Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the transition plan as presented over the last few days has taken a lot of effort and time from each government department to figure out the logistics of the move toward Nunavut in April 1, 1999. I cannot question any Member of this House on their honour, or ability, or determination to have Nunavut start on April 1, 1999, with the proper resources in place to have the government that we have been working for, that people have wanted for x-number of years. I think what the Transition Action Plan shows at the present time, there are no substantive monetary resources provided by the federal government to make the dream become reality. The reality that people want and expect on April 1, 1999. It may take a couple of years longer. I do not see anywhere in the

document where it says decentralization will not occur. I do not see anything in that document that says that April 1, 1999, is going to come and things will not be in place or be ready. I think it is unfair to hint at anything other than that.

The money that has been provided to date by the feds, going back to last year and back to our meetings as Nunavut leaders in Cambridge Bay and Arviat, we had concerns with the $150 million. We had concerns with the incremental monies that were available. We had concerns with the transitional monies that were available after doing the costing exercises with the only plan on the table, Mr. Chairman, which gives us an idea of where we are going. If someone has a better plan, then I would be prepared to sit down and see it. I think every Member of this House would like to see that. But I have not seen a plan. Footprints 2 was accepted by this government. It was a very good kick, as it were, at forming a government. It pointed the way toward a decentralized government and everyone has endorsed that. I have not heard anyone say anything contrary to that. The transition document shows there are some gaps. If we can get those gaps filled in, then we will be more successful over the next 12 to 18 months while we get geared up for April 1, 1999.

The federal legislation has passed in the House of Commons, so we know that the statutory legislation states that on April 1, 1999, there will be a new territory called Nunavut. At the same time, because Nunavut will be separated from the Northwest Territories, you will have a new territory that we call the Western Territory. I do not see anything in the Transition Action Plan to stop or halt that. I am concerned with the monies that are available. I am concerned with how we are going to have the resources in place. I think the action plan has finally, in writing, outlined those concerns that many people have privately expressed over the past several months.

Today, we have a document that is now publicly stating what many have said privately. I think we should stand up with that document and then look at the arguments, pro and con, Transition Action Plan as presented, as tabled in this House.

Mr. Chairman, my children were born in Iqaluit. My wife is a beneficiary and one of the promises and platforms that I stood on, was to hopefully help Nunavut become a reality with the resources in place on April 1, 1999. I am not telling people how to run their government. But as a legislator, as a person who is elected to enact legislation and, hopefully, help on that path, that is what we are trying to do here. Like I said, Mr. Chairman, we finally have something in writing. Something that a lot of people have been saying privately that now is public. We can have debate on that. If some other group, organization or person comes forward with some solutions to the current fiscal problems that are indicated in that plan, then by all means show it to us and we will have a look at it. There are no contradictions in the plan that I see with Footprints 2, except that indeed, without the proper conditional and transitional funds in place, the decentralization model may not happen right on April 1, 1999.

In the meantime, Mr. Chairman, after saying that, I heard nothing from this government or from some of the honourable Members around the table to state that they were against division. No one is imposing the plan. It is not a piece of legislation that will be passed. It is a document that points the way towards the shortfall of funding to date. It is not an imposition. We have been talking to our constituents. I have seen some press releases coming out of the Northwest Territories' Chamber of Commerce and from some other groups, indicating support for this transition document as a starting point to look at where we go from here. It is a plan. It is not legislation. We either take it in the spirit that it was presented. If someone has a better plan, then I would like to see it on the table and we would be able to debate it and look at it.

Everyone realizes the concern with jobs and positions. Hopefully, it is an action call. It is a wake-up call to our partners to help us out in this situation. I think with the change in government and with the new ministerial shift in DIAND, we are going to have a fresh approach to this. I would be asking our colleagues in the next few days. The Nunavut Caucus will be looking to meet with our partners, NTI and the federal government, to have a Nunavut leaders' meeting to discuss the Transition Action Plan after we have word from the federal government what their opinion is of it. Before we do that, anything else would be premature. I do not like a lot of the things I see in the transitional plan, but again, no plan is perfect. Again, if someone else has a better option to present, I am sure we would have an opportunity to look at it. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Picco. General comments. I have Mr. O'Brien. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Picco was looking for a better plan. I am sure Mr. Todd will agree with me, you can move all the jobs out of Iqaluit and move them into Arviat and Baker Lake. In all seriousness, in reference to Mr. Steen's comments and also Mr. Picco's, the word that I heard describe this document from Mr. Todd was, "it is advice, no more, no less." I think if it is anything other than that, there will be some stormy times ahead, Mr. Steen, your comments, if they are correct, will bear out themselves as we go through this process over the next few weeks. The document is not perfect. I see it as advice. When I first looked at it I was upset, I was concerned because it did nothing to help my communities of Arviat and Baker Lake. It does not address the decentralized model as per Footprints 2, as it relates to my two communities. I have a lot of concern with that and so do the people in my communities. I think for the time being that we have to go through the process, and I see it, again, just as document that is providing advice. If the Interim Commissioner, NTI and all the signatories to the agreement see some good in this, fine. If they do not, that is fine also. But I think as a joint agreement by all parties and, as I have indicated and I believe Mr. Picco stated, there are areas of concern that we all share. At this point I think we should go through the document and see it for what it is worth. The various parties can take it or leave it. It is a start. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. O'Brien. Mr. Minister. Mr. Todd.

I did not realize it was going to be so emotional and I am surprised, quite frankly, at Mr. Steen's comments; but Mr. Steen, of course, frequently surprises me, which is not unusual. I do not know where anybody gets the idea that we are trying, Mr. Steen or others, to impose this on anybody's will. I carefully crafted my opening ministerial comments to ensure that we sent the right signal to

everybody. Just so, in case some of you have forgotten or have not taken the time to read the stuff, I am going to repeat some of it because I think it bears repeating.

We said in the plan, in my comments, that in this plan, we have no legal mandate to implement transition measures in Nunavut. Let me repeat that, no legal mandate to implement transition measures in Nunavut. It is clear that transitional responsibility lies with the Interim Commissioner and the federal government. I also said, to a large extent we have to make some critical decisions on the provision of reasonable funding from the federal government. We have tried to document, very clearly and succinctly, what we could not do a year and a half ago which we demonstrated in March, 1996, in a letter from Mr. Bailey to Mr. Rainer what the shortfall of funding was. I also said I was pleased, and I am pleased, that the Federal Minister is prepared to move, to put a table together to try to determine what the shortfall will be and to try to find a way to examine the $150 million, as well as any additional dollars that are required.

I want to talk about the continuing concern that I have heard from many Members which I thought we had addressed clearly and I need to say it again, with respect to decentralization. I think it was pretty clear, unequivocal, that this government supports decentralization, has from the beginning, and clearly in this report it identifies a $18 million cost that was not in the $150 million Cabinet submission, which we indicated to the federal government at the time. In fact, this transition document, because that is all it is, is adhered to the Footprints in the Snow 2 document. Take the darn time to read it. Excuse my language.

As Members of this House are aware, the Government of the Northwest Territories has continually supported the concept of a decentralized government for Nunavut so long as it was efficiently designed and that adequate federal funding was made available. The Government of the Northwest Territories remains committed to the implementation of a decentralized model of the government for Nunavut on this basis. I mean, how clearer can you be than that. Did I just flap my gums the other day there? Did some of you choose not to be in the House? This is probably the most important document we have put on the table since this Legislature has been elected. To suggest for one minute that we are imposing on somebody is wrong and to suggest also there is no decentralization is wrong! Mr. Chairman, this report and this creation of two new territories is a stepping stone to the partners in the process and we are a legitimate third party in the process, Mr. Steen. The GNWT, NTI and the federal government signed off on the political accord. We have not only the responsibility, we have the obligation to provide as much support and as much advice to the Interim Commissioner as we should. He has the responsibility, pardon me, if he so chooses to accept it or not. That is all we have done here. Nothing else. The other part that is important here, this is a transition document, an interim step. It does not impose on the new government any political ideology with respect to programs, concepts, political innings. It merely provides a concise and detailed report that shows where we can get the essential services up and running for April 1, 1999, to ensure that you have got a Legislative Assembly in place, which we have agreed to in Footprints 2; to ensure that we have got a fiscal position in place so that people can get paid, if you want, and there has to be some legal aspect in place. To me, that is the way I view it. It also clearly shows, and I think this was the important exercise for me, the amount of shortfall on the fiscal side and recognizes that it is a negotiation position and the starting position. So, you know, I could be very candid, I object. I strongly object to the comments being made that we are imposing this on anybody. That was not what the intention was. That is not what it is and I strongly object to the implication that we are not supportive to decentralization. It is just simply not true. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, The honourable Deputy Premier, Mr. Arlooktoo.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I will just make a couple of remarks, and I do not mean to remind Members of the House the years of work that have been done to get to this stage, from the discussions on the concept in the early 1970's to the work leading up to the signing of the Nunavut Political Accord and the signing of the Nunavut Final Agreement. I think if there was ever a critical stage in this long process, we are at it now. I think the plan, tabled yesterday by Mr. Todd, is one that, as Mr. Picco said, a wake-up call to everyone, especially the federal government. I saw quoted in one of the papers very recently, that it is, in fact, a wake-up call to the players. I think the territorial government has been very responsible in doing this work, and I must commend the very hard work of the Division Secretariat and of the different departments in putting this very difficult work together in such a short period of time. As Mr. Todd indicated earlier, and others, a lot of the decisions and direction in the very immediate future will be made by the Interim Commissioner.

I wanted to just comment on some of the things that Mr. Steen said, and I was not going to earlier. I was thinking of just letting it slide, but I was somewhat disturbed by the seemingly derogatory tone that I heard. Maybe it was just my perception, where he, Mr. Steen continually talked about, "those people, these people and them." I wanted to remind him that just about half of the Assembly are "those people" and "them." That we are elected leaders from the Nunavut area.

I do not believe for one minute that Mr. Steen represents the rest of the western Arctic's MLAs and people in expressing some of those sentiments. I certainly hope it was just, perhaps, a difficulty in expressing them. I must say that I was offended. I will listen to comments being made by Members and have every faith in Mr. Todd in representing Cabinet in dealing with this very difficult issue in our discussions, but will jump in when I see the need to. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Arlooktoo. I have Mr. Barnabas. Mr. Todd.

The only comment that I wanted to make was that this is a very sensitive time, very delicate in terms of our negotiations with the federal government and our partners in process. It has probably been, for all of us, one of the most difficult tasks we have had to undertake because we are only one player at the table. I want to remind everybody of that. There are a variety of other players, and, as you know, it becomes even more difficult with more players when you are trying to reach the appropriate compromises. So I would like to, and maybe I am just talking to myself, as well as caution all of us in the level of rhetoric and the way we discuss this issue. I apologize to my colleagues for my outburst earlier. It has

been a lot of long hours and a lot of long days on this issue. Thank you.

Thank you. I have Mr. Barnabas.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I will speak in Inuktitut. Sorry, is there a problem, Mr. Chairman.

I believe there was no translation available. Pause momentarily. Proceed, Mr. Barnabas.

No. It seems we are not getting translation from Inuktitut to English. Mr. Ootes.

Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Mr. Todd.

If I may, Mr. Chairman, I think Mr. Miltenberger's point about showing the magnitude on the fiscal side is an important issue. That is something that we are all facing. As I said earlier in the House yesterday, it is the intention of the federal government and to her credit Ms. Stewart has agreed to put a table together to see if there can be some reprofiling and redirection of dollars. These discussions will be under way in the next two or three weeks, hopefully. I will try to keep everybody as abreast of these issues as I can. I want to keep reminding everybody we are just one partner in this process, and this is a delicate time and has to be dealt with some statesmanlike, delicate debate. Thank you.

Thank you. Initially, Mr. Barnabas was to speak. The Chair will now recognize Mr. Barnabas.

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As a Member from Nunavut, there are only 355 days left until Nunavut comes to a reality. I will keep working hard towards Nunavut as our past MLAs have worked really hard. I have not seen a work plan from NTI or the federal government. We will finally be able to make a work plan once Nunavut has been a reality. Thank you. (Translation ends)

Mr. O'Brien, you did indicate you wanted to speak earlier.

I believe we are only entitled to one comment. Thank you.

Minister Thompson.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just want to congratulate the efforts made by Mr. Todd, the chair of the Division Planning Committee, and all the other committee members and their staff, in producing and tabling the draft transition action plan for the creation of two new territories. This is a transition action plan. The Footprints 2 does not have, as I understand, a transition plan to create two new territories. I believe as MLA and as a beneficiary, also as an Inuk representing a region in the NWT, that a draft resource identifying transition needs is an important missing tool. This is a missing tool, that is the key word, that is needed to help further guide our efforts towards the creation of two new territories. I am glad to know that there has been this plan developed and will be even happier when I see those things that are critical in the plan being actioned by our federal partners and our Nunavut Interim Commissioner.

Mr. Chairman, I would just like to say thank you to all those who worked on the plan. It is a missing tool that is needed. It is not in the Footprints 2. It is not saying anything negative about the Footprints 2 model. This is a missing tool that is needed to create two new territories and I want to thank the efforts of Mr. Todd, his staff and his committee members. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.