Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. There is a motion. The motion is in order. To the motion. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. I would like to call on Mr. Krutko, the Deputy Speaker on behalf of the Speaker, if he would like to bring in witnesses.

Yes, I would.

Thank you. Does the committee agree?

I will ask the Sergeant-at-Arms then to bring in the witnesses. Mr. Krutko, could I ask you to introduce the witnesses please?

Mr. Chairman, to my left I have Mr. Hamilton, the Clerk of the Legislative Assembly. To my right is Myles Moreside, director of corporate services.

Thank you. Are there general comments or questions by the Members on the Legislative Assembly? Do you wish to proceed to the detail of the estimates?

Page 1-9, Office of the Clerk, operations and maintenance, $6.564 million.

Office of the Clerk, details of capital, land and buildings. Total headquarters region, $450,000. Agreed?

Total land and buildings, $450,000. Agreed?

Total capital $450,000. Agreed?

Page 1-13, Office of the Speaker, operations and maintenance, $150,000. Agreed?

Page 1-15, Expenditures on behalf of Members, operations and maintenance, $3.453 million. Agreed?

Office of the Chief Electoral Officer, operations and maintenance, $1.106 million. Agreed?

Page 1-19, Commissioner of Official Languages, operations and maintenance, $345,000. Agreed?

Page 1-20, information item, active positions. Any questions? Agreed?

Page 1-21, details of work performed on behalf of others. Total department, $65,000. Agreed?

Back to program summary, page 1-7. Mr. Henry.

Thank you, Mr. Henry. Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Since we have the person sitting next me who is in charge of elections, I will allow Mr. Hamilton to answer that question.

Thank you. Mr. Hamilton.

Thank you, Mr. Hamilton. Mr. Henry.

Thank you, Mr. Henry. Mr. Hamilton.

Thank you, Mr. Hamilton. Further questions? Details of work performed on behalf of others. Total department, $65,000. Agreed?

Back to the program summary, page 1-7. Operations and maintenance, $11.618 million. Agreed?

Capital, $450,000. Agreed?

Total expenditures, $12.068 million. Agreed?

I want to thank Mr. Krutko and his witnesses for appearing before us today. Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Per the previous agreement, we will deal next with the Department of Health and Social Services, and I will call on the Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Roland, to see if he has opening comments.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Are there comments on behalf of the standing committee? Mrs. Groenewegen.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I will start to read these comments. If I cannot continue, I will have to call for a quorum. The Standing Committee on Social Programs met on November 25 and 26, 1998, to consider the business plan for the Department of Health and Social Services and again on March 15, 1999, to consider the 1999-2000 draft Main Estimates for the department.

The Department's business plan shows a high degree of correlation to the recent departmental strategic planning exercise. Committee Members were impressed with the linkages that the department showed between its strategic directions and government and departmental goals. Committee Members were, however, disappointed in the lack of detail provided by the department as to how it intends to measure success in meeting its stated goals. Without knowledge of the starting points and definable targets, the committee, and indeed the department, has no method of measuring its success in meeting stated goals and objectives.

The committee noted in the 1999-2000 draft Main Estimates an increase of $4.605 million in operations and maintenance over the numbers contained in the business plans, and a $541,000 decrease in capital attributable to the postponement of major code upgrades and renovations until after the assessment is done during the upcoming fiscal year. Cost of administration. Committee Members, expressed concern during the business plan review that administration costs must not increase. In the view of committee Members the present level of spending on administration is approaching the maximum and no increases should be contemplated without corresponding increases to actual program spending.

Committee Members continue to be concerned that administration costs within the social program envelope be kept as low as possible. With the inability of the committee to examine the government-funded administration costs at the board level during the business planning and Main Estimates review process, there are concerns that the true cost of administration for the department is hidden at the board level. Committee Members would have greater faith in the Minister's assertions that administration costs are kept as low as possible if they could examine the board's annual reports at some point during the business plan or Main Estimates review process.

Level of detail on territorial-wide treatment programs. Many of the programs of the Department of Health and Social Services are administered at the headquarters level as opposed to the board level. Some activities such as the Northern Addiction Services and the Community Wellness Programs are hidden within one all-encompassing line item in the Main Estimates. Committee Members, while understanding the accounting principles that make this an acceptable practice, would like to see greater detail included as an appendix to the Main Estimates.

Recruitment and Retention Program. The committee understands that this activity is just in the process of being established. In these days of increased competition for health care professionals, it is vitally important to the health and welfare of all residents of the Northwest Territories that the government does all that it can to recruit and retain qualified personnel. Committee Members would appreciate updates on this activity as plans are formulated.

Integrated strategy for children and youth. Committee Members are very interested in the progress the departments in the social program envelope make on establishing baselines and identifying cost-effective improvements to services for children and youth. While committee Members can understand the need for extensive consultation with the health boards, there is a concern that the process will take so long as to be virtually impossible to implement for the next business plan. Committee Members have expressed their dissatisfaction in the past with the lack of identifiable targets for many of the programs that they examined during the business plan review. Members are disappointed that they will have no opportunity to examine any of the results of this strategy during the life of this Assembly. It is, however, important that any progress made on the Integrated Strategy for Children and Youth is incorporated into next year's business plan and Main Estimates review process.

Treatment centres. Committee Members believe that the current departmental review of the activities of the Northern Addictions Services is crucial to the long term success of addictions programming in the Northwest Territories. Members are concerned, however, that as a result of the review of the treatment centre at Detah, more program space for addiction treatment will disappear. Committee Members would like to remind the department that this activity has already experienced significant reductions in funding during the forced budget cutting exercise that occurred early in the life of this Assembly. Committee Members are of the opinion that we cannot afford to lose another treatment centre. Members also believe that the department, in its review, must look at holistic approaches to addiction treatments as opposed to the current 28-day based programs. The root causes of addiction must also be examined and practical solutions effected.

Long term care bed shortage. Committee Members are concerned there is a developing shortage of long term care beds in the communities of the Northwest Territories. It is vitally important that the department develop a strategy to deal with the developing bed shortage. Committee Members look forward to being apprised on future initiatives and strategies in this area.

Child Welfare Information System. The Child Welfare Information System does not accurately track the number of children in care. The department has admitted that the system does not meet the needs of the program. This has been a major concern of the Standing Committee on Social Programs since the beginning of its mandate three and a half years ago. Committee Members were pleased to hear that the Child Welfare Information System will be finally developed and implemented over the upcoming fiscal year.

Tobacco cessation programming and BC lawsuit. Committee Members believe strongly that the Government of the Northwest Territories should join in with British Columbia's lawsuit against the tobacco companies. It is felt that any monies realized from the successful conclusion of this suit could be used to combat smoking in the Northwest Territories, particularly among our young people. The committee looks forward to seeing the statistics on smoking in the new NWT compared to other Canadian jurisdictions. Members of the committee also feel that any smoking cessation programs developed by the department should contain provisions for assisting with the cost of products designed to help the smoker quit. Members believe that spending money now on products that help northerners break the grip of nicotine will translate into reduced costs to the health care network later on in the smokers' lives. The committee recommends that the Government of the Northwest Territories join with British Columbia in pursuing a lawsuit against the tobacco companies to attempt to recover the extra costs to the social envelope caused by dealing with the long term effects of smoking to northerners.

The committee recommends that any smoking cessation program developed by the department include provisions for assisting with the cost of products designed to help smokers quit.

Informatics. Committee Members believe that there is an opportunity to develop common computer programs and platforms in conjunction with other departments in the social programs envelope. The departments serve a common client base and should be able to develop a system that allows for multi-departmental access but restricts the information the user can access on the client. Committee Members understand that there are policy and legislative reasons for the department's reluctance to co-operate in the development of common computer systems. However, in light of the major policy reform initiative recommended by the committee elsewhere in this report, this may be an opportune time to also examine the development of common computer systems.

Committee Members were pleased that the Department of Health and Social Services is examining the Yukon computer system that is being adopted by the Department of Education, Culture and Employment. Committee Members would like to be apprised on the department's evaluation of the Yukon system. The committee recommends that the department work in conjunction with other government departments, particularly with those in the social programs envelope, to develop common computer systems and platforms.

Cooperation with other departments. Committee Members feel that the relationships between departments in the social programs envelope are not as fully developed as they should be. Many of the government's goals will require a high level of cooperation if any measurable results are to be achieved. Programs that are designed in isolation from other departments could create situations where one department's program is at direct cross-purposes to another, while in fact both programs were designed to meet the same government goal. When the Department of Health and Social Services talks of encouraging physical activity in children, it is apparent to committee Members that the department must work in concert with Education, Culture and Employment and Municipal and Community Affairs to develop relevant programming and services to address the issue.

Committee Members believe strongly that regardless of any confidentiality or proprietary concerns, there is an opportunity for the departments in the social envelope to work together to develop a common tombstone computer system, that would allow selective access to data to track the common client base. This would include the removal of policy and legislative roadblocks. The Committee recommends that the departments in the social envelope work together in greater cooperation in developing programming that meets the needs of northerners and accomplishes the government's stated goals.

Mr. Erasmus, would you continue.

Thank you, Mr. Erasmus. Mr. Erasmus.