This is page numbers 537 - 581 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 3rd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was chairman.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. Mr. Ng.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Because the honourable Member brought this up previously in the Assembly, we did some background work on the numbers and on which inmates could be eligible for electronic monitoring.

You have to take into consideration that wouldn't include inmates who are obviously serving sentences for violent offences. They wouldn't be inmates who were convicted for drug trafficking. Of course, the possibility of it working would only be in the larger communities which have existing correctional facilities where the possibility of using correctional staff to monitor the inmates could be utilized in order to reduce the possibility of additional staffing costs.

We found that, of the 35 inmates at the Yellowknife Correctional Centre, of those inmates who are from Yellowknife who could possibly be on electronic monitoring, 29 of those were serving sentences for violence, four were convicted for trafficking in narcotics, so there is only one person who would be eligible for electronic monitoring in the Yellowknife situation.

The situation of the 23 inmates at the South Mackenzie Correctional Centre, again, those from that community who would possibly be eligible for electronic monitoring, living in that community, 14 of those were serving sentences for violent offences, leaving 9 who could possibly be eligible for electronic monitoring.

In the Baffin Correctional Centre, there were no inmates who would have been eligible for electronic monitoring.

So it came down to the fact, Mr. Chairman, for the limited amount of inmates, it would be cost-prohibitive to establish this program for that.

Recognizing what the honourable Member says as far as the possibility of individuals on intermittent sentences being in that situation, the possibility of it working in Yellowknife increased slightly, but it still, to me, didn't justify going to the expense and the work of establishing this program at this time. Thank you.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ng.

Mr. Erasmus.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to thank the Minister for that information since he didn't seem to want to give it to me the other day and since there was not one word of that in the information that was provided to me from his staff, which was rather inadequate. Now that

I know that, I can think about it and let some other people ask some questions. Perhaps I will pursue it further. Like I said, I wanted to thank the Minister. Thank you.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. I have Mr. Ootes.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The NWT has approximately 51 inmates incarcerated at Bowden, Alberta, and they are there because sentences are presumably more than two years less a day. I am wondering if the Minister could tell me who pays for that incarceration? Is that a federally-funded program or is it paid for out of territorial funds?

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. Mr. Ng.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot

Any sentence of two years or more is a federal sentence and, as a result of that, the federal justice system kicks in, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Mr. Ng, I think the question was two years less a day.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Two years plus a day.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Oh. Okay. Thank you. Mr. Ootes.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Several years ago, the subject cropped up as to the possibility of repatriating those inmates to the North, and there were a number of reasons for that; one being that the Northern inmates are then put in with what is felt to be a lot of hardened criminals. Additionally, there is an argument to be made for the fact that if inmates are incarcerated here in the North, they are closer to their families and their homes. The effort to repatriate those inmates and to have an institution built here in the North was not pursued and wasn't followed up on. I am wondering if the Minister could tell us if that may be a possibility and if his department would look at that possibility?

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. Mr. Ng.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The honourable Member is correct. In the past, there was the possibility of a federal institution being established in the North to try to address some of our needs and try to reduce some of the federal inmates going to southern institutions. But as it stands now, those discussions were withdrawn by the federal Justice department. I don't know exactly when, but I know it's not on the table as it stands now, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ng. Mr. Ootes.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 559

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Since it costs the federal government, no doubt, substantial sums of money for transportation, because those inmates would have to be escorted down to those institutions, I am just wondering if it would be feasible to look at the possibility of what was originally considered to add on to the institution here in Yellowknife and put in a maximum institution here. Since the federal government is paying for this program anyway, would they not consider the possibility of putting infrastructure here?

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

May 22nd, 1996

Page 560

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. Mr. Ng.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 560

Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Sorry, for the record, I just wanted to clarify that it was not the Minister of Justice but the Solicitor General's Office of Canada that deals with correctional services.

I think Mr. Ootes probably has a valid point. However, I think there is significant financial pressure on the federal government, as well. It's something that I am certainly willing to take up, but as far as the substantiation for it and the economics of them putting in major capital dollars, that may be an issue that they might not view too favourably, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 560

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ng. Mr. Ootes.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 560

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

I can appreciate the Minister's comments that the federal government will not appreciate having to look at extra expenditures, but there may be situations where there is overcrowding in institutions. I understand that Bowden has 600 inmates and that's likely reaching maximum capacity there. I'm not sure at what other institutions we have inmates incarcerated across the country. The federal government also has to consider the cost of transportation. As I mentioned, in a lot of cases, it requires escorted transportation of inmates. I'm wondering if the Minister wouldn't entertain reopening discussions with the federal government to look at this possibility, if the feds are looking at expanding institutions or they're overcrowded. If they could put in a small addition to the Yellowknife Correctional Institute, the facilities are all there, then we could handle the inmates here.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 560

An Hon. Member

Shame, shame.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 560

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. Mr. Ng.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 560

Kelvin Ng Kitikmeot

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, if the Solicitor General's office were looking at expanding some of the facilities to address some of their capacity levels, certainly I would be addressing the issue with the Solicitor General. Thank you.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 560

The Chair

The Chair Vince Steen

Thank you, Mr. Ng. I have the honourable Member for Iqaluit, Mr. Picco.

Bill 11: Appropriation Act, 1996-97 Department Of Justice
Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 560

Edward Picco Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, when was the last review of the community justice system done and the role of the community justice specialist that we have in place in the communities?