This is page numbers 333 - 366 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 5th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was fund.

Topics

Further Return To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

The Speaker

Thank you. Second supplementary, Mr. O'Brien.

Supplementary To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

Kevin O'Brien Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Are there any guidelines built into the policies that will try to ensure that people in the north or people in the regions, for example, if there is a project in my community or in my region that the individuals or organizations that want to get involved in investing, that they would be given first priority as opposed to opening up to north and south before the regional or local people have an opportunity? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

The Speaker

Thank you. Mr. Todd.

Further Return To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

John Todd Keewatin Central

Well, certainly my hope is that, based on my experience anyway, we will have competitive RFPs, if you want, from regional people. I think in fairness to the public purse and to ensure that we get good value for money and that there is a transparency in the process and a fairness in the process, it will be advertised on a territorial basis under the current policies and regulations of the GNWT which gives preference to, for example, in the BIP. I am fairly confident in my discussions with the business community and investment community, some of the aboriginal groups that we met including the Aboriginal Summit, that there will be people there who are sufficiently interested to ensure one, we have a competitive process and we get good value for money, and two, that we are optimistic that a number of these projects will be owned and operated by the residents of the communities. Again, I would stress that it would be difficult to limit it to that at this stage of the game given that they need to give us a truly competitive process and, of course, transparency and opportunity, and more important, the equity for everything. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

The Speaker

Thank you. Final supplementary, Mr. O'Brien.

Supplementary To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

Kevin O'Brien Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At this point in time, what level of interest have you seen from the bankers and the business people that you have talked to here and elsewhere in reference to this program?

Supplementary To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

The Speaker

Thank you. Mr. Todd.

Further Return To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

John Todd Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would think I would categorize it as relatively enthusiastic. I think lending institutions, whether it be conventional banks or people who back the Aurora Fund, the Pacific Western Group, and others, have showed a real interest in the Public/Private Partnerships. I think that is good. That all goes well for everybody because not only do we want to get competitiveness in the RFPs for the facilities and the leases and the costs, we also want to make sure we get some competitiveness in the money markets. I believe that at the end of the day we will get that, and it is certainly from my initial reaction from the discussion with the vice-presidents of the banks, they were favourably impressed by what they saw, not always what they heard, but certainly what they saw. I know on the return from BHP, they were enthusiastic, and I hope that will be reflected in the bank policy when it comes to lending. We can get on with putting some of these new projects on the ground and bringing the infrastructure into being in keeping with our new strategy. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 350

The Speaker

Thank you, kindly, Mr. Todd. The allotted time period for oral questions is over. Item 7, written questions. Item 8, returns to written questions. Item 9, replies to opening address. Before we begin item 10, replies to budget address, we will take a 15-minute break.

--Break

Further Return To Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Question 120-13(5): Access To Public/private Partnerships Initiative
Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 351

The Speaker

I would like to call the House back to order. Item 10, replies to budget address. Mr. Ootes.

Reply 6-13(5): Mr. Ootes' Reply
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

Page 351

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It is significant that in this is the last budget that will ever be produced for the Northwest Territories as we know it today. This is also the first budget in our term of office where we have not had to do major surgery on our expenditures. The budget moves us in the right direction. It provides support for social programs and offers incentives to northerners and northern businesses to invest in creating jobs. I do have some comments regarding our budget.

First, let me speak about the formula financing arrangement. As I said yesterday, our population growth is 4.7 percent, the largest in North America. Our social envelope will consume 63 percent of the budget. We are spending less and less on capital, less and less on job creation, departments of RWED, Transportation and DPW, and more and more in the social envelope area.

I want to emphasize I am supportive of our social and health programs; however, the pressure will continue because of the forced-growth resulting from population increases. I would like our Minister to address the formula financing agreements with the federal Minister of Finance in regard to our forced-growth and our booming population. If we do not resolve this problem, we will have to continue to cut capital budgets, resulting in more people being laid off and the level of service will continue to deteriorate.

As the Finance Minister had said yesterday, we need to also address our revenue base. Of course, the only place that can be done to any significance is in the area of royalties from the resource sector. Again, this needs to be addressed with the federal Minister of Finance.

I also propose that half of our surplus from this year and half from next year should be used to stimulate our economy. We should put $6 million this year into employment creation projects. If ever this was needed, now is the time.

We should also reinvest in our most valuable resource, our staff. They have made a terrible sacrifice during our days of cost cutting. They have put in the hours. They have faced the uncertainty of jobs, and now we can publicly reassure them, our days of laying off employees are over. We should also demonstrate our support for them by investing in some fashion or other in them.

Effects on Yellowknife, like most communities, our cost cutting measures have been extremely hard on Yellowknife. We have seen the elimination of 450 government positions. The downsizing of the capital budget has meant the elimination of 900 construction jobs and the difficulties of the gold mines have resulted in the loss of several hundred jobs.

Yellowknife is now also suffering from a great deal of empty office space. We are still facing division when 286 positions are targeted for reduction upon the creation of Nunavut. We need a program to assist the gold mines of the north to remain viable, which in turn will greatly assist our community.

The Public/Private Partnerships program is a great idea. There is a lot of support for it out there. This is an excellent opportunity to create employment, gain access to new dollars and capture private sector efficiencies. I would like to make some comments about the guidelines, however, implementing Public/Private Partnerships. They were tabled with us yesterday, and I gave notice to have the guidelines moved into committee of the whole on Wednesday.

The guidelines need scrutiny and serious discussions by Members of this House. As a matter of fact, these guidelines should also be sent to the organizations Mr. Todd consulted on the P3 and ask for feedback.

The committee will present proposals to the Financial Management Board and request authority to proceed. There is no mechanism for MLAs, nor outside bodies of interest to have any input. That to me is not acceptable. This is a huge financial obligation we are exposing this territory to. My approach to this will be, do not ask me to trust you. Show me the hard facts and figures and hard numbers. We need a set of guiding principles that address the many questions that are out there.

Deals have to be definable publicly. For example, in negotiating deals, companies often do not want to bring out in public their finances. My point is they have to be willing to show their facts in public. If you select one company over another, this has to be defended by all of us here on the political side. Otherwise, the losing companies will complain.

In most cases, companies want all the return and no risk. They say, we will let the government take the risk. Exclusivity, because private business built the facility they want the right to operate it. The fees they charge might be contrary to public policy. The method of contracting needs to be addressed. We need clarification on RFPs and how that is going to be handled.

We have passed two motions in this House dealing with the need for clarification in the area of nontendered contracts and RFPs. We have to ensure there is an anti-lobbying clause contained in the guiding principles. We need guidelines to deal with unsolicited proposals and the right to ownership.

As I said the other day, Mr. Speaker, P3 is not new. There are many examples, regionally, nationally, internationally. In order to undertake this major expenditure, we do have to do a lot of homework. We need to study all facets of this program. We need to ensure that projects must irrevocably benefit the public at large.

The other day, I suggested that what we need is a task force made up of industry, union, government and academia. They could look at assessing feasibility and applicability of these programs; select a few programs that could be used on a pilot basis; offer strategic advice on critical factors that create barriers and review national and international experiences. They could review public sector versus private sector financing. That concludes my statement, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

--Applause

Reply 6-13(5): Mr. Ootes' Reply
Item 10: Replies To Budget Address

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The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Ootes. Replies to budget address. Item 11, petitions. Mr. Arlooktoo.

Petition 1-13(5): Request For Kimmirut Community Arena
Item 11: Petitions

January 26th, 1998

Page 352

Goo Arlooktoo Baffin South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to present a petition, Petition No. 1-13(5), request for a community arena in Kimmirut, with 181 signatures from the community of Kimmirut expressing a petition supporting the community arena in Kimmirut. Thank you.

Petition 1-13(5): Request For Kimmirut Community Arena
Item 11: Petitions

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The Speaker

Thank you. Petitions. Mr. Evaloarjuk.

Petition 2-13(5): Understaffing At Igloolik Health Centre
Item 11: Petitions

Page 352

Mark Evaloarjuk Amittuq

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will be presenting a petition, Petition 2-13(5), understaffing at the Igloolik Health Centre. It is a petition from last summer that was being petitioned by people of Igloolik that there is not enough health care workers within the health centre. It has 327 signatures from the people of Igloolik. The health centre in Igloolik presently has only three nurses. They will be eliminating one position so there will be only two nurses left in September, 1997.

Due to this the people and the Hamlet of Igloolik have stated that many health services have been eliminated. Therefore, we, the undersigned are against this elimination of government positions. We request they add more positions to increase the nursing staff to five positions within the community as these are very important positions for us. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. (Translation ends)

Petition 2-13(5): Understaffing At Igloolik Health Centre
Item 11: Petitions

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The Speaker

Petitions. Item 12, reports of standing and special committees. Item 13, reports of committees on review of bills. Item 14, tabling of documents. Madam Groenewegen.

Tabled Document 21-13(5): Unsigned Note Re: GNWT Loan
Item 14: Tabling Of Documents

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Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to table a note, Tabled Document 21-13(5), unsigned note re: GNWT loan, that I received here in the Legislature this afternoon. On the outside it says Jane Groenewegen, spelled correctly, I might add. To Jane, how did you get an $800,000 loan from this government? I will table that. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Tabled Document 21-13(5): Unsigned Note Re: GNWT Loan
Item 14: Tabling Of Documents

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The Speaker

Thank you. Item 14, tabling of documents. Mr. Enuaraq.

Tabled Document 22-13(5): Photographs Depicting Pangnirtung Fire Hall
Item 14: Tabling Of Documents

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Tommy Enuaraq Baffin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to table a document, Tabled Document 22-13(5), photographs depicting Pangnirtung fire hall, and the document contains photographs of Pangnirtung's fire hall's condition. Thank you.

Tabled Document 22-13(5): Photographs Depicting Pangnirtung Fire Hall
Item 14: Tabling Of Documents

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The Speaker

Thank you, Mr. Enuaraq. Tabling of documents. Item 15, notices of motion. Item 16, notices of motions for first reading of bills. Item 17, motions. Item 18, first reading of bills. Item 19, second reading of bills. Item 20, consideration in committee of the whole of bills and other matters. Bill 8, Appropriation Act, 1998-99; Committee Report 02-13(5), Standing Committee on Government Operations, Report on the 1998-99 Main Estimates; Committee Report 03-13(5), Standing Committee on Infrastructure, Report on the 1998-99 Main Estimates; Committee Report 04-13(5), Standing Committee on Resource Management and Development, Report on the 1998-99 Main Estimates; Committee Report 05-13(5), Standing Committee on Social Programs, Report on the 1998-99 Main Estimates; Tabled Document 15-13(5), 1998-99 Budget Address. With Madam Groenewegen in the chair.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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The Chair

The Chair Jane Groenewegen

I would like to call the committee of the whole to order. There are numerous items that have been already listed by the Speaker on the agenda before this. What is the wish of the Committee? Mr. Ootes.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Madam Chair. I recommend or I move that we consider Tabled Document 15-13(5), Budget Address, and following that, Bill 8, Appropriation Act in conjunction with Committee Report 02-13(5), Report of the Standing Committee on Government Operations, and the Committee Report 03-13(5), the Standing Committee on Infrastructure. Thank you, Madam Chair.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 353

The Chair

The Chair Jane Groenewegen

Thank you. Has the committee agreed?

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

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Some Hon. Members

Agreed.

Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters
Item 20: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Page 353

The Chair

The Chair Jane Groenewegen

We will start with Tabled Document 15-13(5), 1998-99 Budget Address. Would the Minister like to take the witness table and bring witnesses?