This is page numbers 1197 - 1228 of the Hansard for the 12th Assembly, 7th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was education.

Topics

Committee Report 11-12(7): Report On The Review Of Bill 25 - The Education Act
Item 11: Reports Of Standing And Special Committees

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An Hon. Member

Question.

Committee Report 11-12(7): Report On The Review Of Bill 25 - The Education Act
Item 11: Reports Of Standing And Special Committees

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? Motion is carried.

---Carried

Mr. Whitford.

Committee Report 11-12(7): Report On The Review Of Bill 25 - The Education Act
Item 11: Reports Of Standing And Special Committees

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Tony Whitford

Tony Whitford Yellowknife South

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to waive Rule 93(4) and have Committee Report 11-12(7) of the Standing Committee on Legislation moved into committee of the whole for today.

Committee Report 11-12(7): Report On The Review Of Bill 25 - The Education Act
Item 11: Reports Of Standing And Special Committees

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Member for Yellowknife South is seeking unanimous consent to waive Rule 93(4). We don't have unanimous consent.

Item 11, reports of standing and special committees. Item 12, reports of committees on the review of bills. Item 13, tabling of documents. Item 14, notices of motion. Item 15, notices of motions for first reading of bills. Mr. Pollard.

Bill 34: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1995-96
Item 15: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

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John Pollard Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Monday, June 12, 1995, I shall move that Bill 34, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1995-96, be read for the first time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Bill 34: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1995-96
Item 15: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Item 15, notices of motions for first reading of bills. Item 16, motions. Mr. Patterson.

Bill 34: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1995-96
Item 15: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

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Dennis Patterson Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would request your agreement that I stand down my motion today. Perhaps, just for a moment, I could explain that Mr. Kakfwi is not able to be here for this debate affecting his ministry. For that reason, I would like to stand it down today. Thank you.

Bill 34: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1995-96
Item 15: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

This motion will be on the order paper for tomorrow. Item 17, first reading of bills. Mr. Pollard.

John Pollard Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Kivallivik, that Bill 33, An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, No. 3, be read for the first time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the motion.

An Hon. Member

Question.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? Motion is carried.

---Carried

Bill 33 has had first reading. Item 17, first reading of bills. Item 18, second reading of bills. Item 19, consideration in committee of the whole of bills and other matters: Committee Report 5-12(7), Report on the Review of Rewriting the Liquor Laws of the Northwest Territories: A Legislative Action Paper; Committee Report 9-12(7), Report on the Review of the Financial Statements of the Government of the Northwest Territories and the Report of the Auditor General for Canada for the Fiscal Year Ended March 31, 1994; Committee Report 10-12(7), Report on Bill 32: An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, No. 2; Bill 25, Education Act; and, Bill 32, An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, No. 2, with Mr. Lewis in the chair.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair Brian Lewis

I would like to call the committee to order then. Good afternoon, colleagues. What would Members like to do this afternoon. Mr. Dent, did you discuss this with the Government House Leader?

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to recommend that we continue consideration of Committee Report 5-12(7) and then move into consideration of Committee Report 9-12(7); following that, Committee Report 10-12(7) and Bill 32.

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair Brian Lewis

Do Members agree with that order of business?

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

---Agreed

Committee Report 5-12(7): Report On The Review Of Rewriting The Liquor Laws Of The Northwest Territories: A Legislative Action Paper
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

June 7th, 1995

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The Chair Brian Lewis

All right, then. We will turn to Committee Report 5-12(7), which is where we left off yesterday, I believe. Any further discussion on Committee Report 5-12(7)? Mr. Koe.

General Comments

Fred Koe Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would just like to make a few comments on the Review of Rewriting the Liquor Laws.

As Members are aware, three years ago, motions were passed and then work was done by the Beaufort-Delta regional leaders in trying to get some changes made to the liquor laws to allow them to issue permits on amounts of booze or liquor that an individual can buy. There is a lot of concern in those communities about bootlegging and the quantities of liquor that an individual can purchase, and I am very pleased to see that the committee has addressed these in the report.

I am also very pleased to see that they have addressed the issue of increased control at the community level. This is one area where the communities, especially those in the northwestern area of the territories, really feel strongly that they should have more say and more authority to control the flow or sale of liquor within their boundaries.

The report didn't address all the issues that were in the legislative action paper but I assume, by not addressing them, that the committee was in favour of a lot of the issues that were raised in the action paper. I know that in the public hearings many of these were addressed by a lot of the presenters and we all understand that not everybody agrees on every issue and there may not be a definitive way to deal with each issue. But generally there was consensus on items raised that many are contentious, and in the act we have to have ways of dealing with these issues.

So those are some of the comments. I just wanted to give acknowledgement to the leaders in the Beaufort-Delta communities that we are getting closer to making the things that they raised law and, hopefully early in the next Legislative Assembly when the act is finally drafted, the issues that they've raised will be included in the new law. Thank you very much.

The Chair Brian Lewis

Thank you, Mr. Koe. Committee Report 5-12(7) then. Does anybody have anything further to say on this report? Mr. Ningark.

John Ningark Natilikmiot

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Are we dealing with the liquor laws? I will speak very briefly to the issue.

Mr. Chairman, I represent two dry communities in my region, one being my home community, Pelly Bay, and the other, Gjoa Haven. Many years ago when I was working for the hamlet, the people of Pelly Bay wanted to go dry, and we communicated with the government at that time through Social Services and through the Justice Minister's department. Because of the problems the use of alcohol was causing for the community, a number of elders got together with some of the community leadership and they wanted to do something about the problem. So the community petitioned the government, and we were told that when we have a plebiscite, if the majority of the people wanted to go dry then that would be the decision of the community through the plebiscite, Mr. Chairman.

For the people of the community, mainly the elders and some women who were very anxious to go through with the plebiscite, the anticipation was that once we have a dry community it will remain a dry community. It will be such: a dry community. We didn't realize, Mr. Chairman, that once you have a plebiscite and the majority of the people decided to go dry then you have a dry community. We didn't realize then, Mr. Chairman, that it was only a technically dry community. Just about every other week -- I am sure this is also the case in Gjoa Haven, Pelly Bay and probably other dry communities in the particular jurisdiction -- people bring in liquor from other communities that are wet.

We have had many public meetings about this problem of alcohol in a dry community; I underline "a dry community." We have had many meetings. Some of the leadership, elders and women are frustrated that, because of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms, there is little a law enforcement agency can do to make sure that a dry community is a dry community. We were told many times by the Justice people and by the RCMP enforcement agency that only if the RCMP has a reasonable ground to believe that a person is in fact bringing in liquor can that person be searched.

So, as a result, because there is not much the law enforcement agency can do to search for liquor, even though Pelly Bay is supposed to be a dry community as is the case in Gjoa Haven, people still drink. Perhaps the problem is not as big as a totally wet community but there is a problem in a dry community.

I don't know if there is much we can do about enforcing dry communities to make sure that there is no liquor in the community but I don't think in this particular jurisdiction there is such a dry community. To me, it's a big joke. I think it's a big joke that dry communities are supposed to be dry communities.

I wish that there was something that we could do about that. I wish that once the community decides to become a dry community, it is a dry community. Okay. Just a point I would like to make. Thank you.

The Chair Brian Lewis

Thank you, Mr. Ningark. Any further comments on Committee Report 5-12(7)? Mr. Patterson.

Dennis Patterson Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to direct this to the chairman of the committee. I wonder if, in its deliberations, the committee considered a question that I find often comes up in my riding, especially since Iqaluit took the bold step in 1976 of closing the local liquor store to over-the-counter sales; a step that I don't think has ever been regretted by the majority of residents in the community, although it has been complained about by some.

Ever since that decision was made -- as a result of a petition by the people of Iqaluit to the then Commissioner, Stuart Hodgson, who acted decisively to agree to the community's request -- the simple question has come up as to whether drinking is a privilege or a right in the democratic society that we have in the Northwest Territories.

I would like to ask the chairman if that question came up, and whether the legislative action paper dealt with that question. Is it premised on drinking being a privilege in the Northwest Territories and not a right? Thank you.

The Chair Brian Lewis

Thank you, Mr. Patterson. Do you wish to respond, Mr. Whitford?

Tony Whitford

Tony Whitford Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I can't recall whether this issue was raised specifically to that but I do recollect that, in general terms, people did talk about the rights or the privileges of the use of alcohol. It certainly must be regarded as a privilege because in many cases there are certain restrictions, licences and permits and stuff that are required to allow people to consume alcoholic substances.

I, again, don't recall anybody raising that as a specific issue that we could have sunk our teeth into and it became something that we entered into our report. What I do recollect, and other Members could assist me if they choose, is that it was regarded, in general terms, Mr. Chairman, that the consumption of alcohol was not a right but that it was a privilege. I think that's the way it was seen.

The Chair Brian Lewis

Thanks very much, Mr. Whitford. Mr. Patterson.