. People seem very pleased, Mr. Todd. Can we hear from the deputy chair of the Standing Committee on Finance, Mr. Ng.
Standing Committee On Finance Comments
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The most important aspects of this department's presentation to the committee were briefings on the planned transfer of Arctic A airports from the federal government to the GNWT, and on marine resupply options for the eastern Arctic.
Arctic A Airport Transfer
The GNWT has already negotiated the transfer of responsibility for smaller B and C airports from the federal government, and is now concluding negotiations to transfer the larger A airports. These are the nine largest airports in the NWT: Cambridge Bay, Fort Simpson, Fort Smith, Hay River, Inuvik, Iqaluit, Norman Wells, Resolute and Yellowknife. When this transfer is complete, every airport in the NWT will be owned and operated by the territorial government.
The standing committee supports the principle of transferring responsibility for airports in the NWT from the federal government. Some concern was expressed, though, regarding the details of negotiations. The federal government appears to be trying to save money by devolving responsibility for all airports in Canada, other than the profitable ones, to other authorities. Committee Members urge the government to ensure that the final transfer agreement includes adequate resources to permit the continued operation of NWT airports at acceptable levels of service.
Eastern Arctic Resupply
In the committee's review of the 1994-95 capital estimates, serious concern was expressed about a proposal to build a marine resupply terminal in Rankin Inlet. At that time, committee Members refused to accept the project until such time as all available options had been explored. The $50,000 budgeted for the project for 1994-95 was eventually directed towards a full study of the issue.
The department presented its case for the terminal in a briefing to the committee. While resupply issues relating to the Baffin and Kitikmeot were also discussed, the committee's attention was focused on the Keewatin issue. Of the four options presented to the committee for Keewatin resupply, the department still recommended the original option of having dry goods continue to be shipped through Churchill, but with petroleum products now being shipped directly to Rankin Inlet and then redistributed by barge from there.
The presentation suggested that the direct resupply option would involve the lowest annual costs. The department explained that this option was not acceptable for a number of reasons. However, the committee did not feel that the explanation was adequate. Specifically, the briefing did not include any numbers supporting those reasons. Committee Members have asked the department for a more detailed report on the numbers surrounding the department's reasons for not choosing the direct resupply option.
The committee was also curious as to the division of responsibilities in the eastern Arctic resupply issue. It appears that the Minister of Transportation has taken responsibility for the Keewatin resupply issue, while the Minister of Public Works and Services has responsibility for resupply options in the Baffin and Kitikmeot regions. The committee's recommendation on this issue can be found earlier under capital expenditure issues.
Mr. Chairman, that concludes the Standing Committee on Finance review of the 1995-96 capital estimates for the Department of Transportation.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Ng. Mr. Minister, would you like to invite your witnesses in?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
John Todd Keewatin Central
I would, Mr. Chairman. May I?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
The Chair Brian Lewis
Is the committee happy with that prospect?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Todd, please take the stand and bring your helpers in.
Thank you, Mr. Todd. Perhaps for the record, you could introduce your witness please.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
John Todd Keewatin Central
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. On my immediate right is Mr. Gamble, who is the deputy minister of Transportation.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Todd. Do Members have any general comments or general questions about the Department of Transportation? Are you ready to go into detail?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Line By Line
Marine Services
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
The Chair Brian Lewis
Okay, the detail begins on page 09-9. Marine services, buildings and works, Fort Smith, total region, $1.38 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 664
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total buildings and works, $1.38 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Equipment acquisition, Fort Smith, $20,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Inuvik, total region, $50,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total equipment acquisition, $70,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total activity, $1.45 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Highway Operations
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Highway operations, page 09-11. Buildings and works, headquarters, total region, $441,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Inuvik, total region, $196,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total buildings and works, $637,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Equipment acquisition, headquarters, total region, $1.084 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total equipment acquisition, $1.084 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total activity, $1.721 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Arctic Airports
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Page 09-13, Arctic airports, buildings and works, headquarters, total region, $11,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Fort Smith, total region, $1.45 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Inuvik, total region, $1.75 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Baffin, total region, $1.764 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Keewatin, total region, $1.73 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Kitikmeot, total region, $2.425 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total buildings and works, $9.13 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
The Chair Brian Lewis
Equipment acquisition, headquarters, total region, $90,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 665
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Fort Smith, total region, $19,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Inuvik, total region, $301,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Baffin, total region, $250,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Keewatin, total region, $107,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total equipment acquisition, $767,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Total activity, $9.897 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Transportation Planning
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Turn to page 09-19, transportation planning. Buildings and works, headquarters, total region, $1.43 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Fort Smith, total region, $17.036 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Antoine, sorry. I missed you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Mr. Chairman, under transportation planning for Fort Smith, this is the area where the highway is getting reconstructed and paved. I just wanted to make a comment with regard to that. The work that this department is doing in my area is going along fairly well. We have major infrastructure, specifically on the bridge to Wrigley, as well as the access road built in Jean Marie River. This current summer, there was work done.
I made a statement in the House when the Minister wasn't here last week with regard to the great progress that has been made in building this access road in Jean Marie River. I don't know if the Minister was aware of it, but I did make a statement that the work was complete beyond what was anticipated this summer. There is money in the budget for this coming year and I appreciate that.
This past summer, the people who were working on it ran out of money and the season was still very good. With the type of work they were doing, if there was more money put in at that time, perhaps they could have done more. But there is only so much per year that is put in there. I think the Minister knows what I am talking about. The equipment wasn't up to par, though. If they had had the proper equipment, they could have done more. I was wondering if it was possible for next year, if this budget is approved and if they are working very well and run out of money before the end of the year, to help this community out by putting additional money in there? I see future years anticipated at $1.6 million in there. Is it at all possible to use some of that in advance?
The purpose is the work is going very well and then they run out of money. There is still a lot of good season left, but they have to shut down their operation. I am just saying if they are working very well and they run out of money, is it possible to have more funds put in place? That is the concern I have in this particular area, for the Jean Marie River access road. That is the comment I have. Could the Minister reply to that, Mr. Chairman?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Todd.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
John Todd Keewatin Central
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. There is $350,000 in the budget for this coming year. There was roughly about $433,000 spent in previous years. We are committed to this project to a total of about $2.4 million. We have allocated these dollars based upon what we think is a fair allocation of dollars. This is a major road facility compared to some of the other ones we are doing in Pelly Bay or places like that.
I would commit to the Member this: this access road program has taken off and I am very pleased with the way it has gone. If you remember, Mr. Ningark from Pelly Bay was a strong advocate of this program. Should some of the projects that we have under way for next year not fulfil their fiscal commitment, if the project was going well in Jean Marie River, I would commit to reallocating some of that money if it wasn't spent. Do you understand? If we have X amount of dollars in the budget for X community and for whatever reason it doesn't get done, we are flexible enough to be prepared to do that. As a matter of fact, we did that in a very small way this year for Baker Lake. It was not much money, but we did it. There is no new money, but there may be a reallocation of money if the work doesn't get completed in the other access road programs. Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Todd. Mr. Antoine.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 666
Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. In this section, transportation planning, there is nothing in the budget for what I am talking about. We need to do something to improve the road immediately out of Fort Simpson towards the airport. It is
about 14 kilometres, perhaps more. It is probably more like 18 or 19 kilometres if you take it right from where the ferry comes off at the Liard River, right into the community of Fort Simpson. It is a well-travelled road, especially to the airport. It has to be repaired constantly throughout the summer because it is a gravel road. They have treated it with calcium and every time it rains, it turns to soup. The heavy trucks pound the road and it is very hard for people to keep their vehicles. Many people have moved out of the community to another part of the community called "Wild Rose Acreage" and the vehicles are taking a pounding.
The request has been made to the department a number of times to see if we could put some asphalt there. There is nothing in the budget for it, but I wanted to ask the Minister if it is at all possible to do some preliminary studies and evaluation to determine what would be required to get the road so that it could be paved or have an asphalt surface? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Antoine. Mr. Todd.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
John Todd Keewatin Central
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, the honourable Member did draw this to my attention some time ago. I did commit to take a look at it in terms of whether it was possible. Unfortunately, there is $1 million less in the budget because of general restraint that everyone is working under, not just myself. I did commit and I will commit publicly that we will do some engineering work on that to determine the cost and see if we can fit it into the budget somewhere. We will certainly make every effort to do that. We just weren't able to do that this year because of the limitations that we are all working under. I am working, as some of you know, with the federal government and provincial counterparts in trying to put together a joint national highway program.
Should we be fortunate enough to be able to secure something there, we may be able to do some of these things similar to what we did when we did the strategic transportation initiative. When we got that money from the federal government, it moved a lot of things up, some of the air strips in Mr. Antoine's riding and others. So I would commit that we would do some preliminary cost-analysis of this project and hopefully be able to work it into the budget somewhere in the next little while. Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Todd. Mr. Antoine.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. If that could be done, I would appreciate it. Certainly, I would be willing to work with the Minister and his department with the community of Fort Simpson to do that and follow through with his commitment. Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you. We are on Inuvik, total region, $2.3 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Dent.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I had a question on the Fort Smith region. It was in reference to the project on Highway 2, kilometre zero to 44. Could we get some information about what that project is about, please?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Todd.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
John Todd Keewatin Central
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The one for $800,000? Is that the one Mr. Dent is referring to?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Dent.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake
Yes, Mr. Chairman, that is the project to which I am referring. I was under the impression that this had been paved already and was wondering why the extra expenditure?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Todd.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
John Todd Keewatin Central
Mr. Dent is correct. In 1992, Highway 2 did receive an asphalt pavement overlay. Recent inspections by the department staff reveal that the overlay is deteriorating prematurely. This premature deterioration was caused by improper asphalt overlay mix. The department, with the legal division, is evaluating options for recourse with the contractor and site engineers. We need to do this to prevent further deterioration, Mr. Chairman.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Dent.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, could we find out if the department is pursuing legal options to try to recover the money that was spent initially on paving this, if in fact there was a problem with the way the work was done.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Todd.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
John Todd Keewatin Central
Mr. Chairman, that is correct. We are trying to recover the cost of this unfortunate project. Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Todd. Anyone else? For the record, I believe I finished Fort Smith, total region, $17.036 million. I believe we passed it, but for the record, total region, Fort Smith, $17.036 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Inuvik, total region, $2.3 million. Baffin, total region, $700,000.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Keewatin, total region, $1.15 million.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 667
The Chair Brian Lewis
Kitikmeot, total region, $350,000. Mr. Ng.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to ask the Minister how his department priorizes community needs as far as harbour improvements. I noticed that the Baffin has one major one and the Keewatin has three communities with a major development, yet the Kitikmeot only has one small one with a Pelly Bay harbour enhancement. Is there a plan out there that the department is utilizing or is it based on demand from communities or from his regional departments and how do they designate funding for harbour enhancements? Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Ng. Mr. Todd.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
John Todd Keewatin Central
We do have a plan. Just to correct Mr. Ng's comments, in the Kitikmeot, we have done a significant amount of work in Gjoa Haven, Taloyoak and Pelly Bay. So there is a plan in place based upon the fiscal resources we have. They are somewhat limited. There is a slightly unique situation in some of the places in the west where the Coast Guard has been involved, historically. We have a plan in place and it is based upon the requests coming in from the community, the need established by the department, priorities established by the municipalities and the fiscal resources that we have. Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you. Mr. Ng.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Could the Minister clarify what involvement the Coast Guard would have in the communities in the western part of the region, primarily Coppermine and Cambridge Bay? Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Ng. Mr. Todd.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
John Todd Keewatin Central
We work very closely with the Canadian Coast Guard. I will ask Mr. Gamble, he has been dealing with them far longer than I have, if I may, to clarify for Mr. Ng the relationship and the role of the Coast Guard, and the development of wharfs.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Gamble.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
Gamble
The Coast Guard is broken into several regions and the Coast Guard in the western region did have some capital dollars available for facilities in the Mackenzie River and western Arctic, including Kitikmeot. In the last several years, they have made that funding available to us for upgrades at communities such as Taloyoak, Gjoa Haven and Paulatuk as well, using Coast Guard funding, which were not as successful in the eastern regions. They don't seem to have a capital fund there. We are also doing work in some of the Mackenzie valley communities to support the barge resupply landing improvements each year.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Gamble. Total region, $350,000. Mr. Ng.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot
I would like to ask Mr. Gamble, regarding the Coast Guard funding, is it an annual amount that is designated to the department or is that a yearly negotiated amount? How does it affect the department's capital planning as far as harbour enhancements? Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
The Chair Brian Lewis
Is it all right, Mr. Todd, if Mr. Gamble answers that question?
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
John Todd Keewatin Central
Yes, Mr. Chairman.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Gamble.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
Gamble
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. In previous years, the Coast Guard had a capital allocation, but they were working through the federal Public Works and really weren't spending any of it. In our developing relationship with Coast Guard in that region, we initially offered to do some work at Taloyoak. Since that time, they have allocated their capital funding which runs between $200,000 and $300,000 a year. Each year, we nominate projects in that region for improvement and generally they have simply been approving that and providing the contribution through us to manage the work. It is largely done in support of the resupply.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you. Total region, $350,000. Mr. Patterson.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 668
Dennis Patterson Iqaluit
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just had one question about resupply particularly in the Keewatin, but in the eastern Arctic generally. As I understand it, Mr. Chairman, the department is examining the option of supplying petroleum products through Rankin Inlet while supplying dry cargo through Churchill. The standing committee will recommend that it makes sense to have the POL supply in the Baffin and the transportation of cargo in the Baffin, but particularly the POL which is now under review because of transfers from MOT brought under one department so as to achieve the maximum economies of scale.
I also understand that the department is even looking beyond eastern Arctic requirements, and is considering whether we might possibly profitably collaborate with Greenland on resupply in some of these items, which would make an even bigger potential economy of scale. I'm all in favour of this, Mr. Chairman.
We also know that the department has done analysis which shows that putting aside the issue of local benefits -- and I don't mean that they're not important -- but looking solely at the issue of cost, the direct resupply of fuel and cargo from Montreal would be the cheapest option for resupplying Keewatin, and that's of course the way it's done in Baffin now. I guess I would like to ask the Minister, Mr. Chairman, assuming that the government will decide to act on the SCOF's recommendation and roll the Baffin POL requirements and the whole resupply issue in Baffin under the authority of the Minister of Transportation so that there can be perhaps better links between Baffin and Keewatin, would this change mean that the Department of Transportation would be looking at new and larger options for resupply in Keewatin? I guess, Mr. Chairman, I'm wanting to know how final this conclusion is about using Rankin to supply petroleum products for the Keewatin and using Churchill to supply dry cargo, in light of other options that may emerge with Baffin and/or with Greenland. So I'm just wondering, is there still analysis yet to be undertaken before the final plan is concluded? Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 669
The Chair Brian Lewis
Perhaps a very broad and very general question, but we're back in Keewatin to do a resupply. Mr. Todd, it's up to you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 669
John Todd Keewatin Central
Mr. Chairman, the recommendation of the standing committee hasn't been discussed at Cabinet, with respect to transferring responsibility over to the Department of Transportation.
You're always under review, you're constantly in a review mode. We believe that this thing has to be staged, and I did illustrate that, hopefully, to the Standing Committee on Finance. We know there will be some significant savings based upon this capital budget, once we get it all in place. Mr. Gamble and Mr. Clegg from Public Works are working together in trying to look at other ways in which we can save this government money so that we can do the kinds of things that are asked of us to do.
So nothing is final until it's final, I guess. But we're certainly moving on this initiative because we know there are significant savings.
The honourable Member is correct about the Greenland experience right now. Mr. Gamble and Mr. Clegg recently came back from discussions with the people over there to see if there is a possible linkage there where there would be some more savings. So it's kind of a moving policy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 669
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Patterson.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 669
Dennis Patterson Iqaluit
Mr. Chairman, as I recall, the discussions in SCOF about this issue...The committee had asked for more details about the option of direct resupply of fuel and cargo from Montreal. I don't believe the committee has yet received this analysis, and I'm just wondering if the committee is going to have the opportunity to review the Minister's complete data on this issue and review the options before any final decisions are taken, given that there's quite a sizeable capital expenditure that would be involved. Thank you.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 669
The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Todd.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 669
John Todd Keewatin Central
(Microphone turned off)...be approved. I didn't get all the information necessary to SCOF, but I met with SCOF twice on this issue. I'm not asking for any further delays, I want approvals today based upon the fact that we can save $1.6 million to this government.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 669
The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Todd. Mr. Patterson.
Committee Motion 49-12(6): To Adopt Recommendation 8, Carried
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Page 669
Dennis Patterson Iqaluit
Just so I understand it clearly, Mr. Chairman, is the Minister saying that the government will go ahead and supply petroleum products through Rankin Inlet and dry cargo through Churchill, and that's a final decision, and approval of this budget will mean that no other short-term options will be considered? Thank you.
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Mr. Todd.
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John Todd Keewatin Central
(Microphone turned off)...because I explained very clearly that this one had to be phased, that it's our intention to move ahead with this marine terminal to enhance the ability to deliver fuel oil into Rankin Inlet. Forty three per cent of the fuel oil stays in Rankin Inlet. We move it twice. It costs us money to move it twice. We merely want to move it once. We need to enhance the marine terminal facilities to do that. We will then look at other options, as everybody does in government, in looking at other areas where we can save, whether it's Greenland, whether it's the dry cargo, et cetera. But at this time, that's the phase that we're proceeding with.
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you, Mr. Todd. I would like to remind Members that we've had a lot of opportunity for general questions, and we should be on the detail now, and we've already gone through the Keewatin. We're into the Kitikmeot and we were dealing with the total region, $350,000. Agreed?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Total buildings and works, $22.966 million.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Contributions, Baffin, total region, $40,000.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Keewatin, total region, $150,000.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Kitikmeot, total region, $80,000.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Total contributions, $270,000.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Total activity, $23.236 million.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
We'll go back to the summary on page 09-7. Capital expenditures, total capital expenditures, $36.304 million.
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Are we agreed that this department is concluded?
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Some Hon. Members
Agreed.
---Agreed
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you very much, Members, for your questions, and thank you very much, Mr. Todd and your witness, for your answers. Would you like to take a five-minute break because a few people were nodding to do that, but I would be guided by what you want to do. Mr. Dent.
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Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake
Mr. Chairman, I would like to recommend that the committee continue on with consideration of the budget, and move into Economic Development and Tourism department.
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The Chair Brian Lewis
I would have to ask Mr. Todd if he's ready to handle that. Mr. Todd, it's the wish of the committee to deal with Economic Development and Tourism. Are you ready for that today?
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John Todd Keewatin Central
Yes, Mr. Chairman, I'm ready.
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Okay, then, proceed, Mr. Todd, with your opening comments.
Department Of Economic Development And Tourism
Minister's Introductory Remarks
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John Todd Keewatin Central
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. As you can see from our budget estimates, we're proposing $8.4 million in new investments for 1995-96. These investments involve a number of projects either directly related to the development of small community economies, or to the development of our tourist infrastructure.
There is $4.9 million or close to 60 per cent earmarked for the community development of the NWT Development Corporation, while the remainder of $3.5 million is targeted for tourism and parks development.
NWT Development Corporation
Mr. Chairman, the role of the NWT Development Corporation is to create jobs and opportunities where few exist. In the NWT, this means investing in smaller, less developed communities. Although there is room for improvement, the evidence shows that the corporation has been very effective at job creation. This year alone, the corporation will spend over $12 million on NWT goods and services. It now has investments in 23 communities and makes regular purchases of meat, fish, crafts, artwork and other goods in another 10 communities. The benefits of these activities are significant. Based on the information collected this spring, every dollar the Development Corporation spends means $4.25 in other direct and indirect benefits. Just in terms of direct employment, businesses owned by the Development Corporation directly employ about 200 aboriginal people. In addition, another 400 hunters, trappers and fishermen received a cheque from the Development Corporation businesses.
I am also satisfied by our improvements in efficiency. Our capital target for this year is down by $1.1 million, or about 18 per cent. Subsidies have also been reduced by $100,000 to $2.2 million.
We are also moving to implement the committee's recommendation the corporation focus its efforts on smaller ventures and on a wider distribution of investments. Mr. Chairman, the investment plan of the Development Corporation reflects this direction. You will see that the six larger capital investments for 1995-96 are in the Deh Cho, Kitikmeot, North Slave, Baffin and Inuvik regions. The information we provided to the Standing Committee on Finance in October details the corporation's expenditure plans.
Some highlights of this investment plan include:
- $816,000 to upgrade the Kitikmeot fish and meat plant;
- $330,000 towards helping the people of Nahanni Butte build a new store, cafe and hotel; and,
- $250,000 to assist the people of Pangnirtung to rebuild the print shop.
Other major investments are slated for Taloyoak, Aklavik and Rae-Edzo. In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, I believe the Development Corporation's plan for 1995-96 addresses the concerns raised by the committee, and provides a sound basis for building opportunities and incomes within all communities.
Parks And Visitor Services
Mr. Chairman, the balance of the department's capital budget involves development of parks and visitor centres. Unlike the NWT Development Corporation which is directly involved with sales and employment, parks and visitors' centres represent a service to residence and the travelling public. They are designed to make it more comfortable and enjoyable to travel in the NWT. The objective is to encourage people, residents and non-residents, to travel more and to stay longer. The end result is more people spending more money in the NWT, creating new jobs and opportunities for local residents.
In the past, the department has been criticized for not measuring the impact of programs. I agree, and have made performance measurement one of the department's top priorities. In my opinion, what gets measured, gets done. While our last major review of the tourism industry was undertaken in 1989, this year we have initiated four reviews:
1. Working with the Bureau of Statistics we have completed a cost-benefit and economic impact analysis of parks expenditures in the western NWT.
2. We have implemented an exit survey to assess the total impact of tourism and resident travel expenditures in the NWT. Unlike the previous survey in 1989, which cost well in excess of $200,000 and was managed by a southern consultant, this survey was completed in-house using local community resources, for under $80,000.
3. This year we introduced the concept of a travel diary to the NWT. Although we had a late start, we managed to hand over 600 diaries to tourists entering the NWT. Each day the tourist is asked to complete a daily log of their
expenses and experiences, positive and negative. In this way we can identify the impacts of tourism on local economies. Although the final results are not in, our response rate has been very high, while the cost has been under $8,000.
4. Finally, we have developed a licensing database which maintains detail information on each tourism facility. This allows us to accurately track capacity and investment at the community and regional levels.
Mr. Chairman, without going into the detail of our cost-benefit analysis, I'd like to review some key findings. First, we found that close to 95 per cent of tourists reported that our parks met or exceeded their expectations. Overall consumer or client satisfaction, the first measure of success in any business venture, was very high.
Last year we charged $10 for staying one night in a campground and the total permit sales amounted to 175,000, an increase in attendance of 25 per cent since last year. Close to 90 per cent of the people surveyed felt the fees being charged were good value for money.
Or course, Mr. Chairman, these direct revenues are only a small portion of the total benefit. The overall objective is to have tourists spend more money in communities and on local goods and services. The Bureau of Statistics estimates that tourists using campgrounds between mid-June and early September contributed over $2.6 million to the territorial economy. This number does not represent the whole tourist season, nor does it include the impact of residential spending.
As Members of the Standing Committee on Finance are aware, we have developed a detailed cost-benefit model to assist in setting park development priorities. Staff are currently working on preparing a less technical version of the results -- which we all didn't understand -- which will be made available to Members of the standing committee.
Investment Priorities For 1995-96
Mr. Chairman, I would like to discuss the new parks and tourism investments planned for 1995-96. Over the past five years, our focus has been on modernizing and renovating older facilities. We will continue this work over the next few years, with the priority areas being in the Twin Falls and Hay
River parks, Happy Valley in Inuvik, Sylvia Grinnel Park in Baffin and the community campground in Fort Simpson.
We are also concerned about the eastern Arctic. Although our current year estimates are not final, there seems to be a decline in tourism activity over the past six years. We will be examining this development in greater detail over the current year, but in the interim we are developing plans for park development at Bloody Falls near Coppermine and Mallikjuaq Island near Cape Dorset.
New Parks Policy
We are also working on a new policy which will establish guidelines for parks development.
Conclusion
In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, this year's capital plan is strengthened by work on several fronts: visitor research; policy development; cost-benefit analysis; and, improved systems planning.
I believe the capital plan before you will ensure the continued growth of our tourism industry. Furthermore, it will provide opportunities and jobs in those communities and regions where few options exist. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Thank you very much, Mr. Todd, for your opening remarks. I would like to turn to the Standing Committee on Finance. Mr. Antoine.
Standing Committee On Finance Comments
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Jim Antoine Nahendeh
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The Standing Committee on Finance review of the 1995-96 capital estimates on the Department of Economic Development and Tourism start off with tourism and parks.
Tourism And Parks
The standing committee held its first week of hearings in Iqaluit. During that time, committee Members were able to see the NWT's newest territorial park, Katannilik Park, on southern Baffin Island. Not only did Members have a chance to see the park itself, and the facilities available to those using the park, they also met with the Lake Harbour hamlet council and tourism committee, and discussed the benefits expected by the community from the investment in the park.
This park is an example of how careful investment can result in greatly multiplied economic benefit to northerners. The tourist spending has greatly exceeded GNWT spending on the park, and the benefits in jobs and economic activity for the area are obvious. This objective was the basis of last year's recommendation to the department in the committee's review of the capital estimates.
Following last year's recommendation, the committee was pleased to see a comprehensive cost/benefit analysis of the department's tourism and parks program, and of specific projects. Not only that, but committee Members were especially impressed that conclusions from this initial analysis were indeed being used to guide the department's capital spending. Analysis of benefits from investment in Katannilik Park, in campgrounds in the western NWT, and in gateway visitor centres at the 60th parallel and in Dawson City, Yukon, have been used to guide and redirect departmental spending.
The sole complaint of the committee was that the analysis was very difficult to understand. While departmental officials may well find the analysis useful in its present form, committee Members and their staff found it hard to quickly digest and analyze the information as presented. Members look forward to seeing a more understandable version of the analysis, as promised by the Minister.
Country Foods
Committee Members raised earlier comments about the use of country foods by NWT institutions. Members recognize that, for institutions such as Stanton Yellowknife Hospital or the Yellowknife Correctional Centre, buying caribou or char would be more expensive than buying beef or tuna. However, the government has to consider not only the economic benefit to northerners of encouraging and supporting the development of a country food sector, but also the social well-being of those confined to such institutions who would likely prefer to have access to food with which they are familiar.
Recommendation 2
The Standing Committee on Finance recommends that the Department of Economic Development and Tourism take the lead in developing a policy that would encourage and enable government institutions such as hospitals and correctional centres to purchase and serve more northern foods.
NWT Development Corporation
The budget for the NWT Development Corporation was listed under this department. However, very little detail was provided. Committee Members would not only like to see details of planned investments and expenditures by the corporation, but also want to see the corporation's corporate plan. It is important that the committee have the opportunity to examine the corporation's activities and compare them to past results. The Minister promised to provide appropriate data as soon as it was available, and to table the corporate plan in the House. As such, Members will discuss issues related to the Development Corporation with the Minister in the House.
Mr. Chairman, I have a motion.
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The Chair Brian Lewis
Okay, Mr. Antoine, proceed with your motion.