Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The Standing Committee on Social Programs is pleased to report on the review of Bill 4, An Act to Amend the Student Financial Assistance Act. Bill 4 was referred to the Standing Committee on Social Programs on February 25, 2000. The committee held public hearings on this bill on March 23, 2000.

The standing committee would like to thank all of the individuals and organizations that made presentations at the public hearing.

Mr. Chairman, this bill proposes to amend the Student Financial Assistance Act to increase the aggregate of the principal amount that can be loaned to an individual student to $47,000. The bill also proposes, over the next two years, to increase the maximum revolving fund amount available in Schedule 1 of the act to $33 million.

Members of the committee were aware that the proposed amendments to the Student Financial Assistance Act were made in order to provide for the redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program.

The presenters to the committee also understood that Bill 4 was essentially enabling legislation that would allow this redesign to occur. All the bill does is allow the amount each student can receive and the amount available in the revolving fund to increase. The majority of the presenters and committee Members had no problems with the bill itself.

The problems, Mr. Chairman, are with the redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program. How the SFA Program will work and how students can access available funding were of more concern to the presenters and committee members than the content of the bill itself.

A common theme in the presentations made to the committee was that the department did a poor job in consulting on the final redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program. The Tree of Peace Friendship Centre, the Metis Nation, the South Slave Metis Tribal Council, Metis Local No. 66 and the NWT Students Coalition all made reference in their presentations to this lack of consultation.

Regardless of the amount of consultation that occurred when the Minister's Forum on Student Financial Assistance visited the communities in the summer of 1997, it remains a fact that the final report of the forum was tabled in this Assembly over two years ago.

Mr. Chairman, the department would be well served in the future to consult in a timely manner with aboriginal governments and other recognized stakeholders on major initiatives before introducing legislation in this Assembly.

Mr. Chairman, another major concern of committee members and several of the presenters was that the redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program created different classes of aboriginals in the Northwest Territories. Because the federal government does not recognize any special tax status for Metis and Inuvialuit students who receive a grant under the present Student Financial Assistance, these student's grants were taxed as income.

The redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program proposed to deal with this divisive issue by making Metis and Inuvialuit students eligible for remissible loans instead of grants. This would remove the potential federal tax burden for Metis and Inuvialuit students. Status and treaty aboriginals would still be eligible for non-repayable grants and would continue to enjoy tax-exempt status.

Mr. Chairman, this was not acceptable to committee members. Clarification was sought from the Minister as to the costs that would be involved with giving Metis and Inuvialuit students the option of whether they wanted a remissible loan or a straight grant for their post-secondary education.

The Minister responded in correspondence dated March 24, 2000 that the extra costs involved with providing that option to Metis and Inuvialuit would be in the neighbourhood of $500,000.

Mr. Chairman, the unanimous decision of the standing committee was that the Minister should be encouraged to seek the extra funding from the Financial Management Board to address the department's ability to provide Metis and Inuvialuit with the option of either a remissible loan or a straight grant.

Committee members made this request of the Minister in the belief that the territorial government's policies and practices should not be construed to be favouring one aboriginal segment of our population over another.

Mr. Chairman, the committee is pleased to report that the Minister and the Financial Management Board agreed with our assessment of the situation. The Minister has provided the Committee with a written guarantee that the necessary funding will be found to allow the redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program to include an option for Metis and Inuvialuit students on whether they wish a remissible loan or a grant.

Another issue that was brought to the committee's attention by several presenters was the need to revisit the required course load to be eligible for continued Student Financial Assistance.

Mr. Chairman, the redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program proposed that to remain eligible for student financial assistance, a student would be required to pass 60 percent of a full course load in the first year, and to pass 75 percent of a full course load in subsequent years.

Committee members, as well as presenters such as Mr. Brian Armstrong of the Northwest Territories Students Coalition, and Mr. Bill Enge, representing Metis Local No. 66, were of the strong opinion that this requirement to take 75 percent of a full course load in the second and subsequent years placed an unfair burden on students. Students from our smaller communities who may be adjusting to life in larger centres may not do so well in their first year. This could mean that the students would be placed on academic probation by the educational institution for their second year. The requirement to take 75 percent of a full course load may doom this student to failure before their educational career gets properly underway.

Mr. Chairman, the Standing Committee on Social Programs requested the Minister re-examine the proposed redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program and make changes to the course load requirements for continued eligibility.

Mr. Chairman, the committee is again pleased to report that the Minister has agreed to the committee's request. The department will change the Student Financial Assistance Program so that students are only required to take 60 percent of a full course load in the first and second year of their post secondary education and 75 percent in subsequent years.

There were many other areas of concern for committee members and in the presentations made during the public hearings on Bill 4.

Some, such as the request of Mr. George Kurszewski of the South Slave Metis Tribal Council to transfer the money for post secondary to those aboriginal governments that are ready for the responsibility, can be negotiated at the appropriate land claim or self government table.

Other areas of concern, such as how the Student Financial Assistance Program relates to the government's Affirmative Action Policy will require much more study and consultation before positive change can be effected. The Standing Committee on Social Programs plans to keep this concern at the forefront of its participation in the anticipated redesign of the Affirmative Action Policy.

Mr. Chairman, one area of concern that committee members and several presenters identified was the need to remove the Minister as an avenue of appeal on matters pertaining to individual Student Financial Assistance complaints.

Members of the committee and the public strongly recommended that the proposed redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program remove the Minister from the appeal process. The standing committee believes that removing the Minister from the appeal process would remove any question of political interference. The committee looks forward to realizing this recommendation in the final redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program.

Mr. Chairman, the simple reality is that the proposed redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program that Bill 4 enables will not make everyone happy in the Northwest Territories. Hard choices have had to be made.

The committee had also requested that the Minister examine the possibility of increasing the dollar amounts available to students for tuition and books. The proposed redesign will increase the tuition allowance for students to $1750 from $1250, increase book allowances by $100 a semester and increase living allowances by not less than seven percent. Members requested that the Minister examine increasing these amounts.

The committee's final request was that the Minister consider matching the rate of forgiveness for remissible loans so that one year of supported education would be forgiven for every year of residency in the Northwest Territories.

The Minister could not support these requests at this time because he believed that to do so would require a further injection of funding for the Student Financial Assistance Program over and above the $500,000 he had already committed to.

The Standing Committee on Social Programs is prepared to accept rejection of these two requests at this time, given the limited funding available to all departments. However, the committee recommends that the amount of funding available to students be examined on an annual basis. It is vitally important that the Student Financial Assistance Program keep pace with inflation. Eight year waits for increased funding are not acceptable.

The committee is of the opinion that the Minister showed sufficient good faith in accepting the two major recommendations of the committee on the proposed redesign.

In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, the Standing Committee on Social Programs is of the opinion that Bill 4, An Act to Amend the Student Financial Assistance Program, will allow the redesign of the Student Financial Assistance Program and recommends passage. Individual members of the committee may bring up concerns during committee of the whole discussion. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. At this time, I would like to ask the Minister if he could introduce his witnesses for the record.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. With me are Mark Cleveland, the deputy minister of the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, and Paul Devitt, the director of financial and management services of the department, and Rebecca Veinott, legislative counsel. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Minister. Welcome, witnesses. Are there any general comments on the bill?

We are dealing with Bill 4, An Act to Amend the Student Financial Assistance Act. Clause 1, Agreed?

Clause 2. Agreed?

Clause 3. Agreed?

Bill as a whole?

Does the committee agree that Bill 4 is ready for third reading?

Bill 4 is now ready for third reading. I would like to thank the Minister and his witnesses. Thank you.

-- Applause

As we agreed, the next bill we will deal with is Bill 3, An Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act. I would like to ask the Minister if he has any opening comments. Mr. Handley.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, the purpose of this act is to amend the Financial Administration Act to provide retroactive approval to the Minister responsible for Municipal and Community Affairs to enter into, as at April 1, 1999, an indemnification agreement with the federal, provincial and other territorial governments for the exchange of information under the Cooperative Enforcement Agreement On Consumer Related Measures.

The Cooperative Enforcement Agreement is intended to reduce inter-provincial-territorial consumer related fraud through the exchange of information or assistance. Cooperation under this agreement includes, but is not limited to, requests for:

• • Assistance in the enforcement of a statute listed within the schedule to the agreement; and,
• • Information respecting a person regulated by any statute listed in the schedule which relates to:

(a) number and types of complaints against that person; and

(b) financial information on a particular business other than that collected as part of a business registration process.

The agreement requires the requesting party to indemnify and hold harmless the party supplying the information or assistance from any or all claims arising out of the requestor's use of the information. By their very nature, such indemnities are not quantifiable until such time as a court judgment or an out of court settlement is reached. Were the Government of the Northwest Territories to be sued for "misuse" of this information, it would be expected that this would be an exceedingly rare circumstance. In addition, mechanisms are already in place to report contingent liabilities such as pending lawsuits within the public accounts of the Northwest Territories.

Consequently, the request by the former chairman of the Standing Committee on Government Operations that Members be given 14 days advance notification of any indemnities under this agreement would not be practical. Therefore, no provision for such has been made in this bill. The former chairman was informed of this decision and its rationale prior to the submission of this bill.

I would note that this agreement has been signed and the bill seeks a retroactive effective date. The timing of the signing of this agreement was due to the timing of the intergovernmental initiative by which these agreements were worked out. To avoid taking any action that may give rise to a liability the government has made no requests pursuant to the agreement and will not make any such requests unless this bill is passed. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Does the committee responsible for overseeing this department have any comments? Ms. Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The Standing Committee On Governance And Economic Development reviewed Bill 3, An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act at its meetings on March 20th and 22nd, 2000.

The committee would like to thank the Ministers of Finance and Municipal and Community Affairs and their officials for presenting the bill and responding to the committee's questions.

The purpose of the act is to amend the Financial Administration Act to provide retroactive approval for the Minister responsible for Municipal and Community Affairs to enter into an indemnification agreement with federal, provincial and other territorial governments for the exchange of information under the Cooperative Enforcement Agreement on Consumer Related Measures, effective April 1,1999.

This inter-jurisdictional agreement provides for the sharing of valuable consumer-related information between jurisdictions. This information is intended to give our northern consumers protection from persons or businesses who are known by other jurisdictions to have carried on questionable commercial activities.

Mr. Chair, the standing committee supports these proposed amendments and awaits further discussion during the clause by clause review of the bill. This concludes the standing committee's comments on Bill 3, An Act To Amend The Financial Administration Act. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. At this time I would like to ask the Minister if he would like to bring in any witnesses?

Yes.

Sergeant-at-Arms, would you please escort the witnesses in.

Mr. Minister, for the record, would you please introduce your witnesses.

Thank you, Mr. Chairman. On my right is Lew Voytilla, secretary to the Financial Management Board, and on my left is Denise Gagnon, legislative counsel with the Department of Justice. Thank you.

Welcome, witnesses. Are there any general comments on the bill?