This is page numbers 1 - 18 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 8th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library. The word of the day was gas.

Topics

Members Present

Honourable Jim Antoine, Honourable Charles Dent, Mr. Erasmus, Honourable Sam Gargan, Mrs. Groenewegen, Mr. Henry, Honourable Stephen Kakfwi, Mr. Krutko, Honourable Michael Miltenberger, Mr. Morin, Mr. Ootes, Mr. Rabesca, Honourable Floyd Roland, Honourable Vince Steen.

--O Canada

--Drummers

God, almighty, as the last Session of this Legislative Assembly is about to begin, we humbly ask you, your blessing upon the matters of this Assembly and those who are working in this building. We ask you to share your wisdom with them, so that they will work diligently for the good of all people. We ask you to share with them your intelligence so that they will listen attentively to one another and the people they serve. We ask you to share your willpower so that they will work actively to build a just society. And we ask you to share with them your gift of prophecy so that they will prepare people to enter the new millennium. We ask you this through your Son and Jesus our Lord. Amen.

Item 1: Prayer
Item 1: Prayer

Page 1

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. I would like to thank the drummers and also Father Pochat. Good afternoon. I understand that His Honour the Commissioner of the Northwest Territories is prepared to enter the Chamber and open this Session of the Legislative Assembly. Mr. Clerk could you please attend to the escort of the Commissioner of the Northwest Territories into the Chamber.

Item 2: Commissioners Address
Item 2: Commissioners Address

Page 1

Commissioner Marion

Thank you, please be seated. Mr. Speaker, Members of the Legislative Assembly, good afternoon. I am pleased to welcome you to the Eighth Session of the 13th Legislative Assembly. This is an historic occasion, as we begin the final Session in the life of this government. A time which has seen dramatic changes here in the Northwest Territories.

Before I go any further, I would like to offer my most sincere congratulations to our new Senator, Mr. Nick Sibbeston of Fort Simpson.

--Applause

Mr. Sibbeston has for many years shown a commitment to the people, the cultures and the future of the Northwest Territories both as a Member of this Assembly and as an individual. We are fortunate to have such a person as the first Senator for the new Northwest Territories.

I would also like to express my deepest gratitude to the Honourable Vince Steen and his staff for assisting in making this weekend's tour of Nunakput such a great success. My aide-de-camp, Constable Noella Cockney and Constable Violet Pokiak, both of whom are Inuvialuit, did much to enrich my visit to this region. One of the main reasons for the tour of Nunakput was to honour certain residents by presenting the Commissioner's Award for Community Service. This award recognises people for their contribution to their community and to life in the Northwest Territories.

Edward Ruben, an elder in Paulatuk, was instrumental in deciding the present location of the community. He exemplifies the elders we have in all our communities, sharing his past with the present generation. In Holman Island, Robert Kuptana was recognised for his work with the Inuvialuit of the region and as a community leader. He has served on all the organizations of Holman Island. In Sachs Harbour, Andy Carpenter has worked for the Inuvialuit people throughout his life and to preserve the environment has been a good portion of his life.

Two awards were presented in Tuktoyaktuk. Norman Felix Sheppard was honoured for his work teaching young people their culture and traditions. He has travelled the world with his troop of drummers, demonstrating Inuvialuit drumming and songs. Lucy Cockney is another fine example of elders who work tirelessly for their community. She has devoted many years to making Tuktoyaktuk a better place through her work on the hamlet council and with the church.

Mr. Speaker, all of us can learn from the example set by these people. By committing ourselves to our communities, to our families and neighbours, we can build a strong territory. We can make the Northwest Territories a place where all people feel welcome. We can create the opportunities that our children deserve. We can show the rest of the world a way to build healthy communities and to make the most of human and natural resources.

Mr. Speaker, when this government took office in late 1995, it introduced the Agenda for Change. This was an ambitious and necessary program to:

- improve social conditions;

- improve economic conditions; and

- work towards the successful creation of two new Territories.

This work is by no means complete, and nor should we expect it to be finished in the life of one government, but important progress has been made. The creation of two new Territories was, of course, accomplished earlier this year to the great pride and satisfaction of people across the North and around the world.

More decision-making authority has been placed at the community and regional lever so that programs and services can be delivered in ways that best suit the different needs of people across the NWT. At the same time, a commitment has been made to give people the training and support they need to adjust to this new authority and make the most of it.

Important socio-economic agreements have been negotiated to see that northern people benefit from new resource development. The NWT has entered into agreements to work with our northern neighbours and with several provinces to cooperate in areas of mutual concern. A new formula funding agreement was negotiated with the federal government.

Mr. Speaker, despite all that has been accomplished, many challenges still lie ahead. That is why this government introduced the Agenda for the New North earlier this year. This document looks beyond the life of this Assembly. It contains a vision of how northern people can work together to make progress on the issues that affect us all. This government recognizes that the Northwest Territories is at a unique and vital point in its development. It also recognizes that government alone cannot take advantage of the opportunities before us. This will require the commitment and cooperation of all parts of our northern society.

And with that, I would like to commend to you for your sincere consideration and wise judgement of the business of this House as I declare open the Eighth Session of the 13th Assembly of the Northwest Territories. Thank you.

--Applause

Item 2: Commissioners Address
Item 2: Commissioners Address

Page 2

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Good afternoon and welcome to the opening of the eighth and most likely the final Session of the 13th Legislative Assembly of the Northwest Territories. I would like to remind Members and guests that after the item, recognition of visitors in the gallery in the orders today, the Commissioner has invited us to a reception in the Great Hall.

Before we begin the business of the House this afternoon I would like to make a few brief comments. First I would like to thank the Dettah Drummers and Father Pochat from Rae-Edzo for joining us today to celebrate the opening of the final Session of the 13th Legislative Assembly.

As I said, this is probably the last time that the Members of this Legislature will open a new Session and I think we all need to take a few moments to think back on where things were four years ago and where we are today.

I hope that when each of you looks back you think about the accomplishments of this Legislative Assembly and feel proud to have been a part of it. As the dean of the House I think it is safe to say that never before have Members of the Northwest Territories Legislative Assembly had to deal with the difficult and emotional issues that the Members of this House have.

Upon entering the House we were immediately confronted with the prospect of a $150 million projected deficit and the need to get it under control to ensure that the two new Territories, the new Northwest Territories and Nunavut, started off on solid financial grounds. Some of the decisions we have had to make were unpopular and had adverse impacts on the people and communities within all our constituencies; however, I think we also have to recognize that these decisions, no matter how unpopular and unpleasant, had to be made. Just think where we would be today if we had not taken the steps we did.

Division is now behind us but the past several months have proven to be emotional ones with the electoral boundaries issue and discussion on how many Members should be elected in the December 6, 1999, election. I know that this issue is still with us; however, we need to remember that we must move forward and build a strong Northwest Territories. It is important that we, as elected leaders, demonstrate to our constituents that we are working cooperatively together for the common good and this will be a key goal for future leaders. Mahsi cho.

--Applause

I wish to advise the House that I have received the following message from the Commissioner of the Northwest Territories:

Dear Mr. Speaker:

I wish to advise that I recommend to the Legislative Assembly of the Northwest Territories, the passage of the Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1999-2000, during the Eighth Session of the 13th Legislative Assembly.

Yours truly, Dan Marion, Commissioner.

Thank you.

Orders of the day. Item 3, Ministers' statements. Mr. Antoine.

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As this is the opening of the final Session of this Legislative Assembly, I would like to take this opportunity to thank all Members of this House for their work over the past four years on behalf of the people of the Northwest Territories. Mahsi cho.

Mr. Speaker, during the last sitting of the Legislative Assembly in July, this Legislative Assembly passed Bill 15, An Act to Amend the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act. This bill, amongst other things, made changes to the electoral districts in the Northwest Territories by adding five additional seats for the upcoming election in December.

In its report to the Legislative Assembly, the Standing Committee on Government Operations made a number of recommendations. One of these recommendations, the inclusion of a sunset clause that will ensure that the 14th Assembly re-visits the issue of electoral boundaries, was supported by the government and resulted in a subsequent amendment to the bill.

The committee made other recommendations related to a political accord, a legal reference to the Supreme Court, the implementation of a 2/2/2 model for regional representation on Cabinet and the establishment of a Constitutional and Electoral Reform Commission.

With respect to these recommendations, I provided the government's initial views at the time. I also made a commitment to consult with all stakeholders to determine the level of support for these recommendations throughout the Northwest Territories.

On August 19th, I wrote to all aboriginal and public governments, land claims organizations, the NWT Chamber of Commerce, the Dene Cultural Institute, and the Status of Women Council of the NWT to solicit their views on the issues raised by the Standing Committee.

This letter also asked for the views of these organizations on the establishment of an intergovernmental process that would bring together representatives of public and aboriginal governments to discuss issues of common interest.

In addition, Mr. Speaker, Cabinet Ministers have been meeting individually with aboriginal governments and attending various summer gatherings over the course of the summer to discuss these and other matters. To date, Mr. Speaker, we have received responses from the following organizations across the North:

- Hamlet of Fort Providence;

- NWT Association of Municipalities;

- Town of Hay River;

- Salt River First Nation;

- Status of Women Council;

- NWT Chamber of Commerce;

- Town of Inuvik;

- Enterprise Settlement Council;

- Sahtu Secretariat Incorporated; and

- Sahtu Dene Council.

The City of Yellowknife wrote to inform us that they did not have an opportunity to discuss the matter but provided personal submissions from the mayor and two council members.

In summary, Mr. Speaker, few of the responses addressed the recommendations concerning regional representation, the legal reference or a political accord. Most focused on the issue of the establishment of a Constitutional and Electoral Reform Commission.

In general, the comments we received indicated an interest in pursuing discussions on constitutional and electoral reform in the Northwest Territories. However, this support was qualified by the need for input into these discussions from all levels of government and other stakeholders prior to the establishment of a new process.

Mr. Speaker, based on what we heard from our consultations, the government does not intend to bring forward legislation to create a Constitutional and Electoral Reform Commission during the life of this Assembly. Nor do we intend to bring forward legislation to implement the 2/2/2 model of representation recommended by the committee.

With respect to constitutional and electoral reform in the NWT, we remain of the view that there is a clear need for a broadly supported process. However, it is obvious from the responses received from various organizations throughout the North and in our discussions with aboriginal and public governments, that a great deal of work must be done to develop a consensus on how best to pursue this reform.

This government intends to continue this discussion with aboriginal and public governments over the remainder of our term and provide recommendations to the incoming Members of the 14th Assembly in the transition document on how to move this process forward.

We also intend to include recommendations in the transition document on the other issues raised by the committee.

Mr. Speaker, what became most apparent from our consultations on this matter was the high level of support for an intergovernmental process that would bring together aboriginal governments and public governments at the municipal, territorial and federal level.

Many of the organizations that responded indicated that such a government to government to government process is required, particularly as we continue to move forward on self-government negotiations. It is clear, Mr. Speaker, that this is the best process to deal with the negotiation of a political accord between aboriginal and public governments.

The government has been pursuing the establishment of such a process over the course of the summer. I intend to speak with the new Minister of Indian and Northern Affairs in the next few days to discuss ways to move this process prior to the end of the term of this government. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Mr. Kakfwi.

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Government of the Northwest Territories is committed to ensuring all Northerners benefit from resource development. As I have stated before, those benefits must include employment, training and business opportunities for Northerners. In the case of natural gas development, it should include access to a less expensive and cleaner burning fuel than oil or diesel.

The Inuvik Natural Gas Project is a good example of how Northerners can benefit from resource development in their own backyard. In 1998, the Inuvialuit Petroleum Corporation, AltaGas Services Incorporated and Enbridge Incorporated formed a partnership to bring natural gas from the Ikhil field to supply the energy needs of the town of Inuvik.

The Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development funded a portion of the initial research on this project. We have been strong supporters of the project from the very beginning.

Two natural gas wells are now operational and the gas is flowing through a transmission pipeline ready for distribution to commercial and residential consumers in Inuvik. To ensure local residents benefit from the reduction in energy costs, the department is continuing its support for the project by providing funding to help residential consumers switch to natural gas heating. Heating conversion costs are high and result in a substantial initial cash outlay for the consumer. The Department of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development will be providing conversion grants to cover up to one third of the initial cost, to a maximum of $1,350 dollars per conversion. Inuvik Gas Limited will provide a matching grant. RWED will provide up to $300,000 for the Inuvik Natural Gas Conversion Program in 1999-2000 with an additional $200,000 available in 2000-2001.

This program will result in the reduction of residential energy costs in Inuvik. It also allows the Northwest Territories to demonstrate its commitment to the reduction of greenhouse gas emissions. Natural gas is considered to be a cleaner burning fuel than either oil or diesel. This switch from diesel to natural gas will result in a substantial reduction in greenhouse gas emissions.

Mr. Speaker, over 150 people have been invited to Inuvik to join the grand opening celebrations over a three day period. On Friday, September 10, there will be ribbon cutting ceremonies at the sites for the Inuvik Gas Limited and the NWT Power Corporation. The Honourable Floyd Roland, MLA for Inuvik, will attend on behalf of the Government of the Northwest Territories.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to congratulate all the parties involved in this project. The vision of the Inuvialuit Petroleum Corporation with its partners AltaGas and Enbridge have provided reduced energy costs and employment, training and business opportunities for residents of Inuvik and the region. Let us strive to ensure all resource development continues to provide similar benefits for Northerners. Mahsi cho.

--Applause.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Ministers' statements. Mr. Antoine.

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today on behalf of the Government of the Northwest Territories to congratulate Mr. Nick Sibbeston on his recent appointment to the Senate of Canada.

--Applause

The appointment of Mr. Sibbeston as the first Senator from the new Northwest Territories is an important and historic step in the political evolution of our Territory.

Mr. Speaker, Mr. Sibbeston has a long and enviable record of public service to the people of the Northwest Territories. Mr. Sibbeston was born and raised in Fort Simpson. A long-time advocate of education, he became the first aboriginal resident of the Northwest Territories to receive his law degree.

Mr. Sibbeston served as a Member of the Legislative Assembly from Nahendeh from 1970 to 1974 and again from 1979 to 1991. During his time in the Legislative Assembly, he served as a Cabinet Minister for six years and as the Government Leader for two. Since leaving territorial politics, Mr. Sibbeston has worked as a justice specialist for the GNWT and as the public administrator overseeing the creation of the Deh Cho Health and Social Services Board.

Mr. Speaker, in appointing Mr. Sibbeston, the Prime Minister has selected a person with a great deal of experience and personal integrity. There is no doubt that he is well suited to serve the people of the Northwest Territories in the Upper Chamber.

On a personal note, I would like to thank Mr. Sibbeston for the support and sage advice that he has provided me over the past eight years that I served in this House. I ask all Members to join me in congratulating Mr. Sibbeston on this important appointment. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Item 4, Members' statements. Mr. Ootes.

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Good afternoon and welcome back, Members. Over the past eight months I have been closely following the Giant Mine situation, Mr. Speaker. Last week we heard that a potential buyer had possibly been found for the mine. Although no official announcement has been made regarding the identity of the buyer, the word on the street is that it is Miramar Mines. The exact details of the purchase between the receiver Price Waterhouse Cooper and the buyer has not been disclosed. What is of concern to me is the status of Giant Mines 278 employees. All along I have advocated for the continued operation of the mine for several reasons.

1. The 278 jobs at Giant Mine have a significant effect on the regional economy. Every job at Giant Mine supports another job in our local service industry.

2. The proven gold reserves at Giant Mine make it a buyable operation, as far as I have been told and that there are good reserves there.

3. The operation of Giant Mine contributes significantly to the revenues in the form of royalty payments to the NWT Power Corporation, revenues from the collection of employee payroll tax, income tax, federal taxes and so forth.

4. The retention of those employees as northern residents contributes substantially to our transfer payments that we receive from Ottawa.

From what I know about the deal today, it could potentially call for the termination of all employees at the mine, both hourly and salary.

My concern is the need for proper succession and that is the concern, of course, of the 278 employees there. Is there any guarantee that the termination process will honour the proper notice of termination, severance pay, topping off of pensions, pension payouts and transfers, priority hiring, retaining and retraining options. I need to know if and how our government has been consulted along with the Department of Indian Affairs in the receivership process? What are our governments prepared to do to ensure proper succession, fair treatment of employees and the retention of as many jobs as is feasible and possible? If we lose all 278 jobs, then this deal is disastrous for us here in Yellowknife, regionally and for the Territory. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, starting off this week on a pleasant note, it is my pleasure today to congratulate the newly elected president of the Union of Northern Workers, Georgina Rolt-Kaiser. Ms. Rolt-Kaiser has been involved in the Union of Northern Workers for many years moving from shop steward to regional vice-president to president as of yesterdays vote. Her employment background is in the profession of nursing. I am confident that she will do an excellent job in leading the UNW's membership into the new millennium. Ms. Rolt-Kaiser is a hard worker, well informed and always well prepared. I am especially proud because Ms. Rolt-Kaiser is a constituent and a friend of mine.

Like the very capable president of our territorial Teachers Association, also a woman and also from Hay River, Ms. Rolt-Kaise, likewise, in her dealings with this government I know will be forthright, persistent, and professional. As I used to remind our former Finance Minister, these leaders have a job to do. They have constituents to represent just as we do and they should never be criticized for doing their utmost on behalf of their members. Mutual respect in that context will go a long way towards ensuring appropriate conditions for our valued public service and in turn, this government's ability to deliver quality services to the constituents that we represent. Once again, congratulations to Georgina Rolt-Kaiser and all the best in her term of office as president of the Union of Northern Workers. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Krutko.

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today, Mr. Speaker, in acknowledgement of the Ministerial Forum on Health and Social Services. I would like to take this opportunity to thank the Minister of Health and Social Services for taking this initiative and boldly go where the previous Minister would not. I would like to also take this time and opportunity to recognize my constituents, who have raised this issue and their concerns by way of petitions to this House, motions, talking on radio and television. Also, I would like to thank the number of people that have come out to public meetings.

Mr. Speaker, as we all know, my riding asked for a public enquiry into Health and Social Services and the delivery of the health and social services in our small communities. The issue, Mr. Speaker, is a question of cost, service being provided to our communities and also the health care that people receive. Mr. Speaker, in my riding there is a large concern in regard to cancer, the way people are dealt with and also in regard to the shortage of professions in our region.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask everyone in the small communities to ensure that they go forth, raise their concerns to the forum and have some positive input in regard to how their voices will be heard and also how this government will take steps to improve health and social services in our community.

Mr. Speaker, I too, will also like to ensure that this government makes all efforts to hear what people are saying, not to put it on the shelf as another report regarding to education and culture. I believe that we may have to stand and admit we were not perfect, we made mistakes, we made cuts where maybe we should not have. Yet, Mr. Speaker, the people in our communities and our health care system have suffered for that. With that, Mr. Speaker, I encourage all people to take part and come forth in regard to the Forum on Health and Social Services. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Rabesca.

James Rabesca North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to welcome my colleagues back to this last Session of the Assembly. We do have a few more items to deal with over the next few days and I hope we can come together and make this an memorable time for us. I would also like to congratulate Mr. Nick Sibbeston for his recent appointment to the Senate.

Mr. Speaker, on August 7, 1999, the community of Edzo experienced one of the most feared elements that this world can give. That, of course, being a fire. At approximately 2:30 pm in the afternoon lightening struck the bush just on the edge of the community. Within two hours we had a raging fire that threatened the lives and well being of our residents. The wind was blowing directly into the community and it looked like all would be lost. We are thankful to the hamlet staff and the fire department of Rae-Edzo and emergency measures staff, the Department of MACA, RCMP, Department of RWED staff and the water bombers, without all of these plus many volunteers this could have ended in a totally devastating situation. However, I am pleased to say that through the efforts of these organizations and many volunteers that came together and fought to control this, that not one person or piece of property was damaged. For this entire operation all the people involved performed to impressive abilities and I would like to congratulate everyone for the fine work they did. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Erasmus.

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I was glad today to hear the Minister of RWED speak about the Inuvik Natural Gas Conversion Program because that is what I wanted to speak about today, natural gas conversion. Mr. Speaker, for some time we have heard about oil companies doing exploration, finding oil and gas, wanting to build pipelines to the Beaufort, further pipelines going south. Why are they doing this? Well, it is all for money. You find oil and gas, you deliver it to your customer, you make money. What do we in the Northwest Territories get out of our resources? Well, we do not get the money, what the oil companies do not get, the federal government gets in royalties. What about jobs? Well, the last time they built a pipeline I worked on it and the only people that were working there from the North, were in the kitchen or cleaning the rooms. What about cheap fuel you say? Well, we still have the highest fuel prices in Canada. Imperial Oil and whoever has pumped out billions of dollars worth of oil and gas and we still have the highest fuel bills in Canada. Mr. Speaker, I think it is time that things have changed. If people want our oil and gas, then we should benefit too. It should be a condition for any new pipelines that they hook up our communities and we get cheaper fuel. That will make it cheaper for the cost of living, it will also make it attractive for new businesses.

The Minister spoke of cleaner, burning fuel and it is true, natural gas is a cleaner, burning fuel. It reduces greenhouse gas emissions when you transfer or convert to that. Obviously with Yellowknife being the largest community, it is the largest contributor to greenhouse emissions. If we hooked up Yellowknife to a natural gas pipeline that would be the largest savings or reduction in emissions we could make.

Mr. Speaker, later today I will ask the Minister responsible questions in this area. Thank you.

--Applause

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Miltenberger.

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize the Language Commissioner for the Northwest Territories, Ms. Judy Tutcho, as well as the deputy minister from Education, Culture and Employment. Thank you.

--Applause

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Antoine.

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to recognize the Consul-General of the United States, Ms. Lisa Bobbie Schreiber Hughes. She is visiting us this week from Calgary. This is her second visit to the Northwest Territories and her first at the Legislative Assembly. I welcome her today. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Erasmus.

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize Ms. Vi Beck, a member of Yellowknife North constituency and the newly appointed chairperson of NWT Status of Women. I would also like to recognize Bob Brooks, who is a councillor on the council and a long term Northerner. Thank you.

--Applause

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Krutko.

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I do not want to shorten my process of recognizing this individual, but I might as well keep rolling. I would like to recognize Ms. Pat Thomas with the NWTTA. Welcome back, Ms. Thomas.

--Applause

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Dent.

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to recognize our Member of Parliament, the Honourable Ethel Blondin-Andrew.

--Applause

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Ootes.

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize a constituent, Colonel Pierre Leblanc, who is also commander of Northern Region Headquarters and a person who is very involved with many organizations in our community. Thank you.

--Applause

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 6

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Recognition of visitors in the gallery. I would like to recognize in the gallery Mr. Rob Clark, he is the Acting Conflict of Interest Commissioner. Welcome to the Assembly.

--Applause Everybody else that has not been recognized, welcome to the Assembly. I would like to ask the Members to join us for a reception in the Great Hall, that also includes the public.

--Break

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery
Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 7

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

I would like to call the House back to order. Item 6, oral questions. Item 7, written questions. Item 8, petitions. Item 9, reports of standing and special committees. Item 10, tabling of documents.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

I would like to table in accordance to section 81(4) of the Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, I wish to table the report received by myself from the Acting Conflict of Interest Commissioner, in the matter of allegations against the Member for Hay River.

Tabling of documents.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

In accordance with section 68 of the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act, I wish to table the annual Report of the Acting Information and Privacy Commissioner for the period April 1, 1998, to March 31, 1999.

Tabling of documents. Mr. Ootes.

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to return to item 6, oral questions.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Yellowknife Centre is seeking unanimous consent to return to item 6, oral questions. Do we have any nays?

Some Hon. Members

Nay.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Ootes, there is a nay. You do not have unanimous consent. Tabling of documents. Item 11, notices of motion. Mr. Dent.

Motion 1-13(8): Setting Of Hours By Speaker
Item 11: Notices Of Motion

Page 7

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Thursday, September 9, 1999, I will move the following motion.

I move, seconded by the Honourable Member for Yellowknife North, that the Speaker be authorized to set such sitting days and hours as the Speaker, after consultation, deems fit to assist with the business before the House.

Mr. Speaker, at the appropriate time I will be seeking unanimous consent to deal with this motion today.

Motion 1-13(8): Setting Of Hours By Speaker
Item 11: Notices Of Motion

Page 7

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you, notices of motion. Item 12, notices of motions for first reading of bills. Mr. Miltenberger.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Thursday, September 9, 1999, I will move that Bill 1, An Act to Amend the Public Colleges Act, be read for the first time. Thank you.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Notices of motion for first reading of bills. Mr. Dent.

Bill 2: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1999-2000
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker I have two notices, if I may. I give notice that on Thursday, September 9, 1999, I will move that Bill 2, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1999-2000, be read for the first time.

Bill 3: Legislative Assembly And Executive Council Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Thursday, September 9, 1999, I will move that Bill 3, Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act, be read for the first time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Bill 3: Legislative Assembly And Executive Council Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Notices of motions for first reading of bills. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Bill 3: Legislative Assembly And Executive Council Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to seek unanimous consent to return to item 6, oral questions. Thank you.

Bill 3: Legislative Assembly And Executive Council Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mrs. Groenewegen, we are on item 12, notices of motion for first reading of bills. We will conclude that first. Notices of motion for first reading of bills. Mr. Kakfwi.

Bill 4: Access To Information And Protection Of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Thursday, September 9, 1999, I will move that Bill 4, Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act, be read for the first time. Thank you.

Bill 4: Access To Information And Protection Of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Notices of motion for first reading of bills. Mr. Miltenberger.

Bill 5: An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I give notice that on Thursday, September 9, 1999, I will move that Bill 5, An Act to Amend the Workers' Compensation Act, be read for the first time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Bill 5: An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 7

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Notices of motion for first reading of bills. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Bill 5: An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 8

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to seek unanimous consent to return to item 6, oral questions. Thank you.

Bill 5: An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act
Item 12: Notices Of Motions For First Reading Of Bills

Page 8

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Member for Hay River is seeking unanimous consent to go back to item 6, oral questions. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mrs. Groenewegen, you have unanimous consent.

Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have a question today for the Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development. In the past, there has been considerable debate take place in the Northwest Territories and in this House, as recorded in Hansard, with respect to the recycling of containers in the Northwest Territories. There are reports that would indicate that based on our per capita, consumption of soft drinks in aluminum cans, that there are approximately six million cans of pop consumed yearly in the Northwest Territories. These cans presently are all going into landfill sites because we do not have any form of deposit system or a way that people will have an incentive to return these to be recycled. I would like to ask the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development why this is the case and why, like other provinces in Canada, nothing has ever been put in place in the Northwest Territories to recycle these products. Thank you.

Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, Mr. Kakfwi.

Return To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There is no infrastructure in which to get into recycling at a level we would like. As Members know, in the small communities there are huge numbers of bottles, paper, tin cans, pop cans, aluminum cans, discarded vehicles, skidoos and automotive body parts. We have no large scale organized approach to recycling in the North because of the distance, the lack of agents that would seek to gain access to these items that I have listed. We have no program at this time. Thank you.

Return To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister is absolutely right. Our communities are filling up with these things. Given the infrastructure that we have and the back-hauling we have, barges and empty trucks coming back right from the Arctic coast all the way back into the South Slave where there is access to roads and rail, being that the infrastructure is all in place and it would be economical to back-haul these items, what would it take to organize a system here in the Northwest Territories to put this in place? It used to be that people could load up their vehicles and take these used products back into Alberta, but at the Alberta depots when they see the NWT licence plate they will not accept these anymore. We are basically forced to waste these products and not be very environmentally conscious because our government has nothing in place for a return and deposit system. What would it take to put something like that in place? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, I think that the department can put together a small paper that would address that. It would be a multifaceted project ending with consumers and dealing with people who purchase supplies, the government as well as municipalities, transportation companies would all need to be involved if such an initiative for it to take place. I can provide a paper to the Members that would outline all the different elements that would be necessary to get into such a major recycling project. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, so the Minister does not see any obstacles in working with business, and working with municipalities, and working with the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs to put such a plan in place? How long does he think it will take to implement a system like this in the Northwest Territories. Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. What I intended to convey earlier, is a commitment to describe what all the considerations that would have to be taken into account in describing a possible program, all the different elements that must be considered and engaged if we should get into recycling of any significant scale. There is no commitment to get into recycling of this time. We can put together a paper that can lay out for the Member and Members exactly what would be entailed and required if we wanted to seriously consider getting into a major recycling program. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 8

Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, given the environmental concerns that could be addressed through such a program and given the monetary benefit that there could be to communities, and to individuals in being involved in this, I am still unclear as to where this would originate. Would this come from private industry or would it take

people who are concerned about the environment to lobby this government? What is it going to take? Given all the benefits, I would imagine this government should be the one that would aggressively pursue such a program, but in the absence of that, where could the Minister direct us to, to generate the interest to get this off the ground. Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there is some information that would be required to answer the question. What I am trying to say is that there are recycling programs in other parts of the world and other parts of the country and there are different types of programs that happen. Some are done by municipalities, some may have been initiated by the private sector, but in all cases it is a multi-party type of initiative that requires government, the private sector, the consumers, as well as people who sell goods, people who transport goods, as well as municipalities that would be required to be interested in supporting parties to such a program. What I have said is, I would try and put this in simple terms in a paper and provide that to Members, so Members can look at it and perhaps include it in their campaign promises in our upcoming election. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 1-13(8): Absence Of Nwt Recycling Programs
Question 1-13(8): Absence Of NWT Recycling Programs
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Krutko.

Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation. It is regarding housing shortages that we have in our communities. We have cases where families have to live with other family members because there is a shortage of houses available in our communities. Also, families of six or more people living in a small 5-12 housing unit with wood stoves and with honey buckets.

Regarding the community of Tsiigehtchic where a lot of people would like to return back to their home community and once they get there find it awfully frustrating to try and find accommodation so that they can provide for their families. Also, the type of units that are available in a lot of these communities. My question to the Minister is, what is his department doing to improve the housing shortages in our community?

Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Housing Corporation runs a number of programs that are designed to address the needs of families who are in overcrowded situations as well as low income. The main program we have know is the expanded or extended down payment assistance plan that helps people in coming up with the down payment to purchase their own homes. We also have the Independent Housing Program that is an alternative program for low income families, but as Members are well aware here, we still run into a lot of problems where we cannot meet the needs of a lot of families in the Northwest Territories. We are doing the utmost in trying to meet those needs and address the concerns and future pressures we face from within the Housing Corporation. It has been very difficult to meet those needs in light of the reductions we receive through the federal government when they reduce spending on social housing programs so we have been trying to meet those needs through other programs and the biggest one we have now is the Extended Down Payment Assistance Program. Thank you.

Return To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Supplementary To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Also, regarding the question of housing shortages there is also competition from other sectors such as professionals, teachers and nurses, and other people who come to our communities. The government no longer provides housing which is also causing a hardship to the communities because of the limited number of units in our small communities where you are not only having to deal with the problems with the residences but also you are dealing with people coming from the outside communities. I would like to ask the Minister, what has he been doing with departments such as MACA or the Department of Education to deal with this problem which also has an impact on our communities, not only for the residents, but for the professionals who do come to assist our communities?

Supplementary To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the staff housing situation that is ongoing in the Northwest Territories was initially undertaken by FMBS and was to direct this government to move out of staff housing. What the Housing Corporation's place in this whole program is that we have become the agent in the sense of selling off some of those units in a transfer or else converting them to social housing, but as for staff housing, the Housing Corporation itself does not provide a program in that area. What we do provide, as I stated earlier, is an Expanded Down Payment Assistance Program that can help new residents coming to housing in the smaller communities but it is somewhat difficult. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Further Return To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Supplementary To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 9

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. One of the areas which the communities feel is essential, is that we somehow take off the pressure from the housing units that are in the communities that there is a possibility of developing a seniors' program to develop specific seniors' units in our communities. This will take off that pressure for the middle age and younger residents of the communities so that they can be able to occupy some of the units that our seniors are in now, but to develop

seniors' homes with four units or whatnot, a lot of our small communities will take off that pressure of the other residents. Has the department looked at the possibility of implementing a seniors housing program in our communities to offset that pressure?

Supplementary To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There is a program with the Department of Health and Social Services and the Housing Corporation that works together to put seniors' units in the communities. We can only meet a certain number of units per year and right now we are not keeping up with the growing demand. That is unfortunate to say that, but we do have a program and we continue to operate with the Department of Health and Social Services to come up with those units to put into the communities and they are selected based on the demand and the amount of need that has been met within the communities and unfortunately this fiscal year we have not been able to deliver any. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Further Return To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Supplementary To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

David Krutko

David Krutko Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Regarding accessing funding in the area of housing, I believe the only area we probably have is looking at social housing and also consideration for elderly units to take off that pressure from the communities. In regard to the whole area of services, we know that our population is getting older and people are living longer and there is a higher number of elders in a lot of our communities who need to find adequate units without sending our elders out to other centres. I would like to ask the Minister if he can possibly develop some scenario and look at the possibility of developing such a program so that all communities will have the ability to have seniors' units in all of the communities? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

Floyd Roland

Floyd Roland Inuvik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it is a goal that the Housing Corporation has, to try and meet all the demands and the needs out there in the communities and I am aware that at the recent senior managers' meeting that was held out at Prelude Lake, the discussion was what we can do to try and emphasize or increase the needs that we meet. I know that they are working hard to try and look at what other options or possibilities are out there, but it is somewhat difficult in the fiscal situation that we find ourselves. Operating within we have we feel right now that without other program changes we are doing the best we can, but program changes, we have been known for changing and I think that we need to review our current status as to what we can continue to offer the people of the Northwest Territories, so that is something we will continue to work on and hearing your concerns is something we could use to generate some of the activity or further push the activity in the next Assembly as well. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Further Return To Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Question 2-13(8): Social Housing Shortage
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Again, I would like to remind the Members about organizing their questions so that you have a preamble and then supplementaries afterwards. I have heard three preambles in one question. Oral questions, Mr. Erasmus.

Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions are for the Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development in relation to natural gas conversion. As I indicated in my statement I was pleased to hear the Minister speak about the Natural Gas Conversion Program in Inuvik because I had been wondering about the possibility of gas conversion in other communities as well. I know that Hay River received natural gas some time ago and that natural gas is a cleaner burning fuel than oil. What I would like to know from the Minister, could he inform the House as to what the current plans for pipelines for natural gas in the Mackenzie Valley? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Community Development, Mr. Kakfwi.

Return To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. With the recent discoveries in the Fort Liard area of significant natural gas finds there has been considerable interest by companies to bring these fields to market, get it into production and build a pipeline to link up to the existing pipeline infrastructure either through the West Coast, that is British Columbia, or through Trans Canada Pipelines which is in Alberta and bring those to the U.S. markets. The U.S. markets are the ones which make it economical because of the millions of people that increasingly require more and more natural gas, it makes it economical to spend millions of dollars building pipelines to bring this resource to market. In the Northwest Territories the city of Yellowknife of some 17,000 people at this time does not present a significant market that would make it economical for anyone to propose spending millions of dollars to link up to natural gas fields to bring natural gas to the city. That is the state of affairs at this time regarding the city of Yellowknife. Generally in the Liard and Mackenzie Valley, increasingly pipeline infrastructure will be built and as more natural gas discoveries, oil is discovered in the Liard, southern Mackenzie area, more money will be spent building up the infrastructure and that will make it increasingly more accessible for the Sahtu, the northern part of the Deh Cho, the southern part of the Mackenzie Valley to bring their resources to market as well. Thank you.

Return To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Erasmus.

Supplementary To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 10

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister has indicated that resources in the Sahtu and other areas would be brought to market as well. Is there opportunity for those

communities in those areas, the Sahtu and those areas along the pipeline route? Would some of those communities be able to benefit from cheaper fuel or does this fuel have to be refined first before it is useable in the North?

Supplementary To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Depending on the type of fuel that is found, for instance in the Inuvik region, as you see the natural gas is of the nature that can readily be brought right to the town of Inuvik and used by industry and consumers there. In Liard there is a possibility there, to provide out of one of the production wells an alternate form of fuel that could be used by the community and there are suggestions that the company and the community may come to an agreement on making available for local consumption some of the fuel that will be produced at one of the fields. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Erasmus.

Supplementary To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Are there currently plans or applications to build further pipelines up to the Beaufort or from the Beaufort through Mackenzie Valley to reach the markets that the Minister had indicated earlier which are primarily the large markets in the U.S.? Are there applications or plans to build a pipeline to reach those markets? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There are significant discoveries already in the Mackenzie Beaufort area. There is always someone, some company that is continually reviewing the economics of bringing those significant finds to market either by pipeline or by ship. So they are always looking at it. At this time, there is no application being made to undertake such an initiative to bring those resources to market from the Beaufort area. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Erasmus.

Supplementary To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Should someone apply to build a pipeline to bring those resources south or perhaps even for the gas that is going to be taken out of the Liard area? Is it possible for us to make it a condition of extracting that resource that a pipeline could be built say over to Yellowknife so that we can cut the costs of fuel in our largest community and decrease the cost of doing business here? Is it possible to do that?

Supplementary To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There is nothing that prevents us from making such suggestions, but at this time it is all hypothetical. There is no significant finds for hundreds of miles from Yellowknife. The closest is, as I say, in the Liard area which is a long ways from Yellowknife. Seventeen thousand people, at this time, is not a significant number in population size to warrant making it economical. But at some time in the future, if there is such a case where there is a significant find close to Yellowknife, of course, it is possible that governments and communities can insist some of that resource should be made available to neighbouring communities for the benefit of northern people. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Question 3-13(8): Plans For Natural Gas Pipelines
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Ootes.

Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is for Mr. Kakfwi, the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development. The question concerns the issue of Giant Mine. I spoke on that earlier today. The concern that is out there for 278 employees and, of course, a lot of people in this community who supply services to that particular mining operation. As I stated earlier, it is not confirmed yet who the buyer is, but there is certainly definite concern about the proper succession of the mine. The main concern is employees do not know whether they have a job or not. If these 278 jobs disappear, then we have got serious problems, Mr. Speaker. Dealing with the issue of succession, there are agreements in place that should be adhered to. There is concern that, that will not happen. Issues like proper notice of termination, severance pay, topping up of pension plans, priority hiring, et cetera. My question for the Minister is related to our government's role in this whole area. Can the Minister tell me if our government has been consulted or informed and had some input with respect to Price Waterhouse Cooper's process of looking at selling this mine? That is my first question, Mr. Speaker.

Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, Mr. Kakfwi.

Return To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 11

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Since the mine went into receivership earlier this year, the Government of the Northwest Territories has been actively seeking to be a player in the process. The mine itself is in receivership, and the receiver has undertaken to look for someone to buy the company, the assets and take over the operations of the mine, if possible. Also, the receiver has been seeking clarification on the environmental liability of the mine. We have, as a government, made it clear to the receiver earlier, that we think it is important that the interests of the workers also be taken into account and treated with serious consideration, people that are owed wages, overtime, and benefits. These need to be clarified and dealt with by the receiver and by the federal government if they are involved in that process. We have tried to keep that in the forefront as well as the fact that, if possible, we hope that a buyer would come forward that could also operate the mine, at

least for some time in the future, to minimize the economic impact of a massive layoff at this time. We have also said that the environmental liability has to be clarified up front. We have been pushing the federal government to do that as well. Thank you.

Return To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 12

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes.

Supplementary To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate that we, as a government, have been anxious to participate actively. But my question is, have we received input into the receiver, to not proceed with any deal that results in 278 employees losing their jobs and a new company does not recognize the succession rights? Have we provided that information and that position to the receiver and to DIAND? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this is largely an action being taken by the private sector. A company has been put in receivership and a receiver is in place to ensure that one way or the other, there is some action being taken to deal with the assets and the employees of the company. We have had meetings with the receiver to raise our concerns, outline the interest we have in this matter. We have conveyed them, as well, to the federal government, from the very first and early part of this development. We met with the union this afternoon to hear from them the specific concerns that they have with the hope of providing them with the information that we have that may alleviate some of the fears, as well as perhaps directing them to focus the concerns in specific areas where there is some ambiguity in the process to date. I believe that there is another meeting lined up tomorrow.

So we are trying to play a productive role in this process, but I must remind Members that the receiver is the one that is going to deal with the disposal of assets or the sale of this company and that we are only, at best, an interested party, a party that is insisting the views and concerns be taken into account, that we have no particular status in the eyes of the receiver. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes.

Supplementary To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, when 285 jobs are involved in this territory, I think we have a responsibility to play a role in that. I do not think it is acceptable to just say we are not a party at the table. We need to be there. This is 285, when you multiply that by two it is 600 jobs in this community that are going to be affected. Mr. Dent is worried about the transfer payments and the amount of money we are going to have. We are going to lose people out of this territory if we are not careful. My question is, will the Minister commit to telling the receiver and DIAND that we need to see the offer and that we, as a territorial government, want time to digest this so that all parties can digest it properly to save these jobs? That is what ultimately is at stake. If we lose them on Friday, then it is too late. We have an opportunity now to do something about it. Will the Minister commit to my question of asking for time for the parties to digest this? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 12

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, we have seen this development as a very serious development, as the Member should be aware. We have conveyed that to the federal government. We have conveyed that to the receiver. We will continue to work to try and ensure that the development does not have a negative impact on Yellowknife, on the economy and the Government of the Northwest Territories. We will continue to work with the receiver and the federal government to make sure that whatever proposal is received, that the best proposal is accepted, that we will work to offer our advice, our input on how proposals can be improved so that the interests of the workers, the interests of the city, the Government of the Northwest Territories, and the environment are all balanced in a way that we can feel comfortable in seeing a deal be accepted by the receiver. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Ootes.

Supplementary To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Jake Ootes

Jake Ootes Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think it is ultimately important, Mr. Speaker, that time be allowed to digest this. Once the decision is made, it is too late. We, as the territorial government, can do something about that, and I wonder if the Minister will ask the receiver to table what the offer is and the company to table what the offer is to allow our employees that are affected by this, they are sitting on pins and needles out there, to say okay this is a good deal, there are two issues, one is employment and we understand there may be loss of employment and that is acceptable to a degree. But the second is succession rights. We cannot just accept that they wash their hands of everything, including DIAND, Miramar, if that is who is going to buy the mine, or whoever buys the mine. Would the Minister commit to a two week grace period that they ask the receiver so we can digest this? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The receiver has been working with the federal government and with ourselves. The receiver has asked for our views and our input into a number of elements that may be constituted presently in some of the proposals that the receiver has accepted from the private sector. There is no doubt that we have concerns about this development, we have conveyed that as clearly and as forcefully as we can. The things that count, as I have said, the receiver has no obligation to us as a government. It is clearly

something that is being dealt with through due process but we have been invited to take part and we have been trying to be a positive party to this process to date. We think we have done fairly well. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
Question 4-13(8): GNWT Role In Giant Mine Purchase
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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral Questions. Mr. Henry.

Seamus Henry Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to Mr. Kakfwi, the Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development. Mr. Kakfwi made a statement in the House today regarding the Inuvik Natural Gas Conversion Program and he informed the House that the department had provided initial funding for research in the project. He also talked about the initial cost of conversion of some of these projects. Mr. Speaker, I would like to make it clear up front, I do not have the concerns of the major oil companies at heart when I ask these questions. I am more concerned about the small business people, in particular the individuals in Inuvik that are presently supplying other kinds of fuel to homes. I think the department and the Minister should be commended for the reduction in greenhouse gases that this type of project will contribute towards, but I am just wondering how or has there been any consultation with the present fuel suppliers in Inuvik, the small business people who have large investments in the community who right now stand to lose substantially because of another government subsidized program bringing an alternate source of energy. My question to the Minister is, Mr. Speaker, was there any consultation or is there any plan to assist the business people who stand to lose because of the government support of this particular gas project? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, Mr. Kakfwi.

Return To Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I believe that there has been extensive work done in the region and in the community of Inuvik. The project has been widely supported by the residents, by the business community in the town of Inuvik. It has been a relatively high profile type of initiative that stands to lower the cost of living for the town of Inuvik for doing business in the town of Inuvik. It is a significant reduction in greenhouse gas emissions so environmentally it is a huge plus. It is true that it will have an impact on some individual businesses but this is a development that is welcomed and supported by the community and by the region. Thank you.

Return To Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry.

Supplementary To Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Seamus Henry Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister did reiterate all the positive points and they are, in fact, positive points about this type of development. I am wondering, would the Minister commit to having his department officials sit down with the parties, say the small business people, who will be affected by this to see if there are opportunities through the department that these parties can be involved in the same roles, suppliers of energy resources, if they can find some role to be involved with this particular gas project so that they are not negatively impacted? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary To Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We will take the Member's comments into consideration and get back to him at a later date. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Question 5-13(8): Consultation On Natural Gas Conversion Project
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Erasmus.

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions are for the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development and a continuation of the questions I had asked earlier in regard to a gas pipeline to Yellowknife. I just wanted to indicate that the honourable Member responsible for Rae-Edzo has indicated that a pipeline could also service his community which would raise the numbers up by ten percent that would be serviced. Mr. Speaker, I know that the market would not be a tremendous market which probably would not be economical for the company that would bring this gas to this market. However, what I am wondering is, are we in any position to make it a condition of other pipelines that they actually do make natural gas available to this market over here? I am saying that, not because it would be economical or profitable to whoever does that, but because it would be good for the residents of the Northwest Territories to actually benefit from our own resources and also to lower the emissions that are contributing to the ozone layers being depleted above us as we speak. Thank you.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, Mr. Kakfwi.

Return To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Member is suggesting that if it is possible, if it is economical, we should try to take some of our own natural resources and make them readily available to our own people here and in the process, lower greenhouse gas emissions and lower the costs of heating fuels. The government would readily agree to that. We would always look for situations, or occasions, or opportunities, where we can do exactly that. If there is such a possibility that it is economical to bring, for instance, natural gas to the city of Yellowknife, economically, we would do everything we can to advance such a scenario. Thank you.

Return To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr Erasmus.

Supplementary To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister had indicated that if it is economically feasible, he could do this. I think that considering the size of the market in this area, it may

never be economically feasible unless the gas find is right on our door step. I think that we have to go beyond looking at economics and doing whatever is possible to ensure that the residents benefit from our own resources. I would ask the Minister if they would go beyond looking at what is economically feasible when they are looking at the possibility of hooking us up to this natural resource? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 14

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we know that the companies will not absorb the costs of building pipelines. They will only build pipelines when it is economical to do so. They will invest the necessary hundreds of millions of dollars into building a pipeline infrastructure if they know that they can sell the product that is going to flow through that pipe to consumers, largely in the United States and get their investment paid back to them plus make a profit. The companies will not do it otherwise. That has been the practice of industry. This government does not have the money to invest in pipeline infrastructure of that sort but it is possible to look at opportunities as I have said. The only thing that can be said is, if there is any possibility to arrive at a situation where we can get cleaner burning fuels, cheaper fuels, available to our people, whether it is in Yellowknife or Fort Providence, Hay River, Fort Smith, any of the communities in the North, then of course, we are obliged to do so. We will actively work to do that if such an occasion should arise. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Erasmus.

Supplementary To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 14

Roy Erasmus Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to thank the Minister for his responses. My final question is, could the Minister get his staff to do an estimate of what it would cost to build a small pipeline, maybe five inches, or whatever, just a teeny one to bring gas over here and share that information with us, please? Thank you.

Supplementary To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We will ask the department to see if there is any type of information we can make that has any resemblance of reality in it. We are not in the pipeline business but perhaps it is possible to do a rough estimate on such a proposal, given the distance where the significant finds are located at this time, in the Liard area. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Question 6-13(8): Natural Gas Availability To Northerners
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mrs. Groenewegen.

Question 7-13(8): Services To Rural Residents
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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Jane Groenewegen

Jane Groenewegen Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am not sure who my questions are for today but we have been talking a lot today about the provision of economic sources of fuel to people living in communities. We have a lot of people in the Northwest Territories who live in rural areas where they cannot even access basic services like power and telephone and these sorts of things. In the Yukon, they have a program called, "The Rural Electrification and Telecommunications Program". It is administered by the Department of Community and Transportation Services of the Yukon Government and the Yukon Development Corporation. It promotes the extension of this infrastructure and these services to people who live outside of municipalities and I certainly have people in my constituency that are in that category and I believe Mr. Erasmus probably does as well with people living along the Ingraham Trail, where for one person to access even these basis services, it is cost-prohibitive and not within the reach of most people. What they do in the Yukon, is that they make a loan available against the property which does not exceed 25 percent of the property's value and they allow these people to amortize the costs of getting these services over a period of time using the property as security.

Seeing as we do have many Northerners in the Western Territory living in rural areas, is this something that this government could consider? I have an instance in my riding right now where NorthwesTel has done away with the radio-telephone system and now for this constituent to get phone service brought in on a one-shot payment, which NorthwesTel would require, would cost $8,000. If they could be involved in a program such as they have in the Yukon, they could spread this over an amortized period and could afford the services. Is this something that this government has ever considered or would ever consider? Thank you.

Question 7-13(8): Services To Rural Residents
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Premier, Mr. Antoine.

Return To Question 7-13(8): Services To Rural Residents
Question 7-13(8): Services To Rural Residents
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 14

Jim Antoine Nahendeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I will have to take this question as notice because we are talking about power, we are talking about telephone, we are talking about subsidy perhaps. You are asking if there is a general program that this government is looking at. Based on that, I need to get more information and get back to her. Thank you.

Return To Question 7-13(8): Services To Rural Residents
Question 7-13(8): Services To Rural Residents
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The question is being taken as notice. Oral questions. Mr. Henry.

Seamus Henry Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask further questions of Mr. Kakfwi, Minister responsible for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development. It is following up on some questions that were asked earlier by my colleague, Mr. Erasmus, regarding pipelines to the capital city. Mr. Speaker, I would also request the Minister, and I realize that he is reasonably new in this portfolio but previously, a number of years ago, there are studies, and I believe the department would have them where it looked at the possibility of bringing natural gas to Yellowknife from the Cameron Hills area. Bringing natural gas to Yellowknife was economically feasible, all but one thing, getting it across the Mackenzie River at Fort Providence. In an initiative that I proposed in the life of this government was to build a bridge across the Mackenzie, and it will come at some

stage. Mr. Speaker, the one way to get that across the Mackenzie would have been to build a bridge and support it on the site of the bridge.

I would ask the Minister to maybe take a look in his department if those studies are still available. My question to the Minister, along the same lines, Mr. Speaker is, bringing natural gas to the community of Inuvik was not a feasible project. That project, rightfully so, was subsidized by the department. The project was subsidized by the department, but the installation for homeowners is also being subsidized to make it feasible. The Minister had told us, in his statement, that I believe the residents of Inuvik were getting $1,350 per conversion to convert homes, so obviously it was not a feasible project. There was the money initially injected into it to make it feasible. So all these things have been supported by the government, the initial money to get the project off the ground and secondly, some money for homeowners to have this project installed in their homes. I am wondering if the Minister would consider subsidizing a similar project for the city of Yellowknife, which would make it potentially feasible under those conditions to have natural gas brought into Yellowknife. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Resources, Wildlife, and Economic Development, Mr. Kakfwi.

Return To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There have been some studies or proposals done in the past that looked at bringing fuel to the city of Yellowknife and to Rae. Those studies are available. We will make copies and make them available to Members. In Inuvik, I know that it was just a few years ago that we proposed to shut down the utilidor system and have individual businesses and houses convert to their own individual heating systems. There was some support that was required to do that. In the case of this conversion, we have offered to help convert the heating systems from some of the communities for the units, housing units to natural gas as well. The largest client in Inuvik is the Power Corporation, and that is really what made it viable and economical to proceed with this operation. Thank you.

Return To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry.

Supplementary To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 15

Seamus Henry Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister has told us that something that made this a feasible project was, I understood him to say, the large consumption of the Power Corporation. When I compare the size of the Power Corporation operation in Inuvik to the size of the power operation here in Yellowknife, surely that should help to make it a feasible or at least a very similar project to what would have been produced in Inuvik. Again, my question to the Minister is, will he have his department officials look at the size of Inuvik and the size of Yellowknife and see what type of a subsidy would be required to make it a feasible project to have natural gas brought to Yellowknife? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 15

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 15

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you. Yes, I will try to provide that information to the Member. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Henry.

Supplementary To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 15

Seamus Henry Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Just a comment, if I will, hopefully followed by a question. I just note that Inuvik's subsidy ran to $500,000 and there was an additional amount of money in research. The Minister has not made that amount available. If I compare the population of Inuvik to Yellowknife, it would look about a $2.5 million subsidy that could be put towards that potential of a project. Will the Minister take this information in consideration when his department officials are looking at the possibility of bringing natural gas to Yellowknife? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Supplementary To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 15

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Question period is over. Mr. Kakfwi.

Further Return To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 15

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Member wanted some information about the economic viability of bringing natural gas to Yellowknife. There is a commitment to give him a response that would outline all the elements and considerations that have been taken into account to make that happen. We will provide that to the Member. Thank you.

Further Return To Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Question 8-13(8): Feasibility Of Transporting Natural Gas
Revert To Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 15

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Item 13, motions. Mr. Dent.

Item 13: Motions
Item 13: Motions

Page 15

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Mr. Speaker, thank you. I seek unanimous consent to proceed with Motion 1-13(8) today.

Item 13: Motions
Item 13: Motions

Page 15

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Yellowknife Frame Lake is seeking unanimous consent to deal with the motion today. Do we have any nays? Mr. Dent, you have unanimous consent.

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, honourable Members. Mr. Speaker,

I MOVE, seconded by the honourable Member for Yellowknife North, that the Speaker be authorized to set such sitting days and hours as the Speaker after consultation deems fit to assist with the business before the House. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the motion. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Item 14, first reading of bills. Mr. Miltenberger.

Item 14: First Reading Of Bills
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 15

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I seek unanimous consent to proceed with the first reading of Bill 1, An Act to Amend the Public Colleges Act.

Item 14: First Reading Of Bills
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Thebacha is seeking unanimous consent to deal with the first reading of Bill 1. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Miltenberger, you have unanimous consent.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Inuvik that Bill 1, an Act to Amend the Public Colleges Act, be read for the first time. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the motion. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Bill 1 has had first reading. First reading of bills, Mr. Dent.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to proceed with first reading of Bill 2, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 2, 1999-2000.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Yellowknife Frame Lake is seeking unanimous consent to deal with Bill 2. Do we have any nays?

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

Some Hon. Members

Nay.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

You do not have unanimous consent. First reading of bills, Mr. Dent.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

Charles Dent

Charles Dent Yellowknife Frame Lake

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to proceed with the first reading of Bill 3, Legislative Assembly and Executive Council Act.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Member for Yellowknife Frame Lake is seeking unanimous consent to deal with Bill 3. Do we have any nays?

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

Some Hon. Members

Nay.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

You do not have unanimous consent. Item 14, first reading of bills. Mr. Kakfwi.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to proceed with the first reading of Bill 4, Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act. Thank you.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

Page 16

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Member for Sahtu is seeking unanimous consent to deal with Bill 4. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Kakfwi, you have unanimous consent.

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you. Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Nahendeh that Bill 4, Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act, be read for the first time. Thank you.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the motion. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Bill 4 has had first reading. First reading of bills. Mr. Miltenberger.

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I seek unanimous consent to proceed with the first reading of Bill 5, An Act to Amend the Workers' Compensation Act.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Thebacha is seeking unanimous consent to deal with Bill 5. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Miltenberger, you have unanimous consent.

Bill 5: An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Sahtu that Bill 5, An Act to Amend the Workers' Compensation Act, be read for the first time.

Bill 5: An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act
Item 14: First Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the motion. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Bill 5 has had first reading. First reading of bills. Item 15, second reading of bills. Mr. Miltenberger.

Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills
Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I seek consent to proceed with second reading of Bill 1, An Act to Amend the Public Colleges Act.

Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills
Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Thebacha is seeking consent to deal with Bill 1. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Miltenberger, you have consent.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Inuvik that Bill 1, An Act to Amend the Public Colleges Act. be read for the second time.

Mr. Speaker, this bill amends the Public Colleges Act, to clarify the authority of a public college to offer university level programs and to grant prescribed university degrees. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the principle of the bill. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Bill 1 has had second reading and according to the bill, stands referred to a committee. Second reading of bills. Mr. Kakfwi.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills

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Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, I seek consent to proceed with second reading of Bill 4, Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act.

Bill 1: An Act To Amend The Public Colleges Act
Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for the Sahtu is seeking unanimous consent to deal with Bill 4. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Kakfwi, you have unanimous consent.

Stephen Kakfwi

Stephen Kakfwi Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I move, seconded by the Honourable Member for Nahendeh, that Bill 4, Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Statutes Amendment Act, be read for the second time.

Mr. Speaker, this bill amends ten statutes to address the paramountcy of the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act, over other statutes that contain provisions that are inconsistent, or in conflict with it, as of December 31, 1999. The bill also amends the Archives Act and the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act.

The Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act is amended to clarify that permitted public access to records in a registry includes access to original records.

The Archives Act is amended to

- provide a new definition of government body consistent with the definition of public body in the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act;

- clarify that a notice of the destruction of public records may be general in nature;

- increase the amount of the penalty for an offence under the act; and

- provide the Commissioner with the regulation-making authority to designate certain bodies as government bodies.

The Consumer Protection Act is amended to ensure that the provisions that limit access and provide for the security of information collected during investigations under the act continue to apply despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act.

The Disease Registries Act is amended to ensure that the provisions for access to, accountability for, and control of records contained in the reportable disease registry continue to apply despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act.

The Education Act, is amended to ensure that the following prevail despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act;

- provisions dealing with conditions of access to and the process for the release of information from a student record;

- specific and detailed provisions for the correction of student records;

- provisions dealing with the requirement that disclosures by a student to a school counselor be kept strictly confidential from the student's parents, teachers and others, as well as from the student himself or herself where necessary; provisions setting out the circumstances when a school counselor's notes or information contained in the notes may be disclosed and requiring that written notice of any disclosure be given to the student where reasonably possible.

The Environmental Rights Act is amended to repeal the access to information provisions contained in section 3.

The Insurance Act is amended to ensure that the provisions dealing with access to information about an insured or about a party to an application under the act continues to apply despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act.

The Labour Standards Act is amended to ensure that the provision dealing with the disclosure of personal information continues to apply despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act.

The Motor Vehicles Act is amended to ensure that the specific access to information and protection of privacy provisions contained in the act continue to apply despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act and to

- allow additional officials or organizations to access limited information from records contained in the motor vehicle registry, either with or without a fee;

- allow public or private agencies to access information from records contained in the motor vehicle registry, except personal information, for research purposes for a fee; and

- clarify that the Young Offenders Act, and the Young Offenders Act (Canada), govern the control and release of reports of convictions in respect of young persons.

The Payroll Tax Act, 1993 is amended to ensure that the conditions of disclosure of information collected pursuant to the Act continue to apply despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act.

The Securities Act is amended to ensure that the specific circumstances of an investigation conducted under the act and the protection of the information collected as a result continue to apply despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act.

The Tobacco Tax Act is amended to ensure that the conditions of disclosure of information collected pursuant to the act continue to apply despite the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the principle of the bill. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Bill 4 has had second reading and accordingly, the bill stands referred to the committee. Second reading of bills. Mr. Miltenberger.

Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I seek consent to proceed with second reading of Bill 5, An Act to Amend the Workers' Compensation Act.

The Speaker Samuel Gargan

The Member for Thebacha is seeking consent to deal with Bill 5. Do we have any nays? There are no nays. Mr. Miltenberger, you have consent.

Bill 5: An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act
Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills

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Michael Miltenberger

Michael Miltenberger Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the Honourable Member for Sahtu that Bill 5, An Act to Amend the Workers' Compensation Act, be read for the second time.

Mr. Speaker, this bill amends the Workers' Compensation Act, to protect the co-workers of a worker and the employer of a worker from lawsuits in respect of transportation accidents arising out of and during the course of the worker's employment. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Bill 5: An Act To Amend The Workers' Compensation Act
Item 15: Second Reading Of Bills

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the principle of the bill. Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Bill 5 has had second reading and accordingly, the bill stands referred to the committee. Second reading of bills. Item 16, orders of the day. Mr. Clerk.

Item 16: Orders Of The Day
Item 16: Orders Of The Day

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Clerk Of The House Mr. David Hamilton

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker there is a meeting of the Standing Committee on Government Operations immediately after adjournment today. Also, again of the same committee again at 9:30 a.m. tomorrow morning and of the Special Committee on Western Identity at 11:00 a.m.

Orders of the day for Wednesday, September 8, 1999

1. Prayer

2. Ministers' Statements

3. Members' Statements

4. Returns to Oral Questions

5. Recognition of Visitors in the Gallery

6. Oral Questions

7. Written Questions

8. Returns to Written Questions

9. Replies to Opening Address

10. Petitions

11. Reports of Standing and Special Committees

12. Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills

13. Tabling of Documents

14. Notices of Motion

15. Notices of Motion for First Reading of Bills

16. Motions

17. First Reading of Bills

18. Second Reading of Bills

19. Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters

20. Report of Committee of the Whole

21. Third Reading of Bills

22. Orders of the Day

Item 16: Orders Of The Day
Item 16: Orders Of The Day

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The Speaker Samuel Gargan

Thank you. This House stands adjourned to 1:30 p.m., September 8, 1999.

--ADJOURNMENT